What is the top predator in the ocean besides man?

[Witis]

I agree with FD: You were even shown examples of Orcas feeding on makos, including explanations of how it was done, yet you bizarrely rejected that in favor of the species that you clearly favored right from the start.

I would not say bizarrely is the word at all. I indicated that an ability to predate on another species does not automatically make it dominate the other. For example Great White sharks prey on humans and yet humans are higher up the food chain than Great Whites. What I needed to see was evidence that Orcas are designed to regularly predate on Mako sharks and I did not find any. Instead I found that the design of the Mako shark means that it is the perfect Orca killing machine not the other way around. The Mako has superior teeth, rows and rows of self replenishing razor sharp teeth, superior speed, and an ability to ambush from and escape to the deep and no constant requirement to make it to the surface to breath. The Orca is too slow, and bobs up and down near the surface like Mako food packets designed to be irresistible to the sharks, and has no where to escape from sharks with eletroreception. Where as the Mako's weakness was being rolled on its back, not much of a weakness, the primary Orca's weakness was that its teeth wear down to the gums if they eat too many sharks which means they are not designed as shark predators. Can a pack of Orcas kill a single Mako, either too young or disabled to evade the pod, sure, although that does not by itself make Orcas an authentic shark predator.

Meanwhile, everybody else was saying that there wasn't a single top predator, yet you rejected that, as well. That's a particularly nasty mistake, too.

I explicated that as the sea is essentially full of predators, it is only natural to try and determine which is the top pelagic predator. In this case I was lucky that there was enough scientific information available for me to feel comfortable with my conclusion.

There has been much mischief caused throughout history by people deciding a priori that the structure must be X, and coming up with arguments to force the data to conform with their pre-existing beliefs.

If I had any preexisting beliefs it was that Orcas were designed as shark killing machines due to Hollywood fantasy, it turns out I was wrong.

The worst case was with race, where there were originally thought to be four races, but if you have an even number, then there can't be one at the top. Therefore, a fifth race was created so that there would be two chains leading to a single race on top. I'll leave it to you to guess which one was chosen as being the 'top' race.

I am not creating a new theoretical species, I am merely looking at the science to determine what the facts are.

You are doing the same thing. You have decided that there must be a SINGLE top predator, and are desperately ignoring facts to make it so.

This thread is an attempt to determine the top oceanic predator. If there happened to be two equal top oceanic predators then I would have been very surprised no doubt; however, that is not what I found.

You take the video evidence that Orcas prey on Makos and dismiss that because the teeth of the Orca aren't as suitable for eating sharks.

That is the evidence that I have presented.

You then go on to state how Makos must be preying on Orcas because they are capable of doing so.

The very fact that Makos could be preying on Makos is a huge revelation compared to popular culture which presents them as fish finger to Orcas.

Therefore, you know that Orcas eat Makos, but you pretend that it doesn't happen, and you think that Makos must be eating Orcas, but you haven't shown that it happens.

The more I looked into it the more I noticed the dominance of Makos over Orcas and the rest of the pelagic predators.

Frankly, both could easily be true. There doesn't have to be a single top predator in the ocean just as there isn't a single top predator on land.

That's strange, most see Man as the top organic based predator on land.

Furthermore, there could also be a keystone predator that is not the top predator, and I would suggest that a keystone predator is more important than a top predator anyways.

Do you have a keystone predator for me to look at?