How to deal with trolls...

These post where extracted from this thread in the General Developers forum. If you guys want to discuss trolling then do it here in the Chit Chat forum.


simplebhe had posted a reply which was a copy of the reply number #2 above. To just copy an earlier reply is a trick new members sometimes use to make it look like they have a valid response and their posts are then approved (since the first couple of posts for new members have to be approved). They later go back and edit their response to post spam. I deleted his/her reply and another similar copy in another thread and banned the user, but not until after their post had been approved by some other moderator and that's why you got the notification.

Wow. I had no idea you had to deal with such devious tactics. It's really sad that a few twisted misfits and mental patients ruin it for everyone else.

I happened to catch part of an NPR (radio) show as I was driving home yesterday afternoon. It was about online discourse and how to deal with trolls (people whose only purpose is to inflame and disrupt). They were discussing the challenge of filtering out the chaff without eliminating the wheat. One person opined that the only effective solution is to eliminate anonymity. One way is to require a credit card (even if not actually charged). Another is to require a login via some other service, such as Facebook. Both of those have their own problems and would deter valuable people who have a legitimate reason for not disclosing their true identity to an unfiltered public.

Thanks for the hard work you do to keep this place clean and free of slime.

I've never understood why people get all bent up over trolls. They've never bothered me one iota. Then again, I may be biased since I'm one hell of a troll myself. I've trolled just about every site I've ever made an account on except for here and ZDoom.org. I've trolled 4chan, Facebook, Iccup.com, Yahoo Answers, Bible Chat City and my favorite, Teamliquid.net. I have like 20 banned accounts on Teamliquid alone. I wanted to make Stormfront my lastest victim but I hear that anti-terrorist organizations monitor such sites. I don't want my IP on anybody's "bad" list lol.

I will say this however, the best way to deal with trolls is to pretend they don't exist. There's nothing I hate more than than being ignored after dispensing a serious piece of flamebait while expecting a frenzy. Even worse when people actual have a level headed and civilized discussion about whatever flamebait I spewed. It gets boring and I tend to leave. Take it from one, trolls get off on causing contention.

That may be the most amazing post I have read on here. I have never heard of anybody being a deliberate troll. I always thought it was something they were born to.

I was going to post something about how I have moved away from using the Not word for anything other than bit manipulations (where there is no viable alternative), but after re-reading the thread, I felt that it was off the point. One thing I will say is that early in .NET there was a measurable performance difference between these two statements:

If someBool Then

and

If someBool = False Then

which was really pretty impressive. I later repeated the test using .NET2005 and found that the difference was gone. Therefore, writing in the negative doesn't have any cost any longer.

(I'm also impressed that somebody would edit their post to fix a typo, and add a comment stating that they did so, but that's another matter).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker

That may be the most amazing post I have read on here. I have never heard of anybody being a deliberate troll. I always thought it was something they were born to.

---

Trolls aren't born, they're forged in the fires of the great insanities that run boundless on the internet. Seriously, 95% of the people you can interact on the 'net are nutty. Its just much better for your mental well being not to take them seriously.

I'll describe some of the truly loony stuff that I've found on the list of sites I posted above:-

Yahoo Answers -
When you see the questions, you wonder if the askers are themselves trolling. The questions there are so retarded that I'm not certain that I can capture just how much so in a contrived example.

Facebook -
My adventures there made me realize just how utterly uninteresting and devoid of character most people really are. EVERY single FB post is either (1) Some girl posting idiotic pictures of herself in the bathroom or clumsily attempting a seductive pose all in the hopes that the 100+ horny boys will shower her with compliments....(2) Horny boys showering barely average girls with unending compliments!!!....(3) People copy-pasting quotes they find on the internet so they can look smart to their 500+ friends........That's all there is to FB. They're just begging to be trolled.

TeamLiquid.Net -
I found this site back in my video game days when I played Brood War. I was repeatedly getting my bum kicked online and figured there must be some place I can go where people can tell me how to win. Found TL. Seemed like a decent enough place...Well, it turns out that their membership is made up of the most obnoxious and downright childish people you will ever come across. These guys take themselves far too seriously and will ban you at the drop of a hat for disagreeing with them even if you expressed your contrary idea in a polite manner. After briefly being the center of a couple mini-flame wars with some of the members there because apparently I'm not allowed to disagree with the general census on anything there, it hit me that the vast majority of members there are full grown men that play video games 16 hours a day and think there's nothing wrong with that. Some of them even dream of playing video games for a living. Of course these people are nuts!

Ah wait....But here the best part. The pinnacle of their insanity!! They got a transexual or a crossdresser or whatever they're called as a member over there and their mods ban anyone who doesn't pretend that he is a she. I mean you can't even mention it. Not even with admiration(HE is a highly skilled member and quite respected there). He just decided one day he wanted to be a girl and just like that everyone has to pretend along with him that he is a girl or be banned. I mean come on, that is just insane. How can I ever take these people seriously. They soon became my favorite place to troll as they're so easy to rile up. Say anything that's too candidly adult there and sit back and watch as they whip themselves into a frenzy of rage at the idea that the somebody actually has the audacity to lay siege to their happy, naive little world view. Definitely one of the most nutty forums out there and the most fun to troll.

