I saw an ad for a park in Kentucky that was centered around Noah's Ark. I was curious if it had dinosaurs on board so I visited the web site. The Ark did have dinosaurs and there is a very logical reason...
"It makes sense to think that God would have sent to Noah juveniles (or sub-adults) dinosaurs or smaller varieties within the same kind. Consider the following advantages to bringing juveniles or smaller versions of a creature: they take up less space, they eat less, they create less waste, they are often more docile and easier to manage, they are generally less susceptible to injury, and they would have more time to reproduce after the flood."
And:
"The average dinosaur is about the size of a bison, and the estimated number of dinosaur kinds (of which only a pair of each was brought) may have been about 85—-meaning a maximum of 170 dinosaurs were taken aboard the ark. Therefore, the ark had adequate space for every kind of dinosaur, particularly if God sent sub-adults to Noah."
You just have to have common sense. Ark Park is now on my bucket list.
Last edited by TysonLPrice; Jan 28th, 2024 at 01:08 PM.
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Re: Dinosaurs on the Ark: How It Was Possible
I've got a lot of respect for religion but I've always thought it was weird when people try to argue it as science. They don't need to share the same problem space for both to be valid.
Anyway, I thought the argument really broke down right around "The average dinosaur"
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
I'm really not trying to go anywhere with this, trolling, I looked it up on a whim after I saw an AD on TV
They go to great lengths to explain that dinosaurs and humans lived together. For their part, the park creators, all life was created in one day and the earth is around six thousand years old. So you have to square that with science.
I wonder if their kids will be mad at them if they ever get out of the bubble they were raised in?
But dinosaurs did not prosper in the post-flood world, and they died out for many of the same reasons that some animals go extinct today. The post-flood world was radically different from the tropical/semi-tropical pre-flood world, and many plant species that the herbivorous dinosaurs likely fed on (cycads and gymnosperms) went extinct or were severely reduced in number and variety. Predation on some of the smaller dinosaurs by larger ones or large mammals and disease also could have contributed to their demise. Mankind may have hunted some dinosaurs for meat or destroyed them because they ravaged crops or were a threat to human survival. As Ken Ham has written, as they began to be seen less and less, they faded from memory and later remembered as legends. Dragon legends though likely containing kernels of truth about the size and ferocity of some of the larger dinosaurs, became stories told around campfires and hearths. But the very nature of their encounters with mankind after the flood in Scripture and in several historical accounts is testimony to their survival on the ark and their continued presence with man for a few thousand years afterward.
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what proof is there humans and dinosaurs live together?
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There is currently no scientific evidence supporting the idea that humans and dinosaurs coexisted. The widely accepted scientific understanding is that dinosaurs became extinct around 65 million years ago, while anatomically modern humans (Homo sapiens) appeared much later, around 300,000 years ago.
The evidence for the extinction of dinosaurs is based on extensive fossil records, geological studies, and various dating methods, such as radiometric dating. Fossils of dinosaurs have been found in layers of rock that date back to the Mesozoic Era, which ended around 66 million years ago.
Claims of human-dinosaur coexistence are often associated with certain religious beliefs or pseudoscientific ideas, but these claims lack empirical support and are not recognized within the scientific community. The scientific method relies on evidence-based reasoning, and currently, there is no credible evidence to support the idea that humans and dinosaurs lived together in the same time period.
I consider myself a Christian and believe in the teachings of the bible. I also understand that much of it is figurative and do not subscribe to a sort of religious fundamentalism.
However, my parents recently joined the Seventh-Day Adventists and they're taught to read the bible literally. Keep in mind that my understanding of how to interpret the bible is a direct result of my upbringing, at one point my parents also believed that some of the teachings were figurative too.
It's caused some awkward moments because on one hand, joining the church got my dad to stop drinking and generally I think it has had a positive impact on their lives. On the other hand I'm like do y'all really believe every effin animal was but on a boat, are y'all out of your minds?
