We dodged the bullet of Palin and McCain's bad judgement of picking her.

[capsulecorpjx]

The truth comes out from McCain's camp.
Palin was embezzling and is really that stupid.

America dodged an ignorant, thieving bullet.

McCain is to blame for his hail-mary pick too. He deserved to lose for showing such poor judgement.

I've heard him say that whenever he makes a decision based on what he thinks is right intead of political reasons, he comes out the winner.

The Palin pick was obviously a political hail-mary. This is probably the first time McCain broke his own rule and because of it he lost the biggest race.
I think he would have won if he chose someone more compatent.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle5103014.ece

Reports yesterday said that the McCain campaign authorised her to buy just six suits for the convention and campaign, but instead she spent a fortune on clothes, luggage, jewellery and other accessories for herself, her husband and her family, and had junior staffers pay some of the bills with their credit cards.

One angry McCain aide told Newsweek magazine that it was “Wasilla hillbillies looting Neiman Marcus from coast to coast”. The New York Times said that there was a “civil war” between Mr McCain’s campaign and hers, and that he seldom spoke to her. Fox News reported that Mrs Palin did not understand that Africa was a continent, not a country, and did not know which countries were in the North American Free Trade Agreement.

[crptcblade]

Cute and stupid, just how I like'em.

[mendhak]

Politics in world events please.

kthxbai

[System_Error]

The truth comes out from McCain's camp.
Palin was embezzling and is really that stupid.

America dodged an ignorant, thieving bullet.

The mudslinging could go on and on. There's dirt on Obama, Palin, and just about everyone else who makes a stab at politics. Just look at who Obama picked for chief of staff. There's already sources trying to link him with the freddie mac scandal.

So I think this "problem" you have with Palin still comes down to being republican and Christian.

Anyways...

The Palin pick was obviously a political hail-mary.

I don't have anything against Palin and think she would have made a much better VP than Biden, but you are right, the whole thing was a stunt. The two as a pair did not "connect" well. It was almost funny in a way. You have McCain who's face is sagging and falling off and then he picks an attractive 44 y/o female. I guess in the end it really showed. Apparently there's some interpersonal problems going on with the losing group.

I think he would have won if he chose someone more compatent.

I don't think so. Obama ran a brilliant campaign and had so much going for him and there's not much McCain could have done to compete - even if he ran a smarter campaign.

I *think* McCain really wanted Lieberman as a running mate, but I can't see how that would have helped him in any way.

[kleinma]

at least Biden has some foreign policy experience (and likely a big reason why he was picked to run as VP anyway)

He may not known squat about the internet, and favors big business like MPAA and RIAA, but he sure knows a lot more about the rest of the world than Palin does...

[homer13j]

The truth comes out

Unsubstantiated gossip from unnamed sources now qualifies as "truth?"

You should send your resumè to CBS News.

Palin was embezzling

Link plz? Googling "Palin embezzle" only gives me two hits from moonbat sites with no info - just unabashed (and highly entertaining) anger and hatred. I can find no actual news on this at all...

[SurfDemon]

I think McCain would have had a good shot at the presidency if he'd gone with Colin Powell (or a similarly charismatic and respected person). I was a bit gob-smacked at his choice of Palin to be honest.

[kleinma]

Colin Powell, the former republican Bush secretary of state that voted for Obama??

[Shaggy Hiker]

I *think* McCain really wanted Lieberman as a running mate, but I can't see how that would have helped him in any way.

Absolutely!! Lieberman and McCain are friends and political allies. If McCain could pick anybody for his number 2, without any other considerations, that's who he would have picked. It would have been utter suicide for his campaign, though. He would have managed to infuriate both sides. He might not even have won Idaho had he made that pick.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Another take on the same story with a Fox clip.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...&type=politics

It's still just mud slinging, but then again, everything negative can be classified into two categories: Mud or prosecution.

[capsulecorpjx]

Another take on the same story with a Fox clip.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...&type=politics

It's still just mud slinging, but then again, everything negative can be classified into two categories: Mud or prosecution.

Mud slinging sure, but I think it's credible.

Why would Republicans turn on their own without legitamently being angry or slighted?

Lets say you are a middle-tier campaign supervisor to McCain.