4Chan -
This place is just a looney bin. The difference with 4Chan though is that the members know they're loony and revel in it. Its like a site where people are in constant completion for the highest aspirations of insanity. Its pretty entertaining if you got thick skin. Its a site made for trolls.

Bible Chat City
Well, I troll Christians in real life so of course I'm gonna troll them online;) I'm sick of people lumping their ridiculous bronze age myths on me trying to pass them off as truth and expecting me to actually accept it without thinking. Its insulting to my intelligence. But I can't make them stop, so I might as well have fun with it. I had endless laughs trolling BCC. Whenever I'm in a bad mood, I just go there raise hell. Its very therapeutic :)

All in all, I troll because you just can't stop obnoxious stupidity, that brand of idiocy that takes itself way too seriously and even tries to convince you its wisdom. Worrying about it will only make you grey. So why not use it for entertainment. That's my philosophy --- Take no one on the internet seriously(Except for VBForumers ;)) and have fun at the expense of those who do, especially if they're loony.

So, that's "fight looney with looney"?

Moved "trolling" posts to the Chit Chat forum since they have nothing to do with handling Null conditions.
If you guys are really serious and even proud to be trolls then I petty you, but feel free to discuss it here in Chit Chat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennifer Murphy

So, that's "fight looney with with looney"?

---

No since:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sane Troll

If adult people take themselves to seriously and waste their life and time on looney things then the only sane thing for me to do is to chase them down, find where they have their discussions, create an account and then tell them how looney they are. When they ban me I just loop back and create a new account. That's not looney, someone have to spend their complete life and time and dedicate themselves in educating the crazy people so that they know that they (in my opinion) are looney... How else would they know? But sometimes even "regular" people say looney things, for example... well, anything that I don't agree with, and they have to know that I don't agree with that. It's important for them to know that I don't agree, because my opinion is so much more important than theirs (because they are wrong).

What? Yes, I'm completely sane. Yes I am! SHUT UP!

---

:)

Trolls are what Yoopers call those of us living under the bridge.

Sorry, regional humor.

Then maybe we can recruit you to play the part of the troll in a reenactment of The Three Little Billy Goats Gruff. What say you?

"Trip, trap, trip, trap! " went the bridge.

"Who's that tripping over my bridge?" roared the troll.

"Oh, it is only I, the tiniest Billy Goat Gruff , and I'm going up to the hillside to make myself fat," said the billy goat, with such a small voice.

Excellent! You're hired. (The pay is rather meager.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennifer Murphy

Excellent! You're hired. (The pay is rather meager.)

---

Sounds like a lot of contracts I get in this age of globalization.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennifer Murphy

So, that's "fight looney with looney"?

---

No!!! Totally wrong :eek: You don't troll by telling crazy people they're crazy. That's just being argumentative. Its about a certain thought provoking subtlety, sometimes even being crazy yourself. I can't really put into words. An example would serve better.

Here is a contrived example of trolling Christians:-

Code:

---

C1  : Jesus is really a savior. He helped me through my messy divorce.
C2  : Yea, he is awesome isn't he ?
Troll: Hi, guys I how are you all today ?
C1  : Fine and you ?
Troll: Fine I guess....
Troll: Actually, I have a problem and was wondering if I can solicit some serious advice.
C1  : How can we help you ?
Troll: I may be in need of some spiritual guidance.
Troll: You see, I bought a goat yesterday right ?
C2  : Go on.
Troll: And ever since that fateful day. I keep having sinful thoughts.
C1  : Well, that's why you need to pray. The lord can loves you and he will certainly come to aid if you give yourself to him.
Troll: Yea, I guess.
C2  : What sinful thoughts are you having ?
Troll: Well I sexually fantasize about this goat. The way its fur glitters in the sun just give me this primal urge, you know ?
C1  : Wow
C2  : Seriously ?
C1  : Well Jesus is willing.
Troll: That's the thing. I don't want to purge my sinful thoughts. Do you think I can ask Jesus to accept me the way I am ?
C2  : Ok this guy is a troll. Troll is not the place for this kind of talk. You need help.
Troll: That's why I'm here. And I'm not a troll. I mean I sure you've had thoughts about nailing your dog from time to time. You won't see me judging! I thought you guys were not supposed to judge.
C1  : Oh my God!! You're sick.
Troll: I don't think I am. Don't you fantasize about your pets C1 ? Come on, I know you did at least once right ?

[Troll has been banned]

---

Now that example is totally contrived but it captures the spirit of what trolling is about. Notice the troll doesn't actually try to argue sensibly with them or call them names or anything like that. His entire angle is to undermine their own thought processes by starting off in a typical fashion that they're used to and eventually introducing some subtle insanity into it that they don't quite know how to process. It evokes an emotional reaction as a result. The best trolls can take even the most civilized and intelligent discussion and turn it into a total train wreck. Its true art is subtlety.

