boycott the record industry?

[kleinma]

do you think it is possible?

i understand where they are coming from with all the file swapping... but think about it... software is just as pirated... and has been for YEARS.. and have the software companies been taking insane legal action against these people? NOPE!

Since the RIAA failed at tackling the source.. they are targeting the destination.. which are also their customers... which if you ask me is just stupid.. because stopping me from DLing music and suing me is NOT going to make me want to GIVE THEM MONEY for music... and these things will just give way to smarter programmers coming up with smarter ways to keep file sharing alive...

you could copy a CD to tape or off the radio for years... now all of a sudden, access to such material has been made easier.. so now they decide its time to sue people... with no warning either... no cease and desist.. just a handful of lawsuits.. and yes we all know it is "wrong" to dl copyrighted material... but it is also wrong to charge me 20 bucks for a cd that MIGHT have 2 good songs on it...

I havent bought a CD in 5 years and I dont plan to start now...

A DJ on the radio said it perfect this morning... that if the record industry had kept up with technology.. they could have developed ways to use such things to their advantage, and avoided all this.. but they were happy getting their 20 bucks a cd and finally consumers decided to do somethign about it so now they attack..

so would a nation wide boycott of buying CDs send a message to them??

[Cander]

Well problem is with this. Is usually the only people that are really informed of this are the techies as they are the ones keeping up wih the RIAA BS. But now with all the legal suits coming up in the news, you are going to really start seeing a major backlash against the recording industry

[kleinma]

plus why target the people sharing a ton of files (i mean i know WHY but)

the way i see it is this

oh you only killed 2 people.. we will let you go...

you killed 40 people your under arrest...

they are trying to shut down the fire sharing networks by scaring people out of allowing uploads.. they know if they filed suit against the 60+ million users of file sharing networks they wouldnt have any customers left.. it is such crap

[demotivater]

Records companies freaked out when songs were first played on the radio, afraid that now people could get their music for free and would have no need to buy records. Same thing here, to a degree. As for a boycot, I certainly will not be buying any cd's, haven't done so in ages and won't start now - unless of course, something that isn't plain crap comes out. The RIAA is screwing themselves here, just like Metallica, sure people (few) still bought their new cd, but a whole bunch of people lost all "respect" (or whatever) for them when they started their anti-Napster crap. I was never a huge Metallica fan, but I am not even a small one now. Filing lawsuits against 261 out of 60 million users - what's up with that? This will really get interesting when the ISP's start to protect their paying customers - the local cable ISP where I live has already refused to give up any info on it's users. Once that starts happening, the RIAA will have to fight their lawyers intead of suing Joe College who can hardly afford a six pack. Sue away RIAA - I'm still not going to buy the crap they market.

[NotLKH]

K,

Are you in any danger? Think you'll be one of the targeted?

[kleinma]

i agree... i dont support metallica at all now... i was never a huge fan..

i remember reading something about them trying to seek permission for ISPs to have to give up names.. hopefully ISPs will fight back since I am sure many people get service for the very reason of getting songs and such

[kleinma]

i think most people on this forum are too smart to be targets... people who left their computers wide open.. or who allowed tons of files to be uploaded are the targets... i am a little too smart to get busted by them (i hope at least )

[seismicweasel]

Imagine the coversation at RIAA HQ;

Director1: Our album sales are down!
Director2: That's disasterous! What's causing this?
Office Junior: err...most of the music we have been promoting is awful?
Director1: No, that can't be it...After all, the sales of CD sigles are higher than they've been in decades.
Office Junior: So does that mean that people only like 1 or 2 songs per album and don't want to pay £15 for an album for of **** songs?
Director2: Of course not, it means that they're downloading the whole album from the internet!
Director1: It has nothing at all to do with the quality of our product!
Director2: This is why we're directors and you're still an office junior!

Seems typical of the RIAA to go after the symptoms of the problem rather than looking at the actual cause of it - the fact that the are churning out more and more crap music day after day instead of trying to find out what their customers (i.e. us) actually want.

Albums are generally bought by people between 20 and 40. People in this age group don't often buy bubblegum pop music that is played to death on the radio and TV.

If the music I enjoy doesn't get radio airplay then I'll download a couple of tracks from the internet before I decide to buy the album. One band (might have been Anthrax, I can't be sure though) even tried to put some of their songs on their website when they weren't getting radio airplay - they were stopped by their record company who felt that it might damage sales, missing the point completely that no one was going to buy the album when they were never hearing the songs being played.

