A Question for the experts

[Sophtware]

I have been teaching myslef vb for the past month and a half...and i have been learning ..but could someone tell me a good way to teach myself..cause i have been jumping from Subject to Subject, can someone give me a idea on where would be a good place to start.
Thanks in advance






NewBee Vbeer6.0()
Working model edition!!! woohoo haha!!
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I just started learning VB 6 months ago, and that is all I seem to be doing too. I started out with a college class, and that really helped me get started. But it always seems I am jumping around like you explained to learn new things. It is taking me forever to finish, what I consider, a relatively simple project an expierienced programmer could turn out in a couple days. I hope you get some informative responses to this, I could also use some great wisdom.

[Sophtware]

I am Starting my vb6 class in college on monday the 19th..and like you said..ill i do now is study vb...ive gone to the point of memorizing code..i have memorized most of the different variables..String,Integer,Long Integer single,double,boolean,variants...
i have some lame programs already compiled...but since i have "working model editon" i cant make no .exe progs...and also i cant do anything with a part of vb that i really want to start learning...ActiveX.I am gonna buy the vb pro academic edition as soon as i can....i dont want really use my credit card..but i think am going to anyways..




NewBee Vbeer6.0()
Working Model Edition Sucks!
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[IanWhitehouse]

The best way to learn is to find yourself a real live project to get your teeth into.

go to your bookstore and see what they have in the VB section that is relevant to your ability, or rather choose the book which is slightly too difficult for you at present, that way you will have a target that you will soon be able to meet.

Flip through the book until you find some unfamiliar stuff, research all about it on the NET and then gett on with it.

That's how I do it, and its much better than struggling through a project that your not ready to finish.

Warning: the hardest part in programming is finding an idea for a project in the first place, I am desperate for ideas at the moment, anyone want any programming done for them?

[HRsystems]

Agreed wossname!

The best way is to get a project that you want done and get involved. I read books etc. and had a reasonable understanding of the language- then when my first project came along I learnt more in a week then all the months with books.
So try and make something useful..and if you have trouble then the lovely forum is here...

[Emidio]

I started VB about 6 year ago and one book was helpful. In Brazil, my country, its name is "Visual Basic para Leigos" and english version is "Visual Basic for Dummies". Despite of name, the book is very well.

Bye.


[Edited by Emidio on 06-17-2000 at 05:54 PM]

[DiGiTaIErRoR]

I started VB about 2 years ago. I started with VB3 and I made those lame AOL type of programs. I bought my first book Visual Basic 3 for dummies, believe me that book didn't help much. My dad bought visual studio 5 a while back because he programs in FoxPro so he bought the whole studio because I knew VB. I'm planning to learn C++ soon also. I mainly learned vb from internet tutorials. I have like 20+ text files on how to make AOL/Prodigy classic progs. Those taught me most of the basics. This site has taught me a few things also.

[Zaf Khan]

How about starting with something simple like a timer/alarm clock?

just use text/labels to display the time and then as you progress you add features like alarms/reminders, messages

etc

doczaf
{;->

Of course working on a project would be the best way, but another great way to learn is the read the VB Books Online that is shipped with VB.

[REM]

The first program I made in VB (proper program anyway) was a copy of my school's network login program. I learned lots of new things while coding the app, such as Network functions (getting IP address, ethernet address, sending data by email). I also learned registry functions, encryption methods and how to use a few controls properly.

The best way to learn it certainly to write programs. Think of a project that you think would be good, that is within your reach... You could always research ways of coding if you have an idea but are unsure...

I am currently working on a new idea I had last week while I was in an english exam, and I *may* be able to get quite a bit of dough if I get it up and running at the end of the summer... (BTW, it isn't the VB World Dev Res )

Laterz Krew

REM

[Sophtware]

I have been making simple little programs and when i learn something new i add to it...but i get so into studying vb that i try to do something else then i change my mind on that....etc....

I have been memorizing some codes...and when i try to start a project that is similar to what i have memorized i can understand what i am doing better...it works for me...





NewBee Vbeer6.0()
Working model edition is a tease!!
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[Paul282]

Just hang around here, we'll look after you!

