Turkish Bombers

[Valleysboy1978]

Also more people die on the roads each year than are killed by gun violence yet we never hear calls to ban the automobile. Guns much like automobiles if used responsibly are perfectly fine; one cannot ban a thing just because some of the population uses it irresponsibly. The constitution of the US guarantee’s the right to keep and bear arms, it has worked really well for 200+ years I don’t see a cause to change it now.

X

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/5400570.stm
So it is acceptable for a grown man to enter a school, and shoot 4 innocent young girls in the head? After all he had the right to bear arms. A person does not buy a gun for fun, they are designed to kill and no good can ever come from using one.

As for the Irish, yet again you are denying the obvious truth, that the IRA received funding via the US (mostly through charities) and the US government of the time did nothing to stop them.

Terrorism was prevelant in many countries around the world but now that it has reached American soil it was become a full scale war. What scares me most is Bush. Thanks to him (and to no small part Blair) terrorists are now receiving far more recruits, funding and resources. This terrorist war has the potential to get out of hand very very quickly, and I have to say I can't see this ending for a very long time.....if ever. What a legacy to pass on to our children

[Xanith]

I do understand that money came from people inside of the US that probably did help fund the IRA (probably most of it from people who didn’t know where it was going). Money has also come from the UK and other countries. I have already stated that and understand that. What everyone seems to be glossing over is that when the US government was able to prove that money was being diverted to terrorist organizations like the IRA these organizations were shut down.

While I understand that some of you feel that this should have been a top priority of the US government to stop terrorism inside the UK/Ireland, you have to understand that before 9/11 the US government didn’t even take Osama Bin Laden’s threat to the US too serious. The US government let its own people down, its not surprising the US government didn’t take the time to stop terrorism in another country, they didn’t even try too hard to stop it at home in its own.

Money is still being raised inside of the US for terrorist organizations that help kill Americans. The problem is proving where the money is going and then taking the necessary steps to shut these organizations down.

In a free society such things like this are always going to happen. The US even trained the 9/11 pilots to fly those airliners into the Pentagon and the Twin Towers. The only thing the US government can do is learn from its mistakes and then take the steps now to correct those mistakes.

Also you have to understand that the problem of international terrorism is not going to go away simply by ignoring it. If history has shown us anything it is that ignoring a problem only makes things worse in the long run. Leaving the terrorists alone for too long allowed them to build a base inside of Afghanistan where they trained the next generation of leaders. Not doing anything to destroy the global organization of terrorists because you feel it would create more terrorists is simply idiotic.

The only way to destroy the threat is to confront it, as I said it’s not going away on its own. So while you are afraid of Bush because he is confronting this global threat (yes its not just a threat to the US) head on, I am more afraid of Iran and if they actually are allowed to get nuclear weapons. Iran will use them, and anyone who thinks otherwise better wake up soon before it is too late.

X

[Valleysboy1978]

The only way to destroy the threat is to confront it, as I said it’s not going away on its own. So while you are afraid of Bush because he is confronting this global threat (yes its not just a threat to the US) head on, I am more afraid of Iran and if they actually are allowed to get nuclear weapons. Iran will use them, and anyone who thinks otherwise better wake up soon before it is too late.

X

Again the US doesn't learn. Confronting the problem head on solves nothing, except by making the said government into the "bad guy". Look at the Irish terrorist war (sorry to keep going back to this but they are very similar). For decades the two sides were too stubborn to sit down and talk. As soon as the IRA and British government (who were both as bad as each other) sat down to talk, peace was finally a possibility and was a reality almost immediately. Now Ireland as a whole is flourishing from renewed trade and tourism and it is proof when the children cannot understand what the problem was, a good sign for it is with the children that are hopes lie

I know it's hard to envisage but the US/UK governments have certainly made their mistakes and can probably be held partially responsible for creating the problem (granted not the current leaders). However, if they continue to try and solve it with weapons it will quickly escalate. What happens if a terrorist (or as you say even Iran) uses a nuclear weapon. Doesn't matter where (although in a Western country would obviously be worse from the international communities point of view), what will be the response?
Will the UN impose sanctions and just condemn the action? But essentially do nothing?
Will the said country ask for international aid in returning the action?
Will the US/UK just invade citing the WMD story used for Iraq?

