Why do you hate the United States?

[Mark Gambo]

For as long as I have been a member of VBF I noticed an anti-american sediments by other members. Some of them covertly or thinly veiled comments. So what is it that bugs you the most about the US? Prehaps you don't like our form of Government, or is it you don't like the amount of freedoms our Constitution grants to us? Could it be you don't like the fact that we don't have a figure head as the head of our Government? Whatever you reason please post it here

[Pino]

Throw us some samples of anti-American sentiment - No names though

[crptcblade]

Boy, the Dept. of Homeland Security has become more overt with their tactics. Can't they tap phones anymore?

[Shaggy Hiker]

For as long as I have been a member of VBF I noticed an anti-american sediments by other members.

Are you stoned? Sedimentaries rock!

Or were you just complaining about all the mud slinging?

On a more serious note, I'm waiting for somebody to answer: Other - this poll!
What a pack of arrogant options.

[grilkip]

For as long as I have been a member of VBF I noticed an anti-american sediments by other members. Some of them covertly or thinly veiled comments. So what is it that bugs you the most about the US?

You.

Prehaps you don't like our form of Government,

Who cares about form? The results count.

or is it you don't like the amount of freedoms our Constitution grants to us?

Yes, this has bugged me my whole life, I can't get over it.

Could it be you don't like the fact that we don't have a figure head as the head of our Government?

Yes, I do hate America for not having a royal house, one should be of good breeding to rule a nation.

Whatever you reason please post it here

Mostly it's you. You appear to gain satisfaction from the knowledge that you're living in the richest country in the world, and you revel in the thought that everyone in the world is envious of you.

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Prehaps you don't like our form of Government.

The US government is fine as long as you are not part of it.

Or is it you don't like the amount of freedoms our Constitution grants to us?

Freedom is subjective; but I am inclined to say that you should have the right to post here removed. Is that in the American constitution?

Could it be you don't like the fact that we don't have a figure head as the head of our Government?

Our queen is a mighty woman; although quite powerless. Don't come to the UK though, I fear that if she were to knight you you'd end up in three pieces.

Now what was it I don't like about America. Nothing not to like really. Although some of its people have overdosed waaaaaay too much on the patriotic peel.

Don't say you didn't ask for that. Now I think my covert comments have risen from the sediments and shown their metamorphic nature. Wouldn't you agree?

[mendhak]

For as long as I have been a member of VBF I noticed an anti-american sediments by other members. Some of them covertly or thinly veiled comments. So what is it that bugs you the most about the US? Prehaps you don't like our form of Government, or is it you don't like the amount of freedoms our Constitution grants to us? Could it be you don't like the fact that we don't have a figure head as the head of our Government? Whatever you reason please post it here

Our figurehead said that if we don't have anti-American sentiments, she'd beat us with a rolled up copy of the constitution.

Now you know.

[Mark Gambo]

Our figurehead said that if we don't have anti-American sentiments, she'd beat us with a rolled up copy of the constitution.

Now you know.

Finally and honest and truthful answer, thank you!

[Mark Gambo]

Throw us some samples of anti-American sentiment - No names though

You are joking right? Query some CC posts from two certain members one from Canada and another from Sweden.

If you want their names pm and I will give them to you and even give you specific posts if you would like.

[Mark Gambo]

Are you stoned? Sedimentaries rock!

Or were you just complaining about all the mud slinging?

Unfortunately, I am away for the weekend and I typed this on my Blackberry. Besides, you know us conservatives are too uptight to smoke a joint :-)

On a more serious note, I'm waiting for somebody to answer: Other - this poll!
What a pack of arrogant options.

Yeah me too.

[Mark Gambo]

. . .Mostly it's you. You appear to gain satisfaction from the knowledge that you're living in the richest country in the world, and you revel in the thought that everyone in the world is envious of you.

No, I feel lucky and privileged to live in the US. I am proud of the accomplishments of my country and how we have improved the quality of life of people worldwide who have benefited from the technology that was developed here by americans.