Is there an area that interest you specifically? there are easy beginner projects in most areas and you should go with what you enjoy. People often start with.

Simple web browser
Access DB connect (just data viewer)
Pattern and graph drawing on a form / loading pictures
Simple word processor, text editor
Math or basic algorithm to answer scientific question

The important thing for practice is to follow the project through, and by this I mean, if you are making a text editor, make sure it has menu's, save and load dialog boxes, maybe a find option, cut-copy-paste etc. Look into font and rich text and decide if you're ready to go that far.

There are lots of little things to learn if you work on all aspects of a project not just some little core piece.

Have fun

[nitrolic2]

So you wanna learn VB? Tough.

Anyways get a book - I would recommend some stupid, cheap book out of the library on something like VB4 so that the book doesn't get into something like ActiveX, vbscript, before it even teaches you VB itself!

Then after you get down with the Basics of VB got get a real Visual Basic 6.0 book!

I recommend: Programming Visual Basic 6.0
Microsoft Press
By:Francesco Balena
Comes with a CD-ROM

(This stuff might sound like a joke! I don't hear anyone laughing just yet though!)

Now a book can only teach you so much! GO TO WEBSITES LIKE VB WORLD VB SQUARE yada yada yada...and look at codes and projects!

HERES THE GREATEST TIP ILL EVER GIVE YOU:
If you are a crybaby (ie: you run for help when something doesn't work) and you don't like to figure stuff out, and you have little patience VB, programming, computers, electronics, and the VB hobby are not for you. VB wants people who are willing to make mistakes, to correct mistakes, and to retype whole pages out of the book! You got to know how to figure things out...when I was learning the WinSock control it took me over 1.5 hours to figure out the simplest things and people consider me bright(I'm 13)! VB is hard, unfogiving, and it can piss you off

__________________________________________________________

And ofcourse like many already said make your own programs and don't forget to ask the pros! Go around forums don't be afraid to ask. We won't flame you(atleast some of us)
___________________________________________________________

DO NOT FORGET: YOU MUST HAVE A BASIC KNOWLEDGE OF PC's!
AND DO NOT WHINE : IF YOU DON'T SUCCEED TYPE AND TYPE AGAIN!
-- Have a nice day


[Edited by nitrolic2 on 06-19-2000 at 06:47 PM]

[frank ashley]

The hardest part, IMHO, is synchronising the UI with what the app'/user is doing , ie with all those buttons, frames, bars etc etc.

As for books I found

Wrox beginning VB6
Wrox beginning VB6 databases

invaluable. They are project based so you work right through until you have a finished, useful piece of code. (now have plenty of wrox books)

Paul282 & nitrolic have the right idea. Finish a project, full error trapping, UI design & implementation, and you have to struggle first before turning for help as you won't learn anything otherwise.

[rrjohnson]

I have found that you will learn the most if you have a well-defined project to work toward. I have had many examples of this in my college classes where they assign things you probably wouldn't think to do on your own. For example, we had a project where we had to strip the titles from an HTML document that contained over 1000 medical briefs and store them in a string array. Then we had to construct a query engine that would that would accept a query and return all documents that matched the query. (i.e. if you entered "Protoplasm" the query should return the titles and document number of all article briefs that contained this word). The program gets very complex when you start adding words to the query and you need to use mathematical vectors to perform the query in an efficient manner. The problem is similar to making a search engine like Yahoo's. We had about 4 weeks to complete the project. If you know an experienced programmer, have them assign you a project to complete for them by a certain deadline.

For books, I like the WROX Programmer to Programmer series (Bright red cover with yellow titles). If you look on the back of the books, there is a chart path showing what books you should read for a particular track and where the book you are looking at fits into the track. They are great for working toward a particular goal.

I've learned by coding my own project. And all of the replies above, and below are correct! You need to get inside a project... Screw it up majorly... Cuss and moan... And then retype all of your code again!

