Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast
Results 81 to 120 of 251

Thread: Debt Ceiling Debate

  1. #81

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    I'm just glad the show is back on to be honest. Nothing more entertaining than a billionaire ex president telling a corporate media interviewer "you're a very nasty person".

    I really hope he gets back on Twitter where he was at his peak entertainment and give up that less popular one he built (what is it called like Truth Social or True Social Media).
    There is a new CNN "news director", I don't know his actual title, and he is making CNN more republican friendly. He is purging VERY anti-Trump broadcasters and if you watch that channel they are bringing on more republican Senators and Representatives as guests. The stated goal is to make CNN friendlier to both parties to capture a bigger audience.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  2. #82
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Are you implicitly admitting that CNN has been biased in prior years? That is sort of the main grievance of many of the republicans that I have talked to. Generally, I agree with them that CNN is biased (really corporate media as a whole towards one faction or another), but I do not agree with them that it is a bad thing. Let CNN and MSNBC cater to the center-left to left and let FOX and Blaze cater to the center-right to right so that both sides can live in their little echo chamber.

    Jeff Deist, former head of the Mises Institute, recently released a book titled A Strange Liberty - Politics Drops Its Pretenses and he gives a compelling case why those who do not agree with the ideologically driven institutions we have today should pursue their own institutions (with media being one of them). If you are interested in reading some of his arguments, the book is free on the Mises Institute's website: https://mises.org/library/strange-li...-its-pretenses

    If you want the left's take on why Trump did a terrible job on Afghanistan while Biden did his best you can go to MSNBC, if you want the right's take on why Biden did a terrible job on Afghanistan while Trump did his best you can go to FOX, and if you want the libertarian's take on why both were terrible on Afghanistan you can go to antiwar.com. With this position it is difficult for any one corporation to claim an argument of authority while simultaneously being "neutral" and instead you as an individual can sort out which arguments make the most sense to you.

    The same thing applies to economics. If you want the left's take on why taxing the rich with a robust welfare state is needed then you can go to MSNBC, if you want the right's take on why making tax cuts with a small(er) welfare state is needed then you can go to FOX, and if you want the right's take on why most economic issues can be resolved by abolishing the federal reserve then you can go to mises.org.

    Podcasts and social media algorithms have basically exacerbated this situation already. We were already headed in that direction with what started with Rush Limbaugh and 24/7 cable news in the late 80s/early 90s, but when people realized you can just get the takes that they wanted to hear by subscribing to a Podcast or YouTube channel it was put into overdrive.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  3. #83
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    5,195

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    I'm just glad the show is back on to be honest. Nothing more entertaining than a billionaire ex president telling a corporate media interviewer "you're a very nasty person".

    I really hope he gets back on Twitter where he was at his peak entertainment and give up that less popular one he built (what is it called like Truth Social or True Social Media).
    I don't find anything entertaining about Trump. I don't find anything funny about his most notable contribution, Jan. 6th. I might find it entertaining if no one took his lies and hate messaging seriously but obviously many people do believe him and are eager to spread them.

    So, NO, I don't find that entertaining.

  4. #84
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    He literally pulled out a screenshot of his tweet refuting the "it took you 3 hours to respond" on stage after the interviewer asked him about it. That is absolutely hilarious to me.

    Edit - Plus, what's not funny about a NY real estate guy calling someone nasty. It's like dude, I can only imagine the below the belt blows you and other had to do to get deals done in one of the most heavily regulated and saturated markets there is.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  5. #85
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    5,195

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Are you implicitly admitting that CNN has been biased in prior years?
    Of course they have been bias. not sure that's been in dispute.

    But I agree with you that that is not necessarily a bad thing. I'm not sure that truly non bias news is even possible. So, having opposing sides helps keep the news reporting to a bias and not flat out lies. At least the major news agencies. I find the smaller (so called) news outlets like podcasters, twitter users, YouTuber's more problematic. There is little accountability, FOX/CNN isn't going to spend the time and money to take legal action against them. Not worth it.

  6. #86
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    I've seen at least 3 "Trump Kennedy 2024" flags now. I thought I had misread it when I saw the first one. Now they make me laugh, people honk as they go by them.

  7. #87

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    Are you implicitly admitting that CNN has been biased in prior years? That is sort of the main grievance of many of the republicans that I have talked to. Generally, I agree with them that CNN is biased (really corporate media as a whole towards one faction or another), but I do not agree with them that it is a bad thing. Let CNN and MSNBC cater to the center-left to left and let FOX and Blaze cater to the center-right to right so that both sides can live in their little echo chamber.

