Bought my first Gun

[Witis]

No, you started off asking about the motivation of the hunter, then turned it into an ethical question about whether I thought it was acceptable.

Although I found it difficult to believe that a large number of deer were killed by arrow instead of easier methods, I think it was very clear that I wanted to know just what your ethical view was in relation to the killing of deer for human consumption.

For one thing, I have already stated that I don't hunt, so even talking about the motivation of a bow hunter is entirely secondhand.

I didn't ask you to speculate about the motivation of the bow hunter, I asked you if "it is acceptable to kill a deer as long as there is more skill involved e.g bow and arrow, blowpipes, or spear?"

When you start talking about what is acceptable, then you get into the realm of fair chase law, an area I have little opinion on.

I think it was clearly an ethical rather than legal question although I don't believe anyone would have minded if you contrasted your views with the state's legal position.

So, if we are talking about how people harvest deer, I have a little second hand information about that.

That was an interesting component of the discussion which I recall adding several elements to myself.

If we are talking about why people harvest deer, I have talked to a variety of people about that and know that there are a wide rande of motivations.

I don't recall having ever asked you to speculate about why anybody else chooses to kill deer.

But, if we are talking about the ethics of hunting deer, I'm not even going to answer, because I don't feel very strongly about it.

Yes, that is what I asked about.

What have I said that indicated whether I thought it was either acceptable or unacceptable to kill a deer by any means?

You have stated that you eat beef and venison although you prefer the taste of elk and mousse which indicates that you believe it is ethical to kill all of those herbivorous animals and then consume them. I was interested to see if you drew the line somewhere, for example, only if the prey is given a fighting chance to get away; or indeed if you had changed your mind altogether mid way through the discussion as I previously explicated.

I would certainly say that it takes more skill, and generally greater effort, to kill a deer with a bow than it does with a rifle.

No argument from me on that point.

A blowpipe without curare would be inhumane and would not fall under fair chase laws, while I would expect that a blowpipe with curare would be illegal in most of this country.

I didn't read anything that stopped blowpipes (with or without curare) being used even by children to kill deer in most U.S states.

Spear hunting is legal for some types of game, but not for others.

I read it is legal to hunt deer and pig is some U.S states e.g Alabama.

Running deer by humans is illegal in this state (it would fall under harrasing wildlife, cause you'd never convince a game officer that you were actually hunting).

I haven't checked although I suspect that you are correct, you would have to travel to say Africa if you wanted to pit yourself in a test of endurance against your target game animal.

Running deer by dogs may be legal in parts of the southeast (hound hunting for various things is more widely used in the some states down there), but the dogs may be shot on sight by law enforcement in other states.

It must have come from Britain and Ireland where "deer hunting" was historically a 'sporting pursuit of deer with scent-seeking hounds ("stag hounds"), with unarmed followers typically on horseback.' which has been illegal since the Hunting Act of 2004 - Wiki.

So, you'd have to check the laws in whichever state you felt like chasing deer around. It may even be encouraged in some areas, since deer will move into towns where they can't be hunted, and they have been known to attack people and domestic animals.

Even if such attacks occur irregularly, somehow I don't quite see Hollywood making it into a full featured horror!

You'd have to check with the state. We have 50 different sets of laws on the subject. Have fun with your research.

Ah, no need to look that far, ye olde blowpipe should do the trick in most U.S states.

I'd certainly consider elk, moose, or bison if I was at a place that had it on the menu. I've certainly had bison, and I think I've had elk, or at least seen it on a menu. Both of those tend to be VERY lean compared to beef, with no marbling to speak of, so they have to be cooked in certain ways or else they are really dry. I had some BBQ Buffalo burgers (American Bison aren't technically Buffalo, but that name is used a lot more than Bison) that were really good.

Sounds like you have quite an appetite.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Although I found it difficult to believe that a large number of deer were killed by arrow instead of easier methods, I think it was very clear that I wanted to know just what your ethical view was in relation to the killing of deer for human consumption.

And I'm not interested in talking about that, so I won't.

I didn't ask you to speculate about the motivation of the bow hunter, I asked you if "it is acceptable to kill a deer as long as there is more skill involved e.g bow and arrow, blowpipes, or spear?"

Ok, what does the more skill have to do with it? Did I suggest it was acceptable or not acceptable regardless of the skill?

I think it was clearly an ethical rather than legal question although I don't believe anyone would have minded if you contrasted your views with the state's legal position.

Guess again.

I don't recall having ever asked you to speculate about why anybody else chooses to kill deer.

