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Thread: abortion

  1. #1

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    abortion

    What is your reason for being pro-life or pro-choice? and give reasons.

    I think that abortion should be illegal because it is killing of a future baby boy/girl and man/woman. Also, what if that person in that mothers stomach would be the one to invent cars? And think about this: What if you mother, while pregnant with you, decided to abort and get rid of you? Now think of the kids that are being killed right now, what if that was you?

    And dont give me any of that womans choice crap because they should have thought about having a baby before doing the activity that causes pregnacy.

    - James

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    Yep. I agree. I am against all kinds of abortions. Even if the baby which would be born would be retarded or have a serious disease, it is still a human life.
    Tolkien is the greatest writer ever.

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    Re: abortion

    Originally posted by james14

    And dont give me any of that womans choice crap because they should have thought about having a baby before doing the activity that causes pregnacy.
    what about rape what then?

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    If they are raped, they should still have the baby. At least they can put it up for adoption.
    Tolkien is the greatest writer ever.

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    Oh yeah adoption, another thing, i know this kid thats adopted and hes like my best friend and to think that he might have been aborted still gives me chills. I dont know but i hope you dont think about supporting abortion

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    <?="Moderator"?> john tindell's Avatar
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    i dunno myself where i stand because every case is differnet, some people think of it as a form of very late contracpetion. it also depends if your religon/lifestyle allows you to do this. but all in all its their choise and there isnt much you can do to change it.

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    Hyperactive Member VBD's Avatar
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    NO ABORTION

    Its like murder except to a baby that cant even understand why its being killed. Do you remember how long ago babie girls where baried in the send? This is the exact same thing accept a little bit less painfull.

    LOTS Get a pro-abortionar in here so we can have a big debate
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    <?="Moderator"?> john tindell's Avatar
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    debate or have a massive go at for saying murdering babys is ok?

  9. #9
    Stuck in the 80s The Hobo's Avatar
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    I'm Pro Life and do believe it is murder...in most cases.

    I believe if a woman is raped, she should have the right to choose whether or not to have the child.

    She wasn't allowed to choose to have sex...she should be allowed to get rid of the consequences if she believes that's what's best.

    I'd highly advise them against it, as I still believe it would be murder. But the child was conceived in sin, not love. I'd leave that choice up to them.

    But in all other cases, I strongly believe in the child's right to live.
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    if it was rape, then i would still condsider it sin to have an abortion, under no circumstances should anyone put a harmless child to death, through sin or through love.

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    PowerPoster Arc's Avatar
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    Wow pro lifers on this message board? Who woulda thunk it. I thought i was the only one.
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    To tell you the truth, i was thinking i would be starting a handful but you guys are better than i thought. Im glad some people have sense to think things out than having people who sound good tell you what to think and leave your decision be.

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    I'm about to be a PowerPoster! mendhak's Avatar
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    It is the mother who has to devote all her energy, attention and instincts towards the upbringing of this baby, and therefore it is she who can decide best. If she wants an abortion, then it's her choice. So I'd be pro-choice.

    Of course it's easy for you and me to just sit there and decide what's best for someone else.

  14. #14
    PowerPoster Arc's Avatar
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    Once the women becomes pregnant she longer has a choice.... she had a choice to not sleep with the guy... I guess you think it's ok for the mother to choose for her child wether it wants to live or not.
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    Hyperactive Member maxl's Avatar
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    Originally posted by james14
    To tell you the truth, i was thinking i would be starting a handful but you guys are better than i thought.
    So basically, if we think like you we are good if not we are bad

    Originally posted by james14

    Im glad some people have sense to think things out than having people who sound good tell you what to think and leave your decision be.
    Are you talking about priests that tell you that abortion should be illegal ??

    I'm not gonna waste any time on what would be a never ending debate.
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    If the mom made a bad choice and had sex, then she shouldn't be allowed to have the baby. What is this teaching ppl? "Don't worry about having sex. You can always have an abortion": this isn't right. I think that if the mother really doesn't want to have the baby, they should put him/her up for adoption.
    Tolkien is the greatest writer ever.

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    I'm about to be a PowerPoster! mendhak's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Zach Elfers
    I think that if the mother really doesn't want to have the baby, they should put him/her up for adoption.
    So it's OK to abandon the child and put it through a lifetime of danger and misery, instead of preventing it in the first place?

