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Thread: [RESOLVED] Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

  1. #2361
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    About the origin of Covid, it is every time clearer that it originated in a lab in Wuhan:
    https://nicholaswade.medium.com/orig...es-6f03564c038

  2. #2362
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    And scientists (with power) today are no more scientists, but politicians or employees of laboratories. What they tell is not based on science but in other interests.

    The one that do not follow the rules (and directions) is simple: is fired.

  3. #2363
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    It is proven that Ivermectin is useful on preventing Covid and also in alleviating the disease, but in main media and government agencies it is discarded and "not recomended".
    It is because it is too cheap (laboratories don't make money).
    There were already many studies by true independent scientists which proved its effectiveness.

  4. #2364
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I'm still puzzled by the Greek parrot infatuation with earphones.

    Is that a meme there or something?

  5. #2365
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    No the person has covid and is parrotin....OK you didn't get it.
    There are many drugs that are useful against covid but people seem to prefer getting vaccinated than druggated but, let's not go into circles again. Vaccine good fire bad, err,
    .

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I always assumed it would be the cats that got us.

    Viruses jumping across species is nothing new. It happens all the time and isn't something to panic about. Deadly viruses jumping across species... that's more worrying. Thankfully this doesn't look like that.
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  7. #2367
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    WHAT'S THE CARROT GOING TO BE?

    "Our freedoms are intentionally denied to us precisely to force us to accept vaccination as the only way out.
    This is Leana Wen, professor of health policy at George Washington University, writes in the Washington Post and appears frequently as a commentator on CNN MSNBC and BBC.
    She was also honored by the World Economic Forum's Young Global Leaders. And in 2019, she was named as one of TIME Magazine's 100 Most Influential People.
    Listen to what she said in a recent CNN interview.
    She was talking about the fact that many U.S. states like Florida and Texas are already reopening to 100% and therefore the number of vaccinated is declining rapidly. That is, in some American states they are realizing that you can go back to living comfortably without vaccinations.
    And that, obviously put her on edge.
    Listen carefully:"

    https://fb.watch/5Fjoq_j3nU/
    https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2846696018944081

    01:07:30
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1KsDNQWrgU&t=4050s

    TRANSCRIPT:
    -But I think that there are many more people, millions of people who, for whatever reason, have concerns about the vaccine, who just don't know what's in it for them. And we need to make it clear to them that the vaccine is the ticket back to pre-Pandemic life. And the window to do that is really narrowing.
    I mean, you were mentioning, Chris, about how all these states are reopening. They are reopening at a 100 percent. And we have a very narrow window to tie reopening policy to vaccination status. Because otherwise, if everything is reopened, then what's the carrot going to be? How are we going to incentivize people to actually get the vaccine?
    So that's why I think the CDC and the Biden Administration needs to come out a lot bolder and say, "If you're vaccinated, you can do all these things. Here are all these freedoms that you have," because otherwise, people are going to go out and enjoy these freedoms anyway. -


    "You get the picture:
    If you reopen everything, how are we going to incentivize people to get vaccinated? What will be the carrot we could give them if they take back all their freedoms?"

  8. #2368
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Yeah, and if you don't understand the context, that would be alarming. If you DO understand the context, then it's meaningless.

    There are drugs that can treat sick people. Those drugs ALL have side effects, several which are potentially pretty bad. None of those drugs 'cure' a virus. They go after the bodies reactions to the virus, and those reactions can be deadly in themselves, but they don't cure a virus. What this means is that they will work better for some people than for others, and for some people they will be worse than the disease itself. Meanwhile, a vaccine shows your body what to attack, and then your body takes care of the virus before the infection gets a hold. So, you're favoring drugs with significant side effects and limited effect over just training your body to fight off the virus, the same as it would do without either drugs or vaccines (unless it failed and you died). That seems crazy, to me. However, that's also the path that India decided to follow. How's that working out?

