*Resolved* CD Burner Blues......

[Jethro]

Ok brought a pack of silver 10 speed disks. Burnt one, and can't play it on the stereo....bummer....mind you Nero (burning software) pointed out this may be the case.

Have l gone way cheap on this? Would l have better luck with the gold CDs, and what type of CD should l be getting....

[scoutt]

the colors make no difference. I had a discussion when the gold ones came out and it got pretty hairy. so in the long run the colors don't make a difference. did you finalize it?

[Behemoth]

certain CD players just don't like CDR/CDRWs. Mine jumps a lot when I play a CDR(W), one of my g/fs just doesn't recognise there's a disc in at all. approximately half of the stereos I have access to will play them. Not sure about the quality of the disc, but I don't imagine so.

[Jethro]

Originally posted by scoutt
the colors make no difference. I had a discussion when the gold ones came out and it got pretty hairy. so in the long run the colors don't make a difference. did you finalize it?

Finalize it??????????

Using Nero burning software, and the burnt disk works on the rigs CD player, but not on the Denon 5 disk hooked into the stereo. Nero leaped on the ten speed being the problem, was wondering if maybe a higher speed would be more successful.

Behemoth

Old 12 speed CD drive wouldn't read the gold disks...fixed by upgrading to 40 speed, damn cd drives are cheap now adays...

[scoutt]

yeah finalize it, in other words close the cd-r so you can't add more to it. some cd players won't read an open cd-r.

you should be able oot burn at 2x and still be able to play it.

[Si_the_geek]

I have nero set up to not close/finalise discs when written, that will make them unreadable by most cd players - I can't remember where the option is or exactly what it is called (not at my own pc).

Some CD players (especially older ones) will occasionally skip on CD-R's, and the chances of this increase the faster the CD has been written.

[Jethro]

All righty am looking for a close/finalize option somewhere...guess it's RTFM time..


Thanks for the answers, as you can probably tell am a newbie to this burning game....

[scoutt]

in Nero if you click on the burn button and that windows comes up, you will see the speed it burns at and it will say simulate, write, and finalize with checkboxes right next to them.

[Jethro]

Originally posted by scoutt
in Nero if you click on the burn button and that windows comes up, you will see the speed it burns at and it will say simulate, write, and finalize with checkboxes right next to them.

Cool


Hey D, check the checkboxes and we are in business.....

[Jethro]

Disclaimer.....am not pirating music CDs by the way... making up some techno mixes etc.....

[Behemoth]

so any CD player should be able to play an audio CDR if it has been closed?

[scoutt]

Jethro: oh sure you aren't

Behemoth: Generally yes, but some will be so old that they just won't read cd-r or cd-rw.

now, on cd burners, they can read them if they are closed or not, it's just the regular cd players that seem to have trouble.

[Jethro]

Originally posted by Behemoth
so any CD player should be able to play an audio CDR if it has been closed?

That's what l'm hoping to find. Will try it and report back on results.

[Behemoth]

that doesnt really explain it for me. are there some stereo cd players that will play open cds? I'm using Adaptec and I'm pretty sure I've done it right...

[Si_the_geek]

only some recently made cd-players will play cd-rw's, I'm assuming you'll need one of them to play an open CD.

[Behemoth]

See, thats what doesn't make sense to me. In both my house and my girlfriends house, its the older players that play properly. The newer ones tend to be awkward.

[Jethro]

Originally posted by Si_the_geek
only some recently made cd-players will play cd-rw's, I'm assuming you'll need one of them to play an open CD.

But...we are okay with closed ones right


Oh bugger it will just try it out.....

[scoutt]

Originally posted by Behemoth
See, thats what doesn't make sense to me. In both my house and my girlfriends house, its the older players that play properly. The newer ones tend to be awkward.

that is the strange part. I have had 4x cd players red a cd-r cd-rw adn some that will not. so it really is hard to say about that.