Yes I agree it's concerning that Iran (and now probably N. Korea) have nuclear weapons, but nothing can really be done to stop them without contravening international law (and of course many would say it's hypocritical seeing as we have countless nuclear weapons)

I just hope there will be stability for our children

[Ex-FB]

I do understand that money came from people inside of the US that probably did help fund the IRA (probably most of it from people who didn’t know where it was going). Money has also come from the UK and other countries. I have already stated that and understand that. What everyone seems to be glossing over is that when the US government was able to prove that money was being diverted to terrorist organizations like the IRA these organizations were shut down.

While I understand that some of you feel that this should have been a top priority of the US government to stop terrorism inside the UK/Ireland, you have to understand that before 9/11 the US government didn’t even take Osama Bin Laden’s threat to the US too serious. The US government let its own people down, its not surprising the US government didn’t take the time to stop terrorism in another country, they didn’t even try too hard to stop it at home in its own.

Money is still being raised inside of the US for terrorist organizations that help kill Americans. The problem is proving where the money is going and then taking the necessary steps to shut these organizations down.

In a free society such things like this are always going to happen. The US even trained the 9/11 pilots to fly those airliners into the Pentagon and the Twin Towers. The only thing the US government can do is learn from its mistakes and then take the steps now to correct those mistakes.

Also you have to understand that the problem of international terrorism is not going to go away simply by ignoring it. If history has shown us anything it is that ignoring a problem only makes things worse in the long run. Leaving the terrorists alone for too long allowed them to build a base inside of Afghanistan where they trained the next generation of leaders. Not doing anything to destroy the global organization of terrorists because you feel it would create more terrorists is simply idiotic.

The only way to destroy the threat is to confront it, as I said it’s not going away on its own. So while you are afraid of Bush because he is confronting this global threat (yes its not just a threat to the US) head on, I am more afraid of Iran and if they actually are allowed to get nuclear weapons. Iran will use them, and anyone who thinks otherwise better wake up soon before it is too late.

X

First, I would like to commend you on an excellent post. Thank you.

I don't believe that the US's top priority should be to stop terrorism in the UK, but if they expect anybody to take them seriously about the "Global War on Terror", then they should at least be arresting the people in the US who fund the IRA. Unfortunately there seems to be little incentive to run the risk of upsetting the 35 milion Americans who claim Irish heritage, so these fund raisers are left to go free. Shutting down the organisations is not enough, people should be thrown in prison for this (IMHO). And until stringent action is taken, the "Global War on Terror" is simply going to look like "Bush's war against Muslims with Oil"

As for ignoring/confronting the threat. I have never seen anyone ever say that the threat should be ignored. That would be insanity. However, bombing innocent people who happen to live near suspected terrorists, only breeds more terrorists. That was obvious from the start of the attacks on Afghanistan and Iraq. A far better solution would have been to pursue these people using the well defined boundries of the law. Yes, it may be a lot slower and more painful but at least you wouldn't be despised by the rest of the world (and unfortunately, that is the state your present government has put you in).

Let's look at the facts:

Afghanistan was harbouring Bin Laden. They asked for proof that he was responsible for the attacks on the WTC (this was before the videos came out). The US cited that to give proof would be detrimental to their intelligence gathering agents. So they invaded. Now, flip this around. If Afghanistan asked the US to hand over a US citizen for a terrorist action, yet refused to show any proof. Do you think the US government would comply?