How would you feel if the Running Mate bought luxary clothing not only ridiculously over budget, but also with some of the expense charged on the credit cards of the younger volunteers that worked for you?

You would be mad as hell.

I'm glad this has come out. Now Palin won't be elected in 2012, she would be a disaster.

[Shaggy Hiker]

My point with the mudslinging comment was directed at this thought:

Mudslinging is generally assumed to be false statements spread to sully somebodies name. Technically, any negative statement not proven in a court of law can therefore be dismissed as mud slinging by anybody at any time. Therefore, those who want to believe this can believe this, and those who don't want to believe it can disbelieve it. It IS mud, unless it leads to a conviction on specific charges in a court of law. Though actually, Ted Stevens is demonstrating that even a conviction by a jury of your peers can be disputed as a partisan attack, and disputed successfully in the court of public opinion.

The point being that those who support Palin and hope she will run for president in 2012 will dismiss all of these statements as lies, no matter how much evidence is presented. That's life. Everybody argues for truth, yet there is no objective standard of truth. Anything that agrees with your point of view can be accepted as given truth, while anything that disagrees with your point of view can be dismissed as false. This is especially true in the modern world where we are bombarded each day with information that we can't possibly have experienced in person...and let's not get into the perpetual fallacies inherent in our perceptions.

Thus, let this mud fly as it will. The only piece of it that will impact the national consciousness is that piece which sticks. If this mud sticks, Palin is finished. If the mud doesn't stick, then it will be as if it never flew in the first place. My money, at the moment, is that it will stick enough to keep her on the perimeter much like Dan Quayle (the last VP pick to be roundly characterized as an idiot). Not down, but definitely out. Only time will tell whether or not my opinion will be bourne out.

[Nightwalker83]

Cute and stupid, just how I like'em.

Who are you talking about McCain, Palin or both?

[crptcblade]

Both, sewn together at the forehead.

[Lord Orwell]

oddly enough they are also considering Newt Gingrich as a 2012 candidate. What a joke.

In a contest like this though, the truth is simple: The most money spent gets you the presidency. Mccain's campaign was broke for a long time and his campaign suffered horribly for it. When he picked Palin he picked up a large group of deep-pocketed supporters. However it was too little, too late. If you look at the electoral map and track who campaigned where and how much time they spent there, it's pretty obviously a one to one relationship: The more money they spent in a state campaigning (people going door to door, putting out signs, personal appearances, etc), the larger the share of the electoral votes they got. Obama spent a fortune in the colony states, and carried every single one of them.

One final note on the maverick status of john mccain: Look up the washington dc vote. Nationwide, he received 46.1% of the popular vote compared to Obama's 52.6% yet in Washington he pulled only about 5% of the vote. Sounds to me like he was a pretty big toe-stepper.

Also look at the county-by-county voting map. I think it is pretty obvious who pulled the majority of counties. Obama merely focused his effort on those places that had more votes to give.

Now compare that with the state-by-state map. There are a few states Obama pulled maybe 5% of the counties but he pulled the populated ones.

The fact is: Obama is extremely inexperienced and has never lead anything. His job as a senator was to do the will of the people and follow. Mccain has multiple years of military experience with leadership experience. Obama's own VP said that we're going to get a major incident in the first month or two after election. And i don't know how this plays into it, but for some reason Al Queda endorsed him as president. Is it because they know he's the weaker leader? We'll see.

[demotivater]

How about not regurgitating gossip articles capsulecorpjx, don't show your ignorance, do some research before coming to a conclusion. An informed opinion is one thing, jumping on the latest blog headline is another.

VP candidates have long been subject to being skewered whether in victory or defeat. Their job as the candidates "bulldog" does have it's downsides. Palin putting up with this crap will have it's payoff, that's the name of the game. Everyone tapped to put themselves out in front of the national stage gets their payback.

We'll have some giggles when Obama fails to come through on ANY of the promises he made and Palin, or someone equally unlikely, comes in and steps all over his administration. The next four, or even eight years are gonna be ****** no matter who's in the Oval Office. The Bush presidency has a lot to do with it, but it certainly goes further back than that. This powder keg has been brewing for a lot longer than eight years.

