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Thread: Windows 11 is available to some now

  1. #41
    Frenzied Member PlausiblyDamp's Avatar
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    I like Ubuntu but I'm not crazy enough to think it could ever replace Windows as my main OS. I find Linux to be a good companion to Windows when it's being hosted in Hyper-V. I could see myself using Linux to host something like a database or webserver. The Linux ecosystem is really strong in this domain but as a user desktop? Not a chance. Nothing beats Windows as far as I'm concerned when it comes to average day to day use.
    Windows 11 and WSL is pretty good, Windows as your desktop but you can run Linux apps as well. Just open a terminal session and you have your Ubuntu box. Explorer can drag and drop between Windows and your linux session and even graphical linux apps are supported.

    Mounting your windows drive under your linux session also gives you your favourite linux commands working on a windows drive. Pretty decent compromise really.

  2. #42
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I have no issue with the security hardware. I just don't want to replace old machines and I don't care for things like the x64 requirement which means more replacing of old machines.

    Everything I have that is still active can run x64 Windows, but some can't accept more than 4GB of RAM which makes that a poor option.

    The UI rearrangement looks awkward, but you can get used to that if you have to. The requirement to install using a Microsoft Account is a nuisance, but you can still remove that afterward.

    So adding it all up: compromise, compromise, compromise, but new hardware, compromise.

    While there may be something of value to a tiny minority of users with tablets... is there anything for anyone else? Doesn't sound like it.

    Still, it is probably inevitable in the end. I really doubt old machines will move to Linux in non-trivial numbers. More likely it's just landfill time for nearly every one of them if Windows 10 ever has the kill switch flipped on.

  3. #43
    Angel of Code Niya's Avatar
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by dday9 View Post
    I can tell you from experience that hosting a web server that isn't ASP (classic or .NET) is incredibly painful. I ran into so many issues trying to host a PHP web server to an on-prem Windows Server maching that uses IIS and I gave up (on a test) to host a GoLang web server using IIS because I got so frustrated. Hosting them on Linux was smooth.

    However, I've rarely run into issues hosting an ASP.NET web server on IIS.

    It all goes back to "the right tool for the right job" discussion that seems to always crop up.
    Yea, I'd expect that. None of that surprises me. Linux has always been great with non-MS and open source tool chains.
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  4. #44
    Angel of Code Niya's Avatar
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by PlausiblyDamp View Post
    Windows 11 and WSL is pretty good, Windows as your desktop but you can run Linux apps as well. Just open a terminal session and you have your Ubuntu box. Explorer can drag and drop between Windows and your linux session and even graphical linux apps are supported.

    Mounting your windows drive under your linux session also gives you your favourite linux commands working on a windows drive. Pretty decent compromise really.
    I hear good things about WSL. However, there are things a full Linux install under Hyper-V can do that WSL cannot. We had some trouble getting some stuff to work with WSL but it worked well under Hyper-V.
    Treeview with NodeAdded/NodesRemoved events | BlinkLabel control | Calculate Permutations | Object Enums | ComboBox with centered items | .Net Internals article(not mine) | Wizard Control | Understanding Multi-Threading | Simple file compression | Demon Arena

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    C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter

    There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney

    The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber

  5. #45
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    My issue is why they are using that chip. They really care for our security? I mean come on. I would suspect and with all the fuss about it to be just a commercial gimmick for better or for worse that will probably be pulled aside or "patched" while MS is whistling in the corner.
    Other than that I can't express an opinion till I see them in use. And I don't mean the beta. I can't imagine anyone trusting a beta by microsoft but hey...
    They don't give a darn about your security, they give a darn about theirs. A brief look into this shows that they're addressing some big hacks on MS based systems, and even MS programs themselves.

    They can ignore this, and get burned again and again and again, or they can force people to address it. That's what Win10 was about with the forced updates, and that's what Win11 is about, as well, with TPM.