Iraq, had nothing to do with the WTC, and was fairly crippled still from the previous war. So what does the US do. They attack them, killing thousands of innocent people and therefore creating a massive pool of new terroriist recruits under the guise of freedom fighters or revenge for freshly killed brothers, sisters, children.....

Bush ignores the Geneva convention and starts holding prisoners without trial and tortuing them. Now, don't get me wrong, I doubt if the terrorists are going to stick to the Geneva convention, that would be nieve, however, he has reduced your nation to just another terrorist state. I mean, for F's sake, listen to yourselves... torture.... acceptable practice.... ***! It's easy to say that if it saves American lives then it's okay... I'm sorry, but any state that employs torture could make that statement. I'm sure the Nazi's used the same excuse when they tortured prisoners... and yet, somehow you still believe that you can hold your head up as a world power.

Now we get onto your so called Allies. Pakistan are only on your side becauise you threatened them (by the way I was there a few months ago, and they hate the US because of your "War on Muslims"), is that the sort of Ally you want? So, then Bush goes on to say that he will stomp all over Paklistani authority if he has to. Again, it shows the world a complete disregard for trust and law. I know, again you will say that the gains justify the means.... however there are so many of these statements that you are presenting a common face to the world as a rouge nation that has no regard for anybody elses juristiction.

So, you also pull out of the Geneva War Crimes, because you don't trust other countries. So we have a world wide forum for convicting war criminals, one that works well and has brought many war criminals to trial, and one that the US supports when it suits them, but one that you are not willing to let your citizens be held accountable to. Again, it shows the world a blatent disregard for the few world laws that we have.

Abducting citizens from their countries and taking them away to torture them? Again, the sort of thing a rouge nation would do. Oh, and before you say the ends justify the means, look at how many have turned out to be completely innocent people. Sorry about the torture and all that...

So, then we have Israel bombing the Lebanese. Again, the world calls for them to stop the massacre, but the US vetos it and allows them to go on. Apparently the US is doing all it can to keep the Israelis supplied with bombs (with many extra weapons deliveries over the period), so that they can bomb innocent families. Don't get me wrong, both sides were to blame, but unfortunately once again, your country sullied it's hands by over eagerly supply cluster bombs to be used on civilians.

So, as you look around at the rest of the world and wonder why your country doesn't garner any respect for it's "Global War on Terror" and most of the other countries cower from your terrorist actions and hope that you don't turn your mightly war machine on them, at what point do you complain because suddenly they feel the burning urge to start buildiung nuclear weapons to protct themselves before you manage to extract your armies from the quagmire of Iraq and turn your hateful vegence on the next nation on your list of "Evil".

No, history has shown us that there are only three succesful ways to fight terrorism.

1) Covertly. Bullet in the brain, bury the body, don't tell anyone. This was the most effective method employed by the Germans against the French Resistence. Lack of knowledge as to where the rest of the organisation is, is one of the weaknesses of a large dissapated, loosly connected group of people.

2) Removing popular support. In this case, I believe this could have been done post 9/11. Most muslims I know where horrified about the 9/11 attacks and had great sympathy for the US. Now most of them see the destruction you have sown and that opportunity is long past.

3) The hardest one. The legal route. Bin Laden could probably have been brought to justice by now through diplomatic means. It would have taken a long time, but would probably have cost far fewer innocent lives. I think Americans scoff at the power of sanctions, which shows a very blinkered view of the world. You have a very affluent lifestyle, but sanctions for many countries are crippling and often more than enough of a threat to topple any government.

Your method of attacking the terrorists has only strengthened them, destabilised the world, and caused massive untold grief throughout both the Muslim and Western worlds.

[rory]

So, then we have Israel bombing the Lebanese.

And Hezbullah bombing the Israellis ..

So, as you look around at the rest of the world and wonder why your country doesn't garner any respect for it's "Global War on Terror"

I am 100% behind the allies and the Global War on Terror and I dont live in the US or the UK .. anyone that is not against terrorism is a little punk terrorist and will have their day in hell.