We won't need to boycott the music industry soon - they'll have started litigation against everyone in the western world & we won't have the money to buy their music anymore

[kleinma]

i know offspring had wanted to allow their entire album to be downloaded for free off the net.. but their label would not allow it

[Slaine]

This band has got it right!

Read the disclaimer towards the bottom of the opening page:

http://www.skyclad.co.uk/

[kleinma]

Originally posted by Slaine
This band has got it right!

Read the disclaimer towards the bottom of the opening page:

http://www.skyclad.co.uk/

thats because bands know they can make a nice living just being a famous band... the group themselves don't see a ton of money from CD sales... they get most from endorsements, touring, and merchandising... which is why the bands are about sharing the music... the labels make the money off the CD sales.. which is why they are the ones suing

[JPicasso]

All i know is that downloading MP3's for albums that you do not own is against the law...

Which is why I just copy mp3 CDs that my friends have filled up.

I have a bunch of MP3 CDs with a ton of songs that I will never listen to.
They just gather dust on the shelf along side programs that came on floppy disks with
my 486 computer that I bought back in 91? or was that 93?

[NotLKH]

from http://www.msnbc.com/news/963684.asp?vts=091020030910

Here’s a quick look at how the RIAA has done its investigations and what kind of information it has used to find people and file Monday’s lawsuits.

Step one: Finding file-traders isn’t hard. Anybody who opens a shared folder on Kazaa, Morpheus or any other file-swapping network is susceptible to potentially prying eyes.
In the most recent wave of investigations, the RIAA has used automated tools that look for a relatively short list of files. When it finds a person sharing one or more of those files, it downloads all or many of them for verification purposes. A complete list of these target files is not available, but a sampling of files cited in the early lawsuits includes the following artists and songs:
Bobby McFerrin, “Don’t Worry, Be Happy”
Thompson Twins, “Hold Me Now”
Eagles, “Hotel California”
George Michael, “Kissing A Fool”
Paula Abdul, “Knocked Out”
Green Day, “Minority”
UB40, “Red Red Wine” Ludacris “Area Codes” Marvin Gaye, “Sexual Healing”
Avril Lavigne, “Complicated”
This is far from a complete list, but if you’ve downloaded and shared any of those songs recently, you may be at greater risk of finding your way onto the RIAA’s list.

Step two: The RIAA uses features within Kazaa, Grokster and some other software programs to list all the files available within a person’s shared folder and takes screenshots of that information. As filed in court, that provides a record of what in some cases has been thousands of songs shared at once.

Step three: The RIAA’s software records the Internet address associated with a computer that is sharing one of the copyrighted songs the organization is investigating. Some file-swapping programs try to hide this by using mechanisms such as proxy servers, but most downloads still expose this information.

Step four: According to information filed as part of a related lawsuit, the RIAA also has the ability to do a more sophisticated analysis of the files that have been downloaded. The group checks the artist’s name, title, and any “metadata” information attached to the files, looking for information that may indicate what piece of software has been used to create the file or any other. Some files swapped widely on the Net include messages from the original person who created the MP3 file, such as “Created by Grip” or “Finally the Real Full CD delivered fresh for everyone on Grokster and Kazaa to Enjoy!”
The RIAA has also analyzed in detail some files’ contents. The trade group has databases of digital fingerprints, or “hashes,” that identify songs that were swapped online in Napster’s heyday. Investigators check these fingerprints against those found in a new suspected file swapper’s folder, looking for matches. A match means the file has almost certainly been downloaded from the Net, likely from a stream of copies dating back to the original Napster file.

Step five: The RIAA files a subpoena request with a federal court. The subpoena allows the group to go to an Internet service provider and request the name and address of the subscriber who’s associated with the Net address that was used to swap files. A few Internet service providers (ISPs) have fought back against these requests, but most have been forced to comply with the RIAA’s request.
Many ISPs notify their subscribers when a subpoena comes in that targets their information. The Electronic Frontier Foundation has set up a database that allows people to see whether their online screen name has been the target of one of these subpoenas.
The RIAA said it has filed more than 1,500 of these subpoenas to date.

Step six: Once the identity of the ISP subscriber has been exposed, the RIAA puts together all the information gleaned through the earlier technical investigation and files a lawsuit. In earlier cases, it has accepted settlement agreements that range between $12,000 and $17,000. In this case, it has accepted some settlement agreements for as little as $3,000.

[kleinma]

what an odd list of songs...

i move songs from shared over to a seperate PC when I DL them... if they were to hack into that somehow... i am sure they would be violating privacy laws

[kleinma]

http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/interne....ap/index.html

[Arc]

Universal records just lowered the cost of their CD's from $18 to $13. I think that's a step in the right direction.

