If you know VB or Javascript, you could probably pick up ASP in a week-end, as the ASP Core Objects are language independent. PHP would be longer, as it is its own langauge and has its own functions and ways of doing things. Perl - you could learn to use in basic CGI in not that long, but you could spend a lot of time mastering it - Perl can do almost anything it need it to do, from CGI to GUI, etc.
If you're long term plans involve Windows/Micorsoft technology based development, then yes, ASP.NET is probably worth learning.
What's your programming/IT background anyway, Hawk - personally, I think I bought Learn ASP in 24 Hours and learn PHP in 24 Hours books over summer vacation back when I was in college and learned the basics of both in a month or so (I've done far more ASP programming than PHP since then, and I already knew Perl).
Josh
Get these: MozillaOperaOpenBSD
I have books for sale: "MCSD in a Nutshell" and "VB Distributed Exam Cram" - PM me for details. Will also trade for a decent ATX Pentium 2 MB/CPU/RAM combo.
My programming background was focused mainly on VB and Database(2-tiers application). I did lots of VBA for Access and Excel. I have been doing web stuff off and on for the last two years. I finally had a better understanding of the concept and architecture of web sometime last year and decided to go hardcore into it. I really like ASP, COM and Javascript. HTML and CSS are easy. I am really happy I made that decision. Also, I have touched XML but only once in a blue moon so it takes some time to refresh when I get back to it. I have done ASP.Net for a year with Microsoft Consultants. During that time, I was not that sufficient with regular ASP.
The reason why I asked you if it is worth it to learn ASP.Net is because it seems like no one is picking up on it. Everyone is either moving to PHP or JSP or sometime Coldfusion.
Lately, my biggest task is becoming a DBA. I just landed a position a while back and they are trainning me in this direction.
One thing I don't like about web technology is that it constantly change. I wish that it would be more like database technology.
I have been doing VB for a while now and it is disappointing when new version comes out every 4 years. You have to spend quite some time into it to catch up but I guess that is just for the better.
When you said that Perl Script can do anything from CGI to GUI, what exactly do you mean. Well, GUI stands for Graphical User Interface. What does CGI stand for? What do you need to start with Perl Script. VB Script just need IE to be installed.
Originally posted by JoshT PHP would be longer, as it is its own langauge and has its own functions and ways of doing things.
Oh no! So far from the truth. PHP was based on C++ which was based on C.
If you have any experience with C, C++, or JavaScript you will pick up PHP within a few hours.
PHP is the same as C, C++, and JavaScript except you put a $ infront of every variable name. That is the main difference. The rest is just learning how to connect to a database and then your all ready to go.
C has the fopen() and fclose() along with printf() scanf() which are all usable in PHP.
Even though PHP has shortened printf() to either echo "" or print "" its still the same method.
Oh no! So far from the truth. PHP was based on C++ which was based on C.
It also heavily borrows from Perl, which borrowed from C (and Unix shell scripting).
Josh
Get these: MozillaOperaOpenBSD
I have books for sale: "MCSD in a Nutshell" and "VB Distributed Exam Cram" - PM me for details. Will also trade for a decent ATX Pentium 2 MB/CPU/RAM combo.
Originally posted by Hawk When you said that Perl Script can do anything from CGI to GUI, what exactly do you mean. Well, GUI stands for Graphical User Interface. What does CGI stand for? What do you need to start with Perl Script. VB Script just need IE to be installed.
Hawk, CGI is Common Gateway Interface - it's a language independant method for a web server to run a script or executable and have that program dynamically create a web page (you probably knew that already) - ASP and PHP both are based on CGI in one way or another.
To run Perl, you need perl installed - www.activestate.com has the free Windows versions, it pretty much comes with any *nix OS. Perl Script is pretty much Perl implemented on MS's ActiveX Scripting Interface, so it can be used in ASP, IE, WSH, etc.
Josh
Get these: MozillaOperaOpenBSD
I have books for sale: "MCSD in a Nutshell" and "VB Distributed Exam Cram" - PM me for details. Will also trade for a decent ATX Pentium 2 MB/CPU/RAM combo.
Matt, I think you miss Josh's point. ASP is not a language unto itself, it is a technology. You can use VBScript, JScript, or PerlScript with the ASP objects. So if you already know one of the languages, learning the objects is not a problem.