Edit - Another one is that they worship the sabbath on Saturdays. They say that it is biblical because the 10 commandments tell us to keep the sabbath holy and that because in Genesis when God created everything he rested on the 7th day. However, they do mental gymnastics when I ask them about cultures that start their calendar weeks on Mondays and end on Sundays.
Like I said, I'm a Christian and I go to church on Sundays but it is the literal interpretation that brings up the conversation with them.
My understanding is that the "roughly 6,000 years" came from adding up the lives of various generations from the old testament. Not sure if that is true or not.
The Seventh Day Adventists have some interesting stores, at least in New England. They sell some healthy stuff, and some strange stuff...which is also pretty healthy. My mother made up a bunch of trail food for me from stuff she got at one of their stores. One of the ingredients was peanuts. She asked if I wanted roasted or unroasted. I realized I had never had an unroasted peanut before, so I tried one. One was enough. I feel no need to repeat that.
My sister is very religious...I remember when bar codes first came out she thought it was he mark of the devil. I think she is over that. We were discussing the current Israel conflict and she thinks God gave them that land. I mentioned that doesn't hold up in world court and she replied “Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's.”. It is hard to argue with that.
Last edited by TysonLPrice; Jan 30th, 2024 at 09:22 AM.
My left hand sets off some sensitive magnet detectors we use for fish work. It doesn't always set it off, but it seems to be a yearly fluctuation. I only use the detectors in August, and most years my hand sets them off, but some years it does not. I have no explanation for this, real or imagined.
That was hilarious. Funny enough, before I got kicked out, I went to a Christian High School for 2 years and not once did they go over the inquisition with us.
That was pretty good. Never seen it before. For some reason there wasn't much Monty Python shown on TV when I was young. Probably had to do with only getting 2 or 3 stations usually.
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Re: Dinosaurs on the Ark: How It Was Possible
they worship the sabbath on Saturdays
Me too... but they were never the same after Ozzy left.
they're taught to read the bible literally
Asking as a genuine question rather than a gotcha: do they really though? The reason I ask is that I used to work with someone who was part of a church that proclaimed that they took the bible as literal. I can't remember which one, it might well have been the Seventh Day Adventists or it might have been a different one. None the less, if you dug into it they were still highly selective in what they believed. They didn't, for example, believe that they should avoid their wife in her "time of uncleanliness" or that it was ok for a master to beat his slave as long as the save doesn't die immediately.
Broadly I think the bible's a good book whose message is overwhelmingly positive on balance. But it was written in a very different time to now and it's got some clauses that are REALLY hard to take literally in today's day and age. (And I think that, on the whole, it's probably best if everyone's at least a bit selective about it.)
Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jan 31st, 2024 at 01:26 PM.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
Asking as a genuine question rather than a gotcha: do they really though?
To be honest, it isn't something that I've asked about. Those two examples you listed are ones that come to mind, but there are others too. I would assume that it's the same thing where they're selective about it but that is just an assumption or more of a hope if I'm being honest.
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Re: Dinosaurs on the Ark: How It Was Possible
more of a hope if I'm being honest
Yeah. Like I said, I think the bible (and religions as a whole) tend to carry an overwhelmingly positive message but it's quite easy (and unfair) to catch them out with some gotcha questions. It certainly was with the guy I worked with and I was curious as to how he compared to other cases.
He was a genuinely good guy if a bit old fashioned in some of his beliefs. E.g. the wife belongs at home doing the cooking and making babies... that sort of thing. Not something I'd subscribe to but as long as they were both happy I figured my opinion didn't count for much.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
Yeah. Like I said, I think the bible (and religions as a whole) tend to carry an overwhelmingly positive message but it's quite easy (and unfair) to catch them out with some gotcha questions
Why is it unfair. If someone said there were 10 days in a week, would it be unfair to point out the error. It seems unfair that we are tasked with publicly ignoring the errors.
That being said, it does seem necessary. But to be honest, I think religion unites small groups of people and divides large groups of people. And the number of people killed in the "name of God", don't get me started.
As for the Bible, I'm no expert and got no real problem with it. But it needs to be acknowledged that the church crafted what's in the Bible and what was left out. Also the gospels were written many years after the events described.