[Mark Gambo]

The US government is fine as long as you are not part of it.

Hmmm, that is kind of hard to do here in the US.

Freedom is subjective; but I am inclined to say that you should have the right to post here removed. Is that in the American constitution?

Wow, do you think and say this about everyone you don't agree with. I liken your statement to something the Communists have/are doing. Silence the critics.

Our queen is a mighty woman; although quite powerless. Don't come to the UK though, I fear that if she were to knight you you'd end up in three pieces.

Well since I am not a subject of the crown, I guess I won't be invited to Buckingham anytime soon.

Now what was it I don't like about America. Nothing not to like really. Although some of its people have overdosed waaaaaay too much on the patriotic peel.

I'll agree with you to a point.

Don't say you didn't ask for that. Now I think my covert comments have risen from the sediments and shown their metamorphic nature. Wouldn't you agree?

I deserve to be "stoned" for that comment thank you.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Hey, no swiping my pun just for Visual Ads benefit!!!

[Mark Gambo]

Hey, no swiping my pun just for Visual Ads benefit!!!

Sorru Bro, I guess I owe you one.

[dsheller]

No, I feel lucky and privileged to live in the US. I am proud of the accomplishments of my country and how we have improved the quality of life of people worldwide who have benefited from the technology that was developed here by americans.

Yes, technology developed by americans... which resulted from the science, mathematics, and technologies developed by the rest of the world as well. I live in the US, and am very grateful to live here, but by no stretch of the imagination would I pretend to gain an understanding as to why some people dislike (very kind term here) the US. Until you have lived their life you are very unlikely to understand their reasoning.

[Mark Gambo]

. . . Until you have lived their life you are very unlikely to understand their reasoning.

Well this is what I am trying to discover.

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I liken your statement to something the Communists have/are doing. Silence the critics.

A right is also a sanction. To enforce one right you must give up another. Communism has its upsides especially in forums where the moderators are chosen / recommended.

[Mark Gambo]

A right is also a sanction. To enforce one right you must give up another. Communism has its upsides especially in forums where the moderators are chosen / recommended.

Like this

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It doesn't load for me. Maybe it is being blocked by communists.

[Mark Gambo]

It doesn't load for me. Maybe it is being blocked by communists.

Maybe Communists hate free speech and religion:

First They Came for the Jews


First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

[Shaggy Hiker]

The "they" in the original poem would serve fairly well for conservative, except for the first phrase.

So let's update it for modern issues:

First they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist
Then they came for the homosexuals
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist
Then they came for the educators
and tried to force their religion on our young.
Then they came for those who whave non-marital relations with women
Yikes...but then again, they aren't too clean in this regard either.
Then they came for the environmentalists.
Yikes.

[Mark Gambo]

. . . Then they came for the educators
and tried to force their religion on our young.

You know quite well that the Left doesn't allow any type religion to be taught in school except of course to allow members of a certain religion to prayer during the school day. Hmmm, I wonder which religion that could be, ahhh yes the Religion of "Peace". Try to have a menorah or a Cross in a school and you will be prosecuted but stop the school day so we can pray yes that is fair.

This which reminds me of something a friend of mine once told me "As long as they keep having tests, there will always be prayer in school." I have prayed many a time in school especially before Midterms and Finals probably just like you whether or not you want to admit it

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Free speech is a figure of speech. I do believe that the idea behind communism is that everyone is seen as equal from a material perspective; totally flawed and totally impossible. But I am also under the belief that democracy is based upon social equality; again totally impossible and flawed.

Here in the UK, if I were to go and preach extremist views I may silenced. My extreme views could be based on religion and I may be exercising my right to free speech. However, I would be deemed as behaving in a socially unacceptable manner and thus giving up my right to exercise my freedom of speech. It highlights the need that in some cases individuals need to be silenced.

