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Thread: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

  1. #5121
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    not sure about the Cabal.
    I don't take it for "truth", but just a watch, to stimulate my brain with some information that I can not be sure its correct.
    yes. I watched the entire first season, and a couple of the second.

    right now Im more interested in hard evidence.
    the "cabal=illuminati" I wait for later, if needed.

    I mean, if you say "illuminati" it will directly discredit everything you say from the 30%.
    no matter what you say. it will dissolve into a big conspiracy. so I avoid anything like that.

    better to stick with what we know and can be explained with real data. and thats also interesting, as we understand more and more about the pandemic.

  2. #5122
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    @Eduardo

    Wow....I had no idea. I thought this whole pandemic was just a bunch of fearmongering mixed in with some genuine ignorance. I had no idea something this insidious was going on right beneath our noses and that credible people were sounding the alarm all along.
    They did a good work discrediting all as "conspiracy theories". They mocked about people talking on this things.

    Perhaps there is nothing more powerful than using embarrassment.
    People avoid getting attached to that at all costs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    I had never heard of Ivermectin until I read your post just an hour ago and I asked the missus if she heard of it since she is generally more "plugged in" to what's going on than I am and she shocked me by telling me she knew about it since the beginning of the pandemic and that "they"(I'm guessing she meant the authorities) didn't want us taking it. This is some deep **** man!
    I think it depended on country to country. Here the information circulated a bit more (mid 2020), mainly in Whatssap and at first in some mainstream media. Then they discredited everything and stopped talking about it.

    The doctors are divided, but most buy the official narrative.

    You have also to take into account that they are afraid, and for many reasons.
    These one doctors talking in the US senate are exceptions, they are truly heroes.

  3. #5123
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by baka View Post
    not sure about the Cabal.
    I don't take it for "truth", but just a watch, to stimulate my brain with some information that I can not be sure its correct.
    yes. I watched the entire first season, and a couple of the second.

    right now Im more interested in hard evidence.
    the "cabal=illuminati" I wait for later, if needed.

    I mean, if you say "illuminati" it will directly discredit everything you say from the 30%.
    no matter what you say. it will dissolve into a big conspiracy. so I avoid anything like that.

    better to stick with what we know and can be explained with real data. and thats also interesting, as we understand more and more about the pandemic.
    Yes, it is also my position.
    And that's why I didn't watch it some months ago when I first found it.
    But these "crazy" people, may be are not too crazy after all, at least not in everything they say.

    Some people started saying that it was a plan almost from the start, and I dismissed their claims, I "bought the mock".

    In some way I somewhat "admire" how they realized about it just from the very beginning.

    That's why I would like to give a shot to that "Fall of the Cabal" to see what they say.
    Of course taking it with a pinch of salt.

    Maybe it is all nonsense.

  4. #5124
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo- View Post
    They did a good work discrediting all as "conspiracy theories". They mocked about people talking on this things.

    Perhaps there is nothing more powerful than using embarrassment.
    People avoid getting attached to that at all costs.



    I think it depended on country to country. Here the information circulated a bit more (mid 2020), mainly in Whatssap and at first in some mainstream media. Then they discredited everything and stopped talking about it.

    The doctors are divided, but most buy the official narrative.

    You have also to take into account that they are afraid, and for many reasons.
    These one doctors talking in the US senate are exceptions, they are truly heroes.
    I've mention those people 2 years ago. I was mocked here. In general a lot of covid like lately posts here, I've mentioned.
    The issue here is that going on rampage posting like you guys are doing , would even discourage me to read it.
    I won't tell you what to do but I would have calmed down on the rampage.
    Anyhow a chit chat post on a vb forum is not likely to wake people up (assuming you are correct).
    If you want a campaign, I would have gone to other more relative forums.
    As I've found out day to day stubbornness is a bliss so as you can see I stopped posting covid news and gone more on the comedy part career (without success I guess. dil has all the marbles )
    Actually there is not much covid like to post really. It's over months ago, we just keeping it alive to sell vaccines.
    Last edited by sapator; Jan 25th, 2022 at 08:49 PM. Reason: I mod told me to wear a mask when posting.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    If what this guy is saying is true, then what the powers are doing by suppressing this information is downright evil. Just straight evil.
    Right, but first you have to get past that little 'if' bit. After all, if what he says is false, then what?

    Consider the company you keep.
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  6. #5126
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I finally understood the rule of vaccination that is "Never perform a vaccination campaign during a pandemic".

    In recently vaccinated people that get infected, in the stage while the antibodies are still not fully developed, the mutations of the virus that always occur due of error in replication, can led to new variants more probably because the ones that survive are the ones that can avoid the action of the antibodies, that are still weak at that stage and that's why the virus is not entirely suppressed.

    They skipped that rule, and every rule.

    That's what criminal do: not take into account any rule, law, moral, common sense or anything.

    I have experience is seeing how criminals in power behave, because the governors of my country are currently criminals. And that's what the do: not to follow any rule, law or anything.
    Then, that behavior is very familiar to my understanding.

    And why most people accepted something like this? Because they were scared.

    And because even if they knew these were "experimental vaccines", they came "from science".
    And Science is now a god, a god of these times. You can blindly trust in science. Whatever that comes from science is good.