However, all trolling is not bad or malignant in nature. TheImp's thread in chit-chat about the 60 Kb Office thingy is a good example of a benign troll thread where everyone is in on the joke.

So the next time you see a guy register to call people names, know that he is not a troll. He's just being stupid.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Joacim Andersson

If you guys are really serious and even proud to be trolls then I petty you, but feel free to discuss it here in Chit Chat.

---

Trolling to me is nothing more than a form of entertainment like watching movies or listening music. I do it in time I've designated for such mindless distractions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Joacim Andersson

No since:

Quote:

---

If adult people take themselves to seriously and waste their life and time on looney things then the only sane thing for me to do is to chase them down, find where they have their discussions, create an account and then tell them how looney they are. When they ban me I just loop back and create a new account. That's not looney, someone have to spend their complete life and time and dedicate themselves in educating the crazy people so that they know that they (in my opinion) are looney... How else would they know? But sometimes even "regular" people say looney things, for example... well, anything that I don't agree with, and they have to know that I don't agree with that. It's important for them to know that I don't agree, because my opinion is so much more important than theirs (because they are wrong).

What? Yes, I'm completely sane. Yes I am! SHUT UP!
:)

---

---

Like I said above, its not about calling insane people insane. Sometimes, it can be about undermining obvious insanity with polite logic and watching it all go to hell ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

I've never understood why people get all bent up over trolls. They've never bothered me one iota. Then again, I may be biased since I'm one hell of a troll myself. I've trolled just about every site I've ever made an account on except for here and ZDoom.org. I've trolled 4chan, Facebook, Iccup.com, Yahoo Answers, Bible Chat City and my favorite, Teamliquid.net. I have like 20 banned accounts on Teamliquid alone. I wanted to make Stormfront my lastest victim but I hear that anti-terrorist organizations monitor such sites. I don't want my IP on anybody's "bad" list lol.

I will say this however, the best way to deal with trolls is to pretend they don't exist. There's nothing I hate more than than being ignored after dispensing a serious piece of flamebait while expecting a frenzy. Even worse when people actual have a level headed and civilized discussion about whatever flamebait I spewed. It gets boring and I tend to leave. Take it from one, trolls get off on causing contention.

---

Look at it like this...take away being an anonymous avatar posting safely behind a protective wall not really responsible for what you are saying. Imagine you and the same people on the forum are in a room together having a similar discussion face to face. Now break into your troll behavior. Hopefully you would see what a jerk you are being.

Flip that around now and you are in that room full of people having a discussion and someone else breaks into their troll behavior. What would you think about them? If it is just some immature kid you could chalk it up to that and hope they grow up some day. If they are already an adult all you could think is “what an a**hole!”.

I've been thinking about this. I'm certainly of the opinion that pomposity needs *****ing from time to time and in that context you could argue that trolling (at least as far as Niya is describing it) is essentially a form satire. Satire has a long and fine tradition and I think most of us wouldn't have a problem with it.

The thing is, though, that satire is only useful when it's deftly and insightfully aimed and carried out. If it isn't deft or insightful it just comes across as childish and makes the troll look more ridiculous than the trollee. Of course, what constitutes deft and insightful is entirely subjective. For example, I find the last example Niya gave to be way too blunt (and certainly not subtle)... but I can see where other's might disagree. After all, the early Ali G interviews were some of the best satire I've seen in decades but I'm willing to bet alot of people thought they were just purile.

The 60kb office thread is an interesting example. I'm genuinely unsure whether TheImp is trolling or not. If all we had to go on was the thread I would have no doubt about it at all but there's so much "packaging" that I'm left uncertain. There's code that does do what he's claiming... sort of, theres a web site with a frankly insane blog on it, there's a facebook page and so on. If he is a troll then he's put plenty of effort into his back-story and, at that point, I'm kind of inclined to applaud him. If you're going to satirise coders then that's a worthy effort. What's less amusing in that thread, to me at least, is some of the troll-like response. Much of the response seems to have required no effort, thought or imagination at all and is certainly neither deft, subtle or insightful. It's not satire. And if it's not satire then it's really just self-agrandising noise.


edit> I got caught by the language filter there and, in hindsight, I can see why. What I was attempting to describe was an action one might carry out on a balloon using a pin. I guess the language filter though I was using it in a different context.:lol:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

The best trolls can take even the most civilized and intelligent discussion and turn it into a total train wreck. Its true art is subtlety.

---

What redeeming social value is there in turning a "civilized and intelligent discussion" into a train wreck. How is that helping anyone or adding anything to anything?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

Trolling to me is nothing more than a form of entertainment like watching movies or listening [to] music. I do it in time I've designated for such mindless distractions.

---

For me, one important difference is where this happens and who initiates it. If one of these "Christians", who seem to get under your skin so much, were to come into your arena and start spewing mindless religiosity, I would think you would have some justification for taking them on. But you are purposely (and repeatedly) going into their arena for the sole purpose of being disruptive for your own self gratification. It's ironic that you chose the goat example (though I think the classic animal is a sheep). What you are doing seems like just that sort of self stimulation, but without the goat. Are you not using these people and their forum like the person in your example is using the goat? (I wonder what Freud would have to say about all this?)

