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Thread: Stop whining - just get numb

  1. #241
    Fanatic Member Peter Porter's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    This is what I'm talking about when I talk about being loose with interpretation. I never once mentioned anything about hating transgenders or gays or any of that. You and the others chose to interpret the things I'm saying in your own way and drag gender politics into it.
    Niya, I'm curious about your stance on gays and transgenders. I understand that you don't hate them, but how do you see gays and transgenders as human beings? Do they deserve to be happy without being ridiculed?

    The reason why I'm asking is because you used a photo of an adult male, who's a visually happy ectomorph joking around, and made it the subject for what you see as the feminization of men, which you stated were told it's ok to wear dresses.

    We all know now he's straight, has a girlfriend and successful career, but how did his amusing photo equate to a person with problems? Is it because he looks feminine to you? Gay?

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by FunkyDexter View Post
    You're right, though, I did make an assumption for which I apologise.
    It was reasonable for you to assume I'm not black, because I'm pretty sure I'm a minority here. Hell, I might be the only one among the active membership.
    I'm guessing it never crossed your mind that there might be gay programming members and lurkers on VBForums everyday. They might have read your assumption of the person in the photo.
    Last edited by Peter Porter; Jul 14th, 2022 at 06:31 AM.

  2. #242
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    I might be the only one among the active membership
    I know for sure that you're not the only one, Neo, but, yeah, I'm pretty sure you're in a woefully small minority.

    I never once mentioned anything about hating transgenders or gays or any of that. You and the others chose to interpret the things I'm saying in your own way and drag gender politics into it.
    But you have repeatedly refused to acknowledge that trans people exist - which is in itself transphobic. And you started out the discussion by demonising men you find to be effeminate by stating that they're the cause of mass shootings in America.
    Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jul 14th, 2022 at 02:38 AM.
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  3. #243
    Angel of Code Niya's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Ok lets take this from the top. Dilettante made a post that linked masculinity to school shootings and I weighed in with my own thoughts on the matter pointing out that many of these young men were never mentored correctly. Many of these young men found themselves unable to acquire the things a young man typically wants in his early years. These early years would be from the time he hits puberty to his very early twenties. What are the things they look for? The are looking for social capital. To understand what I mean here lets draw on an age old trope seen in many coming of age films. Think of the athletes in a school environment. The tend to be very popular, respected, envied and admired by other boys and attractive to the girls. They have a lot of social capital. On the other hand, you have the outcasts who have no friends. They are typically bullied, shunned, mocked etc. They have no social capital. I'm going to assume we all understand what I'm saying here. Right? Let's move on.

    Getting this social capital is very much linked to the identity of the person in question. For girls it's easy, they mostly just have to be pretty. It also helps for them to have a certain level of social intelligence but it's not absolutely necessary. A pretty girl is going to be popular no matter what. However, for boys it's different and a lot more difficult. The easiest way for a male to earn social standing would be through athleticism. The one thing you will find that is common across all cultures is a worship of their best athletes. It's true in my country, it's true in America, it's true just about anywhere in the world. Now, not everyone can be or will want to be an athlete. So what can you do as a young man? Well you have to develop your core masculine traits. This is where the problem starts.

    The core of a masculine identity is strength, competence and assertiveness. Everything you do and say must communicate strength and competence to those around you. However, the behaviors that are typically associated with masculinity has been demonized by the left under the banner of a ridiculous notion called "toxic masculinity". So when progressives discard masculinity what remains? Well everything else that is not masculine but this is a mistake. By demonizing masculinity, you are denying something very central to the identity of a young heterosexual man. This is exactly what went wrong with Elliot Rodgers and a few other school shooters. They found themselves in a world that labeled their natural masculine urges as toxic and told them to suppress it. As a result they grew frustrated because of repeated failures in their social lives and they snapped.

    So what happens when you take masculinity off the table? You end up adopting traits and behaviors that are "green lit" by society. These traits and behaviors come from groups that identify differently. Gay men are allowed to be gay. Women are allowed to be women but straight men are not allowed to be straight men because progressives say it's toxic. Now you end up with a lot of young heterosexual men with a huge hole in their life, having to adopt identities that are not their own. There is nothing for them. It has all been taken away the Radical Left.

    This was my entire point. Read that and tell me exactly where I talked about hating gays or any of the nonsense you guys accused me of?
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  4. #244
    Super Moderator FunkyDexter's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    There's so much wrong with that.