    Jeff Deist, former head of the Mises Institute, recently released a book titled A Strange Liberty - Politics Drops Its Pretenses and he gives a compelling case why those who do not agree with the ideologically driven institutions we have today should pursue their own institutions (with media being one of them). If you are interested in reading some of his arguments, the book is free on the Mises Institute's website: https://mises.org/library/strange-li...-its-pretenses

    If you want the left's take on why Trump did a terrible job on Afghanistan while Biden did his best you can go to MSNBC, if you want the right's take on why Biden did a terrible job on Afghanistan while Trump did his best you can go to FOX, and if you want the libertarian's take on why both were terrible on Afghanistan you can go to antiwar.com. With this position it is difficult for any one corporation to claim an argument of authority while simultaneously being "neutral" and instead you as an individual can sort out which arguments make the most sense to you.

    The same thing applies to economics. If you want the left's take on why taxing the rich with a robust welfare state is needed then you can go to MSNBC, if you want the right's take on why making tax cuts with a small(er) welfare state is needed then you can go to FOX, and if you want the right's take on why most economic issues can be resolved by abolishing the federal reserve then you can go to mises.org.

    Podcasts and social media algorithms have basically exacerbated this situation already. We were already headed in that direction with what started with Rush Limbaugh and 24/7 cable news in the late 80s/early 90s, but when people realized you can just get the takes that they wanted to hear by subscribing to a Podcast or YouTube channel it was put into overdrive.
    You could say biased or catering to their audience. Just like the right side Media. Fox just paid 800,000 million plus and part of what came out of it is they would rather lie to there audience then lose them. I'm willing to bet that "liberal" stations you mentioned will not be facing that soon.

    This country is getting more and more diverse and more liberal. . So I think that shift is naturally reflected in the media. The right in Texas have passed laws against bias online against conservatives because they see bias. The country is just changing. We have gone from something like, and I'm making these numbers up for conversation, something like 80% Christian to 60%.

    I will concede outright the stations you mentioned lean left. I think the country does too. Republicans vs Democrats politics do not reflect that.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  8. #88
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    I don't think people are as brand-centered as you implore them to be.

    Crime is up. Violent crime is up. Inflation runs amok, pricing essentials out of sight. Promises to invest in infrastructure turned out to be corporate pork. The southern border is a mess that's growing. War mongering is on steroids. Energy dependence was brought back while natural gas is being exported to Europe with subsidies. Calls to relinquish sovereignty to unelected global cabals grow daily.

    Without even getting personal (and both camps are full of warts there) I think many voters see the obvious. That doesn't make the decision easy, much less assuring the outcome of elections 18 months away.

  9. #89
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    I don't think people are as brand-centered as you implore them to be.
    I completely agree with that and I think Tucker Carlson is the perfect example. Don't get me wrong, there are some issues where he falls almost in lockstep with the Republican base that mostly watches Fox (*china* with Trump fingers) but there were a lot of issues where he went against the typical Republican position (compare his stance on Ukraine with pretty much anyone else at Fox). Even though people were watching Fox news in record numbers, they were really watching Tucker Carlson. You can confirm this with the massive drop in ratings that is being reported now that Fox took Tucker off air.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  10. #90
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    I'm willing to bet that "liberal" stations you mentioned will not be facing that soon.
    Nor do I think the libertarian outlets mentioned will be facing that soon either. I don't see your point here. Also, I do not agree with your usage of "liberal" here. CNN and MSNBC are not classical liberals in any sense of the word. That's why I deliberately used the word "left" in my post.

    Your thoughts here:
    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    This country is getting more and more diverse and more liberal...I will concede outright the stations you mentioned lean left. I think the country does too.
    Make me understand your position here better:
    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    I agree, all those deplorables are trying to trash the nations credit.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  11. #91
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    We have many problems we need to address. Finding common ground seems much more valuable than deepening divides.

    It's frustrating that expressing this is seen as some sign of weakness or even concession.

  12. #92
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    I don’t see it as a concession, more of naïveté. Without an authoritarian, top down rule on media then the natural instinct is for people to seek information and opinions that they’re comfortable with. All technology did was speed up that process.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  13. #93

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    I don't think people are as brand-centered as you implore them to be.

    Crime is up. Violent crime is up. Inflation runs amok, pricing essentials out of sight. Promises to invest in infrastructure turned out to be corporate pork. The southern border is a mess that's growing. War mongering is on steroids. Energy dependence was brought back while natural gas is being exported to Europe with subsidies. Calls to relinquish sovereignty to unelected global cabals grow daily.

