Learning VB6 ----> How did you do it?

[Sal]

Hello Everyone,

What a great forum. Lots of people willing to help if you have the patience to wait for a response. (I do)

Question:

How did everyone learn VB? I am thinking about taking a course this summer from a local community college. It is about 10 weeks long, and is one of three courses for VB, ie., VB-1, VB-2, and then VB-3. These are all 10 week courses, so it would take me about a year and a half to complete these, unless they accelerate them. I think it is going to cost around $250. Lot better than the expense of those $1500 seminars. Maybe they are good for experienced programmers.

I have books, but the books usually cover blanket stuff. I had a question about locating the exact record in a database using VB. I could not find the answer in $100 worth of books. Finally, got some really good help from Lana on database structures, which I am still learning.

Is it possible to be a "complete" programmer just by knocking around with books, and online forums? It seems to me that it is not possible to fully harness the power of VB through the use of books and online tips. Maybe it is, but for now, my perspective is that it isn't possible.

I would like some feedback from you folks here in this forum. There seems to be quite a few youngsters banging out serious code. Is that from high-school classes or just knocking around? I am 34 and seem to have a fun, but challenging project ahead, especially with a wife and kid, and full-time job.

Talk to me,
Sal

[V(ery) Basic]

I think it is possible to know all you need to know about VB
with books. But the thing is you have to buy a hell of a lot
of books . You need a book about API, Databases, Graphics
ActiveX, Dlls, and two or three that cover them all. This
will end up costing you more than the course but if
you take a course, you've got nothing to refer to (ie if you
forget something you learned on a course you can't 'look it
up' but you can with a book )

So I would do a bit of both: some courses and some books

Just my common sense

[noone]

IMHO it is possible to learn all you need to know about VB from books and the internet (the wonders of the net). Specialy courses on Databases might help but theres a lot of information out there for free if your willing to look and suffer through trial and error.

[Sam Finch]

I got a Job about a year ago, I'd used VB3 when I was about 14 but when I started at my job I didn't even know you could use Variables in VB, I just used hidden textboxes, I was taught about classmodules on my first day and as there was very little work for me to do I was just left to experiment all day and learnt a lot through trial and error, I went back to Uni 3 months later, having learnt on my last day what a Standard module was and that there was this Thing called the API that could change window shapes and other majical things, then I got a few books on the API and taught Myself though Trial and error, I found this site about a month ago and learnt a lot through trying to solve the problems that come up, VB is relly easy to learn, And there's huge amounts of books on the subject, you just have to be prepared to guess what might be going on and see if something works, otherwise people on here will help.

[Sal]

This is very encouraging. I am off to Barnes & Nobles in a few minutes. You know, I get this warm fuzzy and emotional "thing" going on after I have struggled for a few days on a resolution to a problem, and then it works. It's like yea, "Who's your daddy!", well, ok, make it "I'm the man!", ...ah, ...you know what I mean. I guess a more intelligible way to communicate this would be to say I am elated when a resolution surfaces no matter how the resolution came to be.

I think I will give this course a try, although I now think that an exhaustive library is in order.

Thanks for the comments,
Keep em' comin'
Sal

Oh, by the way... How do you get those silly little icons at the ends of sentences?

[Raydr]

I started off in QBasic (who didn't?), got my hands on vb3, then kept moving up to vb6.

Learned through looking at other programs, reading books. I found these vb programming sites only a month ago, but I've already been selling some of my programs.

(Even had Visual Basic for DOS

[Sal]

Interesting!

i would recommend taking a course just to get your hands dirty, but courses will not get you that far. i started off taking vb3 and qbasic 3 years ago in 9th grade. that helped to explain the basics, because before that i have never programmed before, but like i said it only taught basics. but after taking 2 semesters of that programming class, i had a rough idea of how VB works. now its been 2 years after that and i have taught myself everything i know which is quite a lot. so without those classes i would have been too frustrated too start off without any help. so take those classes, it can't do you any harm.

[Sal]

Sounds good. I think you are right, it will give me a solid foundation. I feel like an automechanic, who knows say how to rebuild a waterpump, but who doesn't know what a piston is. I am really good in certain areas, and limited in others.

By the way, I accidentally copied one of those silly icons onto a form. I can't get it off. Try using right clicking on one of those icons, then chose copy, then goto a form and paste it. Then try to remove it.

[Paul282]

I started with some obscure version of basic years ago and fell out of programming for quite a few years, got back into it through Qbasic.

Started VB5 2 years ago and didn't really know what I was doing, I was only used to normal structured code and not the event driven model.

A couple of beginners books got me on my feet and from there it's just practise.

Just program something, anything. If you can't think of anything to do then come here, read a problem and try to solve it on you're own. Pick the ones you're interested in.

That way you help others too.

The only way to learn is to DO !
(at least it was for me)

[Glenn]

A lot depends on your background. When I started to learn VB3 many years ago I came from a programming background of Fortran, C and Pascal at that point I already knew the basics of programming. With VB 3 I just had to learn about the tricks of event driven programming. I learned using mostly books and magazine articles (VB Programmers Journal). Since having now progressed through VB4, VB5 and now VB6 I have purchased specializied books in certain key areas (API, Active X, etc..) and have attend 1 mastering course.