Where do we draw the line. You seem to be saying that you have the right (seems like you see it as your mission) to seek out people who espouse beliefs that you find silly or offensive and throw a grenade in the middle of their community even though they are not doing anything to you or anyone else. They are just having a discussion amongst themselves. I know people who think that "techies" are weird, immature, and even a bit of a pox on society. Are they justified in coming over here and trying to be as disruptive as possible in the cleverest way possible? Are they justified in signing up account after account actually hoping to be banned?

I cannot see anything useful or beneficial about what you are doing for anyone. But I will have to give you a few points for being unabashedly honest.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

No!!! Totally wrong :eek: You don't troll by telling crazy people they're crazy. That's just being argumentative. Its about a certain thought provoking subtlety, sometimes even being crazy yourself. I can't really put into words. An example would serve better.

Here is a contrived example of trolling Christians:-

Code:

---

C1  : Jesus is really a savior. He helped me through my messy divorce.
C2  : Yea, he is awesome isn't he ?
Troll: Hi, guys I how are you all today ?
C1  : Fine and you ?
Troll: Fine I guess....
Troll: Actually, I have a problem and was wondering if I can solicit some serious advice.
C1  : How can we help you ?
Troll: I may be in need of some spiritual guidance.
Troll: You see, I bought a goat yesterday right ?
C2  : Go on.
Troll: And ever since that fateful day. I keep having sinful thoughts.
C1  : Well, that's why you need to pray. The lord can loves you and he will certainly come to aid if you give yourself to him.
Troll: Yea, I guess.
C2  : What sinful thoughts are you having ?
Troll: Well I sexually fantasize about this goat. The way its fur glitters in the sun just give me this primal urge, you know ?
C1  : Wow
C2  : Seriously ?
C1  : Well Jesus is willing.
Troll: That's the thing. I don't want to purge my sinful thoughts. Do you think I can ask Jesus to accept me the way I am ?
C2  : Ok this guy is a troll. Troll is not the place for this kind of talk. You need help.
Troll: That's why I'm here. And I'm not a troll. I mean I sure you've had thoughts about nailing your dog from time to time. You won't see me judging! I thought you guys were not supposed to judge.
C1  : Oh my God!! You're sick.
Troll: I don't think I am. Don't you fantasize about your pets C1 ? Come on, I know you did at least once right ?

[Troll has been banned]

---

Now that example is totally contrived but it captures the spirit of what trolling is about. Notice the troll doesn't actually try to argue sensibly with them or call them names or anything like that. His entire angle is to undermine their own thought processes by starting off in a typical fashion that they're used to and eventually introducing some subtle insanity into it that they don't quite know how to process. It evokes an emotional reaction as a result. The best trolls can take even the most civilized and intelligent discussion and turn it into a total train wreck. Its true art is subtlety.

However, all trolling is not bad or malignant in nature. TheImp's thread in chit-chat about the 60 Kb Office thingy is a good example of a benign troll thread where everyone is in on the joke.

So the next time you see a guy register to call people names, know that he is not a troll. He's just being stupid.



Trolling to me is nothing more than a form of entertainment like watching movies or listening music. I do it in time I've designated for such mindless distractions.



Like I said above, its not about calling insane people insane. Sometimes, it can be about undermining obvious insanity with polite logic and watching it all go to hell ;)

---

Amen! I loved that bit... and can see it actually playing out...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TysonLPrice

Look at it like this...take away being an anonymous avatar posting safely behind a protective wall not really responsible for what you are saying. Imagine you and the same people on the forum are in a room together having a similar discussion face to face. Now break into your troll behavior. Hopefully you would see what a jerk you are being.

Flip that around now and you are in that room full of people having a discussion and someone else breaks into their troll behavior. What would you think about them? If it is just some immature kid you could chalk it up to that and hope they grow up some day. If they are already an adult all you could think is “what an a**hole!”.

---

Nope... it's not about being a jerk... I've done this in real life... during "sensitivity" training at boot camp no less... I asked a simple question... "why was it OK for one black person to call another a niggga, and I can't? Mean while I'm not allowed to use Cracker even when in reference to myself?" - note: I am a cracker... I learned long ago that alleged derogatory terms only hold power if you let it... so I embraced cracker....
I then sat back and watched the magic unfold in front of me. I think we spent the remaining 30 minutes of class on that one subject alone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennifer Murphy

What redeeming social value is there in turning a "civilized and intelligent discussion" into a train wreck. How is that helping anyone or adding anything to anything?


For me, one important difference is where this happens and who initiates it. If one of these "Christians", who seem to get under your skin so much, were to come into your arena and start spewing mindless religiosity, I would think you would have some justification for taking them on. But you are purposely (and repeatedly) going into their arena for the sole purpose of being disruptive for your own self gratification. It's ironic that you chose the goat example (though I think the classic animal is a sheep). What you are doing seems like just that sort of self stimulation, but without the goat. Are you not using these people and their forum like the person in your example is using the goat? (I wonder what Freud would have to say about all this?)