    To understand what I mean here lets draw on an age old trope seen in many coming of age films
    You've clearly never watched the Revenge of the Nerds... OK, I'm just taking the piss with this bit. But...

    For girls it's easy, they mostly just have to be pretty. It also helps for them to have a certain level of social intelligence but it's not absolutely necessary.
    That is a seriously misogynistic view of women. You seem to be equating popularity with attractiveness to the opposite sex. As such, you're implying that the only popularity that matters to a girl is their ability to attract a man which... just... no. Further, you haven't cited anything else a young women could aspire to, e.g. a career, travel, respect in the community, the opportunity to make a difference in the world... Your focus on attractiveness to the exclusion of all else carries the strong implication that getting a good man is the only thing a young woman aspires to.

    The easiest way for a male to earn social standing would be through athleticism
    It's a way but, again, it's your omissions which belie your underlying view. You haven't mentioned career, contribution to the community, wit, intellect... And again, you seem to be reducing the entirety of the aspirations of young men to "gotta get laid" which is massively reductive.

    However, the behaviors that are typically associated with masculinity has been demonized by the left under the banner of a ridiculous notion called "toxic masculinity".
    Nope. "The left" (as you keep referring to anyone with a social conscience, I'm a centrist) has not demonised strength, competence or assertiveness at all. What is demonised is behaviours like bullying, the reduction of women to nothing but sex objects and the belittlement of people who differ from the social norm. Everything else you've said essentially hangs of that, I think, so is flawed in it's basis.

    Nobody is demonising men for being good at sports. Nobody is demonising men for being competent at their job. Nobody is demonising men for being assertive (unless you extend the definition of assertiveness to include bullying). When Russia invaded Ukraine, it was men that the Ukrainian government insisted on staying behind to fight and nobody objected or thought that was remarkable. Frankly, we celebrate masculinity. We just don't consider it's definition to include behaviours that actually are toxic.

    Meanwhile you are demonizing people simply for being themselves. Want to cross dress? You're less of a person. Want to sit down to urinate? You're less of a person. Uncomfortable with your birth assigned sex? You're less of a person. More concerned with intellectual achievement than bumping uglies? You're less of a person. Need to wear glasses and look a bit nerdy? You're less of a person.

    I would summarise your argument as this: Some men want to behave in crappy ways. When they realise that society no longer accepts that and pushes back, they can't cope and go postal. Your proposed solution is that society should allow them to behave in crappy ways. 1. That really is a terrible solution which speaks to a lack of courage to stand up for people who need it and 2. intrinsic to it is that men who you would define as masculine are too weak to cope with criticism without throwing a lethal hissy fit.
    Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jul 15th, 2022 at 08:33 AM.
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  5. #245
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    I think he is talking about school years popularity.
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    πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν·

  6. #246
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Why does that change anything above? simply substitute academic attainment for career and you're golden. It's the assumption that the only thing that matters to young men and women being getting over with the opposite sex that's problematic.
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  7. #247
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    I don't want to get involved, I just tried to interpret that I think he meant that in school your priorities are not career or make a difference in the world.
    Talking about travel. Packing for a weekend at the sea and hopefully in 1 week... Vacations!
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  8. #248
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Packing for a weekend at the sea
    If the weather over there is anything like it is here you've picked the right time. It's going to be brutally hot here in the next week. They've issued the first ever sever weather warning for heat that Britain has ever seen and warned of risk death! Us Brits are not equipped to cope with warm weather - we barely understand the concept.
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  9. #249
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    I think you have a taste of how the weather is here
    But it won't be so "brutal" for Greece standards. 35-37 Celsius.
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  10. #250
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Nobody is demonising men for being good at sports. Nobody is demonising men for being competent at their job. Nobody is demonising men for being assertive (unless you extend the definition of assertiveness to include bullying). When Russia invaded Ukraine, it was men that the Ukrainian government insisted on staying behind to fight and nobody objected or thought that was remarkable. Frankly, we celebrate masculinity. We just don't consider it's definition to include behaviours that actually are toxic.
    I agree. Masculinity is very celebrated, still considered a desirable trait. Toxic masculinity, is more about the negative effects feeling your masculinity is inadequate. Also, some of our behaviors to prove to the world we are masculine.

  11. #251
    Angel of Code Niya's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    The levels of willfull ignorance about what is happening in your own culture and your inability to see pass your own left leaning biases is just too much for me deal with. I'm exhausted by this discussion. Believe whatever you want. I'm done trying to explain anything.
    Last edited by Niya; Jul 17th, 2022 at 12:32 AM.
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  12. #252
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    I'm exhausted by this discussion. Believe whatever you want. I'm done trying to explain anything.
    So you keep saying.