Now most of them see the destruction you have sown and that opportunity is long past.

So as you are saying "you" instead of "we", then you are one of these terrorists?? This is not a Terrorist Support forum!!!

You have a very affluent lifestyle

So you are living in the bush with no running water?

Your method of attacking the terrorists has only strengthened them

They are weak little punks that will spend their time in hell.

[Valleysboy1978]

And Hezbullah bombing the Israellis ..


I am 100% behind the allies and the Global War on Terror and I dont live in the US or the UK .. anyone that is not against terrorism is a little punk terrorist and will have their day in hell.


So as you are saying "you" instead of "we", then you are one of these terrorists?? This is not a Terrorist Support forum!!!


So you are living in the bush with no running water?


They are weak little punks that will spend their time in hell.

Please tell me you're not being serious!
Just because he does not agree with the actions of the UK/US doesn't mean he supports the terrorists. Nothing is that black & white! I myself totally agree that the terrorists must be stopped, but I totally disagree with how the UK/US have gone about doing that. They have ended up strengthening the very terrorists they are attempting to stop

and if you cannot post a well balanced or serious post please refrain from posing in the "World Events" forum. Thank you

[rory]

Please tell me you're not being serious!
Just because he does not agree with the actions of the UK/US doesn't mean he supports the terrorists. Nothing is that black & white! I myself totally agree that the terrorists must be stopped, but I totally disagree with how the UK/US have gone about doing that. They have ended up strengthening the very terrorists they are attempting to stop

and if you cannot post a well balanced or serious post please refrain from posing in the "World Events" forum. Thank you

You're not welcome .. you should refrain from responding to me if you have nothing valuable to say.

[Ex-FB]

I suspect this might be a ten year old kid, or somebody pulling our leg. But just incase it is the former, I supose I should try and explain their quotes.

And Hezbullah bombing the Israellis ..

Correct. If you read my post, I did say that both sides were to blame.

I am 100% behind the allies and the Global War on Terror and I dont live in the US or the UK .. anyone that is not against terrorism is a little punk terrorist and will have their day in hell.

Two fairly accurate points. He is apprently 100% behind the Global War on Terror. Fair enough, that is his right.
Second Point. Anyone that is not against terrorism is a little punk terrorist. Well, I don't see anybody here who is for terrorism, do you? Of course, he might have been trying to imply that those who weren't behind the "Global War on Terror" where for terrorists, but only an absolute moron would make so illogical a leap (Upon seeing a glass of Coke, pronounce "It's not Orange Juice, therefore it's Milk!"). Of course, I scoff at the little punk terrorist, the greatest danger in war is to underestimate your enemy.

So as you are saying "you" instead of "we", then you are one of these terrorists?? This is not a Terrorist Support forum!!!

Mmmm. An (at best) laughable comment. I am an ex-soldier, I have lost people to terrorists in Northern Ireland, but I will make allowances because I'm guessing your still a wee kid. So I will explain it simply to you. I do say "you", as I have had no hand in killing civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq, I have never tortured anyone, and I have never voted for or supported any government that does this sort of thing. Your next jump of logic is very sad. Because I don't believe that we should go around killing and raping innocent people, then I'm a terrorist? Is that honestly what you are saying. I hope that when you grow up you will have more wisdom than this.

I agree with your final statement, this is not a terrorist support forum. I think we are all agreed that the sooner we get rid of terrorist b****tards the better.

So you are living in the bush with no running water?

Er, where did this come from. Please try to keep up with the conversation. I personally have a very good lifestyle, however many of the countries to which sanctions can be applied effectively do not have running water, and in fact many don't even have drinkable water (running or not). I am stunned that this may come as a shock to you. Please ask your school teacher to cover some of the middle eastern nations next time you are in class.

They are weak little punks that will spend their time in hell.