It's such a double edge sword. In the case of my family/relatives, I think it's been a good thing but it's not hard to find cases where people's lives are negatively effected.
But it was written in a very different time to now
That reminded me how an opinion I have about "literal" interpretation of the Bible. Most people that believe along the lines of humans and dinosaurs living together consider the Bible as single divine word of God. I don't think they know the Bible was pieced together over many years, translated and retranslated, and was never "carried down from the mount". Most use the King James version and that is what they swear by and consider it cast in stone.
Though slow to be adopted in the English-speaking world and to replace the more popular Geneva Bible, from the mid-1600s to the late 20th century, the King James Version was THE Bible of the English-speaking church.
My point is the it was never presented as a complete work in an English version until recently and was "reinterpreted" many times.
That reminded me how an opinion I have about "literal" interpretation of the Bible. Most people that believe along the lines of humans and dinosaurs living together consider the Bible as single divine word of God. I don't think they know the Bible was pieced together over many years, translated and retranslated, and was never "carried down from the mount". Most use the King James version and that is what they swear by and consider it cast in stone.
My point is the it was never presented as a complete work in an English version until recently and was "reinterpreted" many times.
More importantly, it was put together by committee... and there's a lot more tossed out than was included...
Our family bible, which...well, I'm not quite sure WHERE it got to, had the apocrypha in it. Those are a series of chapters that were later deemed to be heretical and got excluded in other versions.
More entertainingly, I spent an afternoon with a guy who was totally off his rocker. He was showing me passages to read in the bible. As I was reading them, he spent his time throwing a knife against a tree. He was practicing to fight King James, when he showed up, cause he had figured out that King James was the Beast. I didn't follow that argument, but considering how effective he was with throwing that knife, King James wouldn't have anything to worry about.
One of his arguments was so brilliant that I've always regretted not taking notes on that one. He used the bible to prove that God was the devil, and his argument was utterly sound. Mostly, he was insane, which allowed him to misread the book in interesting ways (such as interpreting an adjective to be a noun). One of his revelations from this misreading was fascinating, suggestive, but ultimately based on thinking an adjective was a noun. The argument about God being the devil was based on a line from the book of Job, and a line from some other chapter. It was really sound, too. Of course, it just showed how difficult taking the bible literally can be. After all, there are at least three different, mutually incompatible, descriptions of the death of Judas. They can't ALL be literally true.
One of his arguments was so brilliant that I've always regretted not taking notes on that one. He used the bible to prove that God was the devil, and his argument was utterly sound.
Wood floats, ducks float, therefore ducks are made of wood...
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Re: Dinosaurs on the Ark: How It Was Possible
Why is it unfair. If someone said there were 10 days in a week, would it be unfair to point out the error. It seems unfair that we are tasked with publicly ignoring the errors.
It's not so much that people point out the errors and I think most religious people have enough of a sense of humour to have fun with it. It's that some people tend to then use it as a platform to wail on other peoples beliefs which always struck me as both smug and cruel. It's usually an exercise in puffing their own chest by putting someone else down and I don't like that.
I'm basically agnostic with a mild lean toward atheism but I envy other people's religion. It gives them a comfort and can be a source of a decent moral compass (n.b. not implying that you need religion to have a moral compass but to it does give religious folk something to anchor theirs to). I won't deny that some organised religions usurp those things in some distinctly unhealthy ways but I think they're a minority and, in my experience, the overwhelming majority of religious folks I meet are good and intelligent people.
The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill
Hadoop actually sounds more like the way they greet each other in Yorkshire - Inferrd
It's that some people tend to then use it as a platform to wail on other peoples beliefs which always struck me as both smug and cruel. It's usually an exercise in puffing their own chest by putting someone else down and I don't like that.
Yeah, I'd say it's more UnKind than UnFair.
I guess if you think about it their are multiple other things that we just let slide. It does make you wonder about the validity of "Honesty is the best policy". lol
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Originally Posted by TysonLPrice