If I were an extremist who encouraged the others to commit mass murder in the interests of an agenda or belief and I then went and exercised my right to freedom of speech by telling everyone. I would (in the UK at least) be silenced and possibly arrested and charged under the terrorism act. If you look beyond of the moral and ethical problems with this kind of preaching (i.e: its clearly not right to kill), my actions would be deemed as socially unacceptable and more importantly they would threaten the social ideals of the society. This is because I my actions could result in one or more people doing what i say and threatening the society. It is therefore necessary to remove my right to freedom of speech in order to preserve agendas of the society.

While this is an extreme example it does demonstrate that a freedom is note necessarily a freedom. The fourth amendment in the US constitution for example gives citizens the right not to be subjected to unreasonable violations of their privacy without probable cause. In the UK there is no such right and police have stop and search powers but not a normal citizen. In either case that right is given up in certain conditions.

Dictatorship, communism, socialism and democracy exist in all cultures in varying degrees and circumstances. The thing to remember is that these societies are not necessarily bad; they don't necessarily oppress religion and in some it is the best way in which the nation can exist peacefully . The ideal world is by no means a democratic one.

[Mark Gambo]

Free speech is a figure of speech. I do believe that the idea behind communism is that everyone is seen as equal from a material perspective; totally flawed and totally impossible. . . . no means a democratic one.

Hmmm, your point being ;-) The freedom of speech here in "the States" is not absolute either for example you can't go into a crowded Fire House and yell Movie . Seriously, you may not be aware of this but at least in the State of New York, and probably other states also, the police have a right in a public place (Street, Bus Station, etc.) to stop you and possibly Frisk you if they reasonably believe that you have, are, or are about to committed a Crime (NYS Definition any Felony or Penal Law Misdemeanor). They can detain you for an indefinite amount of time while they investigate you.

[Shaggy Hiker]

You know quite well that the Left doesn't allow any type religion to be taught in school except of course to allow members of a certain religion to prayer during the school day. Hmmm, I wonder which religion that could be, ahhh yes the Religion of "Peace". Try to have a menorah or a Cross in a school and you will be prosecuted but stop the school day so we can pray yes that is fair.

This which reminds me of something a friend of mine once told me "As long as they keep having tests, there will always be prayer in school." I have prayed many a time in school especially before Midterms and Finals probably just like you whether or not you want to admit it

I honestly have no idea what you are refering to in the first paragraph. The only thing we did routinely was bomb scares as soon as the weather got nice. Of course, I grew up in northern New England, which is hardly the hot bed of just about anything. What was this Religion of "Peace" you were refering to? The only thing I can think of is the Quakers, but I don't know any school that knows anything about them outside of the oatmeal.

As for the second paragraph, I never prayed for a test. My general style was nonchalance. I have those dreams that people talk about where you show up to class in time for the final and realize you haven't been there for the whole semester and didn't study, except that in my version, I just say "bring it on, I may not have been here all semester, but I'll pass your silly test!" In fact, the reason I was able to do well without studying for more than half an hour per test was because I have a good memory that gets better under pressure, so the dreams are wrong. To do well on a test, it wouldn't matter whether or not I studied, but it would certainly matter whether or not I had been to class.

[Mark Gambo]

One thing I do like about the UK Judaical system is the fact that a person who has been arrest identity is not released to the public unless they are convicted. I have seem some instances where a man is arrested for rape only to be found not guilty at trial. but his name was already released to the media and he will be forever branded as a rapist even if the victim recants her story on the stand. The Duke Lacrosse Rape Case is a perfect example. A man who was once acquitted after a well publicized criminal trial once said "Where do I go to to get my reputation back?"

[Shaggy Hiker]

Hmmm, your point being ;-) The freedom of speech here in "the States" is not absolute either for example you can't go into a crowded Fire House and yell Movie . Seriously, you may not be aware of this but at least in the State of New York, and probably other states also, the police have a right in a public place (Street, Bus Station, etc.) to stop you and possibly Frisk you if they reasonably believe that you have, are, or are about to committed a Crime (NYS Definition any Felony or Penal Law Misdemeanor). They can detain you for an indefinite amount of time while they investigate you.