    That's also what that quote is about. If people are immune to the virus, then of course it doesn't matter. It will be just one of the millions of viruses our bodies swat aside each and every day. The vaccine can convey immunity, as can being infected and recovering (as long as you do recover). If enough of the population is immune, then the virus will fade out. At that point, if you are not vaccinated, and those around you are, you're still safe. It's the same safety that Apple users claimed. It wasn't that viruses couldn't attack Apple computers, it's just that nobody bothered writing such viruses because Apple users were too rare to spread it around. Similarly, if everyone around you is immune, then there is nobody to give you the disease, so it doesn't matter whether you are immune or not. However, immunity comes from infection or vaccination, and by no other means. So, if you open everything back up before enough people have immunity, then you...becomes India.

    That's the point behind the vaccination: If enough people are immune, then the virus won't spread, even to those who are not immune. If things open up before that level of immunity is achieved, well, we're seeing how that works out, even in a population FAR younger than states like Florida (where the average age is up around the average daily temperature in Fahrenheit). Immunity comes from infection or vaccination, so you can push vaccination or you can push death.
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  9. #2369
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Next time some idiot nearly crashes into you blowing through his stop sign or red light just remember that feeling.

    I think a very good case can be made for locking anyone refusing vaccines into their homes or maybe FEMA camps, but enforcement isn't practical.

    We let idiots drive cars for the same reason. Some are so aware of how dangerous they are that they insist on driving heavy jacked up SUVs and pickup trucks hoping that will save them when they inevitably crash into others.

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    There are drugs that can treat sick people. Those drugs ALL have side effects, several which are potentially pretty bad. None of those drugs 'cure' a virus. They go after the bodies reactions to the virus, and those reactions can be deadly in themselves, but they don't cure a virus. What this means is that they will work better for some people than for others, and for some people they will be worse than the disease itself.
    Ivermectin has no side effects. It is no dangerous at all.
    OK, there might be special cases (very special), the same happen with vaccines.
    And it doesn't go after the reactions caused by the virus, instead it has antiviral effects, reducing the amount of viruses that multiply in the body in the early stage of the disease.
    It must be applied soon, immediately.
    Some people also use it as prevention.
    The problem, as I said, is that it is too cheap.

    This an study, but there are many.

    It does not replace the vaccines, it is something else that can save lives. Of course, labs don't care about saving lives, they only care about themselves.
    And the payed press and media publish what they are being payed to publish.
    But some people decide to believe everything that TV says, that's a choice.

  11. #2371
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I've seen a number of videos on Ivermectin, many of them positive:


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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    I've seen a number of videos on Ivermectin, many of them positive:

    Very good!

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    My only doubt is if is all about money only or there is an even more sinister plan behind.

    In the case it is about money, they are mass murdering people doing so anyway, so it is also sinister.

    Don't believe that those people can be so evil? I do.
    I do because of the evidence. It is hard to believe (that those people can be so bad), but I think it is clear already.

    I don't believe in conspiracy theories, but this seems real to me.
    Last edited by Eduardo-; May 23rd, 2021 at 07:23 PM.

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo- View Post
    Ivermectin has no side effects. It is no dangerous at all.
    EVERYTHING has side effects. Water can kill you if you drink too much. Toxicologists say that it's always just a matter of dosage. In the case of Ivermectin, here are some side effects listed by the US FDA:

    Some of the side-effects that may be associated with ivermectin include skin rash, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach pain, facial or limb swelling, neurologic adverse events (dizziness, seizures, confusion), sudden drop in blood pressure, severe skin rash potentially requiring hospitalization and liver injury (hepatitis).

    But some people decide to believe everything that TV says, that's a choice.
    If you're talking about me, keep in mind that I have never owned a TV. That's a choice, too.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo- View Post
    My only doubt is if is all about money only or there is an even more sinister plan behind.

    In the case it is about money, they are mass murdering people doing so anyway, so it is also sinister.

    Don't believe that those people can be so evil? I do.
    I do because of the evidence. It is hard to believe (that those people can be so bad), but I think it is clear already.

    I don't believe in conspiracy theories, but this seems real to me.
    You believe in conspiracy theories. This entire post can be summed up as: I believe there is a conspiracy to kill people for profit.

    So, why say you don't believe in conspiracy theories when you are flat out stating a conspiracy theory that you believe in.

