Apple's next big thing

[Merrion]

When you combine Apple's massive cash reserves, existing iTunes multi-currency capabilities and ubiquitous hardware it seems fairly straight forward to me - Apple should get into international personal banking.*

(*Probably best if they get someone else to write the software but that's an implementation detail)

Signs and portents:
* Banking is going mobile (for example mPaysa etc.)
* People are becoming more mobile - increasingly you can expect to live in many different countries in your life
* A greater percentage of person-to-person transfers are small (ish) amounts cross jurisdiction

[Shaggy Hiker]

It sure doesn't strike me as being their target audience, but it would be a pretty interesting road for them to take.

[Niya]

I wish MS would strike first so I can write banking Apps in VB.Net!

[Merrion]

I doubt MS will do this - they might, however, provide Azure based tools to help others so do.

I also think Google should look at a bitcoin replacement. They'd love to have the extra information of "everything ever purchased by this person" to add to their advert targetting data store.

[Arnoutdv]

Maybe I miss the point, but in the Netherlands all major banks already have APPS for mobile devices, the transactions are at this moment limited to account from a contact list.
I don't see what Apple going to be bank and banking apps have to do with each other.

[Nightwalker83]

Apple's next big thing... Pie!

I wish MS would strike first so I can write banking Apps in VB.Net!

We had to create a small C# version for my course a couple of years ago.

[leinad31]

Fashion.. clothing and accessories to go with their devices hehehehe

[bodessia]

ATMs running on Mac OS? Now that is scary.

[jmcilhinney]

Maybe I miss the point, but in the Netherlands all major banks already have APPS for mobile devices, the transactions are at this moment limited to account from a contact list.
I don't see what Apple going to be bank and banking apps have to do with each other.

From what I understand, the biggest opportunity is by the use of NFC chips integrated into phones. Nokia is leading the way in that regard so you'd think that Microsoft should make use of that fact. Of course, the market penetration of Windows Phone might make it difficult to get support from other parties and Apple could come along with an incompatible system and, with their greater market share, leave Microsoft out in the cold.

[bodessia]

From what I understand, the biggest opportunity is by the use of NFC chips integrated into phones. Nokia is leading the way in that regard so you'd think that Microsoft should make use of that fact. Of course, the market penetration of Windows Phone might make it difficult to get support from other parties and Apple could come along with an incompatible system and, with their greater market share, leave Microsoft out in the cold.

On the other hand, if Microsoft doesn't take a % of every transaction (or a smaller % than the competition) from both the end user and developer as Apple would do, it might increase Microsoft's market share.
Although I have not used an MS phone as of yet, I have used their Metro UI and I have nothing bad to say about it, at least not after I have gotten used to it.

[jmcilhinney]

Although I have not used an MS phone as of yet, I have used their Metro UI and I have nothing bad to say about it, at least not after I have gotten used to it.

If you like Microsoft's tiled UI then I highly recommend Windows Phone. I've been using one for the best part of a year now and am very happy with it. There are still a few things that could be improved but many of those will be addressed in the soon-to-be-released WP 8.1. The number of apps available is still lower than for iOS or Android but I find that what's available covers everything I need or want. I'm not one to crave all the latest apps though, and there is no doubt that many apps do still appear on iOS and Android sooner.

[bodessia]

If you like Microsoft's tiled UI then I highly recommend Windows Phone. I've been using one for the best part of a year now and am very happy with it. There are still a few things that could be improved but many of those will be addressed in the soon-to-be-released WP 8.1. The number of apps available is still lower than for iOS or Android but I find that what's available covers everything I need or want. I'm not one to crave all the latest apps though, and there is no doubt that many apps do still appear on iOS and Android sooner.

If there is an app that I want that does not exist, I build it myself.
Currently have an Android phone, but am planning to get myself a cheap MS phone to play around with.
I remember getting my first ever smartphone, which ran on, and was built by MS, don't remember the name though, and this was before the era of touch screens.