Where do we draw the line. You seem to be saying that you have the right (seems like you see it as your mission) to seek out people who espouse beliefs that you find silly or offensive and throw a grenade in the middle of their community even though they are not doing anything to you or anyone else. They are just having a discussion amongst themselves. I know people who think that "techies" are weird, immature, and even a bit of a pox on society. Are they justified in coming over here and trying to be as disruptive as possible in the cleverest way possible? Are they justified in signing up account after account actually hoping to be banned?

I cannot see anything useful or beneficial about what you are doing for anyone. But I will have to give you a few points for being unabashedly honest.

---

Because like Funky noted... sometimes some people need their perceptions popped. By your logic we should just sit back accept what ever spews forth and just go "that's nice" with no debate... I don't accept that... I AM going to challenge people from time to time... even if it means I play devil's advocate... People need to challenge each other's believes and perceptions from time to time... At the same time we also need to realize when we're being poked at and either learn how to turn the tables, change the subject or simply move on. The contrived chat is an example of those who haven't figured that out... and that's partly what makes that amusing.

And I'm just as much of a troll and flame baiter in life as I am online. In fact, I'm probably less so online.
Sometimes it's about entertainment, sometimes it's about giving someone a taste of their own medicine (speaking of Christians, some of the most insensitive, intolerant people I know are Christians) sometimes it's about pointing out something glaring and obvious without explicitly pointing and laughing. And other times, for some people, there is just no other way to deal with them.

-tg

To me what is the key issue here is the feeling of invincibility anonymity seems to empower people with. “invincibility” probably isn’t the right word. People will post things behind the cover of secrecy they would normally not say to someone’s face. Pull them out of the mob and they revert to who they really are.

I can respect someone that would say these things in person for whatever their reasons are for doing it. Hiding behind an avatar to do it, and especially when it is mainly unwanted noise, is childish.

"it's not about being a jerk... I've done this in real life"

I rest my case your Honor :D

Oops...I guess I'm trolling...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TysonLPrice

To me what is the key issue here is the feeling of invincibility anonymity seems to empower people with. “invincibility” probably isn’t the right word. People will post things behind the cover of secrecy they would normally not say to someone’s face. Pull them out of the mob and they revert to who they really are.

---

I think it may be the other way 'round. In a social setting with peer pressure and consequences, most people moderate their behavior. Anonymity, like alcohol and the mob, removes inhibitions. I would say that the less chance of consequences, the most likely to see uninhibited behavior. I suppose it could be debated whether that is the "real" person, but at least it's the less filtered person.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TysonLPrice

To me what is the key issue here is the feeling of invincibility anonymity seems to empower people with. “invincibility” probably isn’t the right word. People will post things behind the cover of secrecy they would normally not say to someone’s face. Pull them out of the mob and they revert to who they really are.

I can respect someone that would say these things in person for whatever their reasons are for doing it. Hiding behind an avatar to do it, and especially when it is mainly unwanted noise, is childish.

"it's not about being a jerk... I've done this in real life"

I rest my case your Honor :D

Oops...I guess I'm trolling...

---

Ooooh.... a wise guy eh? *bonk**pokes Tyson in the eyes* nyuck nyuck nyuck...

-tg

With apologies to Styx:

Quote:

---

♫
I'm trolling away
Setting up straw men and insanity
Cause I'm feeling blasé
Free to cause strife in the community
I'm bored, can't contribute
Don't have a clue
We'll thrash and we'll argue
In every thread
And I'll try, oh man, I'll try
To trash this place
♫

---

Tech and Funky pretty much nailed it. People sometimes need to be brought down a few notches. No one says it has to be all serious and formal. And if someone can't take a hit and roll with and maybe have some fun with it, then that's their own fault. They choose to take offense.

Nevertheless, I want to address a couple things here:-

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennifer Murphy

Where do we draw the line. You seem to be saying that you have the right (seems like you see it as your mission) to seek out people who espouse beliefs that you find silly or offensive and throw a grenade in the middle of their community even though they are not doing anything to you or anyone else.

---

You're making the same mistake troll victims make, taking things way too seriously. First of all, I'm not on any mission except for increasing dopamine levels in my brain. Don't think that just because I think Christians are loony that I won't troll Atheists if given the chance, even though I agree with them. Its not about championing any particular ideology. Its about the entertainment derived from the hilarity that ensues when you remind overly self-important people that...well...they're not really that important. If people stopped taking themselves so seriously online....Trolling would not be so entertaining and would thus lose its appeal.

