The "Axis of Evil" is now known as...

[mendhak]

"The Outposts of Tyranny!!!

[mar_zim]

his going to rule the world. :evilmonk:


wonder if my land is the next target.

[CORONA BEER]

neocons suck

[wossname]

Axis of evil = the Y axis.

I never liked the Y axis very much.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Y?


Gee, I didn't realize that there was a minimum size limit to these posts. There certainly isn't a minimum content limit.

[wossname]

Y?


Gee, I didn't realize that there was a minimum size limit to these posts. There certainly isn't a minimum content limit.

X, Y, Z

Y is evil!!!1!!111111

[wossname]

My average content is approaching 0 recently Bodwad is already in negative figures.

[visualAd]

He forgot the US and the UK. Bloody trouble makers .....

Bush wants to invade Iran now ... good luck to him cos I doubt Blair would be stupid enough to back him again.

[CORONA BEER]

It's not Bush who wants to invade Iran, He's just getting paid to give the final word. His Job is to sell us out, we are like a large corporation for sale. Any takers after Israel is done with us? Dont worry about China though, Clinton already sold us to them during his administration.

It helps to think of Bush as the pimp of America.

[honeybee]

It's not Bush who wants to invade Iran, He's just getting paid to give the final word. His Job is to sell us out, we are like a large corporation for sale. Any takers after Israel is done with us? Dont worry about China though, Clinton already sold us to them during his administration.

It helps to think of Bush as the pimp for America.

Who wants to buy, anyway?

Doesn't it just prove what the anti-Iraq war critics have been saying all this while, that it's just another attempt at establishing the American supremacy over the world?

I mean what the heck does it matter to the US government if Fidel Castro wants to rule his country his way? Isn't this meddling ever going to stop?

.

[mendhak]

HB old boy!

Where've you been?

[honeybee]

HB old boy!

Where've you been?

Getting old


.

[mendhak]

We must be related.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Who wants to buy, anyway?

Doesn't it just prove what the anti-Iraq war critics have been saying all this while, that it's just another attempt at establishing the American supremacy over the world?

I mean what the heck does it matter to the US government if Fidel Castro wants to rule his country his way? Isn't this meddling ever going to stop?

.

Do you think that Iraq is establishing our supremacy? If we don't cut and run from this one, we stand a fair chance of swinging our entire country the way the Vietnam War did for us (and WWI did for France). We have been in Iraq for only a little over a year now, this war is still young, but it is proving to have more legs than anyone anticipated. Our chances of declaring victory and leaving a mess is pretty high right now, our alternative is pretty poor, too.

If we claim that we were asked to leave, and use that as an excuse to get out, the neocons will be able to put it behind them. However, if we are honest, and admit that our departure appears to be a likely trigger for full-blown civil war, and if we stay to prevent it, we could end up in a war with Vietnam like consequences on our highly polarized society.

[demotivater]

I mean what the heck does it matter to the US government if Fidel Castro wants to rule his country his way? Isn't this meddling ever going to stop?

lol
Yes yes, we've done quite alot to Cuba. Seems to me we're letting him govern his country, right into the ground. Ah, the virtues of communism. Cuba is yet another example of it's glory. They're all driving around in their 55 Chevys in fear of a missle attack from the evil USA. pfft
You're right, it shouldn't matter at all if they want to be home to nuclear weapons pointed directly at our shores. We should have let them go ahead with it.

[CORONA BEER]

The map is hilarious. It has all these small countries that nobody even gives a crap about with Iran in the center. It let's you know right away what their really after.

Almost as funny as the map on this site, http://www.newamericancentury.org/

[Shaggy Hiker]

lol
Yes yes, we've done quite alot to Cuba. Seems to me we're letting him govern his country, right into the ground. Ah, the virtues of communism. Cuba is yet another example of it's glory. They're all driving around in their 55 Chevys in fear of a missle attack from the evil USA. pfft
You're right, it shouldn't matter at all if they want to be home to nuclear weapons pointed directly at our shores. We should have let them go ahead with it.

I suspect that most of what America knows about Cuba is distortions. This has been a favorite whipping boy for the right wing for a long time, but it seems to me that the truth is somewhere in between. Fidel is still strongly supported by groups that remember how bad they had it under the pure capitalism of the old regime. Fidel didn't take over because everybody loved their government, he won because he toppled an unpopular regime.

Has he done better? In some ways he has, and in some ways he hasn't. There are certainly human rights issues, but they don't appear to be in any way worse than any of the right-wing dictatorships in central or south America. What is different is the level of demonization of Cuba that takes place in the US. The cuban exile community is large, wealthy, and politically powerful. They maintain a small military force called Alpha66 that does occasional training exercises in S. Florida in direct opposition to the US Constitution (that puts a name on the death squads that will be operating once Castro dies). There is no evidence that they have learned a thing from living in the US, and it is unlikely that they will not devastate the country if they are ever allowed to return.

