What about birds of prey, birds that prey on other birds, would you eat eagles. falcons, osprey, and other large raptors?
Printable View
What about birds of prey, birds that prey on other birds, would you eat eagles. falcons, osprey, and other large raptors?
I would try them, but like here in Louisiana, shooting eagles are illegal. However, vultures... you can forget about.
I didn't, really. It's just all there was.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
That would have worked to some extent. It doesn't allow you to determine the start and end of the message because you wouldn't be able to determine whether to read N-S, or E-W without trial and error, though you'd be able to make a very good guess IF the message left significant numbers of bits at the end.Quote:
I don't quite see the problem, you just zero fill the last few unused bytes and it is then possible to determine exactly where the start and end of the message are.
Still, I wanted the red in there for aesthetic reasons, as mentioned earlier. After all, the real point of the excersize was to not have to mow as much grass, and to have a nice patio in my back yard. The binary pattern was just an easter egg.
Historically, the byte may have been the number of bits used to encode a single character of text in a computer, but also historically: There was no rule that a byte had to be 8 bits. Other size bytes have been used on various old systems. The 8-bit byte is nice because it's a power of 2, but a seven bit byte is more compact and does the job just as well, while a 9 bit byte allows for error checking built into the byte. So, both have been used at times.Quote:
However, an 8 bit binary pattern would have needed no introduction or special markers, e.g. "Historically, the byte was the number of bits used to encode a single character of text in a computer" - wiki
True. That is the main role, but not the ONLY role.Quote:
You designed your binary pattern so that red functions as a visual character delimiter, so that is their main role in the pattern.
The message is still there and is not destroyed. I already stated the only rules needed to read it.Quote:
I am not convinced that you can use red tiles for multiple purposes if doing so interferes with or destroys the message you encoded.
Got it wrong, once again. The equals sign is usually reversible. If A = B then B = A, and that is not the case here. Character delimiter = Red, but Red != character delimiter. So, the equals sign is a poor choice, and you wrote it backwards anyways. I've stated it correctly at least four times, including the text you quoted, and you STILL got it wrong. That's what the whole thing has been about. You stubbornly ignore what I'm actually saying in favor of a slight, but fallatious, misconstruction. Get that piece sorted in your own head and you will see that the pattern is not flawed.Quote:
Red = character delimiter, got it.
That's true. Fill at the end of the message would appear to be vertical based on the point of view of the picture. The top of the picture is North, too, so you are correct in saying that the reading is on the N-S axis rather than E-W (though I leave it up to you whether it is south to north or north to south).Quote:
Further the only obvious 7 bit pattern occurs reading the pattern bottom to top (rather than from left to right or right to left) in the pic your posted, meaning that any fill at the end of your message should only occur vertically rather than horizontally.
Well, no, the red is there to make the back yard more visually pleasing, as the tan and gray bricks are relatively low contrast.Quote:
The red is there to trick you into thinking it is a trinary pattern when it is actually a binary pattern.
By now, not only do I doubt that you are quoting me correctly, I also doubt that you are understanding the words I used correctly, but I'm not going to go figure out which post you are quoting from several pages back. If you want to give me a post number, I will go have a look. Otherwise, I'm going to assume you made that up.Quote:
You originally said that the extra red tiles throw off the binary pattern.
Just follow the rules that exist, not the ones you want to exist.Quote:
Extra red tiles laid in the wrong place can easily throw off the pattern.
Sure, but neither of those are practical solutions. You can't seriously have a gap without something in it. If I didn't add vegetation, nature would take care of that on its own. I could have made some kind of planter every eigth tile, except that it would make for a HORRIBLE patio. Half tiles would be better than that, but would look terrible, as the rows of bricks would sometimes line up and other times not line up. Keep in mind, that the ultimate goal was to have a backyard patio, not to write a message. The message is secondary.Quote:
Although a 7 bit pattern would be a tricky pattern to spot. A gap or a couple of half tiles could also have functioned as a delimiter.
The end of the message is on the other picture, which I didn't add to this thread.Quote:
But the extra red tiles do, particularly as they do not seem to function as fill at the end of the message.
The latest line of discussion is dangerous. I had forgotten about the moral superiority of eating carnivores.
As I was headed home two days ago, I noticed a squirrel sitting on a railing eating something. What it was eating looked kind of odd, and I was on the fourth floor of a parking garage, so it wasn't like the squirrel was sitting near the ground eating a nut. Therefore, I got out of the car to get a better look at what the squirrel was eating: It was a bird.