    Without even getting personal (and both camps are full of warts there) I think many voters see the obvious. That doesn't make the decision easy, much less assuring the outcome of elections 18 months away.
    You effectively summed up one hour of Fox news broadcasting or many other of the far right outlets. The way I see it when the republicans were running the country, before Obama, the country was in a recession and many of the things the things you listed were going on, Eight years of democrats and things were looking good again. Trump took over and ran it into the dirt. Now democrats have to dig us out again. Gas prices are down, inflation is cooling, and the border has been a wreck for decades but congress can't get their act together.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  14. #94

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    Nor do I think the libertarian outlets mentioned will be facing that soon either. I don't see your point here. Also, I do not agree with your usage of "liberal" here. CNN and MSNBC are not classical liberals in any sense of the word. That's why I deliberately used the word "left" in my post.

    Your thoughts here:


    Make me understand your position here better:
    "I agree, all those deplorables are trying to trash the nations credit."

    I told you I deliberately took your quote and flipped it on its head for fun. And I don't think there is a whole lot of distance between "left" and "liberal".

    My point was both sides are biased and Fox is to the point they are willing to lie to their audience versus just the left being biased. I don't think the outlets you call "left" will be doling out that kind of money.
    Last edited by TysonLPrice; May 12th, 2023 at 03:51 AM.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  15. #95
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    You effectively summed up one hour of Fox news broadcasting or many other of the far right outlets. The way I see it when the republicans were running the country, before Obama, the country was in a recession and many of the things the things you listed were going on, Eight years of democrats and things were looking good again. Trump took over and ran it into the dirt. Now democrats have to dig us out again. Gas prices are down, inflation is cooling, and the border has been a wreck for decades but congress can't get their act together.
    Wow. And you probably believe all of that too.

    See: Misery Index

    Those facts don't bear out much of what you said. They show reality to be almost 180 degrees from your positions.

  16. #96
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    The "Trump Years" there are almost hilariously notable as good times.

  17. #97
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Yeah... I wasn't sure if he was joking or seriously believed it.

    Edit - I will say that inflation under Biden is not entirely his doing. If you remember correctly Trump signed the Consolidated Appropriations Act of 2021, which printed $1.4 trillion. That in itself is inflation (more money chasing the same amount of goods) but many predicted that the effects of inflation would not be felt for a couple of months or years.
    Last edited by dday9; May 12th, 2023 at 02:37 PM.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  18. #98

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    Wow. And you probably believe all of that too.

    See: Misery Index

    Those facts don't bear out much of what you said. They show reality to be almost 180 degrees from your positions.
    Thanks for the ammo...did you even read it?

    The all-time low was 5.0 during Obama's 2nd term.

    I reiterate Bush and his wars went from a balanced budget under the democrats/Bill Clinton, to a huge deficient after two wars leading to a recession. Democrats and Obama dug us out of the republican caused pain, and the economy did well despite Trump. Now we need adults in the room again to fix it.
    Last edited by TysonLPrice; May 13th, 2023 at 09:03 AM.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  19. #99
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    That's some incredibly breathtaking spin on reality. Misery fell when Obama was ousted and remained low until Biden stumbled in.

    I don't credit Trump with all of that, but the good times sure do coincide with his administration.

  20. #100
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    I'm surprised we aren't hearing spin on the recent CNN Town Hall. It seems to be the gift that keeps on giving.

  21. #101
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Bush exploded the budget. Obama said hold my beer. Trump said I’m the best spender to have ever spent. Biden cracked his nuckles. Reminds me a lot of the “galaxy brain” meme that was popular some years back.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  22. #102
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    5,195

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    That's some incredibly breathtaking spin on reality. Misery fell when Obama was ousted and remained low until Biden stumbled in.

    I don't credit Trump with all of that, but the good times sure do coincide with his administration.
    That chart doesn't really indicate WHO caused the misery. Things like inflation and recessions don't happen in one day or one month.

    When Obama took office in 2009 the country was in the middle of a financial collapse. So there was a lot of misery. But it had nothing to do with him being in office. When Biden took office he inherited the COVID problem.

    That chart doesn't prove what you claim.

  23. #103
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    38,988

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    That's some incredibly breathtaking spin on reality. Misery fell when Obama was ousted and remained low until Biden stumbled in.

    I don't credit Trump with all of that, but the good times sure do coincide with his administration.
    Speaking of spin: "Ousted"??? He didn't run because he had served as many terms as he was able. Trump was ousted, Obama just finished his term, as has every president who didn't run for reelection.