The most perfect example of how to handle trolling I can think of is that whole Donald Trump/Barack Obama birther fiasco. Donald started trolling Barry hard about his birth certificate. Now Barry could have gotten all butt hurt and emotional, but he didn't. What did he do ? He waited for old Donald and utterly humiliated him at that dinner thing by showing him how petty he was through his own form of trolling. Barack Obama doesn't take himself too seriously. He knows he is only human and has limits. He knows that even though he is the most powerful man in the world that he is not above being a target for criticism and doubt.. He has the right frame of mind. That's why he is such an electric and charming public figure. Humility is the medicine for trolling.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennifer Murphy

I know people who think that "techies" are weird, immature, and even a bit of a pox on society. Are they justified in coming over here and trying to be as disruptive as possible in the cleverest way possible?

---

"Oh yea, I'm weird as hell. I count all my rice grains before I consume it and I like to eat dirt too. And I'm not a pox....I'm a SUPER-POX!!! This techie is the most incurable pox there is. And I come in different flavors too...oh my I think I'm a lil crazy too ;)"

Now tell me just how is a troll going to derive entertainment from someone who not only agrees with him but amplifies his views as well. And on a good day, I might even sing him praises for being able to assess my character so well. Ain;t nothing more annoying to a troll than victims that don't bite his trollbait....at least not in the way he expects. If people wanna come here and troll, lol I say let em. Won't bother me one bit....It'll be fun.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

Tech and Funky pretty much nailed it. People sometimes need to be brought down a few notches. No one says it has to be all serious and formal. And if someone can't take a hit and roll with and maybe have some fun with it, then that's their own fault. They choose to take offense.

Nevertheless, I want to address a couple things here:-



You're making the same mistake troll victims make, taking things way too seriously. First of all, I'm not on any mission except for increasing dopamine levels in my brain. Don't think that just because I think Christians are loony that I won't troll Atheists if given the chance, even though I agree with them. Its not about championing any particular ideology. Its about the entertainment derived from the hilarity that ensues when you remind overly self-important people that...well...they're not really that important. If people stopped taking themselves so seriously online....Trolling would not be so entertaining and would thus lose its appeal.

The most perfect example of how to handle trolling I can think of is that whole Donald Trump/Barack Obama birther fiasco. Donald started trolling Barry hard about his birth certificate. Now Barry could have gotten all butt hurt and emotional, but he didn't. What did he do ? He waited for old Donald and utterly humiliated him at that dinner thing by showing him how petty he was through his own form of trolling. Barack Obama doesn't take himself too seriously. He knows he is only human and has limits. He knows that even though he is the most powerful man in the world that he is not above being a target for criticism and doubt.. He has the right frame of mind. That's why he is such an electric and charming public figure. Humility is the medicine for trolling.



"Oh yea, I'm weird as hell. I count all my rice grains before I consume it and I like to eat dirt too. And I'm not a pox....I'm a SUPER-POX!!! This techie is the most incurable pox there is. And I come in different flavors too...oh my I think I'm a lil crazy too ;)"

Now tell me just how is a troll going to derive entertainment from someone who not only agrees with him but amplifies his views as well. And on a good day, I might even sing him praises for being able to assess my character so well. Ain;t nothing more annoying to a troll than victims that don't bite his trollbait....at least not in the way he expects. If people wanna come here and troll, lol I say let em. Won't bother me one bit....It'll be fun.

---

I guess part of this is about how you define trolling. To me it always has a negative connotation. You seem to consider it, to some extent, lighthearted jesting or trying to lighten people up. I consider them people who are deliberately trying to disrupt conversations with inane or insulting posts. I think the way I see it is the generally accepted definition.

Bottom line: Please don’t feed the trolls!



I'll post this but it might be too big: It is from here: http://netforbeginners.about.com/od/...rnet-troll.htm

Question: What Is an Internet 'Troll'? How Should I Deal With Trolls?
Answer: An internet 'troll' is an abusive or obnoxious user who uses shock value to promote arguments and disharmony in online communities. Named after the wicked troll creatures of children's tales, an internet troll is someone who stirs up drama and abuses their online anonymity by purposely sowing hatred, bigotry, racism, mysogyny, or just simple bickering between others. Trolls like a big audience, so they frequent blog sites, news sites, discussion forums, and game chat. Trolls thrive in any environment where they are allowed to make public comments.

At the lighter end of the troll spectrum, trolls can be personal friends who like to goad and joke with their buddies online. In this case, 'trolling' will mean 'stop hassling me, or I won't invite you to my birthday party'.

At the harsher end of the troll spectrum, trolls are cruel and malicious users who want to set an online community on fire with hate and discord.

The Sad Truths of Internet Trolls:


1.Trolls are immune to criticism and logical arguments. True trolls cannot be reasoned with, regardless of how sound your logical argument is.
2.Trolls do not feel remorse like you and me. They have sociopathic tendencies, and accordingly, they delight in other people having hurt feelings.
3.Trolls consider themselves separate from the social order.
4.Trolls do not abide by etiquette or the rules of common courtesy.
5.Trolls consider themselves above social responsibility.
6.Trolls gain energy by you insulting them.
7.Trolls gain energy when you get angry.
8.The only way to deal with a troll is to ignore him, or take away his ability to post online.


How Should I Deal With Internet Trolls?

You cannot win with a troll. Publicly retaliating against them just fuels their childish need for attention. There are only 3 reliable ways to deal with trolls, all of which focus on removing their audience, removing their power, and depriving them of the attention they seek.