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    Who says that adoption is a life of danger and misery? And I would rather be adopted than murdered.
    Tolkien is the greatest writer ever.

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    PowerPoster Arc's Avatar
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    Originally posted by mendhak
    So it's OK to abandon the child and put it through a lifetime of danger and misery, instead of preventing it in the first place?
    What the hell are you talking about? You been watching pepi longstocking movies? There are couples waiting years in line to adopt a child. These adopted childern would be very well taken care of... there is no danger or misery
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    Stuck in the 80s The Hobo's Avatar
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    Originally posted by james14
    if it was rape, then i would still condsider it sin to have an abortion, under no circumstances should anyone put a harmless child to death, through sin or through love.
    Yes, but I believe it would be the sin of the rapist. He caused it. Whatever the outcome, it's his fault.

    A woman who was taken advantage of should NOT have to deal with the burden of carrying and having a child. Yes, she could put it up for adoption, but why should she have to carry it in the first place? Why should she and her body have to go through that?
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    Well

    Originally posted by james14
    if it was rape, then i would still condsider it sin to have an abortion, under no circumstances should anyone put a harmless child to death, through sin or through love.
    And if it were your daughter, your mother, your aunt, would you still feel the same way?
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  22. #22
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    Heres the deal with rape... if you get rapped go immediately to the hospital and get the spermicide treatment... this will prevent pregnancy. You could even take the "Morning After pill". Theres no excuse for abortion.. unless the child is severly deformed. And by severly deformed i dont mean missing a leg i mean deforemed to the point of never being able to add anyting to society in any way shape or form.
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  23. #23
    Addicted Member rdove's Avatar
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    Originally posted by The Hobo
    I'm Pro Life and do believe it is murder...in most cases.

    I believe if a woman is raped, she should have the right to choose whether or not to have the child.

    She wasn't allowed to choose to have sex...she should be allowed to get rid of the consequences if she believes that's what's best.

    I'd highly advise them against it, as I still believe it would be murder. But the child was conceived in sin, not love. I'd leave that choice up to them.

    But in all other cases, I strongly believe in the child's right to live.
    My aunt was raped a long while ago and she got pregant. She chose to have the baby, but she ended up wanting anything to do with the child. She sent him to live with a good family. When he was 16 (I think I was 12) he took his own life because she wanted nothing to do with him.

    So you could say I have a different prospective on the matter. In this situation it would have been better for the family if she would have had an abortion.

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  24. #24
    PowerPoster Beacon's Avatar
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    At the stage where abortion is legal it is not a child.

    In this day and age if a woman has the choice of providing a good home and good life to a child as against a poor life for both i believe the first option should be taken.

  25. #25
    Registered User Nucleus's Avatar
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    What I want to know is why the women get all the power in deciding whether or not she can have the baby. Ok so the woman carries the baby, but why is the child the sole property of the woman? In effect this means that women own the right to life, every baby that is born can only be born if the mother gives her authority to the child otherwise it is jettisoned, the man is powerless to stop it.

    In my view the child is equally owned by the man and the woman, and although the baby must be carried in the womb of the mother, I don't believe this entitles women to own life itself.

  26. #26
    PowerPoster Arc's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Beacon
    At the stage where abortion is legal it is not a child.

    In this day and age if a woman has the choice of providing a good home and good life to a child as against a poor life for both i believe the first option should be taken.
    Then why does it have arms and leggs and a head and a beating heart? Within a month of pregnancy the fetus looks like a child.. It has nerve endings, it feels pain.

    You could make the argument that within the first 1-3 weeks it could maybe not be considerd to be a human yet, but 3 months? It's deffinately a full fledged human by then.
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  27. #27
    PowerPoster Beacon's Avatar
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    Law states:

    which now permits abortion up to 20 weeks of pregnancy if one of four grounds is satisfied. The first ground essentially allows abortion 'on request,' provided a second, independent medical practitioner has counselled the pregnant woman about any medical risks associated with abortion and has offered to refer her for counselling about other matters associated with the abortion. Some additional restrictions are imposed where the pregnant patient is aged under 16. The other three grounds permit abortion where: the pregnant woman will suffer serious personal, family or social consequences if the abortion is not performed; serious danger to the pregnant woman's physical or mental health will result if the abortion is not performed; or the pregnant woman's pregnancy is causing serious danger to her mental health.