They can also stop and search you to some extent without probable cause as long as they do not single you out. This is used for drunk driving checks, hunter check stations, etc. As long as you are searching everyone equally, or based on a mathematical formula (every other car, for instance), then it's ok...up to a point. It is permissible to look through glass, but not open a closed container (trunk) without probable cause or permission.

[Mark Gambo]

I honestly have no idea what you are refering to in the first paragraph. . .

You should read something other than the New York Times or the Washington Post a little more

http://www.10news.com/news/13767699/detail.html
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/0712/p01s03-ussc.htm
http://www.becketfund.org/index.php/article/453.html
http://www.aclusandiego.org/news_ite...icle_id=000273
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php...show_article=1

. . . The only thing we did routinely was bomb scares as soon as the weather got nice. Of course, I grew up in northern New England, which is hardly the hot bed of just about anything.

Ahh, the good old days but today that would probably get you arrested.

What was this Religion of "Peace" you were refering to? The only thing I can think of is the Quakers, but I don't know any school that knows anything about them outside of the oatmeal.

Religion of "Peace"

As for the second paragraph, I never prayed for a test. My general style was nonchalance. I have those dreams that people talk about where you show up to class in time for the final and realize you haven't been there for the whole semester and didn't study, except that in my version, I just say "bring it on, I may not have been here all semester, but I'll pass your silly test!" In fact, the reason I was able to do well without studying for more than half an hour per test was because I have a good memory that gets better under pressure, so the dreams are wrong. To do well on a test, it wouldn't matter whether or not I studied, but it would certainly matter whether or not I had been to class.

Lucky you

[Mark Gambo]

They can also stop and search you to some extent without probable cause as long as they do not single you out. This is used for drunk driving checks, hunter check stations, etc. As long as you are searching everyone equally, or based on a mathematical formula (every other car, for instance), then it's ok...up to a point. It is permissible to look through glass, but not open a closed container (trunk) without probable cause or permission.

I hate to differ with you again, what you are referring to is a check point where some sort of systematic policy has been put in place ie Stop every 4 car, etc. No what I am talking about is New York State Criminal Procedure Law Section 140.50 which authorizes a police officer “to stop a person in a public place . . . when he reasonably suspects that such person is committing, has committed or is about to commit either (a) a felony or (b) a misdemeanor.” Once such a stop has been made, New York law authorizes a frisk of the person only if the officer “reasonably suspects that he is in danger of physical injury.” These provisions form the core of what is popularly referred to as New York’s “Stop and Frisk Act.”

You can be walking down the street minding your own business and if someone tells a Police Officer that they saw you with the a gun believe me you will be stopped and question and most probably searched Even if you aren't carrying a gun. Anything else you may have been carrying on your person (ie Drugs, etc) that the police find on you as result of the search is admissible against you in state court.

[Mark Gambo]

Shaggy

here are a couple more links for your reading pleasure:

http://www.cair.com/ArticleDetails.a...ge=1&&Active=1
http://www.cair.com/ArticleDetails.a...ge=1&&Active=1

These two links are from the Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR) hardly a right wing group.

[space_monkey]

No option for yanks who love our own country? Don't get me wrong i don't agree with everything the current administration has done nor do i agree with everything the previous administration did, and it's most likely that i won't agree with everything the next one does either. Well unless they elect me.

Also i don't think the US is the better than every other country out there, we have plenty of problems.

But with all that being said I love my country and can't wait to love yours too.



WAIT WE HAVE INDOOR PLUMBING?

[Shaggy Hiker]

You should read something other than the New York Times or the Washington Post a little more

I read neither, of course. Good links, though. Some changes to allow for people to go off and pray should be allowed, it just shouldn't be mandated. This was never an issue when I was growing up. The christian right had no power up there. Had we been allowed time to go off and pray, you can bet I would have taken advantage of it...following Transendentalism, if you know what that is. If you don't, look up Ralph Waldo Emerson or Henry David Thoreau (what's with people using their middle names back then, was it just that movement?).