    You also have your timing messed up. Misery didn't 'remain low until Biden stumbled in'. Biden didn't enter office until 2021. He won in 2020, he didn't start serving until 2021. Note that the graph shows the highest misery index since 83 was in 2020, which is when Trump was in office, as he remained for another year.

    Similarly, Trump won in 2016, but didn't enter office until 2017. The lowest points on that graph covered the last two years of Obama, not Trump.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  24. #104
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    38,988

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    Bush exploded the budget. Obama said hold my beer. Trump said I’m the best spender to have ever spent. Biden cracked his nuckles. Reminds me a lot of the “galaxy brain” meme that was popular some years back.
    Not quite. Bush exploded the budget because of the two wars started after 9/11. Before that, he was actual being pretty hawkish. Yes, the end result was that the budget exploded, but I don't really fault him for that. Had he ignored 9/11, he wouldn't have survived 2004.

    Obama was nothing special, one way or another, on budget issues. He inherited the wars, one wound down, one kept going. Wars are expensive. I haven't gone looking, but I have the feeling that everybody who started, or got into, a war since perhaps the Roman Empire, has run a deficit as a result of the war.

    That's not making any value judgment on the war, or on the leaders who were in charge when the war started, whether they started it or not. Wars are just horrible for budgets. They aren't always avoidable, in this world, but they're always horrible for budgets. Therefore, I don't think it quite fair to say a president was bad on the deficit if a war is involved. You can argue about whether they should have been in the war, started the war, gotten involved, fought back, or whatever they ended up doing, but as long as the war is a fact, then the budget will run a massive deficit.

    For that reason, the two presidents I object to on budgetary grounds, are Reagan and Trump. Reagan had his whole 'voodoo economics' thing. It's a theory, and one that hadn't really been tried, so if he bought into it, then I understand why he would pursue it. I don't agree with the theory, but I do agree that a president should be allow to try a valid economic theory if they believe in it. I think Reagan did, so, while I don't agree with him, it's an academic disagreement.

    With Trump, he was the first president not to pretend to balance the budget. Everybody, including Reagan, claimed their budget was balanced. Sometimes, they assumed that the result of their priorities would spur economic growth, which is what the voodoo economics was all about, but they made a plausible argument that the budget would be balanced as a result of their tax cuts. Trump did not. His administration explicitly stated that the tax cuts they were passing would cause the deficit increase by a substantial amount. He did claim that it would boost growth, and thereby reduce the deficit they would run, but even with their most optimistic forecast, which didn't come true (they never do), they STILL said that the deficit would explode, as it did.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  25. #105
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    So a balanced budget is good but a budget deficit is good. Huh?

    Oh, I think I've cracked the code: "Orange man bad."

  26. #106
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    38,988

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    A balanced budget doesn't mean no debt. You can balance the budget at 0 debt, -1 trillion debt, or a trillion in savings. A balanced budget just means that the amount flowing in equals the amount flowing out.

    That debt IS useful. US debt is in the form of treasury bonds and the like. You probably own some of it, I own some of it, lots of people own some of it. In fact, US debt is particularly valuable because it is seen as an ultra-safe investment that is highly liquid. If there was no US debt, that wouldn't be great. Perhaps somebody would make up something like US debt that would act the same way. Perhaps they'd go into commodities, which aren't nearly as liquid, but can hold value. They aren't as stable, though. Cash tend to hold value, too, and is the most liquid, but it has a generally negative return in the long run.

    There's nothing quite like US debt vehicles.

    Of course, the interest paid on US debt comes out of taxpayers pockets, so it can be seen as a form of wealth distribution, but mostly from high to high and middle to high. If I earn more in interest on my bond holdings than I pay in taxes, am I paying taxes? Well, in my case, yes, since I don't just have US treasuries, but in theory...

    So, while I would rather that the deficit be reduced, I do recognize that government debt isn't a strictly bad thing. There are nuances.
    Last edited by Shaggy Hiker; May 14th, 2023 at 01:42 PM.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  27. #107
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Not at a desk to address all of Obama’s interventions but you’re omitting Libya, Syria, and backing the color revolutions in Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan, Georgia, Belarus, and Lebanon.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  28. #108

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    Not at a desk to address all of Obama’s interventions but you’re omitting Libya, Syria, and backing the color revolutions in Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan, Georgia, Belarus, and Lebanon.
    I'm not at a desk either...Are you responding to Shaggy Hiker? I'm missing your point
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  29. #109
    Super Moderator dday9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    South Louisiana
    Posts
    11,711

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Yeah with the statement about wars.
    "Code is like humor. When you have to explain it, it is bad." - Cory House
    VbLessons | Code Tags | Sword of Fury - Jameram