Castro may be bad for that country, we haven't helped any, but either way, his death will likely make life much worse for the citizens of that country.

[MasterBlaster]

I suspect that most of what America knows about Cuba is distortions. This has been a favorite whipping boy for the right wing for a long time, but it seems to me that the truth is somewhere in between. Fidel is still strongly supported by groups that remember how bad they had it under the pure capitalism of the old regime. Fidel didn't take over because everybody loved their government, he won because he toppled an unpopular regime.

Has he done better? In some ways he has, and in some ways he hasn't. There are certainly human rights issues, but they don't appear to be in any way worse than any of the right-wing dictatorships in central or south America. What is different is the level of demonization of Cuba that takes place in the US. The cuban exile community is large, wealthy, and politically powerful. They maintain a small military force called Alpha66 that does occasional training exercises in S. Florida in direct opposition to the US Constitution (that puts a name on the death squads that will be operating once Castro dies). There is no evidence that they have learned a thing from living in the US, and it is unlikely that they will not devastate the country if they are ever allowed to return.

Castro may be bad for that country, we haven't helped any, but either way, his death will likely make life much worse for the citizens of that country.

It's pretty wierd if you look at all of the money that is being dumped into the cuban travel and tourism industry. They're building some huge 4* & 5* beach resorts there from what I've herd/read. I'll bet within 5 years sanctions on cuba will be dropped, americans will be flooding their beaches and there will be some very rich mexicans! As soon as castro drops dead it will happen. Cuba will turn into another Jamaica or Bahama Islands.

[Xcoder]

I suspect that most of what America knows about Cuba is distortions. This has been a favorite whipping boy for the right wing for a long time, but it seems to me that the truth is somewhere in between. Fidel is still strongly supported by groups that remember how bad they had it under the pure capitalism of the old regime. Fidel didn't take over because everybody loved their government, he won because he toppled an unpopular regime.

Has he done better? In some ways he has, and in some ways he hasn't. There are certainly human rights issues, but they don't appear to be in any way worse than any of the right-wing dictatorships in central or south America. What is different is the level of demonization of Cuba that takes place in the US. The cuban exile community is large, wealthy, and politically powerful. They maintain a small military force called Alpha66 that does occasional training exercises in S. Florida in direct opposition to the US Constitution (that puts a name on the death squads that will be operating once Castro dies). There is no evidence that they have learned a thing from living in the US, and it is unlikely that they will not devastate the country if they are ever allowed to return.

Castro may be bad for that country, we haven't helped any, but either way, his death will likely make life much worse for the citizens of that country.

Youre right about the exile community, and that is IMO the first reason why Bush is all about going after Castro. The cuban exiles supported Bush big time during the presidential race, he in exchange, promised (like they have been promised in the past) to be more strict to the island.

The second reason why Bush is saying Castro has to go, is just to maintain the integrity of his rethoric speach about democracy, plain and simple.

[MasterBlaster]

Youre right about the exile community, and that is IMO the first reason why Bush is all about going after Castro. The cuban exiles supported Bush big time during the presidential race, he in exchange, promised (like they have been promised in the past) to be more strict to the island.

The second reason why Bush is saying Castro has to go, is just to maintain the integrity of his rethoric speach about democracy, plain and simple.

I wonder how much exile community money went into gettin GWs brother elected as well?

[Shaggy Hiker]

Plenty! I was down there at the time, they supported him big time.

One of the unusual groups to benefit from the lifting of the travel ban would be bass fishermen. It is widly believed that there should be bass fishing in Cuba that is superior to anywhere in the US. I have no particular interest in this, but I do wonder whether or not it is true.

I don't expect a bahamas or jamaica in Cuba. I fear that a Haiti would be more likely. I see no sign that the exile community will not enact reprisals on those who stayed behind. After all, those who have stayed are increasingly pro-Castro simply because the anti-Castro group is partitioning out. Therefore, those who remain become the de facto threat to the exile community regaining the power and priviledge that they feel is rightfully theirs.

I expect a bloodbath of recriminations and death squads.

[Valleysboy1978]

It's curious how much the Americans hate president Bush, yet you voted him in for a second term (with more votes than last time I might add). If the American people thought, as most other countries do, that Bush is a to$$er then he would have had about 50 votes.
Such is the power of democracy

[Xanith]

Plenty! I was down there at the time, they supported him big time.

One of the unusual groups to benefit from the lifting of the travel ban would be bass fishermen. It is widly believed that there should be bass fishing in Cuba that is superior to anywhere in the US. I have no particular interest in this, but I do wonder whether or not it is true.

