1000 Dead Johns

[Arc]

Yep, 1000 men who are unknown and are usualy Homeless people die each day in America. Also known as John Doe's. Does anyone care?

[mendhak]

Tens of thousands of insects are killed everyday due to pesticides. These insects have lives and feelings too. Think of the insects.

[morrowasted]

Originally posted by Arc
Yep, 1000 men who are unknown and are usualy Homeless people die each day in America. Also known as John Doe's. Does anyone care?

hey, i give money to the guys on the side of the street!

http://www.disasterrelief.org/Disast...0613aidsanniv/

but how many of us donae to AIDS research?

[Arc]

There's already a cure for AIDS, it's called abstinence or other wise known as "Keep it in your pants".

If you are going to have sex with someone, then get an AIDS test first. Then make sure you stay with only that person and you can have all the sex you want with no fear AIDS.

Sharing Hypodermic needles to administer drugs is another way a lot of people get AIDS.


The only people that can't help getting AIDS are the ones you get it from blood transfusions at a hospital and they are very rare.

[manavo11]

Originally posted by Arc
Then make sure you stay with only that person and you can have all the sex you want with no fear AIDS.

Nah. You might stay only with that person but the other person might have other thoughts...

[morrowasted]

Originally posted by Arc
There's already a cure for AIDS, it's called abstinence or other wise known as "Keep it in your pants".

If you are going to have sex with someone, then get an AIDS test first. Then make sure you stay with only that person and you can have all the sex you want with no fear AIDS.

Sharing Hypodermic needles to administer drugs is another way a lot of people get AIDS.


The only people that can't help getting AIDS are the ones you get it from blood transfusions at a hospital and they are very rare.

AIDS is also transferred through shots and is given to babies if their mothers have it.

[Arc]

Originally posted by morrowasted
AIDS is also transferred through shots and is given to babies if their mothers have it.

Thru shots? How so?

True, Mothers with AIDS can give it to their unborn children. Which is a good argument for not getting pregnant if you have AIDS.

[plenderj]

For once I actually agree with Arc ( what is the world coming to ? ).
AIDS is transmitted mostly by unprotected sex etc.

Its not like some airborne patogen that we can't detect that wafting through the air. You have to physically do something in order to get it.

Granted yes, bad blood products and things like that can cause it.
And like Arc said, if you've got AIDS, then just don't get pregnant.


If everyone was careful about what they did - then this problem wouldn't be there. Of course there's the problem in africa whereby mostly people either don't know, or if they do can't do anything about what's going on with them - but sure that's there the international community should step in...

[manavo11]

I disagree slightly. Not exactly, more of a comment. You say :

Originally posted by plenderj
If everyone was careful about what they did - then this problem wouldn't be there.

but people misinterpret that into ignoring people that are infected with AIDS(or other viruses also). So that creates problems in the society. Be careful with what you DO not don't do anything

[kleinma]

arc your an idiot.. AIDS can be spread by any way that infected blood can get into the bloodstream on non infected peoples.

that can include sex, pregnancy, a blood transfusion, drugs needles, or just from getting blood from someone in an open cut, as in helping someone who has been injured.

People are raped by other with AIDS (lets hope that does not happen to you)

why don't you think before you open your mouth fool

[hellswraith]

Originally posted by kleinma
arc your an idiot.. AIDS can be spread by any way that infected blood can get into the bloodstream on non infected peoples.

that can include sex, pregnancy, a blood transfusion, drugs needles, or just from getting blood from someone in an open cut, as in helping someone who has been injured.

People are raped by other with AIDS (lets hope that does not happen to you)

why don't you think before you open your mouth fool

He did think.

AIDS is transfered MAINLY by sex alone and drug needles. If you don't do those, your risk of aids is by far close to nothing.

Blood transfusions are now so strictly checked for aids, that is almost unheard of that you would get it from that.

Pregnancy, sure, if you have aids, you shouldn't be having kids. You are irresponsible if you are....which goes along with what Arc is saying.

Yes, the last one, helping someone who has been injured and getting their blood in your blood is a possiblity, but it is pretty damn small. I have never been in that situation for 28 years of my life.....so, the risk of that one time it does happen that the person has aids is pretty small.