[dilettante]

Some people are smart and take the thing back before getting stuck with it, while others try to hang in there hoping the sow's ear will emerge as a silk purse down the road:

Five reasons I am done with Windows Phone after 3.5 years.

Don't get "swindowed" by Microsoft.

[Shaggy Hiker]

You certainly ARE consistent.

[Merrion]

It looks like my prediction is coming closer to fruition (if you can forgive the bad pun)

[RobDog888]

Apples business plan has a worm in it.

[jmcilhinney]

Some people are smart and take the thing back before getting stuck with it, while others try to hang in there hoping the sow's ear will emerge as a silk purse down the road:

Five reasons I am done with Windows Phone after 3.5 years.

Don't get "swindowed" by Microsoft.

I read that article when looking for stories on Windows Phone 8.1 a while back. I also read a story written by an iPhone user explaining why he liked WP8.1 so much and was considering using a WP device as his primary. Seems to me that we only see links from you that support a particular position.

I’m tired of Live Tiles: Completely subjective. I can understand people not liking them but I do and I've seen plenty of people write that the UI is WP's strong suit.

I’m tired of the loading dots: I haven't really used iOS or Android so I don't know how performance compares. I have seen the dots he describes at times but I've rarely found it to be an issue. If performance is better on other platforms then I can certainly understand that using them and then going to a platform that performs worse would be an issue. It would be interesting to see a side-by-side comparison because what's often important is perceived performance rather than actual performance.

Notifications are nearly useless: That's been addressed in WP 8.1 with Action Center.

Lack of Google services support: It's not Microsoft's fault at all. Windows Phone would support Google services and it's 100% Google that they aren't. The reason doesn't really matter to users when choosing a phone of course, but it's not a reason to criticise Microsoft. This reminds me of when Apple advertise the fact that you can run Windows on a Mac as a reason to buy a Mac, like it's something great that they did for users. The only reason that you can run Windows on a Mac and not OS X on a PC is because Microsoft will let you do either while Apple won't let you run OS X on anything but their won hardware.

Voice control blows: That's been addressed with in WP 8.1 with Cortana. It is still in beta and officially only available in the US but that's set to change with the official release. Theoretically, Cortana will combine the best of Siri and Google Now and potentially be better than both. The experience may vary by region though, because it's not known how long it will take to provide reliable speech recognition for all areas and the availability of good localised data may vary. I've been using Cortana with the Developer Preview in Australia and have had a pretty good experience. An always-listening mode, which Siri doesn't have either, is said to be in the works too and likely to arrive in an Update to WP 8.1.

Again, I'm not a Microsoft or Windows Phone fanboy. I'm not saying that I hate iOS or Android. I'm just presenting an argument that Windows Phone is not the crap that some would have you believe. There are genuine reasons to choose something else but, especially with WP 8.1, there are plenty of good, legitimate reasons to choose Windows Phone too.

[Shaggy Hiker]

The experience may vary by region though, because it's not known how long it will take to provide reliable speech recognition for all areas and the availability of good localised data may vary.

Right. It will work well from the start in the midwest and west, fairly well in the northeast, and it'll be working in Europe before people from the southeastern US can use it.

[dclamp]

I haven't been keeping up with the BitCoin trend. What I last read and understood about BitCoin is that its not very reliable and that it can be hacked in some way. And I never fully understood "BitCoin mining", essentially stealing BitCoin currency using processing power? Doesn't that sound like a flaw in the system as a whole? Perhaps Mining:BitCoin::Robbery:Banking

[FunkyDexter]

Don't get "swindowed" by Microsoft.

I have to say that I'm very happy with my windows phone. I'm far from a power user but I always found Android frustrating. I just never seemed to be able to work out how to do things and was constantly getting freinds to set bits up for me. Somehow the windows phone is just more instinctive for me. I don't even understand why. Perhaps I'm more familiar having used Win 8/8.1 on my PC but I had an Android phone for longer than I've had Win 8 so I don't think that's it. I'm certainly not going to go as far as to claim that a Windows phone is better... just that it's better for me.