    After 20 weeks of pregnancy an abortion will only be lawful if two doctors agree that the pregnant woman or the foetus has a severe medical condition justifying the abortion. The two doctors must be members of a panel appointed for this purpose by the Minister. The abortion must be performed in a facility approved for this purpose.
    After 20 weeks it is then conidered a child.

  28. #28
    KING BODWAD XXI BodwadUK's Avatar
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    Does the law not cover what we are discussing??

    Yes is says that abortion is permitted but only if it is likely to destroy somebodys life.

    What gives you the right to put a law into place that bans abortion, people have their own right to choose and should never be forced into keeping a child, some people do abuse children that they didnt want!!!!

    Contraception can fail so what then, they didnt fail to try and prevent it and they obviously dont want a child so whats the point in them having it, yes adoption is an option but then adoption is for kids that arent loved and i am sorry to say it but suicides because of this are not very rare, some end up on streets begging and have a crap life.

    Never think you have the right to dicatate somebodys life and the argument of when a feotus becomes 'Alive' is a very difficult one to discuss. You may say it has a heart but does it have a sole??? That is what makes us human.

    When you take medicine for illness you are killing many bacteria what gives you the right to take those lives???


    The irony i see in the world today is that many democracys were created by religious people and yet these religious people want to place laws to control what they believe is wrong, even though many people do not believe in this way.

    The Pro-life campaigns are against peoples rights to choose, you have the right to try and pursuade them not to have an abortion but you cannot force them not too. So stop ranting on about how it should be illegal you have no rights to place a law on this because you would be taking the rights of others to choose!!!
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  29. #29
    PowerPoster Arc's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Beacon
    Law states:
    After 20 weeks it is then conidered a child.
    Actually in the U.S. it's 12 weeks(3 Months). No one is arguing what the law states... we all know what the law states... we are arguing what the law SHOULD be... i cant believe that flew over your head


    Bodawan... what gives the courts the right to say 3 months is when a child becomes a human and is no longer a (non Human). Why dont we say up untill the day before it is born it is not a human, so we can kill it any time we want.. but the second it comes out of the womb it is all of a sudden a human.

    So going on your theory an unborn child is never a human and the mother has the right to kill it whenever she se's fit (even if it's in the 9th month) because we shouldn't impose laws unpon her.
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    Lively Member Wally Pipp's Avatar
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    Pro-choice. Parents must have the choice to go ahead with it or not.
    It's none of our business to decide whether a child should be born but it's not our decision either to force birth upon people.
    Sanctity of life is all good and well but it doesn't mean much if the mother is in danger of dying during birth or that the child grows up and has a miserable life.

    Parents in conference with the doctors should decide to keep it or not. We, the outsiders, have no right to meddle with that decision.
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    Fanatic Member venerable bede's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Zach Elfers
    If they are raped, they should still have the baby. At least they can put it up for adoption.
    Jesus How old are you plebs. Babies dont grow in there mothers stomach and if you where raped I think you would feel a bit different.

    You are to young and silly to comment on such and issue so piffle.

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  32. #32
    Frenzied Member DeadEyes's Avatar
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    this is a sin that is a sin, not everyone believes in a god.

    People mentioned rape there was a case where I'm from
    where a girl under 16 was raped and made pregnant by her
    father; that child (both of them) is going to have a great life.
    Make abortion illegal and women will go to other countries to have it.
    Are you going to stop every woman leaving the country and give
    them a pregnancy test?

  33. #33
    KING BODWAD XXI BodwadUK's Avatar
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    Just because you believe in one thing does not mean you people should dictate other peoples lives.

    If you personally have to make this decision then do not have an abortion and your God will not punish you, if your God punishes you for the action of others then i would have nothing to do with your God!!!!!

    You are obviously convinced you are right but so are those who are all for abortion, i think people should live their own lives and let other people make their own decisions.

    I may not be pro-life but i would definately think twice about letting my partner have an abortion, you need to weigh up the pros and cons of it yourself and ignore anyone elses opinion!!!


    If you were to ban abortions people would go elsewhere and you have no right to stop them going to another country, add to that the fact they could end up in some seriously unhygenic environment and end up dying themselves. Then you must ask if you were the cause because you banned it being done professionaly in the first place!!!!
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    Well ...

    Originally posted by james14
    What is your reason for being pro-life or pro-choice? and give reasons.