    True science is quite secure, yes, and had been beneficial for humanity. But the fact is that it is not science now. It only has the label of science.

    If you eat a jar that has a label of "Marmalade" but has something rotten inside, you'll have a stomach problem. Having a label does not guarantee anything.
    And clearly not when it comes from criminals.

    If you dress someone with a white coat, he will look like a doctor. It does not mean he is one.
    People trust too much in what are presented to them. That's why con are successful.

    They scared everybody and then they came with a solution, the vaccines. People said: of course, rules don't matter, give it to me.

    The Covid virus was a real threat, but they amplified it like 10 times.
    And banned any possible any alternative, as we are seeing (Ivermectin, etc).

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  8. #5128
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    I've mention those people 2 years ago. I was mocked here. In general a lot of covid like lately posts here, I've mentioned.
    The issue here is that going on rampage posting like you guys are doing , would even discourage me to read it.
    I won't tell you what to do but I would have calmed down on the rampage.
    Anyhow a chit chat post on a vb forum is not likely to wake people up (assuming you are correct).
    If you want a campaign, I would have gone to other more relative forums.
    As I've found out day to day stubbornness is a bliss so as you can see I stopped posting covid news and gone more on the comedy part career (without success I guess. dil has all the marbles )
    Actually there is not much covid like to post really. It's over months ago, we just keeping it alive to sell vaccines.
    Good luck with the comedy.
    I'm still interested in discovering and understanding more about this plan.

    And congratulations if you were right from the start.
    I'm not so fast. I go slow but secure.

  9. #5129
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Thanks.
    I wasn't attacking anyone btw, if that was passed out.
    I'm just saying, there's just bitterness and pain to be found in this forum (hah,hah, good one?)
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  10. #5130
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    Thanks.
    I wasn't attacking anyone btw, if that was passed out.
    I'm just saying, there's just bitterness and pain to be found in this forum (hah,hah, good one?)
    In all the world there is bitterness and pain.

    And one key is to have humor, so you are right about the comedy.

    We are sometimes over excited with our discoveries maybe.

  11. #5131
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    Right, but first you have to get past that little 'if' bit. After all, if what he says is false, then what?

    Consider the company you keep.
    You're absolutely right. It could all be hocus pocus. Maybe the mainstream is acting in the best interest of the people. Maybe these alternative treatments are nothing more than snake oil. However, I'd call upon an age old idiom and ask you, what does your gut tell you? Are you really willing to dismiss this and just follow the mainstream? It is certainly easier and painless. Nothing good ever comes easy and I think this is part of the problem. Thinking for one's self and being critical of everything you see and hear is certainly harder than just accepting the most popular claims as true.

    Mark my words. One of these days you're going to wake up to a version of America that punishes it's citizens for not identifying someone by their prefered made up pronouns. You're going to wonder how it happened. I say to you now it's because no one wants to think critically. They want others to do it for them. Remember, you heard it here first.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Hmm, guess that this study (scientists in Israel published) was right in,
    that "natural immunity works a whole lot better"
    It certainly shows that Omicrom is very non-lethal but I don't think anyone in the scientific community is debating that. There was some caution early on (perhaps overly so but hind sight is 20/20) but it's been widely acknowledged as non lethal for weeks. It doesn't show that natural immunity is preferential to vaccinated immunity though. For that you'd need data that separated by those cohorts.

    In an as-yet unpublished paper, Stephanie Seneff, Ph.D., describes a mechanism of the COVID shots that results in the suppression of your innate immune system. It does this by inhibiting the type-1 interferon pathway
    Dr Stephanie Seneff Fact Checked. Also note that she's not a medical doctor. She's earned her PHD in Computer Science and works in AI. She has precisely zero expertise in this field. Finally note "in an as yet unpublished paper".

    What you have found in Ron Johnson is a politician pursuing office. He has a clear motive for Vaccine miss information because he's fund raising off it and appealing to his base. You're going to find lots of instances of him pulling like minded people together to talk on panels but that doesn't mean any of them hold water.
    Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jan 26th, 2022 at 04:47 AM.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    need fact check:
    - Dr. Peter McCullough
    - Dr. Greg Nigh
    - Dr. Anthony Kyriakopoulos

    since this paper is not just written by her.
    so all this people are frauds?

    source of interests:
    https://www.researchgate.net/scienti...lough-38989664
    https://www.researchgate.net/publica..._and_microRNAs

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    need fact check for:

    Dr. Bret Weinstein
    Dr. Jay Bhattacharya
    Dr. Ryan Cole
    Dr. Harvey Risch
    Dr. George Fareed
    Dr. Pierre Kory
    Dr. Richard Urso
    Dr. Paul Marik
    Dr. Aaron Kheriaty
    Dr. Robert Malone
    Dr. David Wiseman

    since you are dismissing them all.

    also: watching this: https://rumble.com/vt8rfa-australian...he-agenda.html
    Australian QLD Senator Malcolm Roberts discusses the danger we are in as a nation.
    We discuss the damning letter he wrote to our Prime Minister Scott Morrison, the lack of response, Scott Morrison's involvement in the agenda and many others in government.
    A multi-angled battle requires effort from every front. We are grateful to still have those in Parliament like Senator Malcolm Roberts who are aware of the agenda and are fighting for us.

    and Senator Malcolm Roberts talks about the vaccination campaign that has been a total disaster, enormous costs and destroyed many peoples life and he says:
    - the failure of the product being blame on those that don't use it
    Last edited by baka; Jan 26th, 2022 at 06:29 AM.