1.For a casual or emergent troll: completely ignore the person's postings. While it is difficult for most users to to let a troll have the last word, this tactic successfully takes the wind out of a casual troll's sails.
2.For repeating troll offenders: report them to the moderators of the system. If enough people report the toll, this will often prompt the moderators to take action (see number 3 below)
3.Have the moderators take away the troll's ability to post online. This will commonly mean that the troll is kicked from the system, or blocked by IP address. Even better is when the troll is allowed to continue posting, but unbeknownst to him: all of his postings are deleted from everyone else's view. This will lure the troll into wasting his efforts while still feeling proud of his childish antics. This moderator move is sometimes called 'muting' or 'bonzo-ing' the offender.


What Are Some Examples of Internet Trolling?

Ans: here are two examples of trolls abusing other people and their online communities:
•Example: a troll named 'Nimrod Severn' trolls Facebook and spreads hateful messages on memorium pages.
•Example: a troll named 'C. Fang' incites forum arguments over anti-diversity and anti-multiculturalism


Where Do You Find Internet Trolls?

Ans: internet trolls are sadly common. They can be found wherever online users interact with each other. Trolls will abuse others in news blogs, political discussion forums, hobbyist communities online, Facebook pages, torrent search engine conversations, and in online game chat. Trolls have become very common in news sites. Many online news sources now avoid using open comment features because so many internet trolls will use this venue to post abusive comments as responses to news articles.

How Exactly Do Internet Trolls Abuse Others?

Ans: internet trolls seek to be disruptive and hurtful by using any of the following techniques:
1.Trolls will post abusive and hurtful comments directed at a specific person (aka "flaming" another person)
2.Trolls will incite broad arguments and provoke angry responses by making controversial statements. (e.g. racism, religious intolerance, bigoted or elitist views, mysogyny, extreme political views)
3.Trolls will narcissistically dominate conversations, trying to make themselves the center of attention. (e.g. nonstop comments about themselves and their accomplishments; repeated self-centered statements and bragging)
4.Trolls will start many off-topic threads, seeking to derail users from the focus of an online community.


Why Do People Enjoy Being Internet Trolls?

Ans: it is a kind of power rush or ego trip to be a troll. Being online is a place that is largely free of perceived consequences... an insecure person can get a sense of power online, without ever having to face someone directly. With the Internet being a world of imagination and fantasy for some, cowardly users can forge an alter ego for themselves, and act out their feelings of anger and inadequacy. It's sad and unfortunate that our advanced communications also brings out the darker side of many people.

Niya, I think you are taking the wrong lesson from what you are doing. If you take your alleged pseudo-example (it seems quite plausible to me, so I wonder just how phony it really is), you aren't really doing what you said you were doing (I'm too lazy to go back and find your actual quote). What you are really doing is pointing out a contradiction in a set of beliefs. This is not appreciated in ANY setting, but it is highly valuable in nearly EVERY setting.

We never really understand the world around us, nor do we ever really understand any programming problem. All we ever do is build up mental models to represent the world, then act on those mental models. To some extent, every one of those models fails to accurately represent reality, but it is relatively common for a group of people to accept a common mental model (though each individual has an actual understanding of that model that differs from all other members of the group). As a general rule, we need those models to be able to function in the world, but we often fall into the mistake of believing that our mental models ARE reality rather than just an imperfect representation of reality. All you were doing with that trolling example was exposing a flaw in the model held in common by some set of people. I think Socrates used the exact same technique, and did so in the same way (at least, that's my mental model of what he was doing). Had you opened with stating that you wanted to show that they had a flawed model, they would assume that you were an enemy to their views and would pre-reject whatever you had to say. From that perspective, they would reject even reasonable things you said (you see this in politics nearly every day). Instead, you open by posing as a co-believer in the model so that they accept you, then extend the model in a logical fashion to the point where you expose a contradiction in the model (even a casual student of the bible would see that Jesus both loved and hated people with fairly equal fervor, and he certainly wasn't always accepting or forgiving). Socrates made use of this technique to tear apart people's understanding of the world around them. As programmers, we are generally pretty used to doing the same thing to ourselves when working on difficult problems.

Whether it is good or bad to highlight the flaws in the mental models we use to view the world is entirely situational. I don't think it is inherently right or inherently wrong. At times it is necessary, since it is the source of inspiration and understanding, but since the mental models allow us to function in this world, there are times they have to be left alone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

The 60kb office thread is an interesting example. I'm genuinely unsure whether TheImp is trolling or not. If all we had to go on was the thread I would have no doubt about it at all but there's so much "packaging" that I'm left uncertain. There's code that does do what he's claiming... sort of, theres a web site with a frankly insane blog on it, there's a facebook page and so on. If he is a troll then he's put plenty of effort into his back-story and, at that point, I'm kind of inclined to applaud him. If you're going to satirise coders then that's a worthy effort. What's less amusing in that thread, to me at least, is some of the troll-like response. Much of the response seems to have required no effort, thought or imagination at all and is certainly neither deft, subtle or insightful. It's not satire. And if it's not satire then it's really just self-agrandising noise.