[Jethro]

Hmmm...could be they are trying to stop pirating of CDS by encoding the players now days.....

DVD players case in point. Regional settings, manufacturers offer a fix to play any region, DVD producers re-engineer to beat the fix...

[scoutt]

that is a good pint but when I tried it was like 2 years ago whne cd-r were coming into play. so I don't think they had any idea that is was happening.

[Jethro]

Okay for public expierment, and considering number of replies seems to be some confusion on this will...

1. Will finalize a burn and test it on CD

2. Will get a gold CD, finalize and test

Will report back on results...

[mastermind94]

Originally posted by scoutt
the colors make no difference. I had a discussion when the gold ones came out and it got pretty hairy. so in the long run the colors don't make a difference. did you finalize it?

the color does make a difference. It is the power and the way that the laser is reflected to the photo detector. Some old CD-roms or Cd-Player, even new ones doesn't have good laser so, it wont reflect right.

that's it is telling u that there is no Cd in or it cannot read or it is skippy.

Also, try to use 74Mins CDs. 80Mins and 90Mins aren't recommended for Cd-Audio, the groove is to close from the end of the disc. Some servo motors might not reach it.

[Behemoth]

probably worth experimenting in a couple of CD players

[scoutt]

Originally posted by mastermind94
the color does make a difference. It is the power and the way that the laser is reflected to the photo detector. Some old CD-roms or Cd-Player, even new ones doesn't have good laser so, it wont reflect right.

I thought that was the case. I had fought with this guys a couple of years ago and he swore up and down that it doesn't matter, now that you say that it comes back to me that I was right in the first palce.

the car cd players don't have that strong of enough laser so the gold ones were the only ones to use, but I use a silver color and it runs in my 8 year old clarion cd player in my truck.

if I remember right the gold cd-r's were the only ones to reflect the laser back to the reader so it would play right. but now-a-days the newer stuff works just fine.

[Jethro]

Originally posted by scoutt

I thought that was the case. I had fought with this guys a couple of years ago and he swore up and down that it doesn't matter, now that you say that it comes back to me that I was right in the first palce.

the car cd players don't have that strong of enough laser so the gold ones were the only ones to use, but I use a silver color and it runs in my 8 year old clarion cd player in my truck.

if I remember right the gold cd-r's were the only ones to reflect the laser back to the reader so it would play right. but now-a-days the newer stuff works just fine.

Nope our Denon cd player, (studio quality professional...and before you ask, no didn't pay full price we know some one who works for the importer here and the box was damaged )
wont play the silver ones...70min.

Will try the gold ones and see what happens.

[Behemoth]

how many CD players do you have in your house? I'm interested in what sort of coverage we've got here...

[Jethro]

Hmmm thinking four, two in rig, l five disc player on stereo, and one in a portable....oops and l guess Robbies play station plays them as well...hmmm and the car...that's about all.

[DragonFly]

Dang beat me too it

[Jethro]

Originally posted by DragonFly
Dang beat me

Do l have to wear the Darth Vader outfit this time

[DragonFly]

Originally posted by Jethro


Do l have to wear the Darth Vader outfit this time

Oh god,....alright you can be Princess Leia...............again!



But you forgot to mention that we have played burnt gold cd's before in the Denon, no worries......

[Jethro]

The Paul Mac EP was burnt on gold....okay problem solved will purchase some today...


I was kinda hopping to be Chewbucca this time round

[Beacon]

Stuff it go get Adaptec CD Creator i have 700mb cd's full of music and havent found a cd player that wont play them!!

Converts your mp3's to .cda if you want as well.

[Jethro]

Originally posted by Beacon
Stuff it go get Adaptec CD Creator i have 700mb cd's full of Britney Spears music and havent found a cd player that wont play them!!

But you have probably run out of neighbours and flatmates by now

[Beacon]

LOL!

[Harrild]

Well in my experience, Adaptec is crap and slow, Nero copies just about everything and for the CD player being able to play them, well that's just bad luck.