I was working with 'Sams Teach Yourslef Visual Basic 6 in 24 hours' and was two hours reading and re-reading a section on a coding project, except mine wouldn't work!!! I had the exact same code I know, because I retyped the whole dang thing three times to be sure... It wasn't until I realized one of the variables wasn't declared! (Or something like that!)

What I learned, was not to be dependent upon the book as much as analyzing what I was doing within the code. To think on my own!!!

Good luck to you! And this is a GREAT place to get help as long as you are willing to work a little too!

[Paul282]

Tip from a Pro...

Alcohol, paper and a pen is great for trying to think up projects.

It'll even help in the user interface design stage.

hahaha (LOL), but when your eyes start to cross staring at an array in the watch window while trying to find a bug, leave it for the next morning and an Ice coffee.

Being able to spot that point before damaging your own code shows amazing experience.



well, I enjoy it!

[Sophtware]

I Have Noticed that in my vb class that the professor wants us to "take the initative" so to speak.And i have noticed that doing projects that way it makes you learn alot more and ALOT faster....
So it seems better to just do it complelty on your own until..there is just no way to figure it out yourself.




NewBee Vbee6.0()
Finaly am getting vb pro edition!!
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[rcallan]

Couldn't agree more on the Wrox books, excellent reference and learning material. I have been programming for over 10 years and the one thing I've found is that other programmers (in the main) are very helpful, don't be afraid to ask but try and figure it out for yourself first. Stick to the Windows standards if you are going to do this commercially as users expect to see standardised things - stupid things like an "About" box etc. My last point is this: There is always more than one way of solving a programming problem, some are more efficient than others but that is part of the learning curve. Good luck.

[sr71pav]

I agree with all these guys. Go find a really good VB book that is based on the type of stuff you want to do. My first project was writing programs to interface with our instruments at work for testing purposes. I had probably a different motivation though. I was just bored at work one day, picked up a VB book, started flipping through it when the boss wasn't looking and got the thing written in a couple weeks. Matter of fact, I'm bored now at work which is why I'm on here.

-Pav

Pav, what the hell are you doing in here when you could be looking for porn! hehehe, I know an excellent URL btw (not that i've been looking, i deny everything).

[sr71pav]

Too much of a chance on that, besides, I am at a University (Notre Dame) doing this and professors tend to take offense to that sort of stuff. I'm going back and forth right now learning stuff in C for one of the projects here and seeing what I can learn about VB online just to see what more I can pick up.

-Pav

[ksutton]

I started with a VB 4 class in school also and didn't learn anything. I hated programming. But I have since dabbled a little here and there.

I have found the best way to learn is to dream up something wild that you would like to have (software-wise) and create it. You can refer to the experts (here, at work, class, etc.) to give you ideas on the methods to do things, but NEVER take code snippets and cut and paste into your own program.

It is much too easy to find code where other people have done things similar to what you are looking for and cut and paste it. But you don't learn that way. Figure out why they do it and see if you can improve it. There are so many ways to code, and it is fun to see everyone else's perspective.

Just keep dreaming the projects up. It's all ONES and ZEROS... And it is so much fun when you create something that makes your life easier! Chances are it will for someone else too.

Good luck!

Kevin
VB6 w/SP4

[Brandr]

You might want to search an auction site like EBAY for Visual Basic books. You can usually get great VB books (many brand new with cd-roms) for about $10-15. Using this method you can get a complete VB library on almost everything pertaining to VB for about the price one would normally pay for two to three good VB books from the book store.

[SteveNova]

Re the discussion about learning VB, I too am a relative newcomer to the language and to begin with it really
is frustrating, like being in a room with a
blindfold on hearing the music and everyone round
enjoying themselves and you"re trying to find a way to
remove that blindfold so you can be one of the crowd!
Well after 18 months (not of solid VB coding I add
as I was Y2K"ing it for 8 months of 1999) I have
"written" and "maintained" 3 different apps and in
my, humble, experience (not being an eat/sleep/do-
nothing-else proggie) as has already been said, you
need to DO some coding, to quote one LAO TZU.....
"If you tell me I will listen,
If you show me I will see,
If you let me experience I will learn!".
Get the experience kiddo, like all the other gurus
have said, anyway you can. You"ll never learn to
ride a bike without skinning your knees.
One other thing, it never stops, you"ll always be
learning it keeps morphing so much so get used to it!