So now, we come back to what Arc is saying is right (with a few minor exceptions that you want to argue). Here is post to refresh your memory of what he said:

There's already a cure for AIDS, it's called abstinence or other wise known as "Keep it in your pants".

If you are going to have sex with someone, then get an AIDS test first. Then make sure you stay with only that person and you can have all the sex you want with no fear AIDS.

Sharing Hypodermic needles to administer drugs is another way a lot of people get AIDS.


The only people that can't help getting AIDS are the ones you get it from blood transfusions at a hospital and they are very rare.

[Shaggy Hiker]

One thing you can say about Arc, you can count on him to get a discussion going. He's never dull....unlike this post

[hellswraith]

Originally posted by Shaggy Hiker
One thing you can say about Arc, you can count on him to get a discussion going. He's never dull....unlike this post

I agree. A lot of people though hold a grudge against him for other posts. I am just trying to be objective on each post (as much as I can anyway).

[kleinma]

of course sex is the most common way to spread the disease.. but not the only way...

what about Dr. David Acer. the Dentist who gave AIDS to 6 of his patients? I bet that was their faults for not having their doctor tested for aids

[Arc]

Well thanks to those who are able to be fair minded.
Klienma, you need to seek some anger management classes, I don't think I said anything in this thread to deserve that kind of response.

But anypoo, 1 thing that ircs me about AIDS research is that they spend as much on that as they do Cancer reasearch. And more on AIDS than they do Heart and Liver Desease reasech which kills WAY more people and is not directly preventable like AIDS.

[kleinma]

Originally posted by Arc
Well thanks to those who are able to be fair minded.
Klienma, you need to seek some anger management classes, I don't think I said anything in this thread to deserve that kind of response.

But anypoo, 1 thing that ircs me about AIDS research is that they spend as much on that as they do Cancer reasearch. And more on AIDS than they do Heart and Liver Desease reasech which kills WAY more people and is not directly preventable like AIDS.

my point to you is while obviously no one wants to get AIDS, a lot of people that end up with it is not by a choice or decision that they could have prevented in anyway. You make it sound like anyone who gets it deserves it

[hellswraith]

Originally posted by kleinma
my point to you is while obviously no one wants to get AIDS, a lot of people that end up with it is not by a choice or decision that they could have prevented in anyway. You make it sound like anyone who gets it deserves it

My only problem is that when we talk about something in a general sense, people will point out the exceptions just to try to prove someone wrong.

In a general sense, you can prevent yourself from getting aids. Sure there are exceptions to the rule, but they are just that, exceptions.

Out of how many millions of visits to the dentist each year, there is what....6 people that got infected? Pretty slim chance, probably less than .0001%. Condoms have worst odds than that, yet we call them safe.

Sure, not all people with aids deserve to be grouped together, this is obvious.

[manavo11]

I say that doctors try and cure MS...

[kleinma]

Originally posted by manavo11
I say that doctors try and cure MS...

cancer is probably what they should work on since they said that in 50 years the majority of the population will have some form of cancer... i forget the percentage... but it was pretty horrible...

problem is there are so many different kinds, and so many ways to get it, that it is going to be really hard to cure

[manavo11]

The annoying thing about cancer is that you see some people smoke 10 packs of cigarettes a day and they get nothing and live to 100 and other people that are more careful that smokers like that getting cancer when they haven't done anything really bad like smoking. That really pisses me off

[kleinma]

speaking of that...

I was thinking the other day and asked myself this question...

they say non smokers CAN be at a HIGHER risk to get smoking related diseases being in smokey places because of second hand smoke... because the smoke doesn't go throught the cigarette filter when they breate it in....

how is that at all possibly true???

first off.. the smoker themselves get both first and second hand smoke.. its not like they only breathe in the smoke from the drag they take.. they obviously get second hand smoke as well... plus they are more likely to be in a smokey area at any given time..

[Shaggy Hiker]

Yes, that sounds incorrect. If non-smokers are at a statistically higher risk from second hand smoke, I would think it would have to be because of some tolerance issue.

[hellswraith]

Originally posted by kleinma
speaking of that...