Hell, The One even said it himself - winning the election does not equal the change we need, and it may not happen in the next four years, or even eight. LOLOL The silence from the rabid crowd was deafening. I was laughing my ass off. "It will take your time and effort to make the change happen". *crickets chirping* Talk about a victory speech targeted to do nothing but lower expectations, priceless.

Oh well, I'm just waiting for my mortgage and gas to get paid for by the Messiah. Change I can believe in!! *snickers*

[capsulecorpjx]

How about not regurgitating gossip articles capsulecorpjx, don't show your ignorance, do some research before coming to a conclusion. An informed opinion is one thing, jumping on the latest blog headline is another.

VP candidates have long been subject to being skewered whether in victory or defeat. Their job as the candidates "bulldog" does have it's downsides. Palin putting up with this crap will have it's payoff, that's the name of the game. Everyone tapped to put themselves out in front of the national stage gets their payback.

We'll have some giggles when Obama fails to come through on ANY of the promises he made and Palin, or someone equally unlikely, comes in and steps all over his administration. The next four, or even eight years are gonna be ****** no matter who's in the Oval Office. The Bush presidency has a lot to do with it, but it certainly goes further back than that. This powder keg has been brewing for a lot longer than eight years.

Hell, The One even said it himself - winning the election does not equal the change we need, and it may not happen in the next four years, or even eight. LOLOL The silence from the rabid crowd was deafening. I was laughing my ass off. "It will take your time and effort to make the change happen". *crickets chirping* Talk about a victory speech targeted to do nothing but lower expectations, priceless.

Oh well, I'm just waiting for my mortgage and gas to get paid for by the Messiah. Change I can believe in!! *snickers*

Don't misunderstand me. I'm not some Obama fanatic. I voted more against Palin's incompetence and McCain's campaign (really? Joe the Plumber against tax cuts for Middle Class? Palling around with terrorists?) rather than for Obama.

I never liked Obama's campaign. the "Change we can believe in" and "Yes we can" (from Bob the Builder children's show no less) slogans make me cringe.

I also never liked how he was never specific in his speeches, until the very end. His speeches sounded inspiring, but little substance. A true politician I guess.

But on the other hand, he was good at limiting Lobbyists, because he was so good at being supported by large numbers of individual donors. Plus he seems very secular (my kind of guy) and comes off as actually educated and makes rational/pragmatic decisions (compared to Bush).

[RobDog888]

I herd on the news that Paylins $150K shopping spree was not her fault. Before the GOP convention she needed clothes for it and the legal staff stated it was ok to put it on the campaign tab but it had to all be in by some deadline for the entire campaign duration. so thats the reason for the surge of spending. Turned out it wasnt legal as they thought so they were given a wealthy supporters credit card and charged it all. If it wasnt for the legal mistake it would have been more spread out and un-noticed.

[System_Error]

I think McCain would have had a good shot at the presidency if he'd gone with Colin Powell (or a similarly charismatic and respected person). I was a bit gob-smacked at his choice of Palin to be honest.

Years ago a lot of people said that if Colin Powell was to run for president he would get it. Not sure if that's true now, but if he really wanted to take on a more reputable position, it probably wouldn't be VP.

Besides, hasn't he strongly expressed the fact that he's not interested in being President or VP for that matter?


EDIT - I guess that wasn't your point. I do agree with you. If he had Colin Powell his chances would have definitely increased.

[zaza]

The fact is: Obama is extremely inexperienced and has never lead anything. His job as a senator was to do the will of the people and follow. Mccain has multiple years of military experience with leadership experience. Obama's own VP said that we're going to get a major incident in the first month or two after election. And i don't know how this plays into it, but for some reason Al Queda endorsed him as president. Is it because they know he's the weaker leader? We'll see.

True, but nobody is born with leadership experience. At some point, somebody has to go out on a limb and give you a leadership job without you having had the experience for it. I think it's fair to say that there isn't another job that he could do that would adequately prepare for the role of US President, military or big company boss included, so lets forget about the "experience" issue. What matters is whether he can step up to the plate and deliver.
As far as al Qaeda goes though, they have their own agenda and maybe by endorsing Obama they're playing a double bluff so that you vote Republican (who are much more pro-war, keep America unpopular and hated by the Islamic world, and play into their hands). Or maybe that's what they want you to think, and they really do want you to vote Obama....