Again, it is a terrible danger to underestimate your enemy. It's a lot like calling the WTC a cowardly attack... It's despicable yes, but what was cowardly about it? They killed themselves in the attack. Any enemy that has such disregard for their own life and the lives of others is a very dangerous enemy. By implying that they are weak little punks you are dishonoring the brave soldiers out there every day who are fighting them around the world, and belittling the danger they are in. Shame on you.

[rory]

I suspect this might be a ten year old kid, or somebody pulling our leg. But just incase it is the former, I supose I should try and explain their quotes.


Correct. If you read my post, I did say that both sides were to blame.


Two fairly accurate points. He is apprently 100% behind the Global War on Terror. Fair enough, that is his right.
Second Point. Anyone that is not against terrorism is a little punk terrorist. Well, I don't see anybody here who is for terrorism, do you? Of course, he might have been trying to imply that those who weren't behind the "Global War on Terror" where for terrorists, but only an absolute moron would make so illogical a leap (Upon seeing a glass of Coke, pronounce "It's not Orange Juice, therefore it's Milk!"). Of course, I scoff at the little punk terrorist, the greatest danger in war is to underestimate your enemy.



Mmmm. An (at best) laughable comment. I am an ex-soldier, I have lost people to terrorists in Northern Ireland, but I will make allowances because I'm guessing your still a wee kid. So I will explain it simply to you. I do say "you", as I have had no hand in killing civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq, I have never tortured anyone, and I have never voted for or supported any government that does this sort of thing. Your next jump of logic is very sad. Because I don't believe that we should go around killing and raping innocent people, then I'm a terrorist? Is that honestly what you are saying. I hope that when you grow up you will have more wisdom than this.

I agree with your final statement, this is not a terrorist support forum. I think we are all agreed that the sooner we get rid of terrorist the better.


Er, where did this come from. Please try to keep up with the conversation. I personally have a very good lifestyle, however many of the countries to which sanctions can be applied effectively do not have running water, and in fact many don't even have drinkable water (running or not). I am stunned that this may come as a shock to you. Please ask your school teacher to cover some of the middle eastern nations next time you are in class.


Again, it is a terrible danger to underestimate your enemy. It's a lot like calling the WTC a cowardly attack... It's despicable yes, but what was cowardly about it? They killed themselves in the attack. Any enemy that has such disregard for their own life and the lives of others is a very dangerous enemy. By implying that they are weak little punks you are dishonoring the brave soldiers out there every day who are fighting them around the world, and belittling the danger they are in. Shame on you.

You're a joke .. say grow up ... need to go live in the 3rd world for a change and see what life is really like outside of that perfect little world you live in. Just because you cant take the straight to the point hard facts .. well carry on smartly then little kid. Everything you just said is total rubbish.

[InvisibleDuncan]

You're a joke .. say grow up ... need to go live in the 3rd world for a change and see what life is really like outside of that perfect little world you live in. Just because you cant take the straight to the point hard facts .. well carry on smartly then little kid. Everything you just said is total rubbish.

This is one of those occasions where I think VBF needs more smileys. , & just don't cover it.

[penagate]

Bush ignores the Geneva convention and starts holding prisoners without trial and tortuing them. Now, don't get me wrong, I doubt if the terrorists are going to stick to the Geneva convention, that would be nieve, however, he has reduced your nation to just another terrorist state.
[...]
Your method of attacking the terrorists has only strengthened them, destabilised the world, and caused massive untold grief throughout both the Muslim and Western worlds.

I couldn't agree more.

It's like that saying about arguing with a fool: he will drag you down to his level, and then beat you. And that's more or less what we're seeing, although no-one has really been beaten yet, and probably never will if we continue down this road.

[demotivater]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/5400570.stm
So it is acceptable for a grown man to enter a school, and shoot 4 innocent young girls in the head? After all he had the right to bear arms. A person does not buy a gun for fun, they are designed to kill and no good can ever come from using one.