  13. #253
    Angel of Code Niya's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb



    I feel exactly like poor Senator Hawley does here having to debate with this crazy woman in a public forum.
    Last edited by Niya; Jul 18th, 2022 at 06:44 PM.
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    C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter

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  14. #254
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Worse yet, a lot of these neo-Marxists really are the drug-addled gun nuts they try to parody others as. We saw a taste of this in the recent firearm fetishism thread here. Sanity seems to be teetering on a knife's edge.

  15. #255

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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post


    I feel exactly like poor Senator Hawley does here having to debate with this crazy woman in a public forum.
    It is not a compliment in anyway to side with Senator Hawley...he is a bomb throwing, ignorant, Trump politician. His main legislative accomplishments are culture war sound bites on Fox news. If you understood the science behind what was being said in the full context of when it was said you would know what an ass he is.
    Last edited by TysonLPrice; Jul 19th, 2022 at 04:50 AM.
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  16. #256
    Angel of Code Niya's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    It is not a compliment in anyway to side with Senator Hawley...he is a bomb throwing, ignorant, Trump politician. His main legislative accomplishments are culture war sound bites on Fox news. If you understood the science behind what was being said in the full context of when it was said you would know what an ass he is.
    See, this is exactly why it's difficult to have conversations and debates with leftists. I'm dealing with what is happening in that 1 minute and 39 second clip, nothing more. He asked a very simple question that has a very simple answer. This is no need for context, nor does this man's background matter. It doesn't matter if he was the devil himself and she was Jesus reborn, it would still be just as crazy.

    I've noticed that leftists have trouble focusing on the actual substance of the conversation and instead prop up their arguments by attacking the person. They do this because their world-views cannot survive actual scrutiny and as soon as they start feeling exposed as the loonies that they are, they deploy their nukes which is to call their opponent some kind of "phobe" or bigot. It happened in this thread and it happened in that clip.


    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    If you understood the science behind what was being said in the full context
    Wait, did you actually just say this? Science? Are you serious?

    You know I'm glad we had this little pow-wow in this thread. I knew the left was crazy and their propaganda was potent but I never knew it was this bad until now. You poor souls really cannot see how insane all of this actually is, can you? My mind is blow, actually blown.

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    Sanity seems to be teetering on a knife's edge.
    That knife has long done it's work. Sanity has been gone for at least 4 or 5 years now.
    Last edited by Niya; Jul 19th, 2022 at 11:06 AM.
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    C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter

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  17. #257
    MS SQL Powerposter szlamany's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/YRUuKKYosCU

    Yea keep assuming. You're doing great.
    Good on you for even engaging these leftists - I bowed out several years ago!

    Being a constitutional conservative in the USA has become a problem and those outside the country love to criticize us even more.

    I guess I can understand that a bit. I'm from the New Haven, CT area - we feel pizza was invented here. We basically spend our entire lives criticizing every piece of pizza we ever eat away from home!

    At least I keep my childish one-sided thinking to silly things like pizza. Otherwise, I like to put several opposing thoughts into my brain at once, and none of them from MSM, and let it grow from that.

    btw - I would imagine that black person you questioned about could be insulted - seeing it as patronizing in a way.

    Although to counter that point I just made, I was happy to see people of color play roles in Broadway shows that might not have been historical or seen as typical.

    Separate performance from reality - don't take the bait either way...
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  18. #258
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    That Left vs Right struggle is what is plaguing Greece for over 40 years now. They put people in molds saying you are this or that so they can easily manipulate them and vote for the sold out left or right parties.
    I don't know exactly what is going on in US but in Greece this is pretty obvious since the "right" government party has now all the characteristics that a "left" party has.
    Hangman the politician edition. Also if you haven't noticed Euro dogs are falling like flies. UK,France(Macron won and he cannot pass legislation because he...Lost),Italy,Slovenia and more to come.Hopefully almighty Greece will fuel you all for 50 years so you can bypass the shortage....If we don't vote a traitor again.
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  19. #259

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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    See, this is exactly why it's difficult to have conversations and debates with leftists. I'm dealing with what is happening in that 1 minute and 39 second clip, nothing more. He asked a very simple question that has a very simple answer. This is no need for context, nor does this man's background matter. It doesn't matter if he was the devil himself and she was Jesus reborn, it would still be just as crazy.
    I think you identified part of the problem....you took 1 minute and 39 second clip that was out of context and left out the science related responses of the other person. Then you say his background doesn't matter and neither does her, of course it does. If you can post a 1 minute and 39 second clip of any moron on the internet and say context and his credentials do not matter so can anyone else. Serious debate is at risk though.