    Ivermectin is used for parasites, which means it works against eukaryotes. WE are eukaryotes. Antibiotics go after the differences between prokaryotes and eukaryotes, so they can kill bacteria without affecting us. Anything that goes after eukaryotes is about ingesting a poison in sufficient quantities to harm the eukaryotes you don't want without ingesting a quantity sufficient to harm you. What is that dose?
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    EVERYTHING has side effects. Water can kill you if you drink too much. Toxicologists say that it's always just a matter of dosage. In the case of Ivermectin, here are some side effects listed by the US FDA:
    As I said: there is no problematic side effects.
    If you drink 20 liters water you'll have problem, and if you eat 100 kg. of Ivermectin, too, obviously.
    These things there is not need to be cleared between mature people.

  19. #2379
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    You believe in conspiracy theories. This entire post can be summed up as: I believe there is a conspiracy to kill people for profit.

    So, why say you don't believe in conspiracy theories when you are flat out stating a conspiracy theory that you believe in.

    Ivermectin is used for parasites, which means it works against eukaryotes. WE are eukaryotes. Antibiotics go after the differences between prokaryotes and eukaryotes, so they can kill bacteria without affecting us. Anything that goes after eukaryotes is about ingesting a poison in sufficient quantities to harm the eukaryotes you don't want without ingesting a quantity sufficient to harm you. What is that dose?
    Believe what you feel comfortable, TV or whatever.
    1984...

  20. #2380
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    What is the point of Ivermectin, anyways? You don't want to deal with two shots (which are free in the US, but may not be elsewhere), but would rather take a pill for several days, and possibly for months, depending on the study?

    What's the rationale here? Do you prefer pills for days over two shots? Are you thinking that one is free and the other is not? Are you thinking there are more side effects to one over the other? If COVID is real, which you seem to recognize because you talk about alternate treatments, and you are accepting of treatments, why is this one acceptable and a vaccine is not?
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  21. #2381
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    What is the point of Ivermectin, anyways? You don't want to deal with two shots (which are free in the US, but may not be elsewhere), but would rather take a pill for several days, and possibly for months, depending on the study?

    What's the rationale here? Do you prefer pills for days over two shots? Are you thinking that one is free and the other is not? Are you thinking there are more side effects to one over the other? If COVID is real, which you seem to recognize because you talk about alternate treatments, and you are accepting of treatments, why is this one acceptable and a vaccine is not?
    I'm not saying to anyone not to take the vaccine.
    I didn't talk about that. I have my personal thoughts but since I'm not sure about anything regarding the vaccine, I don't want to say anything.

    It is that there is something that can help to treat the disease, and it is proven that helps, and these people says that "it is not recommended" and "there is no scientific proof that it helps" and things like that.
    The clinic evidence (tests) also shows that it is useful if used as prevention (at least for not having a severe case), and considering that the vaccine is not available in all the world in the same way, it could be useful for the people that can't get the vaccine right now.
    Also, this knowledge was already available like a year ago, when there were no vaccine at all.
    Why to deny it? Somebody can explain? (it is rhetoric)

    When I said that I don't believe in conspiracy theories, I meant that I do not believe these kind of things usually, but I made my research in the subject of Ivermectin and I see that there are strange things regarding the issue.
    Too many, too many doctors that conducted tests and attest the results.

    Nobody have to believe me, I presented the evidence (or some).
    I think that I am talking with intelligent people that can make their own judgment and conclusions.

  22. #2382
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    And it is not that I'm saying go Shaggy and take Ivermectin, I never took it myself BTW, they are comments in Chit-Chat about things that I see that are happening in the world.

  23. #2383
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    When I said that I don't believe in conspiracy theories, I meant that I do not believe these kind of things usually
    For someone who doesn't believe in conspiracy theories, you sure say a lot of conspiracy theory stuff !!

    It is proven that Ivermectin is useful on preventing Covid and also in alleviating the disease
    So I have heard this a few times, and its just isn't true.

    Ivermectin is not proven at all to prevent Covid, even the doctors (mainly in South Africa) who support the use of Ivermectin do not say it is a prevention, but that they claim it is highly effective in treating people who have Covid and prevents serious disease. That is there claim.