Thomas Hamilton had the right to carry his weapon into the school in Dunblane as well, no? We've seen the affect the knee jerk banning of handguns has had in England where the populace hasn't the means or the legal right to defend itself. Crime rates plummeted, oh wait, no they didn't. They continue to drop here in the US.

removed by moderator

[Valleysboy1978]

Thomas Hamilton had the right to carry his weapon into the school in Dunblane as well, no? We've seen the affect the knee jerk banning of handguns has had in England where the populace hasn't the means or the legal right to defend itself. Crime rates plummeted, oh wait, no they didn't. They continue to drop here in the US.

removed by moderator

And yet the US has had 3 school shootings in 1 week. Surely you have to admit that things are getting out of hand?

Ex-FB you keep coming out with these great posts! I too hope this poster was a kid as the comments seem juvenile, but I suppose we live in a free country and he is entitled to his opinion (rory: something that those said country's do not enjoy)

[rory]

And yet the US has had 3 school shootings in 1 week. Surely you have to admit that things are getting out of hand?

Ex-FB you keep coming out with these great posts! I too hope this poster was a kid as the comments seem juvenile, but I suppose we live in a free country and he is entitled to his opinion (rory: something that those said country's do not enjoy)

Juvenile is this:
Planet Xeoroaniar

Edit. I didnt realise I was replying to young kids here, and the other a troll.
Carry on smartly then ..

[Valleysboy1978]

Juvenile is this:
Planet Xeoroaniar

Edit. I didnt realise I was replying to young kids here, and the other a troll.
Carry on smartly then ..

You really are a piece of work! Once again you show your juvenile nature by making assumptions. The Xeoroaniar name actually comes from a Sci-Fi book I am writing.

Ok little child go back to class now .. the title of this forum is CHAT, if you want a debate you need to think again, i wouldnt waste my time on you. Now that said, I will not converse with you anymore, so have fun wasting bandwidth

How petty...and technically this forum is called WORLD EVENTS

Well gentlemen, now that the juvenile has left shall we continue with the topic?
In reply to Ex-FB, I honestly can't see how they can resolve this with all parties happy. The Iraqi people seem to genuinely want Democracy but it could be a while before that becomes a reality. Perhaps instead of the allied forces, a UN peacekeeping force instead? I know it's in reality the same thing but the UN can be seen as impartial whereas the US/UK can be accused of having alterior motives

I certainly wouldn't want to be in Bush's/Blair's shoes right now

[Valleysboy1978]

In reply to Ex-FB, I honestly can't see how they can resolve this with all parties happy. The Iraqi people seem to genuinely want Democracy but it could be a while before that becomes a reality. Perhaps instead of the allied forces, a UN peacekeeping force instead? I know it's in reality the same thing but the UN can be seen as impartial whereas the US/UK can be accused of having alterior motives

Well it looks like they listened to my advice! Although they used NATO instead

[FunkyDexter]

On a positive note, the independent monitoring commission in Ireland have just announced they believe the IRA has stopped it's terrorist and criminal activities. The republicans have been declaring they want proper peace talks for some times and now Ian Paisley (Unionist) won't have an excuse to storm away from the table... again.

[Ex-FB]

Well it looks like they listened to my advice! Although they used NATO instead

Cool! That will hopefully help matters.

I doubt if it would be possible to persuade the UN to take over Iraq after they sidelined them over the invasion. However, I'm also not convinced that this would be an appropriate use of the UN unless the peacekeeping forces where made up mainly of middle-eastern forces (which rules out NATO).

I suspect the biggest step forward will be made when Bush leaves office (This is not a politcal statement - regardless of whether a democrat or republican replaces him), but he is seen as the main agressor, and hopefully once he is out, there is a chance of calming things down.

Of course, he is only one focal point, and now that the hornets nest is stirred up, it will be difficult to control, however improving the lot of the normal Iraqi civilian would probably go a long way to helping matters. I posted a number of years ago, a tale of how we were putting in power generators to power the oil fields (at the US militarys expense I might add) when 95% of Iraqi's had no electricity. This kind of thing is an easy flash point for the Iraqi people, and can only aid our enemies. Try to pretend that it's not about taking their oil at cents on the dollar.