If you go around listening to terrorists who have their own agenda, you'll just end up in a muddle. Either listen properly, which means getting them around a table and taking them seriously, or don't listen at all. But don't do it in half-hearted fashion so as to spin a political angle out of it. That's what got us in this mess in the first place.

[NotLKH]

I think Bob's response is pretty good.

http://www.wham1180.com/cc-common/me...obcast11.06.08

-Lou

[Lord Orwell]

Let's face it, Palin was given a raw deal by the press anyway. I seriously doubt ANY of the candidates could have answered the questions given her by Katie Couric. That woman's a real piece of work. "So Mrs. Palin, You were given notice yesterday that they want you to be a running mate as VP! Please give us SPECIFIC directions how you are going to destroy Al-Queida. Then Specifically tell us how you will fix the economy, etc etc." The result was she got a bum rap as someone that was not intelligent. And so what if she mistakenly called africa a country and not a continent. Al gore couldn't even spell potato. Does anyone remember the fiasco of asking Bush some questions about foreign countries? But he got elected anyway. The truth is: Sarah Palin is a strong woman with strong leadership skills (as a governor of the largest state) who just happens to have a strong accent and was running for the wrong party. So the press slaughtered her. Every single study done to this effect showed that the press wasn't being unbiased this time. And if 3 out of 4 reports on the news you see about the republican ticket are negative (a proven ratioo) then eventually it's going to brainwash people. The obama ticket had a more even ratio of close to 50/50.
http://www.journalism.org/node/13307
Too late now...

[kleinma]

Let's face it, Lord Orwell was given a raw deal.

And so what if he mistakenly said Al Gore spelled potato wrong even though it was Dan Quayle.

[SurfDemon]

Colin Powell, the former republican Bush secretary of state that voted for Obama??

Yip, but only after Palin had been picked as McCain's VP. I wonder if that had anything to do with him endorsing Obama....

As for the hoopla over Palin's $150k wardrobe. I don't see what all the fuss is about. She's being asked to go on tv and present a serious professional successful image. So, the campaign spent some of it's cash on her wardrobe instead of on flights/party's/drinks receptions/tv adverts/venues etc. It doesn't strike me as wrong, and I certainly don't think it can be classified as embezzlement. If it was tax-payers money, then yes I would understand the fuss, but as it was, it was republican funds being spent on the republican candidate. What's the problem?

[SurfDemon]

We'll have some giggles when Obama fails to come through on ANY of the promises he made and Palin, or someone equally unlikely, comes in and steps all over his administration.

So, you're going to be laughing when your govenrment is full of lobyists and contracts are awarded because of the "ole buddy's" network...?

You'll be giggling yourself senseless if Al-Quaida attacks the US again and kills thousands of people?

You'll be snikering away when the economy continues to tank and destroys the economy?

I find it strange (and quite sad) that you would put your own personal hatred of this individual above the well-being of your country.

[SurfDemon]

The fact is: Obama is extremely inexperienced and has never lead anything. His job as a senator was to do the will of the people and follow. Mccain has multiple years of military experience with leadership experience. Obama's own VP said that we're going to get a major incident in the first month or two after election. And i don't know how this plays into it, but for some reason Al Queda endorsed him as president. Is it because they know he's the weaker leader? We'll see.

I think the last thing you needed was another military leader..... look where that's got you so far. But by your definition of a senator (to follow), the only people who are experienced enough to lead the country are soldiers.... that's not a good thing (IMHO).

I also thought that Al-Quidea endorsed John McCain, not Obama....? Do you have any links to support this claim?

[Shaggy Hiker]

Osama did endorse McCain, Quayle was the one who couldn't spell, and Lord Orwell managed to put so much spin into a single post it's fallen into orbit around him. Alsaska is the biggest state? Do moose vote now? Sure, the state is HUGE, but the population is smaller than many mid-sized US cities. It's also unlike the rest of the country in some significant other matters, such as the oil money and oil rebates that fund the economy and are central to the politics there. What other state has anything similar? One massive source of stable revenue is unlike the problems faced by any other governor.