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I really don't. I've more than demonstrated that the vast majority of the source you cite are unreliable garbage. I do not owe it to you to do the most basic research for you when you should be doing it yourself. I'll continue to dip test them though.

    If you are going to challenge the accepted scientific consensus the burden is on you to make an argument, backed by verifiable sources and establish the validity of those sources. My fact checking merely establishes that you're not bothering to do that and, as a result, the majority of what you're posting is fantasist nonsense.

    Do your research.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I did. while u just swallow the narrative.

    when the truth comes out
    my conscience will be pure, what about you?

    I hope u are happy that children gets the vaccine.

    and this u ignore completely
    https://www.researchgate.net/publica..._and_microRNAs

    but I didnt expect you would understand. I know exactly, 100% how u will react to everything.

    u know most of the things u believe, its just false. misinformation. lies.
    but u will believe in them anyway. they told u vaccine protect and the only solution for not spreading the virus.
    later they changing it that it will protect but it can still spread
    and later they changed it that it will protect against serious death but not protect you.
    and now u see that it do nothing. contrary. data starts to show that the vaccinated are getting more sick of omicron.

    and all the restrictions so doctors could not use the medicines they know of.
    instead they are forced to use a protocol dictated by someone else.

    but still u believe in them. they are just corrupted, money hungry, and plane evil.
    but you believe in them....

    but its easy to blame the others. thats the only thing u have left. blame the people that didnt vaccinate. because when nothing is left. u are forced to blame the one you believe in.

    so u keep arguing against me, because u know if u start looking inside yourself. you are very very very scared. u dont want to admit it one bit.
    its called rationalize. u censor it yourself. its common use by people, they avoid something that is shocking and terrifying. better blame the people that are making me uncomfortable.
    because we are not scared. we want to the truth. so thats the only thing u can do. fight against us. but in the end u are just fighting yourself. its what u have inside thats the problem. u dont want to realize whats going on.
    Last edited by baka; Jan 26th, 2022 at 07:03 AM.

  17. #5137
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    It's a preprint. It's not peer reviewed.

    I hope u are happy that children gets the vaccine.
    As long as there are enough doses available I don't have a problem with it because there's been no credible evidence that it puts them at risk. I do have an issue that I think we should have been doing much more to export doses to the third world but that's a different debate.
    Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jan 26th, 2022 at 07:26 AM.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.


  19. #5139
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    However, I'd call upon an age old idiom and ask you, what does your gut tell you? Are you really willing to dismiss this and just follow the mainstream?
    My gut tells me to eat pizza.

    However, yeah, my gut, my education, my experience with vaccinations, my experience with pandemics, all tells me that what is being covered in the mainstream is at least mostly right. The inability of the other side to come up with a coherent message, the problem that they can't come up with anything other than Youtube videos to support their cases, and when they use official data they misstate it, doesn't give me any confidence that they even have the basis for a solid argument.

    Mark my words. One of these days you're going to wake up to a version of America that punishes it's citizens for not identifying someone by their prefered made up pronouns. You're going to wonder how it happened. I say to you now it's because no one wants to think critically. They want others to do it for them. Remember, you heard it here first.
    Mark my words: We've been there for over two centuries. We're getting better, not worse. We're just doing it slowly. Every generation is better than the last, but that's what it seems to take. Yeah, there might be some mild discrimination over pronouns. When you consider that it was only a few decades back where you could get assaulted or murdered for your beliefs, the color of your skin, the church you attended, and so on, with the full expectation that your attackers would be exonerated, that's not so bad. Go back a century, and your attackers would be celebrated.

    You think you know history, but the US is all about pretending our history didn't happen, and you're joining in. We created a lot of the economic problems in the Caribbean nations today, but you don't have to go very far back to find where we would have just come in and slaughtered people (though the ability to slaughter was less than it is today in terms of bodies/day). Now you have to look for the subtle effects of the invisible hand. A hundred years back, it would have been neither subtle nor invisible. You have the luxury to speculate on secretive conspiracies. You didn't use to have that option. We're getting better, and at this pace, perhaps our grandchildren will get there.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I say to you now it's because no one wants to think critically.
    The thing is, most of what's happening in this thread isn't critical thinking.

    I'm all for challenging main stream science. In fact the ongoing challenge is a critical function of science. It's what separates science from religion as far as belief systems are concerned. But that's not just a case of coming up with a different idea and saying "this is how it is". It requires scientific rigour.

    Without that what we have is simple grand standing and it's dangerous. It leads to bad conclusions that, in turn, lead to bad outcomes. People die needlessly.

    Mark my words:...
    ^What he said + 1^
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Thank you for providing a paper. I've been looking through it. There's some good stuff in there, but a whole lot of chaff. I'd expect a bit of editing before any final paper emerged, if it ever does. After all, they go off on tangents that seem suspiciously unrelated to COVID, but highly related to the interests of one of the co-authors. I'm not saying that those digressions are wrong, just that they are irrelevant and should have been excluded. For example, there's a bunch of discussion about cancer signaling pathways, and the discovery of a certain chemical (unrelated to COVID, even according to the paper) in the brains of Alzheimer's patients. They don't even suggest that those are related to COVID.

