So Trump is yet again using the courts and threats of legal action to get his way...
How do you feel about the potential release of the Epstein files then? Would you still be a dedicated supporter if the evidence showed he was complicit? Where would you draw the line in what is acceptable in your mind compared to what is unacceptable?
We know you don't care about rape and sexual assault of adult women, would rape of children be enough to stop you supporting Trump? How about turning a blind eye to other people raping children, would that be enough to stop your support?
For some weird reason you seem to think this is about Trump. It is not. He is just a major actor in the effort to push back the darkness.
I'm not sure why it gives you comfort to fetishize the man so. He's just one player on a stage, with many millions of Americans behind him.
Your rape accusations are bizarre. You're really reaching if you think that kind of issue has anything to do with a societal movement growing in achievements and gaining more adherents every day.
What is it that blinds you to the real issues, anyway? Something certainly produces a lot of rabid overreaction.
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Re: Post election prediction
I'm not sure why it gives you comfort to fetishize the man so
You clearly do exactly that. Nice attempt at deflecting PD's question though. Where is your line?
Trump has been found guilty of sexual assault, boasted about walking into women's changing rooms at beauty pageants and you must have heard his own words about where is is acceptable to grab a woman. So, in light of the smell around Epstein, this really does beg the question: where is your line?
The BBC lawsuit is going nowhere. A poorly judged edit is not the same as defamation, there's no indication of malice and there's no indication of reputational harm given that he was subsequently re-elected. If Trump really wants to got to court over this, it will mean litigating whether he actually did incite insurrection and his speech, taken in it's entirety and in the context of the other speeches that were given that day, clearly did that. It will also mean relitigating his claims of the election being stolen and he does not want to do that given the plethora or parties who did suffer reputational damage as a result of his lies in the 3 months preceding that speech.
Trump just throwing a hissy fit and making noise.
Last edited by FunkyDexter; Nov 13th, 2025 at 06:54 AM.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
Nice attempt at deflecting PD's question though. Where is your line?
Yeah, there was nothing in his response that answered PD's question.
But I don't think his "line" would be relevant anyway. His mind wouldn't let him believe that Trump crossed it, no matter what the evidence was. He would find someone on YouTube to tell him it was all fake and that would be enough. After all, he doesn't even think it's about Trump,
He is just a major actor in the effort to push back the darkness.
Somehow PD's direct question about Trump was actually,
You're really reaching if you think that kind of issue has anything to do with a societal movement growing in achievements and gaining more adherents every day.
In what reality did PD's post make anything close to a statement about "societal movement"? In Dil's reality. So, Trump crossing a "line" in our reality and Dil's reality probably aren't the same, even if we have the same line.
How do you feel about the potential release of the Epstein files then?
This has about zero chance of happening. Even if the House approves it.
The Epstein measure is likely to pass the House but has no path to enactment.
If every representative who signed the petition also votes for the Epstein measure, it would pass the House.
In fact, it is expected to draw even more votes than that. Republican leaders expect that some of their members who did not sign the discharge petition — which many lawmakers frown upon as an act of party disloyalty that undercuts their leaders — are likely to vote for the resolution itself. Representative Don Bacon of Nebraska already told reporters this week that he would support the measure, even though he did not join the effort to force a vote on it.
But unlike the subpoenas issued by the House Oversight Committee for its investigation into Mr. Epstein, which this week yielded emails in which the disgraced financier asserted that Mr. Trump knew more about Mr. Epstein’s abuses than he had acknowledged, the resolution has no force unless it is enacted into law. That would require passage by both chambers of Congress and a presidential signature.
If the bill were to pass the House, it would be sent to the Senate, where it would face tough odds.
It would take 60 votes to bring up the bill in that chamber. Democrats hold 47 seats, so even if all of them back the measure, they would still need 13 Republicans to buck Mr. Trump and join them.
If the bill were to pass the Senate, it would be sent to the president’s desk, and he would be all but certain to veto it. Even if he did not, the only way to compel cooperation with such a measure would be for the House to enforce it by holding the attorney general in contempt of Congress for failing to comply, an exceedingly unlikely scenario.
Such is our politic system. But just passing the measure is a win of sorts.
With the identification of the Capitol Pipe Bomber, the entire conspiracy around January 6 may be imploding. Complicity apparently even reaches to the BBC with the recent resignations of top executives there. The pipe bomber no identified using FBI software has been identified as a Capitol Police Officer who resigned the week before January 6 and the "bombs" were designed to pull security personnel away from other areas of the Capitol to allow radicals to incite the crowd. The person who planted the bombs then was hired by the CIA a short time after this all went down. This is beginning to look like the single most widespread scandal in modern history.