I then turned on the radio and caught a mention of somebody talking about seeing cute, furry, woodland creatures and bright, colorful, birds. At which point I thought, "I just saw a cute, furry, woodland creature eating a bird. Does that count?"
People may not think of squirrels as carnivores, as they generally are not...but sometimes they are. Deer have been observed eating chicks, too. It's all a lot fuzzier than people expect.
I love squirrel and I love deer, but Witis asked about non-mammals.
That's easy... you eat the tasty ones!Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
Just all there was, you mean you didn't set out to make your backyard into an homage to the colour red?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Excatly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Yes you must like the colour red, a lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
How many folks have discovered and deciphered your egg thus far?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
But everyone knows it is eight bit binary which is most likely to hold characters. 8DQuote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
At last Shaggy agrees that the red tiles are the delimiter!Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
How can that be when you added some extra red tiles to throw a visual error and interfere with or destroy the meaning in the message?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Do you mean the rules that you invented a couple of days ago to cover up your anti-binary behaviours, and that can't be deduced by anyone looking at the message?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Nah, the main role of the red tiles is to act as a character delimiter, you just agreed a second ago in your post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
No, I have established that the red tiles are the delimiter but you have still not clarified the role of the extra red tiles you added. In your last post you said they were fill at the end of the pattern, what are they now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
So if they are not fill at the end of the message what is the purpose of those extra red tiles?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
More visually pleasing, yes, red is his colour.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Post #55823 "I also see that there are some extra red bricks in the upper left corner of that picture, which are now covered by a raised bed, but would throw off the pattern in the picture."Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
You mean that you want me to follow the rules that you invented a couple of days ago to cover up your furtive anti-binary behaviours. No thanks. Those rules cannot be deduced by anyone and therefore cannot apply, instead it seems very clear that you added the extra red tiles to throw an error and obstruct or block any attempts to decipher the encoded message.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Sure they are, a gap and half tiles are both relatively cheap and easy ways to create a delimiter in the pattern.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Use your imagination Shaggy, a gap can definitely work as a delimiter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Sniff, you used to care about binary.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
So what are those red tiles doing in the picture you posted?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Why so many quotes in all y'all's post?!
I didn't say that it was morally superior to eat carnivores, however, using science to determine the moral character of each animal might come in handy. =^.^=Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
To be fair, nobody has had the chance. None of my friends are computer geeks, so they wouldn't bother, and those who could were all family, so they knew about it before I wrote it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
No. Once again you are getting it wrong. The delimiters are red tiles, but red tiles are not delimiters. If you say it correctly, you will (possibly) think about it correctly.Quote:
At last Shaggy agrees that the red tiles are the delimiter!
That's kind of funny, actually. It proves itself to be wrong, which makes it kind of a clever paradox.Quote:
Do you mean the rules that you invented a couple of days ago to cover up your anti-binary behaviours, and that can't be deduced by anyone looking at the message?
You don't get to establish anything. The rules are what they are. You decided that they are something else and you are trying to state that the pattern is wrong because it doesn't fit with your mistaken conception of the rules.Quote:
No, I have established that the red tiles are the delimiter but you have still not clarified the role of the extra red tiles you added. In your last post you said they were fill at the end of the pattern, what are they now?
They are both cheap and easy, to be sure. The half tiles would only appeal to somebody with no taste, though, because your columns would line up at times, then not, then line up again. Humans (and quite possibly other animals) appear to be hard coded to find such patterns unappealing. We like to follow lines, and that would create jaggedness. Gaps would have a different problem, as they would be filled in by weeds....and would otherwise be tripping hazards, which is far from ideal in a patio.Quote:
Sure they are, a gap and half tiles are both relatively cheap and easy ways to create a delimiter in the pattern.
