"Yes, You'll Own Two Tablets" What the ...?

[dilettante]

Tomorrow the Kindle Fire color eReader/Tablet will be announced:

Amazon Holding Sept. 28 Event, Finally Unveiling Tablet?

A followup article suggests the 7 inch form-factor had its woes in the past, but assuming the new generation actually works well (has enough CPU, RAM, onboard flash memory?) it will blow away iPad-scale devices for many tasks. Like the iPad, most Win7 and soon Win8 tablets are in the 10 inch range. The problem is... they just aren't portable enough to go places a 7 inch unit can go.

So their idea is TWO tablets per person or household, since the 7 inch units still won't pack the punch of a homebound 10 inch slab:

Why Amazon's 'Kindle' Tablet Is No iPad Killer


With Kindle Fire taking the direction of starting with Android and making a locked down custom build for stability (Android churn rapidly obsoletes devices today) we end up with yet another unique platform.

Between iOS, BlackBerry, the "33 flavors" (and growing) of Android, WinCE wrapped as Window Mobile and as Phone 7, existing Windows NT (Win7), upcoming Windows NT ("Win8. New, with Metro")...


It is getting to be a developers' nightmare.


But I'm not sure I buy the idea of people owning two tablets just because all tablets have problems. Most people will get one tablet (or just make do with their phone, or nothing) and live with the headaches.

It just tells me that both touch-phones and tablets/slates alike haven't found the sweet spot yet. Maybe in a few years we'll all just have a Star Trek comm badge and separate 7 inch tablets we toss around like paper as they had in the '90s Star Trek TV shows? I think these figured most prominently in the DS9 series (BTW, Amazon Prime Streaming has all of DS9 for free right now).

[Shaggy Hiker]

in the 10 inch range. The problem is... they just aren't portable enough to go places a 7 inch unit can go.

Yeah, I've never had that problem, though I can see how it could cause trouble.

That statement works in so many different ways, but on a more serious note, this is a problem that will never really have a solution. What is the ideal screen size? I would say that a 32" screen is pretty nice, or two 24" screens. Since those aren't all that portable, I would also say that my watch is a bit larger than I would like, which is because of all the functionality crammed into it (it's a pretty cool watch). Between those extremes...lies the tabletverse. No matter which size you choose, there will be some things that you just can't do with them. For many of us, the whole tablet idea is about as goofy as it gets. I have seen them used in a reasonable fashion, just as I have seen smart phones used in reasonable ways. The people who want to do both will buy two. Others will think that two is extreme and choose one, which will always sacrifice some useability. Still others will think the whole thing is silly and choose none. I'm in that camp.

[dilettante]

I'm only interested in tablets for the software market they represent. I just worry things are getting too fragmented. All of those "app stores" want to charge you big fees and want a big cut of sales. Just the cost of belonging to one is bad enough for somebody who wants to do side jobs making software to sell there.

[dilettante]

Not to harp on Trek as a model, but here are some later "data pads" I found. The sizes seem to be from about the 7" size in one case to more like 8 or 9" size in the Jake Sisko case.

I'll note that the tablets I've used with capacitive touch instead of resistive single-touch tend to be worse at accepting a finer point stylus for handwriting recognition, drawing, and all tasks actually. The common capacitive stylus has a fat, blunt tip (fatter than a pencil eraser), a fine-tipped stylus seems to be "seen" with lots of skips in a drawn line.

More evidence these devices are better suited as universal remote control substitutes or as entertainment devices. Yet even on a tablet with Win8 on it, Windows Media Player, DivX Player, and other mainstream entertainment software all use controls too small for reliable finger-touch or cap stylus clicking.

This stuff isn't even close to ready for prime time.

[dilettante]

Here's about as good as it gets using one of the thinner cap-styli available. I'd be ashamed if my 3 year old resistive-touch phone did so poorly, but of course it can use a real stylus.

[dilettante]

YouTube addresses the "teeny buttons" problem for their Web-delivered content. This is smart, since even using a 3rd party browser for touch (BTW, Metro IE sucks at this) you get a lot of teeny links and buttons hard to hit with finger or regular cap-stylus.

http://www.youtube.com/xl

At least somebody is thinking.

[Shaggy Hiker]

There is also the on-going issue that a competent touch typist can type FAR FAR faster than they can write, so tablets as text entry tools are always going to be inferior. They do have portability, you can write on them in nearly any setting, and you can draw pictures, whereas typing requires space for a keyboard of some sort, but you can't write fast.

[techgnome]

are the next round of iPads still sporting that curved back? What about some of the other tablets? Like my ears, will they wobble to and fro? I don't care if I can tie them in a knot or tie them in a bow. It just occurred to me that I often see the person holding the tablet, and typing with their thumbs, or holding it with one hand why typing (albiet only a couple keystrokes) with their other hand... I can see that getting tiresome real quick. you should be able to set it down flat on a surface and type with out it rocking like the Edmund Fitzgerald.

-tg

[dilettante]

They almost always curve the edges (at least) under on tablets, trying for an optical illusion that the thing is thinner than it really is.

[dilettante]

The actual display is 9.7" diagonally on an iPad 2, and that's the one with the handwriting above. Talk about a crude effective resolution.

I'd want to be able to write out emails and such at least. I guess handwriting recognition is somewhat secondary since writing is so impractical in the first place. My single-touch phone does pretty well at that though.

And look: Controls too small to use by finger, such as sliders like those used to set volume or backlight brightness or navigate within playing media.

No, these things aren't what people hope when they make their impulse purchases.

[moti barski]

I'm facinated with skiff reader

[dilettante]

I saw a lot on the Skiff two years ago, but never a released product. Most of the links Google has seem dead or dated back in January 2010.