    I looked into this is my Girlfriend shared number of articles and videos about it with me, and if you read into it more deeply Ivermectin is being used in places like South Africa and I think more recently India to treat people in hospital with Covid.

    Some doctors have conducted meta analysis of various smaller studies around the world and they say that the result of the meta analysis show that Ivermectin has significant positive results in preventing severe disease in Covid patients.

    Some doctors also claim that they have empirical evidence of it working with there patients.

    They say this analysis should be enough for regulators to approve Ivermectin for use for Covid patients so that there Countries medical system will bare the cost and Doctors can prescribe it to all Patients.

    The Regulators in various countries around the world argue that the meta analysis is flawed as it includes trials where they are giving Patients multiple drugs where it is difficult to tell which drug actually caused the effect on the patient and also trials which were not conducted to proper clinical standards.

    There seems to be quite a bit of disagreement in the medical establishment as to whether Ivermectin is effective or not and its critics argue that like any drug including the vaccines it would need to undergo proper large scale trials and prove its effectiveness that way in order for regulators to approve it.

    I have no personal feelings as to whether Ivermectin should be used or not, but i have strong feelings that it should have to go through the same process as any other drug that wants to be approves by the medical regulator.

    The Vaccines which you disparage have had to go through the large scale clinic trial process, Ivermectin has not.
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  24. #2384
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Hard for me to understand these people that argue for using a drug that treats a disease instead of a drug that prevents a disease. They work so hard at trying discredit the vaccine and there are plenty of people with a laptop and video camera posting unfounded theories. Now they're pounding their chest over Ivermectin. I guess it would make them happier if the pharmaceutical company made money on that drug instead of the vaccine.

    Most of the time the conspiracy spreaders don't bother me, in fact it's fun to listen to. But this is life and death for some people, there isn't anything interesting or funny about that.

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by NeedSomeAnswers View Post
    For someone who doesn't believe in conspiracy theories, you sure say a lot of conspiracy theory stuff !!
    I don't believe in those conspiracy theories like that the man didn't go to the moon, that there are UFOs found with alien technology that the government tries to hide, or that the vaccine is intended to create infertility to lower the world population and if financed by Bill gates.

    But it is quite clear to me that there were and there are some conspiracies.
    For example, all the leftists and the status quo of politicians along with main mass media and social media joined to make Trump to loose the election.
    That's one I wouldn't say "I believe", because I don't need to believe, I saw it.

    About this one, that the labs are discrediting medicines that they are not selling, is another one that it seems to me quite clear already.

    You can mock if you want, as I said: believe mass media and everything what governments and WHO says, if you want.
    I don't disbelieve everything that they say but try to investigate on my own.
    And my conclusion already is that they can't be trusted.

    Quote Originally Posted by NeedSomeAnswers View Post
    So I have heard this a few times, and its just isn't true.
    Lets see.

    Quote Originally Posted by NeedSomeAnswers View Post
    Ivermectin is not proven at all to prevent Covid, even the doctors (mainly in South Africa) who support the use of Ivermectin do not say it is a prevention, but that they claim it is highly effective in treating people who have Covid and prevents serious disease. That is there claim.
    It is not only South Africa, there are like 100 countries already (a random number, an estimation).

    Quote Originally Posted by NeedSomeAnswers View Post
    I looked into this is my Girlfriend shared number of articles and videos about it with me, and if you read into it more deeply Ivermectin is being used in places like South Africa and I think more recently India to treat people in hospital with Covid.

    Some doctors have conducted meta analysis of various smaller studies around the world and they say that the result of the meta analysis show that Ivermectin has significant positive results in preventing severe disease in Covid patients.

    Some doctors also claim that they have empirical evidence of it working with there patients.

    They say this analysis should be enough for regulators to approve Ivermectin for use for Covid patients so that there Countries medical system will bare the cost and Doctors can prescribe it to all Patients.

    The Regulators in various countries around the world argue that the meta analysis is flawed as it includes trials where they are giving Patients multiple drugs where it is difficult to tell which drug actually caused the effect on the patient and also trials which were not conducted to proper clinical standards.