  30. #110

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    Yeah with the statement about wars.
    I don't know what you are referring to or what you are trying to convey...
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  31. #111
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    38,988

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    Not at a desk to address all of Obama’s interventions but you’re omitting Libya, Syria, and backing the color revolutions in Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan, Georgia, Belarus, and Lebanon.
    Frankly, if you include those, then EVERY US president has been involved in wars. I read a book called, "The Savage Wars of Peace", which I think was the one that chronicled all the US interventions in Central and South America prior to the Vietnam war. I'm not sure how far back they went, but probably, "to the halls of Montezuma", or perhaps even further back. People who dislike the US because we keep invading them...have a point.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  32. #112

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    Frankly, if you include those, then EVERY US president has been involved in wars. I read a book called, "The Savage Wars of Peace", which I think was the one that chronicled all the US interventions in Central and South America prior to the Vietnam war. I'm not sure how far back they went, but probably, "to the halls of Montezuma", or perhaps even further back. People who dislike the US because we keep invading them...have a point.
    We are not invading...we are supporting freedom fighters. We fight tyranny and repressive governments. We are spreading democracy and freedom. Get with the program. Whose side are you on

    Edit:

    I forget we are spreading the word of God to save people.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  33. #113
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Meanwhile that Putin has been utterly defeated again for like the 70th week. Pay no mind to that deficit.

    You cheer the thugs on, then try to pin their violence on the opposition?

    It was far from unexpected to see Asa Hutchinson, Chris Christie, Mitt Romney, et al. join Biden in calling Trump a "Putin Puppet" after the CNN Town Hall where he decried all of the deaths in Biden's War and called for an end to it.

    Opinion: What Trump gets right on Ukraine

    There were certainly some howlers in Trump’s statements, but it’s a mistake to instantly dismiss all of his points – especially given that GOP support for intervening in the war is dropping. As of January, only 39% of Republicans supported giving US weapons to Ukraine and just 21% supported financial assistance, compared to 53% and 28%, respectively, since the war began a year ago.
    ... to say nothing about the huge lack of support among independents and non-coastal Americans.

  34. #114
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    24,482

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    I think if Trump does run he'll have a good chance of winning again. If it makes you feel better I don't think he'll run though.

    I'm actually more worried about who will run against Biden in that case. There are some pretty awful alternatives out there. I think people so sick of the misery there's no telling who they might back.

  35. #115
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    38,988

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    ... to say nothing about the huge lack of support among independents and non-coastal Americans.
    I'm sure if there were stats to say, you'd say it.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  36. #116

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    I think if Trump does run he'll have a good chance of winning again. If it makes you feel better I don't think he'll run though.

    I'm actually more worried about who will run against Biden in that case. There are some pretty awful alternatives out there. I think people so sick of the misery there's no telling who they might back.
    Where have you been? Trump declared his candidacy months ago and has been running.
    .
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  37. #117
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    38,988

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    I assume Dil's figuring Trump doesn't really mean it and will drop out. I didn't think Trump would run again, either, but now that he is running, I do think he'll stick it out. Still, everybody gets to place their bets on what Trump will do, as he's pretty erratic. My bet is on him sticking around through the primaries.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  38. #118

    Thread Starter
    Wall Poster TysonLPrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    3,834

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    I assume Dil's figuring Trump doesn't really mean it and will drop out. I didn't think Trump would run again, either, but now that he is running, I do think he'll stick it out. Still, everybody gets to place their bets on what Trump will do, as he's pretty erratic. My bet is on him sticking around through the primaries.
    I think his mental issues will keep him from dropping out. He had a taste of it and wants it back. This time maybe he'll manage to overthrow the election if he wins and then gets voted out again. He already had a practice round. I wonder how many more impeachments he'll rack up.
    Please remember next time...elections matter!

  39. #119
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    5,195

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    I think his mental issues will keep him from dropping out. He had a taste of it and wants it back. This time maybe he'll manage to overthrow the election if he wins and then gets voted out again. He already had a practice round. I wonder how many more impeachments he'll rack up.
    If he wins he can't run again. But maybe he can find away to change that law. lol

  40. #120
    PowerPoster
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Modesto, Ca.
    Posts
    5,195

    Re: Debt Ceiling Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    I assume Dil's figuring Trump doesn't really mean it and will drop out. I didn't think Trump would run again, either, but now that he is running, I do think he'll stick it out. Still, everybody gets to place their bets on what Trump will do, as he's pretty erratic. My bet is on him sticking around through the primaries.
    Strange things happen in politics but so far no one is even close to dethroning Trump as the Rep nominee.

Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  



Click Here to Expand Forum to Full Width