    However, I have some doubts that the paper will ever make it to print. This is an amazing age we live in. When I was in school, if you had a citation list, you had days or weeks of work ahead of you, tracking down the citations. If you had access to a good research library, you could find things in whatever journals they subscribed to (the larger the library, the more subscriptions, but nobody has them all). For those citations that they didn't subscribe to, you'd have to get a loan. No longer, though. I found two statements I wanted to look into further, and Google was able to provide the cited paper.

    And when I looked...well, for both of the statements, the research didn't quite support the way the citation was used. For example, if you look at this quote:

    Furthermore,the overwhelming impetus for cells to perform a single and artificial approach to translation according to the robust capping and synthetic methylations of mRNAs in vaccines is fundamentally associated with disease progression due to differential rather than normal signaling of pattern recognition receptors (PRRs) [69]
    That looks quite impressive, but does the citation support that statement? Well, no, it really doesn't speak about that much at all. Here's the article that was cited:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5218996/

    If you look through it, it's about how cells recognize self versus viral RNA and mechanisms around that. It's pretty dense reading, but does it really have anything to do with the line where it was cited? It might be argued to have something to do with it, since it has to do with pattern recognition receptors, but it doesn't even speak to the more alarmist parts of the statement.

    A bit more disturbingly, you have this example:

    Consistent with other studies, they found thatSTAT2 and IRF7 were significantly downregulated 28 days after vaccination, indicative of impaired typeI IFN responses. They wrote: “Together, these data suggested that after vaccination, at least by day 28,other than generation of neutralizing antibodies, people’s immune systems, including those of lymphocytesand monocytes, were perhaps in a more vulnerable state.” [52].
    Now, this is a direct quote from a paper (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41421-021-00329-3), but is it accurate? Well, they left out this OTHER direct quote from the abstract of the paper:

    Moreover, scRNA-seq revealed increased NF-κB signaling and reduced type I interferon responses, which were confirmed by biological assays and also had been reported to occur after SARS-CoV-2 infection with aggravating symptoms.
    In other words: Yes, these things happen from the vaccine...because these things also happen from the virus itself. which was stated more clearly elsewhere in the abstract:

    Similar changes had also been reported in COVID-19 patients, suggesting that vaccination mimicked an infection.
    Which is exactly what would be expected. So, the paper you cited is pointing out potentially bad things that the vaccine is doing, when those same bad things are being done by the virus, a point that they notably left out even when it was in their citations.

    I chose those two because the statements seemed quite definitive and significant. In the first case, the citation barely spoke about a few words in the claim they were making, and was silent on the claim itself. It wasn't a proper citation. In the second case, while they included a quote that was on point, they left out some crucial information from the same paper that would have undercut their hypothesis.

    0 for 2 is a bad start. I would expect that a bunch of their citations are entirely correct, as a bunch of them are totally non-controversial, but considering that track record, I'm not entirely sure.
    Last edited by Shaggy Hiker; Jan 26th, 2022 at 11:49 AM.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    its a pre-print and need more work.
    even so, to work in the blind is not easy. it would be easier if big pharma would reveal the vaccine documents.

    and its not that big pharma is perfect either. if you need that accuracy, wheres the same critical observation to the real thing?

    right now we have:
    - nothing from big pharma except they want us to trust them
    - a lot of professors all around the world that try to understand whats going on.

    the latter is like this paper. 4 scientist/doctors working together to understand the process.
    the same with others as well, as I posted here, the German pathology and other doctors if you would watch the videos.

    but, no matter what I post, you are very good to discredit it.
    and I would appreciate it a lot, and also admire you, if you also did that with the vaccine.

    right now you are believing in something without giving any scrutiny but you go deep to find anything that could make it "bad" to whatever source that actually try to figure it out.

    so, you stand is this:
    - I don't believe in anything until someone figure it out, and if so, I will just buy it and place myself there.

    well. guess what. while you are comfortable in your spot, a lot of people are dying of malpractice. a lot of people are getting sick from the vaccine, and tons of people lost their job.

    that you don't even care about the early treatment protocol that doctors couldn't use, tells me, do you care at all about life? you think that hundreds of thousands that could have been saved, they deserve it?
    because you government decided to "stop" the treatments. people got nothing and only used the ventilators that can cause tissue damage.

    so you think all doctors that actually decided to "not" follow that decision and instead give the patient medicine, that showed result, that they deserved to get fired?
    since you believe in the government and the vaccine.

    the last post I uploaded a youtube about this doctor, that is actually what Im talking about.
    do you even care? or u will just use your "defense mechanism" and say: its fake news.

  23. #5143
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    a lot of people are dying of malpractice. a lot of people are getting sick from the vaccine
    Except that there's no credible evidence of this, that's the problem your argument faces. Whereas the evidence of excess deaths that could have been prevented by more extensive vaccination is overwhelming. If the data actually indicated that vaccinations were causing more deaths than it was preventing I know my position would change... but it doesn't indicate that.

    Here's a breakdown from the Office for National Statistics. This is the official Governmental statistical body for the UK. They are party independent. Note the following table:-
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    Note the drop off between death rates between the unvaccinated and those who had received a double vaccine.