    There seems to be quite a bit of disagreement in the medical establishment as to whether Ivermectin is effective or not and its critics argue that like any drug including the vaccines it would need to undergo proper large scale trials and prove its effectiveness that way in order for regulators to approve it.

    I have no personal feelings as to whether Ivermectin should be used or not, but i have strong feelings that it should have to go through the same process as any other drug that wants to be approves by the medical regulator.
    Now you you are saying that it works.

    About that the studies don't meet the standards, these are excuses, false claims. And there are hundreds of studies already all around the world.
    None of them meet the standards? Give me a break.

    How can it be, that with almost an year and a half of this pandemic, all 2020 with every lab and every country trying to find a cure or something that helps to mitigate this, with many, many studies on Ivermectin that are showing that it works, no one institution that they believe can conduct a study that "meet the standards" was conducted, to say a definitive word regarding whether it works or not???
    Unbelievable.

    Well, yes believable (at least for me), they won't a solution for the pandemic that they cannot make money.
    If course, that makes no sense to people that believe only in mass media, because politicians are all good, WHO has the most honest and qualified people and scientists in the world, and the labs want to save people lives and money is unimportant or a secondary goal for them.
    Ahh, and journalists never sell an article, but they are all honest and tell you always the truth and nothing but the truth.
    (About journalists , many must believe also things like Trump is a bad guy and things like that, because they don't escape the mass media bombing either)

    Quote Originally Posted by NeedSomeAnswers View Post
    The Vaccines which you disparage have had to go through the large scale clinic trial process, Ivermectin has not.
    I said nothing about vaccines, intentional lie or what?

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by wes4dbt View Post
    Hard for me to understand these people that argue for using a drug that treats a disease instead of a drug that prevents a disease. They work so hard at trying discredit the vaccine and there are plenty of people with a laptop and video camera posting unfounded theories. Now they're pounding their chest over Ivermectin. I guess it would make them happier if the pharmaceutical company made money on that drug instead of the vaccine.

    Most of the time the conspiracy spreaders don't bother me, in fact it's fun to listen to. But this is life and death for some people, there isn't anything interesting or funny about that.
    Are you lying intentionally or just didn't read what I wrote (too)?

  27. #2387
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Are you lying intentionally or just didn't read what I wrote (too)?
    What did I lie about.

  28. #2388
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Ivermectin may well help. It is not allowed in the US, because it would take a special exemption under FDA rules for it to be approved for something as off purpose as this. That could happen, and further study of the anti-viral action of the drug seems like a REALLY good idea. After all, we don't have any good anti-virals, so if one was found, that would be impressive. Anything that shows promise should be studied further in this regard. It is telling that the company that developed the drug (Merck) said that it won't work for this, but there are studies that suggest that it might, so that should be studied.

    Having said that, regardless of whether or not those studies are correct, Ivermectin is worse than vaccines in EVERY POSSIBLE WAY. If you don't believe that, think it through: You have two alternative, the first is to use if for prophylaxis (preventing the disease ahead of time) the second is to use it for treatment (moderating symptoms after the disease has been diagnosed). For both paths, you have to determine what the treatment regimen would look like. That isn't clear for prophylaxis, so say it is one pill per week. For the second, it looks like a course of pills for five days with perhaps a couple follow up pills over the next month.

    If you want to stop the disease using prophylaxis, that would mean that the vast majority of people in the world would have to be taking the prophylaxis at the same time. If they don't take it at the same time, then the disease would be in one place, then another, then another, and so on, always chasing those populations not taking the prophylaxis. That would mean that you'd have to manufacture and distribute several billion doses per week, which is FAR harder than what is currently being done with vaccines. It's probably off patent, so all kinds of people would be getting a piece of THAT action, good and bad. It might be the largest drug manufacturing operation in history, so it has all the negatives of the vaccines, doesn't confer immunity (once you stop taking it, you're just as vulnerable as you were before), and it has more side effects. Even rare side effects are not so rare when you scale out to billions of people.