As for the Katie Couric interview being so tough: It was a bunch of softballs. Heck, I could answer those questions better than her. Now, with Fox reporting the same issues, why discount it?

[DeanMc]

I think its nice to see some young blood in power, im sick of seeing old farts on the telly spouting about years of military experience. McCain was a POW in Vietnam. So that means he was captured in a war that the US lost, yeah real leadership skills there.....

He is an ignorant fool, I'm not from the US but watched all the debates and in everyone he gave off the impression that "the black guy" had no chance. I think that Obama got a raw deal as the US is in a lot of trouble and this is not something 1 term will resolve but for once its nice to see the president of the most important country in the world and not think oh god hes and idiot or hes and arrogant git.

I rather like Obama charisma and to be honest its very refreshing.

[crptcblade]

Yip, but only after Palin had been picked as McCain's VP. I wonder if that had anything to do with him endorsing Obama....

As for the hoopla over Palin's $150k wardrobe. I don't see what all the fuss is about. She's being asked to go on tv and present a serious professional successful image. So, the campaign spent some of it's cash on her wardrobe instead of on flights/party's/drinks receptions/tv adverts/venues etc. It doesn't strike me as wrong, and I certainly don't think it can be classified as embezzlement. If it was tax-payers money, then yes I would understand the fuss, but as it was, it was republican funds being spent on the republican candidate. What's the problem?

Palin + less clothes = you see where I'm going with this...

[demotivater]

Palin + less clothes = you see where I'm going with this...

mmmm, capri pants

[Lord Orwell]

I think its nice to see some young blood in power, im sick of seeing old farts on the telly spouting about years of military experience. McCain was a POW in Vietnam. So that means he was captured in a war that the US lost, yeah real leadership skills there.....

He is an ignorant fool, I'm not from the US but watched all the debates and in everyone he gave off the impression that "the black guy" had no chance. I think that Obama got a raw deal as the US is in a lot of trouble and this is not something 1 term will resolve but for once its nice to see the president of the most important country in the world and not think oh god hes and idiot or hes and arrogant git.

I rather like Obama charisma and to be honest its very refreshing.

don't be rude. He hadn't been promoted to levels where he was in charge of anything yet. He was captured as a POW under a democratic president! But enough about that. I watched the debates and i didn't see any such "gave the impression" In fact it seemed to me he did a really poor job of getting his plans out there in a comprehendable way. His "buy up bad mortgages" not only was poorly explained but that was nearly all he talked about. He needs a better debate coach telling him what the nation wants to hear. Obama's was nearly spot-on.

I think it's fair to say that there isn't another job that he could do that would adequately prepare for the role of US President, military or big company boss included, so lets forget about the "experience" issue. What matters is whether he can step up to the plate and deliver.

what about Governor? It's the exact same position as president, just at a state level. And Don't forget "commander-in-chief" is one of the presiden'ts duties as well.

[capsulecorpjx]

Let's face it, Palin was given a raw deal by the press anyway. I seriously doubt ANY of the candidates could have answered the questions given her by Katie Couric. That woman's a real piece of work. "So Mrs. Palin, You were given notice yesterday that they want you to be a running mate as VP! Please give us SPECIFIC directions how you are going to destroy Al-Queida. Then Specifically tell us how you will fix the economy, etc etc." The result was she got a bum rap as someone that was not intelligent. And so what if she mistakenly called africa a country and not a continent. Al gore couldn't even spell potato. Does anyone remember the fiasco of asking Bush some questions about foreign countries? But he got elected anyway. The truth is: Sarah Palin is a strong woman with strong leadership skills (as a governor of the largest state) who just happens to have a strong accent and was running for the wrong party. So the press slaughtered her. Every single study done to this effect showed that the press wasn't being unbiased this time. And if 3 out of 4 reports on the news you see about the republican ticket are negative (a proven ratioo) then eventually it's going to brainwash people. The obama ticket had a more even ratio of close to 50/50.
http://www.journalism.org/node/13307
Too late now...

You're just making excuses for a Republican.

Also it wasn't Al Gore that couldn't spell potato, it was Dan Quayle.