    Your posts are dripping with the implication that we don't care if people die. The opposite is true but we are basing our opinions on how to best achieve that on actual data.
    Last edited by FunkyDexter; Jan 26th, 2022 at 01:09 PM.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    you are still not addressing early treatments that where banned.
    and faulty testing methods that showed more death, with all the people died "with" and not "because" of covid.
    that will invalidate everything you show.

    I think thats the problem. you are believing in the honestly of the system
    while I see corruption and manipulation of data. this to force the agenda to create a mass-vaccination campaign when it was not needed.

    if I where to see your side, that I believe in my government (very hard to do, they lie all the time) I would also be critical to anything that says otherwise.

    now, lets assume you are right. the government is honest.
    how can you explain the hundreds of thousands of people around the world protesting, doing research, telling the media is hiding the truth, doctors telling they where fired because they didnt comply, and more and more.
    theres so much. if you are right, what does this mean? you suggest all this people are lying?

    just check australia, I follow a person that show many videos of people there. and its the same story we have in usa, germany and other countries.
    is still coordination? who is behind all this BS?

    it seems its contraproductive. all this people are not getting anything positive doing this. except some youtuber getting some clicks.
    but the enormous amount of work to do all that, for some clicks? Im sure theres better things they can do.

    and how come theres so many politicians, doctors, scientist, nurses, etc that are part of this "conspiracy"?

    I would believe you if this is just one country and a few channels. I would say. ok, I can not find anything anywhere else. why are they saying this?

    how do you explain this?

  25. #5145
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    you are still not addressing early treatments that where banned
    Which ones? Are we back onto hydroxychloroquine? I've already addressed that one. Or do you want to propose another? There's currently people touting that you can drink your own urine. Care to try it?

    with all the people died "with" and not "because" of covid.
    That's why we look at excess deaths, it removes the doubt.

    how can you explain the hundreds of thousands of people around the world protesting, doing research, telling the media is hiding the truth, doctors telling they where fired because they didnt comply
    Simple, some of them are miss-leading because they are seeking profit or prominence. The rest are simply misled. You fall into the second category.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    fine.

    you are superior. your intelligence and wisdom are on another level.
    us, the lower species we don't understand. its too complicated for us.
    we should worship you, as you are using your brain fully.

    we will follow you. you are the most intelligent being in the universe.
    nothing can compare. u have the answer to everything. you are our god.

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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by baka View Post
    fine.

    you are superior. your intelligence and wisdom are on another level.
    us, the lower species we don't understand. its too complicated for us.
    we should worship you, as you are using your brain fully.

    we will follow you. you are the most intelligent being in the universe.
    nothing can compare. u have the answer to everything. you are our god.
    This escalated into a cult way too quickly :-))

    cheers,
    </wqw>

  28. #5148
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    My gut tells me to eat pizza.

    However, yeah, my gut, my education, my experience with vaccinations, my experience with pandemics, all tells me that what is being covered in the mainstream is at least mostly right. The inability of the other side to come up with a coherent message, the problem that they can't come up with anything other than Youtube videos to support their cases, and when they use official data they misstate it, doesn't give me any confidence that they even have the basis for a solid argument.
    Then explain to me how it is that this pandemic has been happening for 2 years now and I've heard of every vaccine from Johnson and Johnson to Pfizer but I never heard of Ivermectin until yesterday? What's that about? Are the stats behind Ivermectin made up?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    Mark my words: We've been there for over two centuries. We're getting better, not worse. We're just doing it slowly. Every generation is better than the last, but that's what it seems to take. Yeah, there might be some mild discrimination over pronouns. When you consider that it was only a few decades back where you could get assaulted or murdered for your beliefs, the color of your skin, the church you attended, and so on, with the full expectation that your attackers would be exonerated, that's not so bad. Go back a century, and your attackers would be celebrated.
    You raise a good point here. However, let me bring it into focus a little bit. Average people haven gotten better. Your neighbors aren't going to kill you for worshiping a different god in 2021 and yes, this is far better than what we've had in the past. However, rulers(not just the government but powerful corporations too) have not changed. In fact, a good argument can be made that they have gotten far worse. In the past, their conquests were violent and genocidal you are right but just because they aren't doing that as much anymore doesn't mean they are sugar and spice and everything nice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    You think you know history, but the US is all about pretending our history didn't happen, and you're joining in. We created a lot of the economic problems in the Caribbean nations today, but you don't have to go very far back to find where we would have just come in and slaughtered people (though the ability to slaughter was less than it is today in terms of bodies/day). Now you have to look for the subtle effects of the invisible hand. A hundred years back, it would have been neither subtle nor invisible. You have the luxury to speculate on secretive conspiracies. You didn't use to have that option. We're getting better, and at this pace, perhaps our grandchildren will get there.
    Ask the people of Iraq if the invasion of their country by the US was invisible. Ask the people of Libya if the so called "intervention" by NATO was invisible. I'm sure no innocent hard working average people died in these countries as a result of these invasions. Right?
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  29. #5149
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    https://tube.childrenshealthdefense....3-681a09c1259b

    “A Call to Europe: The Future of Our Children is at Stake” - CHD Europe - Press Conference, Brussels January 23

    Call for a European moratorium on health restrictions: the future of our children is at stake.