    Wait, did you actually just say this? Science? Are you serious?
    Senator Hawley has always "cherry picked" his "facts" and consistently is throwing "culture war" bombs. If you really cared about facts you would look up who you use as references and the arguments that were actually used versus picking and ass and a sound bite that fits your narrative.
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  20. #260
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    I'm dealing with what is happening in that 1 minute and 39 second clip, nothing more. He asked a very simple question that has a very simple answer.
    Which question and answer did you disagree with? That "people capable of pregnancy" is not an perfect correlation with "women", or that pretending trans women don't exist is inherently transphobic? Or something else that I missed?

    I guess I can understand that a bit. I'm from the New Haven, CT area - we feel pizza was invented here
    John Stewart's pizza rant. Also, I have a Sicilian friend who'd like to have a word with you.
    Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jul 20th, 2022 at 08:46 AM.
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Quote Originally Posted by FunkyDexter View Post

    John Stewart's pizza rant. Also, I have a Sicilian friend who'd like to have a word with you.
    UH-OH , Greece to the rescue again
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    πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν·

  22. #262
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    You did teach the Italians everything you knew so... yeah.
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Una faccia una razza
    ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ
    πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν·

  24. #264
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    My Italian half is great grandparents that came from Sicily late 1800's.

    And then my Italian grandfather that married into that family, he came from Calabria around 1905.

    Both regions are heavily Greek influenced over the centuries. At times complete Greek control of the region.

    That led to DNA results that years ago returned a mix of Italian and Greek - basically southern Mediterranean. The Ancestry.com types have cleaned this up with better data and now know that part of me to be actually northern Sicilian - that it pretty specific.

    At any rate, I cook all my Italian grandmothers meals to this day - keeping my memories of her from the 1960's alive!

    And I personally make a better pizza than most of the places near me - that's sad.

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  25. #265
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    That is interesting.
    Most of the southern Italy had the first Greek colonization at ancient times creating the Magna Graecia, many cities where named after the Greek colonies.
    Some places still have Greek phrases spoken
    There is a significant difference with North Italy that the tribes there eventually gathered as proto Germanic.
    ...And since you have mentioned it, Calabria was founded by Greeks
    https://www.britannica.com/place/Reg...Calabria-Italy

    Edit: Forgot the pizza part. Unfortunately most of the pizzas are branded, if you are lucky you can get to a wood over at places and eat properly. Unfortunately I am not aware of a place near me but I haven't looked it up also...Hmmm.
    Last edited by sapator; Jul 20th, 2022 at 05:14 PM.
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  26. #266
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    That is interesting.
    Most of the southern Italy had the first Greek colonization at ancient times creating the Magna Graecia, many cities where named after the Greek colonies.
    Some places still have Greek phrases spoken
    There is a significant difference with North Italy that the tribes there eventually gathered as proto Germanic.
    ...And since you have mentioned it, Calabria was founded by Greeks
    https://www.britannica.com/place/Reg...Calabria-Italy

    Edit: Forgot the pizza part. Unfortunately most of the pizzas are branded, if you are lucky you can get to a wood over at places and eat properly. Unfortunately I am not aware of a place near me but I haven't looked it up also...Hmmm.
    I'm more than lucky. There are three places near me that cook pizza the old fashion way! There might be more in other villages that I don't know of, but I'm happy with the ones I frequent.

  27. #267
    Super Moderator FunkyDexter's Avatar
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    And I personally make a better pizza than most of the places near me - that's sad.
    That's not sad, that's epic!

    I've been meaning to buy a pizza oven for the back garden. I think an air conditioner unit is taking priority right now though.
    The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter - Winston Churchill

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  28. #268
    King of sapila
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    What is a pizza over?
    Is the one that regular pizza places have (with the grills and stuff)?
    There is no point to do so then. If doable then make a wood over, the taste of the slow cooked pizza would be fantastic.
    And on that note, I hope the best pizza creators or pizza eaters are referring the "best pizza" as one created by a wood over. If not then you don't know what you are talking about.
    ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ
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  29. #269
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Better than pizza cooked over old tires I suppose.

  30. #270
    King of sapila
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    Re: Stop whining - just get numb

    Well tree oven is the best but you can also use tire oven, nuclear oven, vaxbies oven etc
    ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ
    πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν·

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