Not being able to spell potato concerns me less than not being able to name a single newspaper or know that 150k on clothes is excessive, no less some of it were for her family, an obvious breach of ethics.

[Lord Orwell]

You're just making excuses for a Republican.

Also it wasn't Al Gore that couldn't spell potato, it was Dan Quayle.

Not being able to spell potato concerns me less than not being able to name a single newspaper or know that 150k on clothes is excessive, no less some of it were for her family, an obvious breach of ethics.

you're right of course, since the press won't ever see your husband or children. Hillary clinton was never in the spotlight when Bill was president, so who cares how she's dressed? This stuff matters to some people. Obama's wife made headlines yesterday for "worst dressed spouse at an acceptance speech". Perhaps the democrats could have tossed some money her way. But it wasn't necessary. He was already rich from special interest groups tossing him money. Palin had to borrow money from aides. And who is saying it's "not proper"? It's not like the republican party is a federal body. It's private. But you're right. Let's dress her up in nieman marcus, and dress her husband and kids in flannel next to her. No one will notice...

And how many posts does it take to point out it was Dan Quayle? Whatever. If people don't think Al Gore is an idiot then maybe they should pay attention to his global warming movie.

as for the osama endorsement, a simple google will show you who he endorsed. He not only endorsed Obama, but he said if he was around in 1973 he would have bought mccain from the vietnamese.
http://lifethelove.wordpress.com/200...-allen-hafman/
Of course some people have flipped this around and claimed that osama clearly stating "i want obama as president" (there's a tape that was played on cnn) is reverse psychology because he really wanted mccain. That's totally ridiculous. Any link you find saying so has "humor" as a keyword. But what can you do. I wanted Hillary.

[DeanMc]

Im not being rude, every goverment of every country, including my own is ran by old farts. I really hope the guy who ran the libertas campaign creates a party in Ireland. And don't give me the experience waffle. The world is at its lowest ebb because all these old farts hate change, lets try something different.

[VBChick]

Really? Really you guys? Can't we just come together and support our soon to be ex-President and our President-Elect in these very difficult times? Rehashing the campaigns of both parties is a waste of time.

[Lord Orwell]

and don't forget, our current president had a bill passed that makes it a federal crime to publicly talk against the president. So obama-bash all you want now, but it has to stop by law the day he's sworn in.

[VBChick]

LOL - That's B.S.

I disagree with Obama.

I disagree with Bush.

Someone come arrest me!

[Lord Orwell]

LOL - That's B.S.

I disagree with Obama.

I disagree with Bush.

Someone come arrest me!

merely disagreeing doesn't count. You must actively try to get people to go against his directives in some manner such as stating in a public forum such as this one "don't listen to him". It's considered domestic terrorism and under the applicable law you can have your property seized in the investigation (including but not limited to your computer). At the time it was passed, there was plenty of press on it. I am not sad to see Bush leave office. He's done more to strip the rights of Americans away than any other president with perhaps the exception of Theodore Roosevelt, who was known for a similar law. The difference was Roosevelt's law had a built-in expiration date. But it also allowed no-trial imprisonment as well. http://www.let.rug.nl/~usa/E/teddy/teddyxx.htm

Perhaps the patriot act doesn't ring a bell? It also had a built-in expiration date but parts of it live on, including the warrantless eavesdropping.

[InvisibleDuncan]

I didn't pay any attention to this eletion, mainly because I'm not American and therefore couldn't really give a toss. However, I did encounter one thing which made me laugh - it was a clip of Sarah Palin being asked whom she'd voted for. She refused to answer, and said that the fact it was private was another thing that was "really cool about America". Because, of course, in every other democracy it's compulsory to tell people for whom you voted...

[Lord Orwell]

I didn't pay any attention to this eletion, mainly because I'm not American and therefore couldn't really give a toss. However, I did encounter one thing which made me laugh - it was a clip of Sarah Palin being asked whom she'd voted for. She refused to answer, and said that the fact it was private was another thing that was "really cool about America". Because, of course, in every other democracy it's compulsory to tell people for whom you voted...

We're a republic, not a democracy. Common mistake. You can tell by the electoral votes thing. You know, a lot of people make this error, even though our pledge of allegience states otherwise.