    In the framework of the citizens' rally in Brussels organised on 23 January by Europeans United International, Children's Health Defense Europe organised a press conference with several speakers concerned by the current policy turn and the future that awaits our young generations, who have been constantly side-lined since the beginning of the crisis.

    During the pandemic, most EU member states made far-reaching decisions, often blind to the health, physical and mental well-being of children and young people, putting political agendas and vested interests first.

    Today, the European Union is considering continuing and centralising these measures imposed by the state of emergency, which have failed and caused so much damage, and which are also putting the young generation at unnecessary and exceptional risk, particularly through the imposition of masks and vaccination campaigns. It is time to change course and call for an immediate moratorium on this arsenal of obligations and restrictions that cannot offer a sustainable and humane future for society.

    The panels of experts composed of internationally renowned lawyers, economists and doctors will review the impact of current policies on our society and in particular on its most fragile members.

    Children's Health Defense Europe is an association chaired by attorney Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. whose mission is to protect children's health by combating hazardous exposures, to defend their health rights and their fundamental rights in general.

  30. #5150
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by baka View Post
    its a pre-print and need more work.
    Yes, but the writing wasn't bad. The edits I would suggest would be to remove chunks to tighten up the focus. I've seen a whole lot worse.
    ight now we have:
    - nothing from big pharma except they want us to trust them
    - a lot of professors all around the world that try to understand whats going on.
    One of the strengths in that paper, I felt, was a pretty detailed discussion about the challenges that the mRNA vaccine had to overcome and how that was accomplished. They actually have considerable information in there as to what the pharma companies did to make those. I knew about the general approaches, such as what had to be done to keep the body from breaking down the mRNA before it ever made the ribosome. I was slightly disappointed that they called that a defense, since it happens all the time, every day, in every cell, and to the mRNA created by the cell. Still, they laid it out pretty well, and the citations they had in that section would likely explain different parts in far more detail. Perhaps more detail than anybody would really ask the companies to provide, since science tends to be a series of failures leading to a success. Those citations would probably lay out the roadmap of issues that had to be overcome, and how they were overcome, while the the paper itself was mostly just mentioning the issues and going on.

    but, no matter what I post, you are very good to discredit it.
    and I would appreciate it a lot, and also admire you, if you also did that with the vaccine.
    It's easier to throw stones, of course. That starts with a paper, though. You can't always find any faults with papers. As part of an exercise in grad school, we were tasked with finding papers (actual physical papers, in that case, since this was pre internet) and 'editing' them. Essentially, looking for weaknesses in the papers. I chose at random, and ended up with a paper about honeybee metabolism. The paper was flawless, which was astonishing. I then looked at the publishing notes (which won't exist for preprints, and might not exist for any online article). The paper had been accepted without revision. In other words: Even the professional editors and peer reviewers couldn't find anything to complain about, and it's their job to complain about things. You almost never see that.

    I then went on to review a series of other papers by the same author. That guy was quite the writer, I'd say. Learned a bit about bee metabolism, too.

    Still, if you have a paper on vaccines, I'll take a look. It's kind of a fun exercise, though a bit morbid.
    so, you stand is this:
    - I don't believe in anything until someone figure it out, and if so, I will just buy it and place myself there.
    I wish. If I understand you right, that might be something to aspire to, but I'm not there. I have opinions, just like you do. If something supports my opinions, I will dig less deeply.

    well. guess what. while you are comfortable in your spot, a lot of people are dying of malpractice. a lot of people are getting sick from the vaccine, and tons of people lost their job.
    That's mostly regional. I'm not covinced that anybody is getting sick from the vaccine, but when it comes to losing your job, and every other economic impact, you do have to remember that the US is really an outlier in that area. We're in a pretty different situation from most of the rest of the world due to the whopping stimulus packages that got passed. We have problems you don't have, but we don't have problems you do have, as well.

    so you think all doctors that actually decided to "not" follow that decision and instead give the patient medicine, that showed result, that they deserved to get fired?
    since you believe in the government and the vaccine.
    Many of our problems arose before the vaccine.
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  31. #5151
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by baka View Post
    you are still not addressing early treatments that where banned.
    and faulty testing methods that showed more death, with all the people died "with" and not "because" of covid.
    that will invalidate everything you show.
    That isn't true, as has been covered repeatedly. The excess deaths in the US and the UK show that something was killing lots of people in both places. If it wasn't COVID, what was it? Can't be vaccines, the data predates the development. Can't be 'delayed treatment', because it's FAR too high, and there doesn't appear to have been much in the US.
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  32. #5152
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niya View Post
    Then explain to me how it is that this pandemic has been happening for 2 years now and I've heard of every vaccine from Johnson and Johnson to Pfizer but I never heard of Ivermectin until yesterday? What's that about? Are the stats behind Ivermectin made up?
    Explain it? I can barely believe it. I've been hearing about Ivermectin since early on. It didn't come first, that was the hydroxy...whatever, can't spell it, but you probably know what I mean.