PHP is a language, and has its own idiosyncratricities (sp?).
Furthermore...
Originally posted by cpradio
Oh no! So far from the truth. PHP was based on C++ which was based on C.
PHP was based on Perl, not C++. Perl gets its syntax from C/C++ (C++ is a superset of C, they have the same syntax). Perl's legacy is very evident in PHP, more so than C/C++'s. But PHP is not the same as Perl. Mind you, if you know Perl, learning PHP is easy. That is not to say that knowing C/C++ doesn't make learning PHP easy.
Heck, if you are a programmer, learning any language is easy. But that is another discussion.
Hawk, as to using Perl (which is semanticly different than PerlScript), it can be used for everything. Perl is the most common language used in CGI (Common Gateway Interface, a precursor to ASP). Perl is also a very powerful scripting language used in place of shell scripts, with roots in awk and sed. Perl has dozens of variants such as wxPerl, Perl/Tk, and VisualPerl (and eventually Perl.NET) that make it possible to develop GUI applications. Perl also has templates and variants such as Mason that make it possible to create web applications such as ASPs. There is also a Perlix project: making an OS out of Perl.
Correct, PerlScript and ActivePerl are versions of Perl. Kind of like VBScript is a version of VB. PerlScript is the version designed for use with WSH (Windows Scripting Host) and ASPs. ActivePerl is the ActiveState Win32 release of Perl. Just as there are some things that you can do in VB that you can't do in VBScript, there are a couple of things that you can do in Perl that you can't do in ActivePerl or PerlScript (fork() and alarm() come to mind).
Other Perls:
wxPerl: Windows XWindows Perl. A version of Perl with libraries for creating GUI applications that can be ported between MS Windows and X Windows.
Perl/Tk: Perl using the Tk (Tcl/Tk), a GUI Toolkit. I'm probably explaining that wrong.
VisualPerl: A plugin for the new MS Visual Studio.NET. MS now owns ActiveState, so all of the Win32 ports of open languages (Perl, Python) are being adapted as plugins. Now you can create GUIs with Perl the same was you do with C++ or Basic.
embPerl and Mason: Two web application oriented versions of Perl. I don't know alot about them. I've never seen anyone admit to using them. I would be curious about Mason, but I think I'll play with PHP first.
People will say, "this is a Perl script". Perl started as a scripting language. It usually isn't compiled, and is interpreted at runtime. But one shouldn't underestimate it by calling it a scripting language. But it isn't fair to say "Perl executable" because people aren't reffering to a binary.
Originally posted by CiberTHuG Correct, PerlScript and ActivePerl are versions of Perl. Kind of like VBScript is a version of VB. PerlScript is the version designed for use with WSH (Windows Scripting Host) and ASPs. ActivePerl is the ActiveState Win32 release of Perl. Just as there are some things that you can do in VB that you can't do in VBScript, there are a couple of things that you can do in Perl that you can't do in ActivePerl or PerlScript (fork() and alarm() come to mind).
There's a bigger difference between VBScript/VB and Perl/Perlscript - VBScript is based on VBA, but minus most capabilities that would make it useful, PerlScript can do almost anything Perl can do, subject more to OS / Perl port limitations (there's a bunch of built in functions that don't make any sense outside of Unix, but fork() actually works for me on Win32) - I suspect the ActiveState's perl.exe, perlse.dll (PerlScript), and perlis.dll (ISAPI) all use functionality from Perl56.dll.
So to hawk, I say if you learn Perl, then you'll already know PerlScript - there's really no new syntax to learn, just a couple of quirks because of ASP and OLE.
Josh
Get these: MozillaOperaOpenBSD
I have books for sale: "MCSD in a Nutshell" and "VB Distributed Exam Cram" - PM me for details. Will also trade for a decent ATX Pentium 2 MB/CPU/RAM combo.
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction guys. You guys are really great!
If I introduce these to my company right now, I will need some key points in order for them to approve it. What are some of the points that I should focus on about these two products?
I know that both probably has a low cost factor, but what is the main key for a company to use it over ASP, VB Script and so on.
Also, when you go with PHP, does COM matter any more because I heard it has really good database hook ups. Can it use COM and ActiveX?
I know most website now a day uses PHP. But most big company still stick with ASP or ColdFusion. Do you think that is true?
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