Squirrels "are predominantly herbivorous, subsisting on seeds and nuts, but many will eat insects and even small vertebrates" (wiki) i.e. they are actually omnivores unless they cannot digest the insects and vertebrates they consume. As far as I am aware deer are herbivores not omnivores.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
I hope you mean you love them rather than love to eat them, and yes I did ask about non-mammals.Quote:
Originally Posted by dday9
Would you murder an animal just because it tastes good?Quote:
Originally Posted by homer13j
Ah yes, that one. Combine the fact that I used pattern to mean two different things in the previous posts, plus your dubious reading comprehension....and I'll just leave it at that. It was a poor choice of words on my part, that's for sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
Well, I wouldn't for any OTHER reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
They are generally considered to be. They don't have the teeth for eating meat, but something like a chick, which can be eaten hole, they have been known to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
Hmmm, that confirms my suspicions, you added the extra red tiles, and no-one has deciphered your message. Would you now call the addition of the extra red tiles a success?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
I dunno Shaggy it doesn't read like you are making too much sense to me, I think clarifying the role of the extra red tiles is the key.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Where is the error?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Too late, I have already established that the main role of the red tiles is to act as a character delimiter and you agreed. =)Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
I merely noticed the obvious error you inserted into your binary pattern, then you tried to cover it up by inventing some rules. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
You can use two half tiles to make everything line up neatly, and I am sure that you can work out how to insert a gap without generating a tripping hazard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Yes, that post. I can only call it an unambiguous anti-binary confession.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
°o°!Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Hmmm, but if they cannot digest meat then they can only be classified as herbivores.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Only if you have a tenuous grasp of logic. The fact that nobody has tried doesn't equate to it being impossible, it just means that nobody has tried.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
I clarified very explicitly about six times (inlcuding the last two posts), you simply ignore it or feverse it each time. That's why I'm saying it is you. You can't seem to get over the idea, which was your own, that...well, I can't say it, or you'll quote it out of context. It just comes down to me saying that A is always B, which you consistently interpret to mean that B is also always A, which is not true.Quote:
I think clarifying the role of the extra red tiles is the key.
It's kind of clever, because you managed to make up the case, then stated that the case couldn't be made up. You stated that I created the rules a couple days ago, then go on to state that the rules "can't be deduced by anyone looking at the message". So...how did I deduce the rules a few days ago if nobody can do so by looking at the message? Did I not figure them out from looking at the message, and if so, then where did I get them from? They do happen to be sufficient for interpreting the message, which you don't dispute (a good thing, because they happen to be sufficient), and you say that I didn't have them before a few days ago, so where did they come from?Quote:
Where is the error?
I don't have a problem with you saying that they are mainly used as a character delimiter. By number or frequency, that is clearly true. The issue I have is with you then going on to assume that that that is the SOLE role they serve, which is not true.Quote:
Too late, I have already established that the main role of the red tiles is to act as a character delimiter and you agreed. =)
But you said that nobody could do that, so I must not have done that. How could I be doing something that you have proven I could not have done.Quote:
I merely noticed the obvious error you inserted into your binary pattern, then you tried to cover it up by inventing some rules. :p
As for the first one, rather than the hassle of cutting two tiles in half (and having to decide whether that should be a gray or tan tile that I cut, or half of each), couldn't I just use a tile of a different color? As for inserting a gap...no, I don't believe I can work that out. How about a suggestion?Quote:
You can use two half tiles to make everything line up neatly, and I am sure that you can work out how to insert a gap without generating a tripping hazard.
They can digest what they need to from that. Whether they are interested in the meat is a question I don't know the answer to. What they certainly ARE interested is in the minerals that go into the bones. Those are found in meat, as well, to some extent. The assumption I have seen is that minerals are the reason rather than protein, but I have never seen any study on meat consumption in deer to look at what they are and are not digesting from what they eat.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
On the other hand, owl pellets are made up of the indigestible parts of what they eat, so there's a carnivore that is not digesting all parts of its meals, either.
Really? That's ALL?Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
Binary Talk == Puppy Talk?
Close enough.
By far my favorite one. Mostly because I like HouseQuote:
Originally Posted by dday9
Did you add the extra red tiles to throw a visual error and make it difficult to decipher the message, or to make it impossible to decipher the message?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Not true, most recently you tried to tell me that you added the extra horizontal red tiles as fill at the end of your message, then admitted the end of the message was not even in that picture and that any such fill would have to be vertical rather than horizontal, and then you failed to explain the actual role of the extra red tiles even when I asked you directly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Anyone looking at the pattern would, as I did, instantly recognise that the extra red tiles are obviously there to obstruct or block anyone from reading the message, and you even admitted the extra tiles throw off the pattern. Then you changed your mind and forged rather than deduced some new rules a couple of days ago, and simultaneously tried to retract your admission regarding the extra tiles. The truth is that those extra tiles throw a clear red visual error through your binary encoded message and removing those tiles, not a difficult job as it is only a few tiles, is the only way to remove the error. I don't imagine you have managed to con anyone into believing your new rules should be taken seriously.:pQuote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
True, you also use them to throw an error in your binary pattern.:cry:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
I think you have to clarify what you mean there Shaggy, as it is does not make any sense to me. I never stated that it was impossible to throw an error by inserting extra red tiles, nor did I indicate that it was impossible for you to forge some new rules in an attempt to cover up the act of inserting the error into you message that way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
It is zero fill, so half tiles are in which ever colour represents zero. Also using more than two colours to represent binary is just not very intuitive and will make anyone looking at the pattern think it is anything other than binary.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
In the absence of any evidence suggesting that deer can digest meat, I can only view them as herbivores.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Owls are definitely carnivores. "Like other birds of prey many owl species exhibit reverse sexual dimorphism in size, where females are larger than males (as opposed to the more typical situation in birds where males are larger)" - wikiQuote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
That confession is enough for me!Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Why can you hear a lot of barrking?Quote:
Originally Posted by dday9
If you think about it, a cow is basically just concentrated grass. Thus by eating steak I am merely engaging in a more efficient form of vegetarianism.Quote:
If God didn't want us to eat animals he wouldn't have made them out of tasty meat.