Ahh, the good old days but today that would probably get you arrested.

It would back then, too. I have no idea who was calling in the bomb scares. I do think there was very little effort spent on trying to catch the perpetrators, and there would probably be more now, but without a tip, there was little they could do back then. I noted that bomb scares were only in the spring, and only on sunny days when the temperature got up into the 60's.

Religion of "Peace"

That may be accurate, but is there any religion that doesn't have blood on it's hands? (ok, the Quakers don't have much history of bloodshed, nor do the Unitarians, but those are just offshoots of christianity, which has a gory history indeed). Every religion seems to go through this, and some never get out of it. If we aren't killing people over their flavor or christianity in this country, it's only because we got tired of it. Phooey on them all.

Lucky you

My cup is only half full. Why is it only those dreams where I can alter the outcome to get rid of what would normally cause stress? There are some people who can control what happens in their dreams entirely. If I had that ability, I sure wouldn't be dreaming about going to school, though I'd be naked in alot more dreams, and I wouldn't be the only one

[penagate]

Well this is what I am trying to discover.

Your own posts demonstrate exactly why.

You place the United States on a pedestal. You extol its virtues; you compare it to other cultures and ways of life in a manner that is nothing but condescending. You deliberately set out to frame anything that does not conform to your partisan, patriotic viewpoint as somehow inferior.

There is a prevailing arrogance among Americans. And you have the naïvetè to wonder why you think the rest of the world hates you. I hope that one day you can see.

[Pino]

Well I was just about to reply to this post, I couldn't be bothered to read it all. But I read Pengates post and well.. I couldn't really have put it better if I tried.

Pino

[TheBigB]

Whatever you reason please post it here

- Extreme censoring
- Guns on every corner of the street
- Americans thinking that they help the world by starting wars
- Strict religious families (not saying they don't have that anywhere else)
- Bush

I'm not saying that the Netherlands is perfect; I actually hate my country too, but those are my reasons.

By the way, no offense to anyone

[MaximilianMayrhofer]

Penagate put it pretty succintly.

[Atheist]

Your own posts demonstrate exactly why.

You place the United States on a pedestal. You extol its virtues; you compare it to other cultures and ways of life in a manner that is nothing but condescending. You deliberately set out to frame anything that does not conform to your partisan, patriotic viewpoint as somehow inferior.

There is a prevailing arrogance among Americans. And you have the naïvetè to wonder why you think the rest of the world hates you. I hope that one day you can see.

[Mark Gambo]

Your own posts demonstrate exactly why.

You place the United States on a pedestal. You extol its virtues; you compare it to other cultures and ways of life in a manner that is nothing but condescending. You deliberately set out to frame anything that does not conform to your partisan, patriotic viewpoint as somehow inferior.

There is a prevailing arrogance among Americans. And you have the naïvetè to wonder why you think the rest of the world hates you. I hope that one day you can see.

So I should sit back and just let uninformed persons make disparaging remarks about the US? Yes, I am very proud of my country and I have fought to protect it's sovereignty which I will happily do again if call upon to do so. How many of you can say that you have or would do the same?

I will not stand by and listen to out right slander of the US and it's people. It seems to me that all of the worlds problems are because of the US. So if it bothers you so much that I am a big "flag waver" then do yourself a favor don't read my posts better yet there is a function on VBF where you can ignore a particular user, I suggest that you utilize this feature because I am not going away and I will continue to espouse the virtues of the US whenever it comes under attack.by bombs or by the pen (or the keyboard).


With that being said I wish a Happy Easter to all and have a pleasant rest of your weekend!

[Mark Gambo]

Well I was just about to reply to this post, I couldn't be bothered to read it all. But I read Pengates post and well.. I couldn't really have put it better if I tried.

Pino

So I guess in your original post you were joking.

[SwedeNpro]

They eat all my hamburgers! thats why i dont like theeem!

And its stupid that its avablie to run with guns and all that.