I'm not sure I really have a point to make except that it's all subjective and anyone who's claiming X is better than Y is therefore, by definition, wrong. Try stuff out and go with what you like.

[jmcilhinney]

Some people are smart and take the thing back before getting stuck with it, while others try to hang in there hoping the sow's ear will emerge as a silk purse down the road:

Five reasons I am done with Windows Phone after 3.5 years.

Don't get "swindowed" by Microsoft.

Well, well, well. That story was used as evidence that Windows Phone is bad and now that same fellow has gone back to Windows Phone after discovering that WP8.1 addresses all his issues.

http://www.zdnet.com/why-windows-pho...in-7000030299/

Don't get bullsh*tted by dilettante.

[SJWhiteley]

I thought that Apple's next big thing is....a phone. (I like my iPhone, and iOS in general, so should probably be the last person mocking Apple...) I will say, I'd take a Windows phone over an Android.

I think MS are getting it, though: 'just let me get my work done'.

I, personally, am looking forward to Swift. Objective-C is like trying to s*** out an endless bike chain.

[techgnome]

I haven't been keeping up with the BitCoin trend. What I last read and understood about BitCoin is that its not very reliable and that it can be hacked in some way. And I never fully understood "BitCoin mining", essentially stealing BitCoin currency using processing power? Doesn't that sound like a flaw in the system as a whole? Perhaps Mining:BitCoin::Robbery:Banking

It's not stealing... it's creating... the way I understand it, you install an application, feed it a code, and it starts crunching it... at some point, it calculates a valid code for a BitCoin... you've just mined it... the longer the process goes, the more you can mine, so the more powerful your computer is and the faster you can generate the bitcoin values, the more you mine. When the code it generated, it "phones the mothership" and that coin's code is then logged to you and added to your account. At least that's how I understand it... and built into the algorithm is a limit on the number of codes... so once they are all mined, that's it. http://www.bitcoinmining.com/

-tg

[dclamp]

So... Mining:Bitcoin::Counterfeiting:US Currency?

I understand it to be a complicated and time consuming process. You cant just pop out bitcoin left and right. But it still seems like its cheating the system... making money that you didnt earn....

[Shaggy Hiker]

It isn't counterfeit because it is the only legal way for new bitcoins to get into circulation, so it is more like minting. Making money that you didn't earn is what most everybody does to some extent. The value of my work isn't tied to much of anything.

[dclamp]

But you get to keep the coins that you created?

[techgnome]

It's also NOT US Currency... it's it's own currency... And you ARE earning it by running the algorithms and completing the puzzles and what not. And it's not like they pop out left and right... it could be days or month between BCs being mined.

-tg

[dclamp]

But if I am able to exchange bitcoin for US dollars... then Its almost as good as US Currency.

According to http://preev.com/ the current exchange rate is 1 Bitcoin = $655.9 (Seems to be changing by the second).

Sounds like I need to get into Bitcoin mining... I wonder if it is easy to sell bitcoins for US Dollars?

[techgnome]

You can exchange it for just about any currency... I can exchange USD for Pesos too... does that mean Pesos are just as good as US Currency as well? It's debatable... but either way, it is a currency... SOME exchange do recognize it, others do not. At the moment, there isn't an official USD-BC exchange, but what you're getting out of it is what someone is willing to pay for it... It's a commodity... just as is money (in a manner of speaking).

-tg

[dclamp]

In the room that I am sitting in at work, we have 16 computers running 24/7/365. I wonder if IT would get mad if I used them to mine bitcoin

[techgnome]

Check out ebay... there are a number of bit coin mining machines available, at fairly reasonable prices too... not quite sure how they work though.

-tg

[dclamp]

I was just researching it, seems that pooled mining is more effective than mining on your own. The payout is more steady and reliable, but not as much at a time.