    Ivermectin isn't as wacky as some of the ideas, and there are plenty of studies that suggest that it works. There are also plenty of studies that suggest that it has no impact. I listed a series of metaanalysis studies (summaries of many other studies) in a reply to Eduardo a page or two back. What I was looking for when I found those metaanalysis studies was one particular one (that I was unable to track down, so I tossed the magazine it was in) that showed that studies conducted in areas where a certain parasite was found showed Ivermectin was effective, while studies where the parasite was not found showed no effect. Why that would be wasn't clear, but Ivermectin does a whole lot of different things, and so do parasites, so it's not out of the question.


    You raise a good point here. However, let me bring it into focus a little bit. Average people haven gotten better. Your neighbors aren't going to kill you for worshiping a different god in 2021 and yes, this is far better than what we've had in the past. However, rulers(not just the government but powerful corporations too) have not changed. In fact, a good argument can be made that they have gotten far worse. In the past, their conquests were violent and genocidal you are right but just because they aren't doing that as much anymore doesn't mean they are sugar and spice and everything nice.
    Fair enough. You've likely noticed that the more people you kill, the longer your name lingers in history. You don't tend to hear much about William The Pretty Effective Manager.

    Hopefully, as the people get better, the pool that produces the leaders will improve, but I'd agree with you if you said that doesn't appear to be happening.


    Ask the people of Iraq if the invasion of their country by the US was invisible. Ask the people of Libya if the so called "intervention" by NATO was invisible. I'm sure no innocent hard working average people died in these countries as a result of these invasions. Right?
    I was specifically talking about the Caribbean. We used to invade down there a whole lot. We've only done so a couple times in the last few decades, and then with little bloodshed.

    The US is certainly a work in progress, and plenty more work remains to be done, but we were unrepentant. Now, things come to light, people agree that they were wrong, things bend in the right direction. Lot more to be done, but it's hard not to imagine that there wouldn't be a whole lot more glowing wastelands had the US figured out the atomic bomb in the late 1800s rather than 1940s.

    That's why I'm saying it's generational. We aren't good, but we're moving that way. Not those of us alive, though, it's just that our children will be better than us, their children will be better than them...and there's no guarantee that it will keep moving in that direction. The European dark ages were dark for a reason. They could come again.
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  33. #5153
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I feel I repeat myself.
    here in sweden we had around 6000 "covid death" (2020)
    if we compare to death rates/year average etc.

    the thing is, it was a wipe of old and sick people.
    when the pandemic started it was like the whole system-care stopped.
    doctors didnt visit the old, they cut a lot of appointment etc.

    in the first few months we had thousands of death, and only from elderly homes.
    but covid in the population was almost non-existent.
    similar to Italy, it was a total wipe of old people.

    it was like a coordinated attack against them.
    and it was very strange, how it could find its way to all the elderly homes while
    most people didnt get sick.

    like the US, they didnt allow any treatment. they told people "go home"
    and a lot did. the most usual response was: I was sick a couple of days and after that I got well
    but suddenly after 1 week, I started to get worse, couldn't breath. (its the spike protein reaction that nobody knew)
    anyway, most people didnt get help, and the few that got help they did give them respirator.
    but nothing else. a lot of people died, because of malpractice.
    the doctors couldn't examine the patient because of "restrictions", so they all follow the same protocol.
    instead of examine the patient and give them the right medication. that of course was banned if any doctor even had that thought .

    I see that first year, 2020 of really bad decisions that killed so many people.
    and to not forget, the health system was bad already, lots of cuts everywhere.

    in 2021, things got better. but I dont believe it was the vaccine that helped us.
    I believe it was coordinated to go that way, to give space to the vaccine.

    if they allowed early treatments, everything would have been different.
    many people would have given that medicine instead of letting them die.

    right now, they tell u, take the booster. it will protect you.
    meanwhile, most vaccinated are sick right now. Omicron is bypassing it all, protects nothing.
    even so, they are not removing the covid-passports, its still restrictions, they are still asking to give the vaccine to kids.
    no logic.

    yes, as you seems to be logical and quite smart, I ask you. whats your take on this.
    why are the government still imposing boosters and want the children to take it.
    and I think you understand about the immune-system and that kids are stronger right?

    also, when in history have we forced kids to protect the old? it should be the way around
    and if we have already vaccinated all the old, whats the point to mass vaccinate all the kids?
    and we know that u can still infect even if you are vaccinated.

    (also, for more info, no kids died first year. and if any died they where sick, like cancer or something severe that killed them, and almost no kids died the second year either, not even sure any kid died at all from covid)

    and new studies also show that people that gets sick, also create a better immune-system against future covid mutations. so its preferable to just let the kids get sick. especially now when Omicron is not that strong.
    Last edited by baka; Jan 26th, 2022 at 05:12 PM.