[moti barski]

is there a pdf/txt reader that is like the scouter from dragon ball z ? one that the user puts on one eye and then he can read or get gps data for where he is ?

[dilettante]

Here's an HP video advertising their Slate 500, showing the sorts of things you might use it for that distinguishes a Win NT slate from "toys" like iPad and Android slates.

Note the fine-point stylus for eInk use. These are hard to find except from HP Parts and most people admit they don't work well on the capacitive multitouch screens Apple has driven everyone toward. This may be exactly why so few pens are sold for them except the "blunt finger" types.

http://h71016.www7.hp.com/html/inter...500/model.html

[dilettante]

Turns out those "fine tip" styli (styluses?) only work on a device like that HP 500 that have two digitizers in the screen. And even that unit isn't well regarded.

No, these "multitouch" tablets, slates, etc. (including your Androids and iPads) are consumer eletronics toys. They will never replace paper and pencil for a business use it seems.

WHY DO CAPACITIVE-SCREEN TABLETS FAIL AS ACTIVE INK PLATFORMS?


I'm starting to think Ballmer "bet the company" on Windows 8 as he said, and he's gonna lose big. Now we know why Metro has those giant tiles instead of icons.

[SJWhiteley]

The problem I find with these tablets is that you can't 'grip' them. You must either balance them on something, or hold it (delicately?) by the edge.

They need to 'sense' how you are holding it, that your big chunky thumb on the screen needs to be ignored as a touch input. When Apple do this (it will be Apple, of course) It'll really take off instead of being this new fad...

[dilettante]

Most of the ones I've been playing with have a fairly wide bezel, just like my Acer W500 does. The weight of a Windows tablet is the biggest drawback for me, they're just about twice the weight you can hold comfortably for any length of time.

I get more frustrated by trying to use a stylus on a multitouch display. There's the "fat tip" problem for one, but also the problem of no "palm rejection" - resting your hand on it to write causes false hits. I suspect that resistive digitizers don't have any fancy "rejection" but just aren't triggered by your hand resting on them.

[Jenner]

What the world needs is a capacitive touch-screen that works with your fingers, but flip a switch on the side, and it changes the input mode where it will ONLY work with a high-precision capacitive stylus. If the sensors were fine enough, the capacitive nature of the stylus controlled in a tight range and outside of human skin/fingers range and the software written to interpolate stylus input while in this mode, you'd have the ultimate pad platform.

Precision when you want, touch when you don't need it. Surf through websites with your fingertip and standard multitouch interface, open a new email, switch modes, grab the stylus and write out an email message using high-precision handwriting recognition with your palm dragging across the 10" screen but not interrupting it at all.

Side note: Do you even have to switch modes? What if it detected the stylus with it's very different capacitive electrical properties coming into contact with the screen and switched for you? Interesting thought...

Technically, it could be developed tomorrow; we have all the technologies available.

[techgnome]

I have a windows laptop-convertible-tablet that allows me to use my fingers to do non-precise action... like swiping... playing cards... scrolling through photos... using google earth/maps, kindle reader.... or I can use a stylus if I want finer control, like drawing in paint, or using the handwriting recognition... wouldn't use either method for development though... but if not for the dead zone in the lower corner, it would be fine... but then it's a laptop/tablet convertible... not a straight up tablet.

-tg

[dilettante]

The HP 500 I mentioned above has a capacitive digitizer for finger touch and a second "active" digitizer for a (special) stylus.

Capacitive sensor digitizers can't really be very high resolution by their nature from what I've read. Most pre-iPhone era touch/stylus phones and specialized tablet/slate devices used a resistive sensor digitizer that doesn't have the same problems but requires pressure instead of merely presence.

[dilettante]

Well, in backing off and abandoning the travesty that is the Windows 8 Developer Preview (and Metro) I came upon a solution to my "touch media player" quest.

Not that Media Center wouldn't work mind you, but the Win8 DP doesn't have it.

Acer has a technology they call Clear·fi and they offer a client (fairly widely now, may install on any PC) and a server (only bundled with some newer Acer systems I believe). Basically this is a fancy DLNA-based media sharing and playing system. The plus for me here is that the client has large touch-finger friendly controls compared to Media Player (or most of the frankly wretched open source and free alternatives).

A search should turn up the download page if anyone wants to try it on a non-Acer system. The catch is that it requires Windows 7 or later (not even Vista).

Works fine for me, and I already have a DLNA server on my home network. You can also just use Windows Media Player on a desktop as such a server, though I can't imagine why you'd want to use a tablet PC as a media sharing server.

Acer has a Clear·fi client for their Android tablets and phones as well.

[dilettante]

Another answer to the "teeny buttons" problem when using capacitive touch for media viewing, albeit one specific to one media streaming outlet. I'm surprised nobody else mentioned it yet, though I only just stumbled upon it myself.

http://www.hulu.com/labs/hulu-desktop

Versions for Windows, Mac, and Linux.

Testing it now, so far so good. While meant to make it easier to use a remote-control device (or even a mouse) with a PC connected to a "distant" hi-res display (like that 60" TV you have, right?) it should be great for tablets too.

Great for TV viewing too of course. Quite a find, I like it.


Also see post #6 above for YouTube's answer to this.

[dilettante]

is there a pdf/txt reader that is like the scouter from dragon ball z ? one that the user puts on one eye and then he can read or get gps data for where he is ?

I haven't seen anything practical yet. Look at the cost of http://www.tekgear.ca/index.cfm?page...395&section=83

Not sure whether this one just died away http://www.gizmag.com/go/3298/

[dilettante]

Speaking of YouTube, I just found https://www.desktube.tv/index.php

YouTube seems to be gaining things lately, such as full-length episodes of TV series from the source (Funimation has all of Full Metal Alchemist and Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood up now, both dubbed and subbed versions I believe).