[SJWhiteley]

This is where you get in trouble with 'currency' speculation.

Just because someone will trade $ for BitCoin (What is bit coin currency symbol?) does not necessarily make it a currency.

I could buy a chicken (let me just google that...) for less than $4 a piece - wow, that seems like a pretty cheap chicken - but does that mean that chickens are a currency?

I don't know what the future holds for BitCoin - it is really a very fringe thing - but I'm not sure that it will go very far, because there is no 'work' really involved for the person that 'earns' it (I have seen the argument regarding energy usage, and it doesn't hold water). Coupled with the fact that there seems to be an artificially limited supply of BitCoins (maybe I'm wrong on that).

Regardless, BitCoins appear to be an artificial currency developed to operate the way a small group of people believe currencies should operate. Ironically, those that obtain BitCoins obtain them through the very same mechanisms that 'real' currencies are portrayed as flawed, favoring one group over another (for example, the way very rich people obtain their billions of dollars).

[techgnome]

Well, fortunately the definition of currency is pretty loose... basically it can be any thing that is recognized by both parties and used for the purpose of trade. Chickens at one time were a form of currency. Gems, stones, copper, gold, silver are a currency. All it takes is for two sides to agree on what the given value is, both for the currency and the item in trade.

So if someone wants to accept BC for payment, and from what I hear, it is gaining traction... that's between those two parties. Accepting BC or not isn't all that different from accepting payment in currency from foreign countries. Whether BC has any advantages over more traditional currency remains to be seen.

-tg

[techgnome]

And to be fair, virtually all currency out there is fiat money, so it's all artificial. There's nothing backing any of it up other than the promise of the respective government to honor the bills. That's how a country like Mexico can essentially one day devalue their currency, making it worth about 1/1000 what it was before.

-tg

[dclamp]

techgnome. I watched a youtube video talking about currency once (entertaining, I know)... actually I think it was a video explaining bitcoin...

But it was just what you said. Money only has value because we as a whole have decided to give it value and we agree that it has value. Should we all decide we no longer want to have the US dollar as the main currency, then we could make that happen (theoretically).

Thats how they described bitcoin. It only has value because a large number of people agree that it has value. But besides that, Its just numbers in a database...

[Shaggy Hiker]

You might find this interesting...or else I'm just yapping:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2011/...of-stone-money

[techgnome]

Precisely... currency works because it is a social contract. I have a friend who brokered a number of deals to pay for her wedding... I think the only thing they ended up paying for was the minister... the rest of it, from the cake (which was done by the same baker that supplies the Crystal Cathedral in LA) to photographer, to DJ and even the wedding invites... all bartered for.

Meanwhile, while in theory we could wake up one morning and decide that we're no longer dealing in US Dollars (USD) but rather Monopoly Money (MMS) ... we might run into some hurdles... specifically the social contract portion of the deal. get a few hundred thousand people to buy onto the deal, then maybe you are on to something.

BC gained near instant traction due to it's lack of physicality. Although, you can search for BitCoin on eBay and come up with actual physical BCs for sale... what they are, are nothing more than tokens with their representative BC code printed on them -- Think casino chip - and in fact, there is a perfect example of the social contract aspect of currency... casinos all issue their own coinage in the form of chips. There is a bound contract that when you exchange USD (or other nationally based currency) for the casino's currency, that it is good for the specified amount on the chip. And, like national currency, it will only be recognized within that casino, it will not be honored by other casino - they break that contract by not recognizing the other casino's money, rendering it value less and mostly useless to you (until you return to the original casino, where it then becomes recognized again.)

-tg

[Nightwalker83]

Well, I don't think the Apple is going squish any time soon.

In the room that I am sitting in at work, we have 16 computers running 24/7/365.

Well, that's the busiest bathroom I have ever hear about.

[dclamp]

Well, that's the busiest bathroom I have ever hear about.

Have to keep myself busy while I take care of business...