    I think that abortion should be illegal because it is killing of a future baby boy/girl and man/woman. Also, what if that person in that mothers stomach would be the one to invent cars? And think about this: What if you mother, while pregnant with you, decided to abort and get rid of you? Now think of the kids that are being killed right now, what if that was you?

    And dont give me any of that womans choice crap because they should have thought about having a baby before doing the activity that causes pregnacy.

    - James
    YOU don't give any crap about all those What Ifs. If we were to just hypothesize, there would be no end to the What Ifs of any matter. Think practically.

    If you want the abortions to be banned, I suggest all the people should be banned from having sex. This is because whatever the measure of birth control you adopt, none of the measures is 100%. Also it's very difficult to enforce these measures.

    I also propose the male and female members should be housed separately, fed separately and work separately. There should be absolutely no interaction between the male and female members, except in cases such as breast-feeding a baby.

    I initially thoght of allowing copulation for the purpose of reproduction, but there's a danger of a woman ending up with twins or more kids when she only wanted one. Since she cannot do anything about it, any type of physical intercourse/copulation should be prohibited. Babies should strictly be produced, if need be, using non-conventional means such as test-tube baby or cloning.

    If the anti-abortionists among you are OK with the above changes, I shall support a ban on abortion.

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  35. #35
    Fanatic Member simonm's Avatar
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    I think that abortion should be illegal because it is killing of a future baby boy/girl and man/woman.
    Does a future person have the same rights as a person? Does a potential person have the same rights as a person?

    If a phoetus is merely a potential person (and that's a matter for debate), it cannot be said to have the same rights as a person.

    There is much talk of the right to life but does that "right" include the right to live, in a parasitic fashion, off of somebody else's body?
    Also, what if that person in that mothers stomach would be the one to invent cars?
    This is, in my opinion, a feeble argument. What about the potential child that I never had (nor never conceived)? What might they have become? What is the use in talking about what might have been?

    Arc
    Then why does it have arms and leggs and a head and a beating heart? Within a month of pregnancy the fetus looks like a child.. It has nerve endings, it feels pain.
    Actually, it doesn't feel pain upto around 18 weeks. It is around then that the phoetus develops self-awareness and the capacity for feeling pain. Before then, no matter how childlike it looks, it does not feel pain. That is the scientific consensus anyway.

    That is why I believe that abortion (before this time) is justifiable, because it is the mind of the phoetus that makes it human in my eyes. Once it has developed a capacity for suffering, then it is a child (and inherits a child's rights).
    Everything I say is either loose interpretation of dubious facts or idle speculation rooted in irrational sentiment.

  36. #36
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    I am pro-choice myself.
    Its a woman's body. She has the right to do whatever she wants.

    And its not like getting an abortion is an easy way out of commitments.
    Women are deepy traumatized at losing the child.

    Also bear in mind, that some women die during childbirth.
    Why must a woman put herself through that danger, to bring a life into the world that she doesn't want ?


    So once again, 100% pro-choice here.

  37. #37
    Lively Member Wally Pipp's Avatar
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    perhaps a non-related question but how many of you are deeply Christian (with that I mean firmly and undeniably believing in God and the bible) ?

    I ask this because it is my experience that predominantly religious people are vehemently against abortion in any form.
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    Well ...

    Originally posted by james14
    if it was rape, then i would still condsider it sin to have an abortion, under no circumstances should anyone put a harmless child to death, through sin or through love.
    I take it you are fighting against a possible US led war against Iraq?

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  39. #39
    KING BODWAD XXI BodwadUK's Avatar
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    Off HB goes again about bloody iraq!!!!!



    I suppose true christians are against abortion because it goes against the commandment 'Thou Shalt Not Kill' (or whatever)
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  40. #40
    Randalf the Red honeybee's Avatar
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    Well ...

    Originally posted by BodwadUK
    Off HB goes again about bloody iraq!!!!!



    I suppose true christians are against abortion because it goes against the commandment 'Thou Shalt Not Kill' (or whatever)
    I am just plain pissed off to see these people fighting for a ban on abortions under the pretext of "thou shalt not kill", but they don't mind a massacre of innocent children and people (mind you almost all of them over 12 weeks of age ) under the pretext of war.

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    Last edited by honeybee; Jan 30th, 2003 at 07:45 AM.
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