I was thinking the other day and asked myself this question...

they say non smokers CAN be at a HIGHER risk to get smoking related diseases being in smokey places because of second hand smoke... because the smoke doesn't go throught the cigarette filter when they breate it in....

how is that at all possibly true???

first off.. the smoker themselves get both first and second hand smoke.. its not like they only breathe in the smoke from the drag they take.. they obviously get second hand smoke as well... plus they are more likely to be in a smokey area at any given time..

Good point. I have always wondered about that myself.

[manavo11]

It probably is because non smokers are not used to it. I know that when I am in a smoky area my eyes start hurting and I start caughing. Luckilly, no one in my family smokes so I am not used to it at all. If that is going to cause problems to me then I better start smoking!!! However, it doesn't make sence that non smokers are at a higher risk of getting diseases cause I might not be used to it but the smoker is exposed to a hell of a lot more smoke than me. So it doesn't make much sence, to me at least.

[Shaggy Hiker]

Let me correct my earlier observation. Arc can start some interesting threads, but they rapidly wander away from where he began. I don't quite get his point with the original post, but now we seem to be discussing second hand smoke. Where will it go from here? Will Woka show up to ask about ass battering?

[manavo11]

Ya never know...

[morrowasted]

One thing you can say about Arc, you can count on him to get a discussion going. He's never dull....unlike this post

hey, IM the one that mentioned it in the first place

[nishantp]

Originally posted by kleinma
my point to you is while obviously no one wants to get AIDS, a lot of people that end up with it is not by a choice or decision that they could have prevented in anyway. You make it sound like anyone who gets it deserves it

At least 90% of people get AIDS through some action of there own that could have been prevented had they been more careful/cared/thought.
Another 9% likely goes to children who got AIDS from their mothers at birth. The situations you brought up likely all fit into the other 1%. Thats not to say they are any less horrible, all I'm saying is that in general, what Arc said is correct.

[Arc]

Originally posted by Shaggy Hiker
Let me correct my earlier observation. Arc can start some interesting threads, but they rapidly wander away from where he began. I don't quite get his point with the original post, but now we seem to be discussing second hand smoke. Where will it go from here? Will Woka show up to ask about ass battering?

My original post was merely a play on Klienmas post about 2 Dead Johns that was refering to John Ritter and John Cash. It just accured to me that people really only tend to morn loss of life when that life has touched them in some way. Which got me to thinking that people really don't give a crap about other people dying unless they "know" them. WHich in turn got me to thinking about all the homeless people that die every day that no one cares about, aka John Doe's.

Which is probably the reason alot of people on this board who don't live in the U.S. have no trouble saying "Ohh get over it already" when they talk about 9/11. But that's another topic all together.

[mendhak]

Originally posted by kleinma
speaking of that...

I was thinking the other day and asked myself this question...

they say non smokers CAN be at a HIGHER risk to get smoking related diseases being in smokey places because of second hand smoke... because the smoke doesn't go throught the cigarette filter when they breate it in....

how is that at all possibly true???

first off.. the smoker themselves get both first and second hand smoke.. its not like they only breathe in the smoke from the drag they take.. they obviously get second hand smoke as well... plus they are more likely to be in a smokey area at any given time..

All lies... second hand smoke doesn't have as much the adverse effect as is being shouted about. It's just a ploy to get the potential second hand smokers to stop smokers from smoking around them.

It's just like that "research" stating that "one cigarette eliminates 12 minutes of your life". What they don't tell you is that it takes 12 minutes to smoke a cigarette.

[si_the_geek]

Originally posted by Arc
My original post was merely a play on Klienmas post about 2 Dead Johns that was refering to John Ritter and John Cash. It just accured to me that people really only tend to morn loss of life when that life has touched them in some way. Which got me to thinking that people really don't give a crap about other people dying unless they "know" them. WHich in turn got me to thinking about all the homeless people that die every day that no one cares about, aka John Doe's.

Very true... as Joseph Stalin said:

"a single death is a tragedy. a million deaths is a statistic"

Originally posted by Mendhak

All lies... second hand smoke doesn't have as much the adverse effect as is being shouted about. It's just a ploy to get the potential second hand smokers to stop smokers from smoking around them.