    They aren't doing it for you.
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  6. #46
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    I have no issue with the security hardware. I just don't want to replace old machines and I don't care for things like the x64 requirement which means more replacing of old machines.
    Really? Well, maybe I agree with you on that, I can't decide. In a way, I like getting new computers, but in other ways, not so much. My last desktop upgrade was based on the fact that I wanted an SSD drive, and that was great. I updated my surface because the cumulative benefits from the 2 to the 7 were substantial. They changed the device from usable, though marginal, to an awesome road-warrior machine...for those who want to carry one biking.

    More likely it's just landfill time for nearly every one of them if Windows 10 ever has the kill switch flipped on.
    Nah, if my experience counts for anything, they'll just end up in my spare room. Drop 'em off, I'll likely never notice.
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  7. #47
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    They don't give a darn about you(r)....

    I can relate to that, I don't give a damn about them also.
    .

  8. #48
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now


  9. #49
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I'm almost ashamed to admit but it was like stealing a church this one. We know Microsoft for soooo long...Ohh boy I hate it when that happens.
    .

  10. #50
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    I'm almost ashamed to admit but it was like stealing a church this one. We know Microsoft for soooo long...Ohh boy I hate it when that happens.
    Stealing a church??? The whole building, or just part of it? Is that easy, difficult, bad, or something else?
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I think if Microsoft can make WSA work it will have far more impact than warranted by the time and energy spent on WSL, which nobody (less than 0.01% of users) wants or needs. Will they pull it off? So far it's looking pretty grim but I think a leak forced their hand so they rushed it out to the "beta channel" to silence a few noisy voices.

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Be carefull also, Windows 10 & Windows 11 use Bitlocker automatically on computers that can support it.
    This morning I had a BSOD and I had to enter the bitlocker key for each disk.
    But I havent saved them
    So I spent 3h to find a way to retrieve them and repair my laptop.
    Finally all was Ok

    So save your bitlocker keys somewhere

    NB : It was after an upgrade of the driver NVidia. so I removed the NVidia Driver once I can access in recovery to Windows

  13. #53
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Egad, shopping web sites selling PC hardware are a mess. All that crazy humpty-jumpty crap that makes this site look sane.

    Try digging out specs, much less trying to figure out whether a given box and board will even support Windows 11.

    It seems to be all about selling you a box that uses as much power and spews as much heat as possible, along with 500 Watts in colored lights and case fans big enough to levitate the thing. But I guess they know that Gay Moors can be sold anything, the higher the price and markup the batter.

  14. #54
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    Stealing a church??? The whole building, or just part of it? Is that easy, difficult, bad, or something else?
    Lol.
    Another expression we have, meaning it is easy to steal because as an institute of the poor and rich, no one is guarding it.
    I guess that falls to the miscommunication bucket as well...
    .

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Probably should be translated as "robbing a church", not "stealing a church", I think.
    "Anyone can do any amount of work, provided it isn't the work he is supposed to be doing at that moment" Robert Benchley, 1930

  16. #56
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Maybe. I'm not native English speaker, so...
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I admit that I haven't been in a lot of churches, but there was a that bank robber who was asked why he robbed banks, and said, "that's where the money was." Well, he sure wasn't robbing churches, cause that's where the money was NOT.
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  18. #58

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I just upgraded...nothing is really jumping out at me other then the start menu change. On my personal laptop I'm a causal user. Not much more then email, web shopping, home documents, etc. It is at work where the applications I support are VB 6.0, VB .NET and Windows integrated that I'll get under the hood a little more. That is probably a least two years or so away based on past practice.
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Windows 11 is still raw and has a lot of bugs. I will update to it no earlier than 2022.

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Driplem View Post
    Windows 11 is still raw and has a lot of bugs. I will update to it no earlier than 2022.
    What are some of the bugs you are referring to...I'll check them out.
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  21. #61
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Well you can't check them out if it's on beta as they are unkonwn. That's the whole purpose, you should let us know of the bugs.
    .

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    Well you can't check them out if it's on beta as they are unkonwn. That's the whole purpose, you should let us know of the bugs.
    The just doesn't make any sense...the poster said "Windows 11 is still raw and has a lot of bugs. I will update to it no earlier than 2022". I asked what bugs the OP was referring to so I could check them out. Then you post this non sequitur.
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  23. #63
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I meant nothing by it, just that you can contribute to the windows community. Personally I don't care about w11 beta.
    .