    So, prophylaxis is probably beyond our reach. The alternative is to use it as treatment. You need a lot more for each person, but there would be FAR fewer people. Tens of millions of doses a month would probably do, which is entirely within reach. An outbreak like India would strain the system to the breaking point, and you still aren't conveying immunity, but India is a rare case. However, with COVID, it is well established that you are infectious for days before symptoms appear, so treating the symptoms wouldn't solve a thing, as the damage could be done before you ever knew to treat. Once again, the side effects will appear with that many people taking higher doses of the drug, and while the studies do suggest that death and serious consequences are reduced, they are not reduced as far as the better vaccines, so you'd still be saying that people would die, just not as many.

    Basically, as long as you are using it because you don't have anything better, it's hard to argue against doing that, but Ivermectin is a worse solution than the better vaccines in every way: It imposes a greater burden on users (they have to take more, and for longer), it has worse side effects, it doesn't result in you body being any better at dealing with COVID, and the logistical and financial cost of treating the world would be considerably higher than it is for vaccines.

    There's just no good reason to do that, unless you have no alternative.
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  29. #2389
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by wes4dbt View Post
    What did I lie about.
    If you were talking about me, everything.

  30. #2390
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I think antivirals work as an alternative to buy time until vaccine supplies can be secured and distributed into the hinterlands. Aside from that there seems like there is little worth saying.

    One problem we're seeing in the US is that besides the people cowering away from vaccination there are about 8% who got their first dose but then never came back for the second booster dose. You'd expect some of that through incompetence, but 8%? For those with a bad case of innumeracy, that's approaching 1 in 10 people.

    Remember to drive defensively, they'll let anyone drive.

  31. #2391
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo- View Post
    If you were talking about me, everything.
    So,

    Your saying this is a lie, that I really do understand
    Hard for me to understand these people that argue for using a drug that treats a disease instead of a drug that prevents a disease.
    Your saying this is a lie, that there are no people trying to discredit the vaccine.
    They work so hard at trying discredit the vaccine and there are plenty of people with a laptop and video camera posting unfounded theories. Now they're pounding their chest over Ivermectin.
    Your saying this is a lie, that there are no people doing this
    Now they're pounding their chest over Ivermectin.
    This is just an opinion, maybe I'm wrong but it's not a lie.
    I guess it would make them happier if the pharmaceutical company made money on that drug instead of the vaccine.

    You think I'm lying about how I feel?
    Most of the time the conspiracy spreaders don't bother me, in fact it's fun to listen to. But this is life and death for some people, there isn't anything interesting or funny about that.
    You give me too much credit for my lying abilities. lol

  32. #2392
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Repeating lies does not make them true.

  33. #2393
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    BuT vOtEr FrAuD!!!!

    -tg
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  34. #2394
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I think Eduardo's explanation what misinterpreted in the first place (of course he can correct me). The chosen word "conspiracy" was a little hard to digest.
    I believe what was meant to be said was "chance" not conspiracy. Pharmaceuticals found a chance to make more money.
    For the sake of conversation, let's say that vaccines is the cure, well, the pharmaceuticals were giving it to the highest bidder(at least in Europe), also other vaccines were left out initially and proclaimed "forbidden" in EU, like the Russian and Chinese, until EU members broke the barrier.

    So even if vaccination would have saved us, pharmas were running in circles delaying the doses or shelling to the highest bidder,note that we prepaid them for the vaccines -aka government idiots and we were not having the promised doses that THEY got the money for. Eventually the doses were balanced but most of us don't want them and pharmaceuticals were , as I've said, prepaid, so shipping or not shipping doses, they don't care , they got the mulla.


    Now, let's correct Shaggy since using hi tech Greek words need love and tender...

    Prophylaxis is singular, so it denotes a precaution , so it's like saying "taking precaution" for many people.
    "The vast majority of people in the world would have to be taking precaution - prophylaxis"
    That does not add up, you need plural aka "precautions" thus prophylaxes.

    (I hope I won't get bullied for my English writing now )
    Last edited by sapator; May 24th, 2021 at 06:34 PM.
    .

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by dilettante View Post
    I think antivirals work as an alternative to buy time until vaccine supplies can be secured and distributed into the hinterlands. Aside from that there seems like there is little worth saying.