With the identification of the Capitol Pipe Bomber, the entire conspiracy around January 6 may be imploding. Complicity apparently even reaches to the BBC with the recent resignations of top executives there. The pipe bomber no identified using FBI software has been identified as a Capitol Police Officer who resigned the week before January 6 and the "bombs" were designed to pull security personnel away from other areas of the Capitol to allow radicals to incite the crowd. The person who planted the bombs then was hired by the CIA a short time after this all went down. This is beginning to look like the single most widespread scandal in modern history.
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Re: Post election prediction
what a bunch of little girls
Yep, that's Trump's preference, right there.
So from the recent email drop we know he appears, despite lying to you that he didn't. Crossed your line yet?
we know that he knew what Epstein was doing and, at best, did nothing. Crossed your line yet?
We know he spent a large amount of time alone with the one of the victims. Crossed your line yet?
We know that he moved Maxwell to a minimum security facility - with puppy - despite knowing what she had done. Crossed your line yet?
We know that Epstein had photos of him with girls in bikinis. Crossed your line yet?
We know that he "Blew Bubba" - though I kinda doubt Bubba was underage. Personally, I'm good with that one, he's allowed to. But I do wonder if it crosses a line for you.
Last edited by FunkyDexter; Nov 17th, 2025 at 05:53 AM.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
Well, for those who have been wanting to know what's in the Epstein files, there has been progress. The House will be sending the bill to the Senate. What's going to happen there? I have no idea.
It has been interesting watching this thing play out. If nothing else, it'll be good theater watching what happens next.
Wow, that was quick. It pasted both houses of congress (controlled by Republicans) in one day. That probably doesn't happen without Trump pushing for it.
The Epstein files don't really matter. Trump has been Trump for as long as he has been in the public eye, and probably longer. Back in the 80s, he espoused Democratic views, but was still a singularly horrible person. In the 90s, he became more ambiguous in his politics, yet remained a singularly horrible person. Since then he has espoused other views that enthused conservatives, but he hasn't changed.
Anybody who paid attention would note that his actions were appalling. Everybody who was around him acknowledged that he was a terrible person. Epstein isn't the first to say that. He isn't even the dozenth to say that.
Still, US politics is so broken for so many people that there were those who were willing to overlook his character flaws because he said some things that they wanted to hear. We have some serious issues with affordability, which neither party was addressing. He talked about it, so they listened. Had they paid attention to his business practices in the 80s and 90s, they would know that this WAS his business practice: Say what people want to hear to get them onside, then do whatever you want.
In any case, the Republican party has hitched their wagon to this horse and are now desperately trying to assert that they meant to go where it is taking them. People inside and outside of the party warned them that this was going to happen. Those inside were kicked out, and those outside are just denigrated. They have hitched their wagon to an amoral force, so they've had to pretend all the moral lines they once held no longer exist.
There is no line, because if you state a line, Trump just going to cross it. He has spoken to the right, he has spoken to the left, but the one constant throughout his entire life is that he has no moral compass. Those who have tied themselves to him, are now forced to go where this boat without a moral keel takes them and pretend that's the direction they always wanted to go.
Unfortunately, for some people, it IS the direction they wanted to go.
Still, US politics is so broken for so many people that there were those who were willing to overlook his character flaws because he said some things that they wanted to hear.
This is the key but I'd expand it to our whole government/capitalistic system.
Trump has his true believers but most of his votes came from people disgruntled with life as it is in the US. Trump told them what they wanted to hear. Which isn't new for a politician but the extent that people were willing to overlook Trumps flaws is exceptional.
I guess that really speaks to what people think about the current state of our country. Then again complaining is one of our national past times.
Yeah, it's the government system, but really at the top. The swamp is inside the beltway...in more ways than one, considering that DC was never very stable or dry ground, and it is now flooding more and more frequently. People thought, perhaps, that he really would drain the swamp.
The swamp is of our own creation, though. The politicians reflect an aspect of the people. There are strong divisions in views, which isn't being made any better when there is no common truth. I don't doubt their honesty in what they say, I just doubt that they are bad people....but the person they elected, he was always a terrible person.
He was fading out of the spotlight. He had blown through all his inheritance and was basically getting by on selling his family name. THEN came the Apprentice. And he was able to convince people he was important. The rest, as they say, is history.
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Re: Post election prediction
Trump has his true believers but most of his votes came from people disgruntled with life as it is in the US.