  24. #64
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I'm not interested in being an early adopter of MS technology. It seems to be better to let it age a bit.

    However, I have always assumed that I wouldn't be adopting Win11. I expect that it will be pushed out to my Surface 7, might be pushed out to the Surface 2, and I'm not sure about my desktop.

    Is that not the case? Is this not going to be pushed automatically to computers that meet the requirements?

    I don't care whether it ends up on the Surface 2, since I only use that as a database server. I'd like it on the Surface 7, since the main user feature added in Win 11 seems to be focused on devices like that one. I'd take it on the desktop, but I have a sneaky suspicion that I'd have to do some minor research and work.

    When I built the desktop, there was an optional chip that plugged into a socket. I didn't know what I'd use it for, so I left it out. I think that may have been a TPM chip, though it was a couple years ago, so I may also be mistaken about that. If it WAS a TPM 2.0 chip, then I'd have to find it (I think I know where it is), open up the computer (it's a bit tedious to get to it, though not terribly difficult), and plug in the chip. Nothing much, I just haven't done so, yet, and didn't see any point until Win 11 was being pushed out.

    So, if Win 11 is NOT being pushed out to computers that meet the requirements, then I guess I'll have to do a bit more work, which I won't do just yet because I don't want to be an early adopter.
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    I'm not interested in being an early adopter of MS technology. It seems to be better to let it age a bit.

    However, I have always assumed that I wouldn't be adopting Win11. I expect that it will be pushed out to my Surface 7, might be pushed out to the Surface 2, and I'm not sure about my desktop.

    Is that not the case? Is this not going to be pushed automatically to computers that meet the requirements?

    I don't care whether it ends up on the Surface 2, since I only use that as a database server. I'd like it on the Surface 7, since the main user feature added in Win 11 seems to be focused on devices like that one. I'd take it on the desktop, but I have a sneaky suspicion that I'd have to do some minor research and work.

    When I built the desktop, there was an optional chip that plugged into a socket. I didn't know what I'd use it for, so I left it out. I think that may have been a TPM chip, though it was a couple years ago, so I may also be mistaken about that. If it WAS a TPM 2.0 chip, then I'd have to find it (I think I know where it is), open up the computer (it's a bit tedious to get to it, though not terribly difficult), and plug in the chip. Nothing much, I just haven't done so, yet, and didn't see any point until Win 11 was being pushed out.

    So, if Win 11 is NOT being pushed out to computers that meet the requirements, then I guess I'll have to do a bit more work, which I won't do just yet because I don't want to be an early adopter.
    I would agree except that on this laptop I do the very basics. Email, Word documents, the web. That's it really. I have a slower spare just in case...
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  26. #66
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Am I to assume with my limited English that you are suggesting that MS will intentionally hack your PC and install software of their own without your acceptance?
    Did I understand that correctly? If so, then I really hope so, I would love to see them go bankrupt from the lawsuits.
    .

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    Am I to assume with my limited English that you are suggesting that MS will intentionally hack your PC and install software of their own without your acceptance?
    Did I understand that correctly? If so, then I really hope so, I would love to see them go bankrupt from the lawsuits.
    Why would you love to see MS go bankrupt? What terrible things have they done.

  28. #68
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    and install software of their own without your acceptance?
    MS already do this on a regular basis. It's called updates. It just installs without any intervention. we just/have to/ trust what is being installed.
    All advice is offered in good faith only. You are ultimately responsible for the effects of your programs and the integrity of the machines they run on. Anything I post, code snippets, advice, etc is licensed as Public Domain https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/

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  29. #69
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Yeah, what 2kaud said: I assumed that Win11 would come out as an update, whether optional or mandatory. Nobody has yet said one way or another, but if it is still in beta, it may be that nobody on here knows, yet.
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    All I see under Windows Update right now is a big fist in the eye saying "No soup for you!"