    One problem we're seeing in the US is that besides the people cowering away from vaccination there are about 8% who got their first dose but then never came back for the second booster dose. You'd expect some of that through incompetence, but 8%? For those with a bad case of innumeracy, that's approaching 1 in 10 people.

    Remember to drive defensively, they'll let anyone drive.
    Yeah, I really do believe 8%. Of course, some portion of that will be due to circumstances arising such that they couldn't come back for the second, but an incompetence rate of 5% wouldn't surprise me. I was a census taker back in 1990. The test you had to pass to get that job was pathetic. I remember having some city grid (though in NH, we barely had cities, let alone grids) with an A and a B on it. You had to do something like draw a line from A to B. I was told that a fantastic percentage of applicants failed that test. I also got assigned to clean up the mess some other guy had made. He had several houses located in what proved to be a swamp, houses on the wrong side of towns, and plenty of other things. People were sure mad at me, as I could end up being the third or fourth person showing up to talk to them as I tried to sort out the mess.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  36. #2396
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    Now, let's correct Shaggy since using hi tech Greek words need love and tender...

    Prophylaxis is singular, so it denotes a precaution , so it's like saying "taking precaution" for many people.
    "The vast majority of people in the world would have to be taking precaution - prophylaxis"
    That does not add up, you need plural aka "precautions" thus prophylaxes.

    (I hope I won't get bullied for my English writing now )
    Nah, teased maybe, but not bullied. Heck, I'd rep you for that, except that this is Chit Chat, so...no rep for you.
    My usual boring signature: Nothing

  37. #2397
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    I think Eduardo's explanation what misinterpreted in the first place (of course he can correct me). The chosen word "conspiracy" was a little hard to digest.
    I believe what was meant to be said was "chance" not conspiracy. Pharmaceuticals found a chance to make more money.
    What I had said in the first place is that I don't believe in conspiracy theories.
    Then I was accused of otherwise.
    Since I don't know exactly when something should be labeled as a conspiracy and when it shouldn't, I added as an explanation that I don't believe (or pay attention) to conspiracy theories "usually".
    A conspiracy (or something like that) can be true, or not?

    Conspiracy or not (and I'll repeat for th time) it is what I see that is happening: labs trying to discredit a medicine because they don't profit from it.
    OK, that the reason is because that they don't profit from it is an inference, very valid and logic to me, but that they are discrediting a medicine that has proven successful against the disease there is no doubt.

    In the meantime died millions of people that could had been saved.
    (contrary to what someone here accused me -that with these ideas people die-, totally opposite)

    I just want to clarify (for anyone honest that is reading), that I "personally" don't advocate to use it as prevention, but as early treatment after a covid infection. But if someone want to take it as prevention until she/he get the change to be vaccinated I see no wrong and I think is valid and rational (and also proven effective).

    I'm not saying "take that instead of the vaccine" as some liars here implied.
    Nevertheless it is a free world, and nobody should be in position of forcing other people to take something that they don't want (I mean for the ones that don't trust on the vaccine).
    To think otherwise is fascist (for more reason that you think you have).

    I remember Jehovah Witness that they refuse to have blood transfusions because they believe it is a sin. And in some cases they are forced to receive a transfusion. I don't agree wit that either, even if someone dies for their decisions and belief, they should be free to decide (as long as they are mentally competent persons).

  38. #2398
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo- View Post
    Repeating lies does not make them true.
    Well that clears things up. lol

  39. #2399
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    ...
    But you are right sapator, "conspiracy" is too strong, because that involves many people according something.
    It is just that labs are doing their business (in a very unmoral way) and other people are payed to spread what they say.
    And WHO moves following political interests of their bosses (China, whatever), not for people interests.

    So it stands what I said at first: I don't believe in conspiracy theories.
    It doesn't qualify as a conspiracy.

    You are one that has read paying attention.

  40. #2400
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    A "conspiracy" if you like, is how or why the covid escaped the Chinese labs, something that is questionable but I don't have a solid answer. Biological weapons or not, I can't be sure.
    .

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