I believe there are 2 aspects of programming:

#1 Is learning to program, this is not language specific. This is learning about algorithms, programming constructs and problem solving.

#2 is learning the language.

I believe #1 is best taught in classes. Having taught VB classes at a local technical college I think it's best to look for a class taught by someone from the field. All to often instructor know how to teach the curriculum, but don't have a clue about anything beyond the curriclum.

Just my 2 cents worth

34 huh??? :-) well I'm 39 and still learning. I purchased VB 6 Pro about 6 months ago, read some tutorials and then decided developing my own program solutions wasn't for me.

Now I am back learning with a vengenance! For a Data base start I purchased 'Beginning Database with VB6' by John Percifield, 'VB for Dummies', and just recently 'Learning VB6 in 24 hrs'.

Between the three books, looking at source code, and these forums... I'm slowly beginning to absorb the language.

Now I have some ideas of products I wish to develop and market to other in the field of direct sales.

I'll be watching and learning from you! :-) I would love to take a course but I hate testings and my schedule doesn't allow for a fixed day and time to be somewhere. I enjoy my freedom.

~ vbMarketer

[Thai]

Just thought I'd throw in my 2 cents.. I started VB about 2-3 months ago.. Before VB I learned BASIC and wrote a retail store s/w for my work, it went fairly well and I needed to step it up a notch so I descided VB would do the trick.. I grabbed some VB books and surfed the net for about 2 weeks and I just hacked away after that. I have bought about 3 books in the process, Professional Databaes Using VB 6, VB6 Superbible (GREAT Reference) and VB 6 Programmer's Guide (not recommended, didn't help).. I've finished the 32bit app of my s/w about 3 weeks ago, it uses ADO for the database. I pretty much taught myself through these forums and the books, so I do believe you don't need a class to learn to program =) Im 19 years old and attend college, but they haven't taught me anything useful.

good luck,
Thai

[YoungBuck]

I took two courses on VB5 back in '98 and I was completely new to programming except for one Intro to Programming course which really wasn't very enlightening all books and no computers. However what I learned in those few months is nothing compared to what I have learned from books outside the classroom and especially the net (and this forum of course ). So my advice is if you are new to programming completely the courses would probably be a big help but if you're not I'd just go at it on your own.

[Glenn]

I may have not stated it very well in my earlier post, but I agree with YoungBuck. If you have programming expierence, get some books an go to it !!

However if your just starting out I think a class in which good programming practices are taught is indispensable.

[Sal]

Wow, Incredible response! :-) Well, here is my life story,...maybe not the whole thing. I was given a TI-994/A computer in about eighth grade, which came with a book called "Basic". I was really intrigued(is that spelled right?) by the book and started putting out some basic programs and saving them to a small cassette tape. That was my last computer until about twelve years later. Bought VB3 back in the early 90's with the intentions of developing a program for my job. Big corporation, Airline company. Well, they came out with the exact solution to what I had in mind just a few months later, and on CD-Rom. Couldn't compete with that, ...they didn't even have cd-burners out then. Well, now, another brainstorm. This is a program for pilots, more of a knowledge base refresher/testing program for annual reviews.

So here I am, with a newer version of VB and some familiarity with the language of Basic. It sometimes seem that you have a big challenge ahead of you. But, when the solutions start coming , the need for a class is in question. On the other hand, when there seems to be no solution in sight, the need for a teacher becomes a desire.

Thus, this forum is a great resource for us all who are aspiring to learn VB. It is also wise it seems to have a great wealth of material on hand in the form of books.

I think I'm going to take this VB course online. That would be more compatible with my schedule. I have made great progress with my current project. It is coming along quite nicely.

Keep the comments coming,
Sal

[Sal]

By the way... How many hours are you folks spending on the pc a day?

Well, I started VB 6 at the end of January. I am taking a visual basic programming class. Personally, I know I would have NEVER learned as much on my own as I did in this class, at least not in the same time frame. I have very limited programming skills when I started, and the whole Object oriented thing was new to me. Now, just 12 weeks later, I feel confident enough that I know the basics to move on and out.

I am sorry, but I hear you guys talk about not taking a class, and that the books are better, and for some I am sure it is, but if you are new to this, and don't know what an array is, or what initalizing a random access file is, then you should take a course. I am almost sure that the people telling you not to take classes are the ones who have been programming for a long time and forgot what it was like to just start out, or they are still teenagers that hate the structure of classrooms anyway. (Please, no one take offense, I am just trying to prove a point)

I have looked through many text books, and even bought 4 of em. But these books all lacked the teaching method. They are great reference material, but for teaching visual basic to a new user, they suck.

Now that I am done with this class though, these books I bought make a lot more sense. I am using them more and more. I will take more classes on VB if offered, I feel like it will only help me. If you think about it, while your learning (which is lifelong), you have to learn it from somewhere. hmmm...spend 1-2 days finding out how in books, or in a 3 hour lecture. For me it's a no brainer...