It's just like that "research" stating that "one cigarette eliminates 12 minutes of your life". What they don't tell you is that it takes 12 minutes to smoke a cigarette.

All true too - except 12 minutes, It takes me 5

Oh, and as I'm sure you know, there has never been any genuine research that says smoking a cigarette takes a certain amount of time off your life. It's just an urban legend.

[crptcblade]

Originally posted by mendhak
It's just like that "research" stating that "one cigarette eliminates 12 minutes of your life". What they don't tell you is that it takes 12 minutes to smoke a cigarette.

Plus, that's 12 minutes off of the end of your life, which is usually pretty miserable anyway.

[Arc]

Originally posted by crptcblade
Plus, that's 12 minutes off of the end of your life, which is usually pretty miserable anyway.

Well not true these days. People live to be 70+ and are still in great condition. Able to walk and communicate efficiently and basicaly enjoy retirement. If you smoke your whole life then those years(if you make it there) will indeed be misirable.

[Shaggy Hiker]

The twelve minutes can be calculated, so it is only an urban legend in so far as the calculation is based on a whole load of averages. In other words: "Actual results may vary"

[Edneeis]

I would think that Emergency works are at a medium to high risk of getting HIV considering its their job to help injured people, likewise for emergency medical professionals. You could say that they of all people should know better but something can get hectic especially when saving others lives and I'm sure if some guy is dying they aren't going to say hold on let me put my gloves on. I don't think its as big a cause as unprotected sex but I bet a significant amount of people get infected each year from it.

[nishantp]

Originally posted by Edneeis
I would think that Emergency works are at a medium to high risk of getting HIV considering its their job to help injured people, likewise for emergency medical professionals. You could say that they of all people should know better but something can get hectic especially when saving others lives and I'm sure if some guy is dying they aren't going to say hold on let me put my gloves on. I don't think its as big a cause as unprotected sex but I bet a significant amount of people get infected each year from it.

Which emergency medical professionals? As far as i know, paramedics and ER personel all wear gloves...

[Arc]

Originally posted by Edneeis
I'm sure if some guy is dying they aren't going to say hold on let me put my gloves on.

Well they always have their gloves on(My observation from watching too many Real Life ER shows) and if they donlt have gloves on then they do stop and put them on.

It would be extremely rare for the Doctor to not have gloves and to just happen to have an open wound that allowed some of the guys blood to get in and then for that guy to actually have AIDS.


I would not say that is even remotely a common occurance.

[Edneeis]

Namely Firemen, Police, and Nurses, even if you are shot the doctor is not the first one to see you. I hardly think reality shows about ER will give you an indictation although I have seen cop shows were they get blood on them or get cut or even may ***** a finger on a needle while searching someone. Primarily first responders though. I mean if you get blood on your finger and the area around the nail is cut or messed up it can come through there likewise through your eyes, nose or mouth.

[si_the_geek]

Originally posted by Shaggy Hiker
The twelve minutes can be calculated, so it is only an urban legend in so far as the calculation is based on a whole load of averages. In other words: "Actual results may vary"

That's not quite true I'm afraid..

the averages that you talk about are not based on "this person died 3 weeks early because they smoked", they are based on life spans of people who smoke versus people who don't.

people who smoke are statistically more likely to drink than those who don't, so the alcohol (which also does noticeable damage) will have an impact, as will many other factors such as the food eaten, stress, pollution and hereditary illness.

it's easy to blame the cigarettes, as people can easily remember that they smoke 20 a day for 7 years.. it's much harder to remember how many times over the same period you have eaten beef (which has been proved to be capable of causing heart disease), or how much coffee+tea+cola you have drunk, or how many times you have inhaled exhaust fumes from traffic, etc...

assuming you have in-depth knowledge of the biology of a particular person, ie: know the exact chemical and biological makeup of the organs that smoking affects (lungs, heart etc), then it is possible to calculate how much damage will be done by smoking under specific circumstances (eg: in a particlar sized room with a specific amount of air flow).

the time cannot be calculated, only the damage caused can be (that's assuming the person lives in lab conditions ).