Why Britain needs more guns...

[Gaffer]

Originally posted by DeadEyes
Gaffer:
From the Article

This sentence from the article does not really say very much.
They have the highest crime rates, but don't say what type of crimes, are they including white collar crime a gun is not going to
help you there. and the worst record for "very serious offences". again what does this mean? The worst record for convictions for serious crime?
And as you said not naming the countries is a bit odd.
Also why is it England & Wales. Shouldn't England and Wales be
seperate and if not where's Scotland and the North.

Yeah, the details are scant. Another media ploy to skew stories.

As for the Northern Ireland thing it would mean the terrorist wouldn't have to go to Lybia(sp?) etc to get weapons.
I also believe that the Marching Season and the incidents at Interfaces would be a lot uglier

The onus in NI from a huge majority is peace. The problem areas such as West Belfast and South Armagh are always going to source guns, regardless if they are from Lybia or from Londonderry. The only gain I can see is that it would reduce the IRA/UVF's relince on US funding form NORAID.

As for Marching Season, well I've been to quite a few and there are never any problems - the only (very well documented) flashpoint is on the Garvaghy Road. Not every march is like this - most of them are family events.

Looking at non-terrorst crime figures in Northern Ireland (Spontanoius Murder, Rape, Robbery) is very enlightening...

[Gaffer]

Here's a link:

http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/othelem/research/esrc7.htm

[DeadEyes]

by gaffer

Not every march is like this - most of them are family events

So I've heard, but I've also heard(and had to put up, with bloody tourists) people who won't stay in the province

the link was interesting; if not an easy read.

but all this is going off the general topic of more guns in Britain,
and the right to defend oneself.

I still believe more guns more problems.

[simonm]

Honeybee

Don't you think it's the root of the discussion, on the contrary? If you could create a society where there was no encouragement to crime, maybe you wouldn't be discussing the right to privately own firearms. In fact so far we have been using Britain as an example where an ordinary police officer doesn't carry any arms apart from a club/batton. Some sociology experts here argue that if the policemen start carrying firearms, the criminals will be inclined to carry more dangerous arms.

Well, if you ask you average gun toting American, he will tell you that protection from crime is not the only reason why they have the right to bear arms. It is also a deterrant against state tyranny. If there was no crime, and you had a gun carrying policeforce, who would protect us from them?

Bionic Orange

.... and speaking as someone who lives in Wales, I would like to say that Cardiff has very few gun related incidents .... but head further North up into the valleys and its a completely different ball game.

Now that SHOULD strike as bizarre, as Cardiff being the capital city has a much more dense population, and crime figures generally are higher in densely populated areas.

Therefore what DOES explain the upturn in gun related crimes in more rural areas ? Ignorance ? Boredom ? Drugs ?

I'm gonna stick my neck out here and say I personally think its the latter. The worldwide increase in drugs I think plays a MAJOR part in gun related crime .... you up the stakes you up the weapons.

I don't think it is the increase in the use of illegal drugs that has caused the increase in gun crime, I think it is the rise in demand for substances that are kept on the black market. In otherwords, the war on drugs and prohibition are to blame.

[DeadEyes]

simonm says
If there was no crime, and you had a gun carrying policeforce, who would protect us from them?

If there was no crime there would be no need for a police force
gun carring or not. What's the saying wherever there's a policeman you'll find crime.

[stewie]

sad little internet geeky no social life prepubesant virgins like you give us English a bad name
grow up

[simonm]

Stewie

Who are you referring to?

[Gaffer]

Originally posted by stewie
sad little internet geeky no social life prepubesant virgins like you give us English a bad name
grow up

How was the Millwall game last Saturday stewie?

[BodwadUK]

Living in Nottingham, UK I know how much guns take place in crimes, guns arent used in burglaries and are used to 'Know people off' this means that if you keep out of trouble then you are more likely to be stabbed than shot!!!!!!! So fear of guns in unrequired and people armed with guns would not hit random people but those that threaten them.


What about the instance of the stabbing of a policemen and the obvious fact that people no longer fear or respect the police because they can use wepons whereas the police cant. Would you be afraid of an unarmed policemen if you had a gun or a large knife?????

ANSWER = NO


The Police need guns, you can no longer argue that the police are a feared force, and they wont be until they are stronger than the criminals!!!!

[honeybee]

Originally posted by simonm
Honeybee

Well, if you ask you average gun toting American, he will tell you that protection from crime is not the only reason why they have the right to bear arms. It is also a deterrant against state tyranny. If there was no crime, and you had a gun carrying policeforce, who would protect us from them?

Again, if you think like this, when the police force exists solely to protect you from crime, at least on paper, the society itself has failed, because the police force after all is part of the society, and the job of preventing crimes is not solely with the policemen. I think there're citizen arrests too, in Britain?

Another point mentioned above is the loss of fear about policemen. Another sign the society has deteriorated. Whether the policeman carries a gun or not, he should be feared for the authority he represents, not because he can put a hole through your head.

.

[BodwadUK]

Another point mentioned above is the loss of fear about policemen. Another sign the society has deteriorated. Whether the policeman carries a gun or not, he should be feared for the authority he represents, not because he can put a hole through your head.

It Helps



The Justice system as a whole is screwed up in britain you can rob a place get caught and you are practically slapped on the hand and told to go home!!!!!


Age of 15 before you can be prosecuted means that kids dont give a FUC* about the police because the police cant do anything to them!!! There are even ideas to prevent parents doing anything about it, in Scotland i believe it is illegal to smack children, i agree to smacking if done with resonable force but not if it is excessive.

In recent years peoples respect for society and other people in it has disappeared and its causing much more frequent crime expecially more violent ones.

[honeybee]

Originally posted by BodwadUK
It Helps



The Justice system as a whole is screwed up in britain you can rob a place get caught and you are practically slapped on the hand and told to go home!!!!!


Age of 15 before you can be prosecuted means that kids dont give a FUC* about the police because the police cant do anything to them!!! There are even ideas to prevent parents doing anything about it, in Scotland i believe it is illegal to smack children, i agree to smacking if done with resonable force but not if it is excessive.

In recent years peoples respect for society and other people in it has disappeared and its causing much more frequent crime expecially more violent ones.

Don't you think making laws to prevent smacking of children or granting virtual immunity to children is a mistake, then?

.

[BodwadUK]

Yes i think you should smack kids and the law shouldnt stop you, society has always thrived on fear, smacking a child tells them not to do it again and gives them something to fear. The people who are against smacking have this weird and wacky idea that you can reason with a child


THAT THE BIGGEST FU***** JOKE I HAVE EVER HEARD!!!!!!