  31. #71

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    Yeah, what 2kaud said: I assumed that Win11 would come out as an update, whether optional or mandatory. Nobody has yet said one way or another, but if it is still in beta, it may be that nobody on here knows, yet.
    I believe it is a phased roll out but I don't know the order. One week I checked for Windows updates and didn't have Win 11 available. Next time I checked it was available to me. On the same updates screen from settings you can check if your PC is compatible with it now.
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I installed win 11 the other night and it was a nightmare.

    When installation hit 94% it just stalled. I waited a bit and nothing.

    I googled "Win11 94%" and got a ton of hits, so this may be a common problem.
    I tried a few of the simple solutions but none worked.

    The one that worked was using a command prompt to stop the update services, going into windows and deleting the downloaded files, then starting the services and update process again.
    Took about 5 hours.

  33. #73

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by moke123 View Post
    I installed win 11 the other night and it was a nightmare.

    When installation hit 94% it just stalled. I waited a bit and nothing.

    I googled "Win11 94%" and got a ton of hits, so this may be a common problem.
    I tried a few of the simple solutions but none worked.

    The one that worked was using a command prompt to stop the update services, going into windows and deleting the downloaded files, then starting the services and update process again.
    Took about 5 hours.
    Did you see the part about making sure all the proper updates were installed first?
    Your Windows 10 version is nearly 18 months old and about to go out of support, click the link below, then click 'Update Now' on that page to download the Update Assistant, then run that to immediately get 20h2 and bring your PC right up to date
    https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...f-4c68e0618633

    I had to do that.
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  34. #74
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    if it is still in beta, it may be that nobody on here knows, yet.
    It's not in beta. There are Insider channels that get beta and dev builds but Windows 11 is RTM and in the throes of a phased release. You can download the Upgrade Assistant to force it, which I did, or you can just wait until your region and hardware combination is added to the list and it appears on its own.

  35. #75

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    This guy installed it on a fifteen year old PC:

    https://www.digitaltrends.com/comput...5-year-old-pc/
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  36. #76
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    You likely wouldn't have been able to do that ten years ago (installing something on a 15 year old computer, that is). It's something of a sign of the times. For most of computer history (which is really quite brief), a 15 year old computer would be so deficient that you might as well be trying to install on a rock. That pace of change appears to be slowing steadily. The difference between the most modern PC you can build, at the moment, and what was possible 15 years back just isn't all that great, and it's quite possible that in 15 years, the difference will be even less. We won't be seeing an ability to address more memory anytime soon (we can't physically install as much memory as a 64-bit OS can theoretically address, on any current desktop motherboard), we aren't seeing greater clock speeds, and so on. What we are mostly seeing is less power consumption, or more cores, neither of which is a game changer once you have gone above one core.

    Pretty soon, installing on a 15 year old computer might be no feat at all. It already might not be all that big a deal, considering that this guy has done so, but let's see him get it running on a 486. Now, THAT would be impressive.
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  37. #77
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Well, duh.
    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    My issue is why they are using that chip. They really care for our security? I mean come on. I would suspect and with all the fuss about it to be just a commercial gimmick for better or for worse that will probably be pulled aside or "patched" while MS is whistling in the corner.
    .

  38. #78
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Pretty soon, installing on a 15 year old computer might be no feat at all. It already might not be all that big a deal, considering that this guy has done so, but let's see him get it running on a 486. Now, THAT would be impressive.
    I think it's impressive that an electronic device is even working after 15yrs. What other electronic devices(or appliance) are you still using after 15yrs.

    I do have a frig that I bought used in 1997 that I'm still using.

  39. #79
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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    I have a SONY 21' tube TV that my uncle used to have and is probably err 25 years old or so. Still working fine, a little discoloration but nothing serious. Heavily used at my vacation house.
    Yes SONY DID at one point in time made devices that lasted.
    Last edited by sapator; Nov 2nd, 2021 at 11:58 AM.
    .

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    Re: Windows 11 is available to some now

    Quote Originally Posted by wes4dbt View Post
    I think it's impressive that an electronic device is even working after 15yrs. What other electronic devices(or appliance) are you still using after 15yrs.

    I do have a frig that I bought used in 1997 that I'm still using.
    I have an old VCR that worked last time I tried. It has to be over fifteen years old.
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