Plus, I have seen some peoples' code that looks horible. It takes you forever to figure out what they are doing. Granted, I have a very limited experience with the subject, but I feel I can write more self-documenting code than some are currently doing. I received this structure from a class room environment.

Sorry if anyone doesn't see my point of view, I just think that if you are new to programming, there is NO better way to start than by taking a class, unless you have an expert right next to you to walk you through everything.

oh ya, Sal, I took my course as an online course. It fits in with my hectic schedule. The book I used in this class is the "Programming with Microsoft Visual Basic 6.0" by Course Technologies. The authors name is Diane Zak. 862pgs

Here is a break down of chapters:
1. Introduction
2. Designing Applications
3. Using Variables and Constants
4. The Selection Structure
5. The Repetition Structure
6. Sequential Access Files, Menus, and Reports
7. Dialog Boxes and Error Trapping
8. Random Access Files
9. Database Access
10. Variable Arrays
Appendex A: Creating a Web Page with VB
Appendex B: VB's Drag and Drop Feature
Appendex C: Clipboard, DDE, OLE
Appendex D: Creating Active X Controls

If you feel you know this stuff already, then don't waste your time with a course. But if you feel you are seriously lacking a majority of those skills, then I suggest a class.
or at least a book like this that will teach you.

[GRAHAM]

I started VB programming back last year, at the tender age of 48, as a small part of a Uni course. In all honesty, I have learnt far more from books and sites like this one(especially this one) than from the classroom. The best way to learn 'anything' is to do it...practise makes perfect etc. Don't rush it, master the basics first and progress at a steady pace, experiment with code, but above all ENJOY it. If you get stuck on code that refuses to work, don't give up straight away and head for this forum, try and work it out, leave it alone for a couple of hours and have another try, then use the forum as a last resort; you tend to learn more that way.

TTFN
GRAHAM

[Sal]

Very interesting, I feel like finding a fence and trying to walk along it with steel-toe boots. Hmmm, maybe the classroom will be good, I dunno. Still evaluating comments.

Keep em' coming,
Sal

Graham,
I do believe that I am learning a lot more from books, ...now... You need a good base to start from. I am very glad I started out with a course, it taught me the required skills to go out on my own and learn from books. Without the "basics" I was stumbling through these books I bought, trying to figure out what VB was about. After the course, I seem to "understand" the code instead of just doing the code. It just really helped me make sense of it all.

[Glenn]

I have to agree what been said in the last few posts. I think a class is good if your just starting out in programming. However, once you get going, books may provide knowledge in a specialized area in which you need advanced knowledge (ie. api).

All classes are not created equal. Before you take a class try to find out what the instructor's background is. Does he or she have industry expierence or have they been in the world of academia all their lives.

Having been an instructor, I've always tried to teach my students the extras that weren't in the book or the curriculum. The extras include writing structured and readable code. By doing this I sometimes found it hard to stay an curriculm and at the same time give my students a sound foundation.

To sum it up, if your going take a class check it out first.

All posts above are equally correct, and equally incorrect. It depends upon how you assimilate information.

Some will need to be in a classroom setting, others won't. Some will advance rapidly on their own with a few books, others will need large libraries.

Some will learn to code for their jobs and to produce specific results for jobs requested on demand. Still others are learning to code to develop products for a particular niche market. Or with a desire to code some far reaching program, which exists only in their minds!

One of the many things I enjoy here is the diversity of everyone! From pre-teens, teens, twentysomethings, thirtysomethings, fortysomethings, and beyond. From pinstripe suits to baggy pants! We're all here learning and helping one another.

Very few other topic matter forums, can say the above.

vbMarketer

[Paul282]

My background's a bit like Sal's

Old radioshack computer with basic and a tape drive then didn't touch computers for years.

When I did I was living in Tokyo though so there weren't an abundance of courses. I started with "Teach yourself VB5" and moved on from there. It was slow going at first but I've had programmer friends for years who were always saying "Name your variables, comment your code" etc so I missed most of the really bad habbits.

Now its Books, books, books. plus code from the web, places like this too. I aggree with Graham, practise is all important. I come here to answer questions more than to ask but the reason for that is as any teacher will tell you "The best way to learn is to teach" sounds odd if you're not familiar with the concept but you have to know something to explain it and you soon discover the gaps in what you thought you knew.

So I come here to answer questions, ask a few more, because thats how I learn best.

oh and books books books, I've got lots and lots

I never studied in school, but I can't get enough now. Dropped out of school and now I'm a computer engineer ! (first hardware, then networks, now programming)

[Andy Dunn]

Well i can't say i'm brilliant at VB at 19 years old but i can hold my own with maybe a few of the good programmers around. I started with QBasic, and then got launched into VB when i had to design a system for my A-Level Project.

VB can do wonderful things, but i took me time to learn them! I bought a couple of books, but as people have said some only really sweep over the surface of VB, I also used this site, i've been coming here for about 2 years and have always recieved help, lots of help from certain people, always helpful and always willing to re-explain if i didn't understand!

The courses i have seen and been on were ok, but they didn't really give me any reference for later.

All in all, i would actually recomment going on the course, but also buying refernce material, and then there is always this site!

Andy