We've got the same phenomenon over here at the moment with Farage and Reform absolutely smashing it in our polls. They're good at identifying grievance, which seems to be enough for most people. They're not actually offering any solutions but that doesn't seem to matter.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney
The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney
The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber
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Re: Post election prediction
Yeah, the whole "double tap" thing is disturbing. Though I personally think bombing boats without any due process should qualify as extra judicial killing whether a second missile is required or not.
In more practical terms, why are you dropping hundred thousand dollar missiles on small boats when you could, e.g. simply pull up alongside them and board them for much less cost? As far as I can tell this is nothing but chest puffing ego.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
It's theatre. Everybody knows that this WILL fail, and how it will fail. We have decades of experience. If you shut down one avenue, the flow shifts to a different one.
In the late 80s, drug interdiction efforts boosted in the south Florida area, so drugs started coming into ports further up the east coast. So long as demand is very strong, there will be a great incentive to supply it.
On the other hand, Trump is fundamentally a coward at heart. He expects that people will cower before force, because that's what seems natural to him. Perhaps he really does think this will work.
If you shut down one avenue, the flow shifts to a different one.
Come on man, don't tell me you bought into this war on drugs nonsense. I'm from this region of the world, and everyone here knows this is pure high-grade bullshit. This is and has always been 100% about controlling Venezuela's oil. Nothing more, nothing less. The goal here is to install a puppet regime that obeys US dictates. [EDIT] Or to get Maduro's regime to bow to US dictates.
Originally Posted by FunkyDexter
...Though I personally think bombing boats without any due process should qualify as extra judicial killing..
The US violates international law as a matter of foreign policy. The US isn't doing anything here that it hasn't always been doing.
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney
The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber
It's theatre. Everybody knows that this WILL fail, and how it will fail. We have decades of experience. If you shut down one avenue, the flow shifts to a different one.
Trump obviously doesn't care about drugs coming into America, if he did why would he be pardoning people like Juan Orlando Hernandez or Ross William Ulbricht? Drugs are just his ongoing justification for doing whatever he wants to do.
It's theatre. Everybody knows that this WILL fail, and how it will fail. We have decades of experience. If you shut down one avenue, the flow shifts to a different one.
It's theatre. Everybody knows that this WILL fail, and how it will fail. We have decades of experience. If you shut down one avenue, the flow shifts to a different one.
In the late 80s, drug interdiction efforts boosted in the south Florida area, so drugs started coming into ports further up the east coast. So long as demand is very strong, there will be a great incentive to supply it.
On the other hand, Trump is fundamentally a coward at heart. He expects that people will cower before force, because that's what seems natural to him. Perhaps he really does think this will work.
On the other hand, Trump is fundamentally a coward at heart. He expects that people will cower before force, because that's what seems natural to him. Perhaps he really does think this will work.
Yeah, we've seen this movie several times. Attacking the supply chain just leads to a different supply chain. Trump is simple minded enough to think it will work because he doesn't spend much time thinking things through. Plus, he really doesn't care about solving the problem. As you said it's theater. And he will claim he has reduced the flow of drugs by 7,000%.
Yeah, the whole "double tap" thing is disturbing. Though I personally think bombing boats without any due process should qualify as extra judicial killing whether a second missile is required or not.
In more practical terms, why are you dropping hundred thousand dollar missiles on small boats when you could, e.g. simply pull up alongside them and board them for much less cost? As far as I can tell this is nothing but chest puffing ego.
I'm curious if we'll get a true account of what happened. Right now there's been nothing but accusations and denials.
The US and other Caribbean countries spend a lot on "pulling up alongside them". Been doing that for decades, it a big ocean and they're hard to catch. They catch some but most gets through. Using missiles wont have any long term success either.
As for "extra judicial killing". It truly is that and the worst part is it feels like most people here are OK with it. Then again, we've been dropping missiles into populated areas in the name of fighting terrorism for a long time.
Yeah, we've seen this movie several times. Attacking the supply chain just leads to a different supply chain. Trump is simple minded enough to think it will work because he doesn't spend much time thinking things through. Plus, he really doesn't care about solving the problem. As you said it's theater. And he will claim he has reduced the flow of drugs by 7,000%.
The thing is, this isn't even remotely possible as a supply chain, there is no way those boats could make the trip to America without having to refuel multiple times (in the order of 20 times). Just how much drugs could they carry on one of those boats, and would it really be worth the effort and risk to make such a crossing (and somehow have a second boat with fuel meet you several times) for the limited amount of drugs they could carry. Most of the profit would be taken up on fuel, plus the fuel for the refuelling vessel that would be following (so why aren't the drugs on that boat???).
As Niya said, this is 100% an attempt to gain access to oil reserves and killing innocent fishermen is a small price to pay as far as Trump and his followers are concerned.
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Originally Posted by dilettante