[dpeithman]

I understand your frustration 'Sophtware'. I have only been working with VB for about 1 month. When I turn to the books I get very confused since it seems like there about 10 ways to do everything. With all of the different methods of connectivity, code, and controls -- what's the right way????? I find myself asking that question often.

I'm working on a very specific project for my company and having to learn quick. The Forum has been very helpful - Thanks everyone.

[smh]

I am also pretty new at this myself. I took some classes in college, graduated from college with an AAs in Computer Programming this Spring, and am now working in my first job.

I tell ya what, college classes don't teach you anything but the basics. I learned more in my first week of my job than I did in all of my classes in school. I have learned the most by seeing examples on the internet or asking questions in the forum. I do have some reference books that I use on occasion, but they are very dry, and usual confuse me even more because they code differently than I do.

I think my best reference out of everything is PaulW here in the forum. I think he has kind of taken me under his wing.

Thanks PaulW for the never ending great help!

smh

[Col. Ollie]

I might get a lot of flak for this, but I still think MS Press puts out the best books. Start with Visual Basic Step by Step. It's pretty easy. Then move on to Visual Basic 6.0 Programmer's Guide. It's VERY detailed. But take your time, one chapter at a time, until you get it.
And good luck, just don't give up.

[VBKNIGHT]

Get involved into a lot of projects, make your own virus code, hack into the internet, crack everything, dream of the impossible because there is no such thing as impossible when you put your mind to it....when ur pc breaks buy a new one.

[Comora]

Hi there,
as someone said in an earlier post: The best way to learn it is to finish a project.
3 weeks ago I had not seen a VB-code before. Now, with my head mealted and with the help of a lot of nice people in this forum, I managed to write an autoresponder of which I am quite proud of. And I fell in love with VB, I will defenetly go on learning this language.
I studied computer-sience 7 years ago. I had to learn GW-Basic, Pascal, Cobol, C and Assembler, but none of these laguages have the power of VB. Back then, of course, there were no languages called Visual C, Visual B....
Assembler was and still is the most powerfull language, but it is very very hard to learn.
Ok, anyway, all I wanted to say is: Think about a programm, a little routine, macro, what ever you always wanted and start programming.....
Happy debugging :-)

[paulw]

Most of what has been said is good advice and starting with a few projects as suggested by Paul282 (excellent name there) is a good idea. However, I would say that unless you are going to do VB 24/7, you are not going to be able to master it all at once, so decide on an area to concentrate on. In programming,knowing the exact syntax is often less important than knowing how to approach a problem and for that you must learn design skills. If you don't know the syntax, post a thread and we will help you out!

Personally, I specialise in Databases and distributed connectivity, but the first thing I learned was how to normalise a database and how to create an efficient design. The second thing was SQL and that is applicable to Access, SQL Server, Oracle, DB2, Sybase etc. etc.

By all means, read all the books you want about VB but don't forget to supplement it with learning about data structures.

You can learn Object Orientated Programming techniques without knowing any of the details of VB!

Good luck with it.

BTW, smh, I've got big wings

Cheers,

P.

[Edited by paulw on 11-29-2000 at 07:02 AM]

[fallnwrld]

I been reading a good book called Visual Basic 6.0 Secrets....


Goes from beginner to advance really well

[Lafor]

good advice from everyone...

paulw...
Normalizing the db...
did u learn by doing, did u pick up a book?

[Ianf]

I did two years of training in VB thought I new alot but not only till I did my first project did the real knowledge sink in.

My advice is get some basic training. If you know other languages it won't take you long to get used to the syntax. The editor must be the most user friendly out there so it won't take long to get used to that. Then get yourself on a project. Dealing with deadlines, customers and of course the fact that not all projects are the same is in my opinion the best way to learn. One project might be a database front end. Another might be developing activex components etc. What I am saying by concentrating on one area might be useless when you are out there doing your bit in the real world.

Sorry if I am going over old ground...

So sue me.