[seismicweasel]

Just out of interest....

When was the last time anyone here actually heard the following songs (or saw their video on MTV or VH1)?

Bobby McFerrin, “Don’t Worry, Be Happy”
Thompson Twins, “Hold Me Now”
Eagles, “Hotel California”

A person may like "Don't Worry, Be Happy" but may not want to pay for an album that contains the song, considering that they're very unlikely to hear it on the radio when the commercial stations have to pander to the masses (and by masses I mean teenagers who are wrongly asumed to buy the most music - its not, its people between 20 and 40 who have disposable incomes, not pocket money) & play Justin Timberlake (or his latest clone).

Bobby McFerrin probably won't mind that you're downloading his music - he shot himself some time ago.

Why is the RIAA so worried that people actually want to listen to their artist's music? Should they not actually be more worried by the fact that one of the main reasons that people download music is because the mainstream media refuses to play it?

Personally I'm a fan of Frank Zappa, but there is virtually no chance that I'm ever going to hear his music played on radio or TV (I think the last time was 2 years ago on a documentary about Captain Beefheart). But that's not to say that I like all his songs - some of them are awful - so will Frank Zappa's family complain that I download a few of his songs so I can hear them & appreciate his music? I doubt it. Most artists who no longer get any airplay probably like the fact that their music is still listened to long after their chart success has passed by

[mendhak]

MP3s and P2P won't be going away anytime soon, that's for sure. I wonder if we'd be least bothered by the shutting down of a P2P service. There are always so many more to turn to.

Besides, what about local piracy? Rip a $20 CD, make a hundred copies sell them at $1 each. What about friend burning CDs for his friends? Does the RIAA plan to get to them too?

The last time I bought a CD was over 6 years ago.

I'll bet the record industry is kicking itself in the ass right now for not having kept up with the times. Some sort of an encrypted, program specific MP3-selling service would have been a good idea. Hey wow, I just made that up!

[kleinma]

problem with MP3 pay services (including the ones already out there) is why am I going to pay when its there for free...

its like walking up to 2 racks of the same CDs in the store.. one is marked 10-15-20 bucks whatever. and the other is marked free... i mean its not rocket science..

so basically the music industry needs to find new ways to make money...

OR

screw the music industry... artists hardly need a label anymore thanks to the same modern technologies that the record companies are trying to kill...

Years ago no one would think about being able to put out their own CDs without a label.. now it is happening all the time

[MixMaster]

I know that if someone is suspected of selling drugs its illegal for the police to just go up to them, ask to buy some, and then arrest them if the person offers. Im not sure what the technical word for it is but I think its entrapment.

Does the same not apply to file sharing?

After all, the file could just have the same name as a popular music track and not actually contain any music. If the law enforcement or the RIAA download it off me are they not forcing me to commit a crime?

[kleinma]

Originally posted by MixMaster
I know that if someone is suspected of selling drugs its illegal for the police to just go up to them, ask to buy some, and then arrest them if the person offers. Im not sure what the technical word for it is but I think its entrapment.

Does the same not apply to file sharing?

After all, the file could just have the same name as a popular music track and not actually contain any music. If the law enforcement or the RIAA download it off me are they not forcing me to commit a crime?

what we should develop is a complicated encryption system for the file names and ID3 tags.... that way they wouldnt be able to tell what people are DLing...

[Admiral Michael]

Would Kazaa or other file sharing programs create some kind of security and protection for us? So that we don't have to worry.

Also, Im in Canada. Does this concern me, lke could I get charged and stuff?

[NotLKH]

Originally posted by Admiral Michael
Would Kazaa or other file sharing programs create some kind of security and protection for us? So that we don't have to worry.

Also, Im in Canada. Does this concern me, lke could I get charged and stuff?

IMHO:

2) Yes, it concerns you. International Trade laws, Coutries bending over backwards to be buds with other countries, yep!

You're about to be busted!

1) Its kinda like closeing the gate after the horses have run off!
Best you can do is store 'em off the dl computer.

2nd best, zip 'em, and name the zip files after your 'mates in preschool.

3rd best: delete.delete.delete.!!!!


Why Worry? Do something illegal?
ah..ahh.. ahhha!

Naughty Naughty!

BTW, whatever you say here, or any other public forum is admissable into courts of law.

So, care to confess?

[Pc_Madness]

I only own 2 music cds. :blink:

[Admiral Michael]

No, I dont download alot anyway, not even a song a week. It's just that a friend of mine mentioned that and I was curious if it was true.