I don't expect a bahamas or jamaica in Cuba. I fear that a Haiti would be more likely. I see no sign that the exile community will not enact reprisals on those who stayed behind. After all, those who have stayed are increasingly pro-Castro simply because the anti-Castro group is partitioning out. Therefore, those who remain become the de facto threat to the exile community regaining the power and priviledge that they feel is rightfully theirs.

I expect a bloodbath of recriminations and death squads.

Wow! A politician that supports the constituency that got him elected. That has never happened before! You act like being anti-Castro and anti-Communist is a bad thing. I still cant believe how some people on the left hold up Castro as some kind of hero or something. Like everyone in Florida is getting on makeshift rafts to get into that Communist paradise.

And I can’t imagine those left behind in Cuba being pro-Castro, you would think they would be thrown in a hole or something for opposing Castro in Cuba, ohh no wait that’s what would happen, nevermind.

And what’s this talk about the powerful Bass fisherman lobby? You know I have never heard of them you will have to inform me as to how this group can sway national policy just to catch a few more fish.

X

[Xanith]

It's curious how much the Americans hate president Bush, yet you voted him in for a second term (with more votes than last time I might add). If the American people thought, as most other countries do, that Bush is a to$$er then he would have had about 50 votes.
Such is the power of democracy

First off we appreciate other countries opinions of course but I’m sorry we don’t vote in our leaders based on what other countries think. Just as I am sure you do not consult what the people of France think when elections come around in your country. Listening to the left-leaning liberal media has obviously given you a slanted opinion as to what the US believes, just looking at the final vote tell you more people support Bush that are opposed to him.

X

[yrwyddfa]

As a generalisation, American's do not care how they are viewed or judged by the world. They are a very powerful nation; they begot such power through a mixture of luck, and geographic wealth - not through the efforts of it's governments nor it's people.

America does not consult with the world at large on any matter. Sure Britain is a poodle, but America 'appears' to have a completely unilateral foreign policy. After all they are the biggest bully in the playground . . . .

On the other hand most other nations in the world feel that it is necessary to consult other people because they know that it's necessary (in the misty veil of democracy) in order to achieve some sort of peace and world order.

Whatever form of media you read or listen to will always have some slant - it can never be the truth - ever. Left, Right, Middle who cares? Do we not all agree that people are entitled their opinions? Do we not agree that debasing someone because of their opinions is bigotry?

[Valleysboy1978]

Xanith, I agree. We are in the same situation because given the choices between the potential leaders we will likely choose the lesser of three evils, Blair.

yrywddfa....chill out dude. It's the weekend!
None of these things ever change how my life proceeds anyway so I look out for myself and those close to me (friends and family), nobody else.

[yrwyddfa]

On a different note: Xanith - why has your post count been reduced to 2?

[Shaggy Hiker]

Wow! A politician that supports the constituency that got him elected. That has never happened before! You act like being anti-Castro and anti-Communist is a bad thing. I still cant believe how some people on the left hold up Castro as some kind of hero or something. Like everyone in Florida is getting on makeshift rafts to get into that Communist paradise.

And I can’t imagine those left behind in Cuba being pro-Castro, you would think they would be thrown in a hole or something for opposing Castro in Cuba, ohh no wait that’s what would happen, nevermind.

And what’s this talk about the powerful Bass fisherman lobby? You know I have never heard of them you will have to inform me as to how this group can sway national policy just to catch a few more fish.

X

That's over the top X old boy. I am not pro-Castro, and you are not a Floridian. I know very little of the conditions in Cuba, but I know some of the opinions of the exile community, and I don't like them. They have an existing para-military organization (alpha-66 which makes the papers every now and then during their training exercises), which is illegal under the US constitution. What do you suppose that group is there for? They are not going to attack Cuba while Castro is alive, so what are they training for? It's pretty obvious what they are training for: The people who pay for their firepower will need some paramilitary support to regain the property they feel was stolen from them.

Do we think that the exile community will stay away after Castro goes? Probably not. Do they have a model for how to regain control: Yes, El Salvador! They will come in and bludgeon Castro's supporters into submission.

So are there supporters? There are. The black community in Cuba was severely repressed under the pre-Castro government, and is reported to be still strong in its support for Castro because they are treated as human beings. I have no idea how the other ethnic groups feel about Castro, but that kid (Evian?) Gonzalez chose to return to Cuba despite a strong attempt to bribe him into staying. The exile community wants to demonize Cuba to show how terrible Castro is. For non-political people (which is a group that includes the bulk of the US, as well), Cuba is probably about as good as any other Central American country. There is repression, but it is political repression. For those folks who just don't care about government, it probably has little impact on their day-to-day lives. Is Cuba some kind of paradise? Considering the climate, Cuba could probably become what is known as a gift-society, a phenomenon that arises in places where it is pretty easy to meet basic needs. Could it become like the Bahamas? Not unless the two dogs fighting over this bone will leave the bone alone when they win. I've never seen that happen.