No, I don't think you did, but since I don't hunt, you can't very well ask me why I choose to kill a deer, because I obviously don't make that choice.

I didn't read anything that stopped blowpipes (with or without curare) being used even by children to kill deer in most U.S states.

I can't speak for most states, but I can quote from page 88 of the 2013 Big Game Regulations for the state of Idaho: "In any hunt, including any-weapon seasons, it is unlawful to pursue or kill big game animals:
By any means other than approved firearms, muzzleloaders and archery methods."

Deer are classified as big game, and blowguns are not classified as firearms, so hunting deer with a blowgun is not legal in the state of Idaho.

There is similarly restrictive language concerning short range weapon hunts. Blowguns are completely excluded.

I read it is legal to hunt deer and pig is some U.S states e.g Alabama.

Pigs are a destructive, invasive species. As far as I'm concerned, you should be allowed to hunt them by any safe means (no landmines). The pigs in question are feral, smart, dangerous, and do lots of damage to the areas they inhabit. Unfortunately, I have heard that they taste pretty bad, too.

Ah, no need to look that far, ye olde blowpipe should do the trick in most U.S states.

Frankly, I seriously doubt it is legal in ANY state, but if it is legal anywhere, I'd be looking in the southeast or Texas. They have some strange laws down there.

[Witis]

And I'm not interested in talking about that, so I won't.

I have to presume that is because ethics is not one of your fortes.

No, I don't think you did, but since I don't hunt, you can't very well ask me why I choose to kill a deer, because I obviously don't make that choice.

Although you said that you have eaten venison, elk, moose, bison, and you know where the meat comes from, so it is only logical to ask you about your ethical views regarding the killing of such animals.

Pigs are a destructive, invasive species. As far as I'm concerned, you should be allowed to hunt them by any safe means (no landmines). The pigs in question are feral, smart, dangerous, and do lots of damage to the areas they inhabit.

I assume you mean like those -> http://www.picsofpigs.com/.

Frankly, I seriously doubt it is legal in ANY state, but if it is legal anywhere, I'd be looking in the southeast or Texas. They have some strange laws down there.

As blowpipes have no age restriction and are legal in every state except California, Massachusetts and the District of Columbia, I don't believe it would attract too much attention from the authorities if you were skilled enough to bring down a razorback via such a method, especially as some states have no limits on hog hunting unlike deer or elk, and in the case of curare I guess you could say the bark is almost as bad as the bite!

[Shaggy Hiker]

I have to presume that is because ethics is not one of your fortes.

That would be as logical as all of the rest of your assumptions, so I agree that you would have to presume so.

Although you said that you have eaten venison, elk, moose, bison, and you know where the meat comes from, so it is only logical to ask you about your ethical views regarding the killing of such animals.

I wouldn't say that it was logical to ask anybody anything unless you had a reason to do so. In any case, you may ask, but I have no interest in answering. Frankly, I have never thought about it all that much, and what thoughts I have on it are too complex for me to have any desire to type out. Therefore, I won't.

I assume you mean like those -> http://www.picsofpigs.com/.

No, probably not. That's a pretty bizarre link, though. There really isn't any limit to the internet and what people have found on there.

As blowpipes have no age restriction and are legal in every state except California, Massachusetts and the District of Columbia, I don't believe it would attract too much attention from the authorities if you were skilled enough to bring down a razorback via such a method, especially as some states have no limits on hog hunting unlike deer or elk, and in the case of curare I guess you could say the bark is almost as bad as the bite!

I'm not sure. Serious blowpipes don't look like anything else, and are WAY too big to conceal with any ease. I think you would find that they'd attract considerable attention from authorities, non-authorities, and pretty nearly anyone else. They are clearly weapons, so if you were carrying one in the woods, you would certainly be asked about it by anybody in law enforcement. From there, it's anybodies guess what would happen. After all, there is this "Looks like a duck" legal precedent established by the courts in hunting cases. I don't know how that gets handled in places with feral hogs. Up here, it isn't necessary that you be observed harvesting game, so if you were in the woods with a blowpipe, you could get cited, and probably would unless you could provide credible evidence that you were not hunting game. In places with feral hogs, I assume that some distinction is made regarding what you are hunting, but I don't know how that would be handled. You'd want to check with the authorities before attempting it, though. While hunting and fishing regulations are handled on a state by state basis, enforcement is not. If you lose your hunting rights in any of the compact states, you lose them in ALL of the compact states. Since the states in the compact (which started out as the Western Compact, I think) keep expanding, you'd lose your right to hunt in most of the country by now.