Doin' my bit for the planet.
°o°!Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkyDexter
Are you really happy slitting their throats just because cows taste good even though they have committed no crime?
Isn't killing something without just cause called murder?
What about switching to fish?
Why do you feel fish are so inferior?Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
That's not really a flippant question, either. If you see killing a cow as wrong, how is it that you see killing a fish is fine?
Cows are herbivores, they don't out looking to make a kill, they might defend themselves if they have to to stop themselves from being eaten which makes them innocent creatures. Also they have a relatively placid nature when left to graze on their own adding more support for their case. If they were humans they would represent law abiding citizens, and the word vaccine is derived from the latin for cow. ˚ᵕ˚
By contrast fish are designed entirely differently. In the case of the grey nurse shark their criminal behaviours begin during pregnancy where there are approximately 20 shark pups in each uterus, the fastest developing pups eat all the other pups until there is only one pup left in each uterus - that's fratricide.
They will eat each other just for the hell of it - that's homicide and cannibalism.
Also they never stop growing, meaning that if you created a robotic shark it would continue to eat and grow until it takes over the universe, unless you kill it first.
So by eating fish you are saving the universe.
./\ /\
>°.°<
.''" "''
It certainly isn't for the hell of it. There's a reason for that. You see it all over the place, too. There are lots of birds where the first born will push the rest out of the nest, or kill them. When a new queen bee hatches, it will generally sting and kill any other queen pupae not yet hatched. This isn't done for the hell of it, it's done because of competition for limitted resources.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witis
As for cows and sheep, they have been bred domestically for thousands of years. We weren't breeding hostility or territoriality into them, for sure. Non-domestic animals don't play so nicely. Elk, deer, and every other ungulate that I am aware of, will kill each other. Deer have eaten baby birds, and it is likely that cows will, too. Pigs can be vicious, as can all domesticated fowl.
Meanwhile, you mention only sharks. Do you eat sharks? Maybe you do, but you have shown several pictures of salmon nigiri. Salmon do eat other fish, including other salmon (if they can), but not all fish do. How about tilapia? Do you not eat tilapia since they are vegetarian?
By the way, do you eat mushrooms? Do you care whether they are parasitic?
You can't just dismiss the flawed design and criminal behaviours of the piscine pests as mere competition as there are plenty of animals that compete over resources and do not commit fratricide, do not engage in cannibalism, and will not grow until they take over the universe. Mammals are classic examples as they do not typically murder each other merely to fill their bellies, and cannot grow indefinitely and take over the universe. Birds that are not raptors are another good example, they often mate for life and cannot grow indefinitely, although there are some exceptions like the boobies that do behave badly by letting one chick kill all of the others until there is only one left in each season - hence the expression booby prize. Cuckoos are another bad exception:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SO1WccH2_YM
I'd eat a cuckoo clock. All of the birds of prey also behave very badly.
I am not sure that I believe your assertion that elk, deer, etc will kill each other, they might get into a rut in breeding season, they might tire each other out in battles over females, they might even injure each other, but I do not believe you that their intent is to murder each other. Although I'd be interested to read about precisely how viscous pigs can be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
One of my aims is to dine on some mako shark if I can get hold of some, and a good chef. Salmon are tasty, and I eat a lot of salmon each week, same goes for tuna. As far as tilapia goes, it is slightly more difficult to make a case against them, and marine iguanas, as they only consume vegetable matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
Sure I eat edible mushrooms, they have a root stock which allows them to continue to grow even after the fruit are picked, although I would not eat any of the poisonous or parasitic species, for example like those:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgkL8PulPdE