As for the bass fishermen, I wasn't suggesting that there was any strength there. There is a group of bass fisherman who speculate that the largest bass in the world are in Cuban lakes. How many of these people are out there I have no idea, but if travel restrictions were lifted, they would almost certainly be testing this theory.


For too long Cuba has been an ideological battleground for left and right. There are only two groups who want control of this island. They are both well armed, and have shown a willingness to gain control through oppression, without showing any willingness to form a benevolent governing structure. The current ruler is Cuban communism. If that falls, the likely replacement will only be right-wing, and will only differ in the names of the people they kill to gain power (and possibly the color of their skin). Cuba's best answer would probably be a move from Castro communism to internal democracy, without allowing the exiles to return. That is not what the exiles want, and you can bet that they will not support any US politician who will allow that.

[yrwyddfa]

I don't know how true this is but . . .

Didn't Castro lead the world is disaster avoidance and mass evacuation- essentially looking after his people should a natural disaster hit. Being a policy that saved thousands (millions?) lives last year?

[Shaggy Hiker]

I have heard several things along these lines, as well. The right would like to demonize Castro, but they could just as easily demonize the exile community. There was bad under both, but good under both as well. Despite the bad things Castro has done, I expect that the exiles will be far worse if they ever get their hands on that country again.

[Xcoder]

For too long Cuba has been an ideological battleground for left and right. There are only two groups who want control of this island. They are both well armed, and have shown a willingness to gain control through oppression, without showing any willingness to form a benevolent governing structure. The current ruler is Cuban communism. If that falls, the likely replacement will only be right-wing, and will only differ in the names of the people they kill to gain power (and possibly the color of their skin). Cuba's best answer would probably be a move from Castro communism to internal democracy, without allowing the exiles to return. That is not what the exiles want, and you can bet that they will not support any US politician who will allow that.

Few questions here: would the US take a role during the transition of power? at what extent? would they occupy the island? ( for whatever reason they may give) how is the international community gonna react?

[demotivater]

they begot such power through a mixture of luck, and geographic wealth - not through the efforts of it's governments nor it's people

Since I'm walking out the door, I only have time to say - what a load of crap.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Few questions here: would the US take a role during the transition of power? at what extent? would they occupy the island? ( for whatever reason they may give) how is the international community gonna react?

It is unclear yet whether or not there will be a transition. If Castro names a strong successor, or if some organization within Cuba does the same upon his death, then the US will probably not get involved, since it would mean a war (not that we appear to be avoiding any of those these days, but I think we would avoid that one). The exile community may start something, but if Cuba remains united and resistant to them, I doubt they will be successful in the short term (the lifespan of any living exile).

[demotivater]

I think it's more likely someone will be in power who will bend over backwards to get the US dollars back into Cuba. It's gotta suck to have a donkey and cart serving as the presidential limousine. If the US had taken Castro out, it's likely a facist regime would have risen to take his place. I personally don't see that happening when the old goat kicks the bucket (or trips on it).

*books New Year 2008 hotel room in Havana*

[yrwyddfa]

I think it's more likely someone will be in power who will bend over backwards to get the US dollars back into Cuba. It's gotta suck to have a donkey and cart serving as the presidential limousine. If the US had taken Castro out, it's likely a facist regime would have risen to take his place. I personally don't see that happening when the old goat kicks the bucket (or trips on it).

*books New Year 2008 hotel room in Havana*

I don't think USD is quite worth what it used to be.

Much better to use Florins

[Valleysboy1978]

The value of the USD suits me fine! I'm coming to the US for a holiday so I'm getting penty of $ for my £

[nemaroller]

Don't bring your knife!

[nemaroller]

they begot such power through a mixture of luck, and geographic wealth - not through the efforts of it's governments nor it's people.

Geographic Wealth? I'm sorry - is China and the plains of Sourthern Russia full of geographic wealth? How does geographic wealth apply to Japan or even the UK?

It's the amount of work we do (not that is necessarily a good thing at all - I'd love to have 4 weeks off like the average German.)

"The average Briton now works 43.6 hours a week, longer than any of their neighbours in Europe. The French work an average 39.6 hours a week, the Germans 40.2, and the Italians just 38.5, according to recruitment group Manpower. We have a long way to go before we are as over-worked as the Americans, 40% of whom work more than 50 hours a week"
- http://money.guardian.co.uk/worklife...031703,00.html


Disney even put out a nation-wide campaign about how a full quarter of Americans don't take vacation at all - its pretty a damn funny commercial too

http://www.beyerphotography.com/vacation.swf

[Shaggy Hiker]

I remember hearing a report (it was over 15 years ago, maybe even 20, so I'm not posting any links) about how natural resources are generally not related to economic stability, except in an inverse relationship. Those countries with huge natural assets are generally worse off than countries with relatively modest assets.


Now that I think about it, I kind of feel the same way about breasts