  34. #5154
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by baka View Post
    I feel I repeat myself.
    here in sweden we had around 6000 "covid death" (2020)
    if we compare to death rates/year average etc.

    the thing is, it was a wipe of old and sick people.
    when the pandemic started it was like the whole system-care stopped.
    doctors didnt visit the old, they cut a lot of appointment etc.

    in the first few months we had thousands of death, and only from elderly homes.
    but covid in the population was almost non-existent.
    similar to Italy, it was a total wipe of old people.
    One of the problems is that everybody knows their own country, and every country had a different experience.
    it was like a coordinated attack against them.
    and it was very strange, how it could find its way to all the elderly homes while
    most people didnt get sick.
    I don't see why you find that strange. Elderly homes tend to have a bunch of people with other issues, indoors. The first wave was in the summer, when most people were not all that confined, but those in elderly homes were.
    like the US, they didnt allow any treatment. they told people "go home"
    and a lot did. the most usual response was: I was sick a couple of days and after that I got well
    but suddenly after 1 week, I started to get worse, couldn't breath. (its the spike protein reaction that nobody knew)
    anyway, most people didnt get help, and the few that got help they did give them respirator.
    but nothing else. a lot of people died, because of malpractice.
    the doctors couldn't examine the patient because of "restrictions", so they all follow the same protocol.
    instead of examine the patient and give them the right medication. that of course was banned if any doctor even had that thought .
    The US health care system is far from monolithic. Each state, and in most states, regions within the state, have quite different health care. A blanket statement about the whole country is going to be wrong.


    right now, they tell u, take the booster. it will protect you.
    meanwhile, most vaccinated are sick right now. Omicron is bypassing it all, protects nothing.
    even so, they are not removing the covid-passports, its still restrictions, they are still asking to give the vaccine to kids.
    no logic.
    Those are different things. The vaccine doesn't appear to protect you from getting COVID, but does greatly reduce the chance of you getting seriously ill.

    As for the passports, that's driven by a different mechanism. I suspect you will find that no politician loses more than they gain by taking action, even if the action is useless or wrong.

    and I think you understand about the immune-system and that kids are stronger right?
    The last half of that isn't always right, though generally true. At first, kids barely have an immune system. Then they are relatively strong, but you have to keep in mind that the Spanish Flu killed primarily people in the prime of life, while generally sparing the elderly. There are speculations as to why that was, such as that an earlier flu had provided some immunity, but that was a long time ago.
    also, when in history have we forced kids to protect the old? it should be the way around
    and if we have already vaccinated all the old, whats the point to mass vaccinate all the kids?
    and we know that u can still infect even if you are vaccinated.
    Politics. I don't think there is one reason. I think there are several, depending on the region. I'd say that the reason in Chicago is decidedly different from the reasons in the rest of the US. The reasons in this state probably vary by county...and by household. Though you have to keep in mind that there is no mandate, and this state has one of the lowest vaccination rates in the country, still, so the reasons here are basically up to the parents, and vary by household.

    and new studies also show that people that gets sick, also create a better immune-system against future covid mutations. so its preferable to just let the kids get sick. especially now when Omicron is not that strong.
    I agree, but anything that creates cover to keep them in school I'm tending to favor, at this point. The harm of keeping them out of school definitely outweighs the harm of COVID. That's largely where the fight is at in the US, as far as I can tell.
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    The Ins and Outs of Omicron

    Bottom line? We need to update our vaccine formulas. Yes, getting vaxxed and boosted with what is on hand is still by far the best way to prevent deaths and hospitalizations. But we can do better. One of the beautiful things about the new mRNA technology is that techs can update the formula in a matter of days, and alter production runs within a couple of months. The firms that manufacture the mRNA formulas – Pfizer and Moderna – suggest that by April we can be churning out updated formulas that use Omicron as the baseline (as opposed to the original Wuhan version). If past proves prologue, we could get back to the heady days of May 2021 when we had a platinum-standard vaccine formula that provided something very close to sterilizing immunity. That’d be awesome.

    It won’t last of course. America’s anti-vax community will remain millions strong, ensuring an ample supply of walking petri dishes Omicron can use to breed the next generation of coronavirus. But armed with a vaccine based on Omicron rather than Wuhan, we’d only be a single generation behind rather than three. That’s still a win. And a big one at that.

  36. #5156
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    this Peter Zeihan dude don't have the facts right.

    - all people, vaccinate and not are walking breed for next gen virus.
    - as long the vaccination is not "stopping" the spread, it will still spread it around. as it do now, most people that are sick with omicron are the vaccinated.

    another thing.
    a lot of "anti-vax" (that I think is the wrong word) are actually people that recovered.
    the immune-system of those people are much better than any vaccination. theres also studies showing that.
    no point injecting that poison if your protection is above of any vaccination.

    so, you should not follow this dude. as he spread misinformation and he seems to be quite stupid.

  37. #5157
    Super Moderator Shaggy Hiker's Avatar
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    We need to do all we can to ensure that the next variant of COVID starts either in the US or somewhere in America (Mexico is doing their part, but Canada isn't really stepping up on this). After all, the next named variant would be Pi. The song darn near writes itself.
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  38. #5158
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Yep that would be brilliant.
    You started the virus as far as possible in China and they suspected you, now no one will suspect that the government is idiotic enough to start the virus in it's own turf.
    I hope it's not named Pi aka Greek Π cuz you will be pronouncing it wrong it's not phay it's pe , sus-pi-cious , or , yes, pee . Having wrote that I suspect some people getting on my nerves with that Pi business....
    ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ
    πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν·

  39. #5159
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    Yeah, we won't be pronouncing it right. We'll be pronouncing it with a long I: pie. Not sure what your phay is, and we CERTAINLY won't be pronouncing it pee.
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  40. #5160
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    Re: Corona virus, China major city lockdowns, etc.

    I can't resist it:-
    Peter Zeihan fact checked





    theres also studies showing that.
    Source?
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