Also, I believe we need to stop ***** footing around with politics. For instance, what the hell is an insurgent? Let's be honest here and call the Iraqi Resistance, the Iraqi Criminal Opportunists and a seperate group who are Iraqi Terrorists by different names. Not everyone who picks up a gun in Iraq is a terrorist, and not everyone who picks up a gun is a freedom fighter. As long as we are deliberatly muddling the terms, it will always appear that the terrorists are garnering popular support. We have a chance to sort out the Iraqi resistance by addressing their concerns (such as not tortuing their people and locking up innocent people, raping and burning families etc. - this should be an easy first step). Stamp out the Iraqi criminal opportunists (by good police work - and fair trials), leaving just the terrorists to deal with. These are a harder nut to crack, and it may take a generation or two to sideline them into unconsequence. But that will be the only way to stop them (IMHO), is to make them irrelevant.

[Ex-FB]

Ex-FB you keep coming out with these great posts! I too hope this poster was a kid as the comments seem juvenile, but I suppose we live in a free country and he is entitled to his opinion (rory: something that those said country's do not enjoy)

Thank you, I will endeavour to keep up the good work.


Rory makes me laugh. It's kind of nice to know that such innocent nieve people still exist in this world. I hope nobody takes advantage of him in the real world.

[rory]

Thank you, I will endeavour to keep up the good work.


Rory makes me laugh. It's kind of nice to know that such innocent nieve people still exist in this world. I hope nobody takes advantage of him in the real world.

I dont normally respond to trolls, so here's a shout out from the real world, something you wouldnt know if it bit you in the buttt ..

[FunkyDexter]

what is the ex capital name?

L_a_g_o_s. Doesn't seem very offensive to me

[Ex-FB]

I dont normally respond to trolls, so here's a shout out from the real world, something you wouldnt know if it bit you in the buttt ..

Rory. This is a debate forum. This is the sort of place adults (that's big people to you, like your mummy and daddy) come to discuss and argue over differences of opinions.

Now, most of the adults here, who are discussing these matters (from either side) appear to be able to put forth their viewpoints in a mature and coherent manner.

Whilst we think that it is rather cute that you sit there going "I know you are, but what am I?" and sticking your fingers in your ears and going "nananana not listening nananana", it does get a tad distracting for the adults in the forum who are trying to carry on their discussion.

So please, if you have something of relevance to say, please be me guest and join in the conversation. We will make allowances for your young age. But please don't sidetrack this excellent discussion with your childish temper tantrums and sulking.

Thank you.

[rory]

Rory. This is a debate forum. This is the sort of place adults (that's big people to you, like your mummy and daddy) come to discuss and argue over differences of opinions.

Now, most of the adults here, who are discussing these matters (from either side) appear to be able to put forth their viewpoints in a mature and coherent manner.

Whilst we think that it is rather cute that you sit there going "I know you are, but what am I?" and sticking your fingers in your ears and going "nananana not listening nananana", it does get a tad distracting for the adults in the forum who are trying to carry on their discussion.

So please, if you have something of relevance to say, please be me guest and join in the conversation. We will make allowances for your young age. But please don't sidetrack this excellent discussion with your childish temper tantrums and sulking.

Thank you.

Ok little child go back to class now .. the title of this forum is CHAT, if you want a debate you need to think again, i wouldnt waste my time on you. Now that said, I will not converse with you anymore, so have fun wasting bandwidth.

[demotivater]

And yet the US has had 3 school shootings in 1 week. Surely you have to admit that things are getting out of hand?

Not at all. In fact, assaults and other violence at schools in the US have dropped nearly 50% in the last decade. Not that the media would tell you that or anything, but the facts is the facts.