Screw Adaptec, Nero RULES!!

Oh the finalize option is under the BURN tab, but if you're buring to a CDR you don't need to finalize, it doesn't make a difference

[Behemoth]

Im using Adaptec and I've never had any trouble, other than this, and I think Ive this problem with CDs burnt from both...

[Si_the_geek]

I have burnt literally hundreds of CD's over the years (one of my mate bought a writer as soon as they came out, and I had to work it all out for him...). I currently have access to about 10 different writers (mainly at work), there is no significant difference between them even though there should be (supercheap £60 'LG' gives same results as £150 Plextor burnproof).

I play the CD's in about 15 different players (home/work computers, 2 hifi's, cd-walkman, in-car cd player, friends hifi's...), and all of them play all closed/finalised CD-Rs no problem (but only a couple play open ones).

I use Adaptec and Nero software, and have unfortunately used a few others too that were just complete pants... In my opinion Nero is the best, but I haven't noticed any difference in quality between the two (for copies or new CDs) - I just prefer the interface of Nero.

The speed you write the CD does make a difference - the faster you write the less likely it is to play without skipping every now and then.

my god I'm going on a bit! final thing - the media hasn't made a difference to me, all types of disk play for me in all players (silver, gold, blue, green, 74/80 mins..). The reason for different colours is their endurance - some colours stay better for longer, the best I know of is Kodak's silver & gold mix.

My sister just leaves her CD's lying around to get scratched really badly, and CD-Rs get damaged more easily - the Kodak ones are almost as good as normal CD's.

phew! I'm exhausted after all that typing!

[Behemoth]

very nice, thanks Si.

Following that logic, do you think I could get my burned CDs to play on the offending CD players if I burned them at a slower speed?

[Si_the_geek]

Originally posted by Behemoth
very nice, thanks Si.

Following that logic, do you think I could get my burned CDs to play on the offending CD players if I burned them at a slower speed?

Hopefully, but if the disc isn't recognised at all I can only assume that you aren't closing it properly... when I've had that problem I've just re-written the CD and it's worked fine.

[Behemoth]

found this. thought it might be handy...

http://www.tape.com/techinfo/cdraudio.html

particularly this part -

BLUE DYE vs. GOLD DYE
As we said, a blank CD-R disc contains a layer of dye in a
preformed spiral groove. The laser burns pits in the dye. Two
types of dye are in use: blue or gold. The blue dye, which
appears green because of the gold backing, is Cyanine. The gold
dye is Phthalocyanine.
What are the differences? Mitsui claims that gold dye is more
durable and reliable than blue dye when exposed to heat,
humidity, and light. "Unlike a Cyanine based CD-R, which shows
degeneration from continuous exposure to light and heat under
Carbon Arc Lamp testing, Mitsui's Phthalocyanine based CD-R
remains durable and remarkably stable throughout the entire test
exposure time of 180 hours.
"Mitsui CD-Rs' projected longetivity was tested by employing
the Orange Book Standard for Block Error Rate (BLER) set by the
industry for CD-Recordable media. The Phthalocyanine-based
Mitsui CD-R was subjected to 80 degrees Celsius and 85% RH for
over 1000 continuous hours, the equivalent of more than 100 years
under normal use. The Mitsui CD-R was consistently able to
retain data and outperform the Orange Book Standard."
According to Dana Paker in the Incat Systems Web pages,
"Cyanine dye is the de facto standard; the Orange Book was
written based on the original cyanine dye discs from Taiyo Yuden.
Most CD-Recorders are optimized for cyanine dye. Cyanine discs
are compatible with a wider range of laser powers.
"Phthalocyanine dye has performed better than cyanine dye in
accelerated age testing, and may work better in higher speed
recording (which requires higher laser powers.)
"However, all of these differences aside, it appears that in
most cases, the two types of discs perform in essentially the
same ways -- it's at the extremes and in the worst-case
scenarios where these differences appear most marked."