---

You are clearly forgetting Moti Barski and his AI thread: http://www.vbforums.com/showthread.p...ht=moti+barski
and his battle programming manual which is up to the 12th edition now (Mar 27th, 2012) http://pastebin.com/w0K9hh9q
correction 16th edition (http://yotamarker.justforum.net/t65-...g-16th-edition).
I found his new hang out (recent posts by him) on his own battle programming site, how appropriate: http://yotamarker.justforum.net/f3-battle-programming
He was banned from go4expert.com, I wonder why? http://www.go4expert.com/member.php?u=81247
His AI thread took over the forums for 28 pages over 7 months.

By contrast iMp, in his two troll threads (the other is here:http://www.vbforums.com/showthread.p...for-Microsoft-!!) has taken over the forums for 40 pages over an entire year, and still going, which makes iMp the all time VB forums troll champion!!!!

@dilettante: I liked the lyrics. Way to pick up styx.

I liked your Socrates reference Shaggy.

Quote:

---

Tech and Funky pretty much nailed it. People sometimes need to be brought down a few notches. No one says it has to be all serious and formal. And if someone can't take a hit and roll with and maybe have some fun with it, then that's their own fault. They choose to take offense.

---

Woah there, Nelly. I do not want to become a flag bearer for the sort of inane trolling I've seen in the 60Kb Office thread recently. I've always been a fan of the bon mot, the incisive and perfectly timed put down or the clever way of holding up a mirror to the world to betray the ridiculous. Aggressive and dull behaviour requiring no intelligence and providing no insight is dull and boorish. If anyone's going to use me to support their argument I want that distinction clearly understood first.

I think Tyson touched on the distinction here:-

Quote:

---

I guess part of this is about how you define trolling. To me it always has a negative connotation. You seem to consider it, to some extent, lighthearted jesting or trying to lighten people up. I consider them people who are deliberately trying to disrupt conversations with inane or insulting posts.

---

If you're defining trolling as the former I've got no problem with it, it lightens the mood. If you're defining it as the latter I start getting pretty uncomrfortable with it.

I think there are a very few occasions where someone needs a good insulting to bring them back down to earth but I think those occasions are VERY few and are pretty much limited to politicians and public figures who've chosen to put themselves in the public firing line. I don't think that extends to the general rank and file of the rest of us common mortals though. Rather I think what we merit is something far less directly insulting. Holding us up as a bit ridiculous and overblown is fine, insulting us is not. Because if everyone is insulted every time they try to express an opinion then pretty soon everyone who cares what anyone else thinks will stop expressing opinions. At that point I suspect nothing but bigotry would remain.

So I guess my qualifications for "goood trolling." would be three fold:-
1. It has to make a point worth making.
2. It has to be clever and funny.
3. It has to stop short of actually insulting or abusing some someone (though bursting their bubble is fine).

Realistically, once something's met those three criteria I think it's highly debatable whether you could define it as trolling or not. I think I'd probably define it as satire rather than trolling but I think the boundaries so blurred I'm happy to go with whichever definition suits the discussion.

For the record I think I'm pretty pompous myself (hell, I was talking about the "bon mot" earlier and if that's not pompous I don't know what is) so you can take this as an open invitation to anyone to give me a damn good *****ing (and I know I'm going to get caught by the profanity filter againt with that one but I couldn't resist it). You have to obey my three rules though: point worth making; clever and funny; not actually insulting. Anyone who can do that is welcome but if I can come back with a line that's funnier than your's then I win.:p

Quote:

---

You are clearly forgetting Moti Barski and his AI thread

---

No I'm not, that was one of my all time Chit Chat threads. But I wouldn't have considered Moti a troll. Like the Imp I was left completely bemused as to whether he was pulling our leg or just wonderfully, benignly nutty as a bottle of chips. If he was pulling our legs then he'd put a huge amount of effort in. He had you tube videos. He'd written the maddest book I've ever read. He probably had a rubber girl-freind. Hell, he even had T-Shirts printed. And all of it was wonderfully insane. And I don't think I saw him once insult or abuse another member (although he did seem to carry a negative rep but I never saw that posts that earned it for him so I can't judge them). If he was pullig our legs then he didn't seem to be trying to make us look ridiculous, he was making himself look ridiculous. That's in the fine tradition of clowns through the ages. If that's trolling then long live trolling because it frequently had me holding my ribs with laughter. Even when I wasn't laughing I found myself thoroughly engaged.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

No I'm not, that was one of my all time Chit Chat threads. But I wouldn't have considered Moti a troll. Like the Imp I was left completely bemused as to whether he was pulling our leg or just wonderfully, benignly nutty as a bottle of chips.

---

Out of interest, have any of those letters that promise to release millions of dollars of cash to you after you pay them a small transaction fee ever paid out? Or are you still waiting for them to get back to you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

If he was pulling our legs then he'd put a huge amount of effort in. He had you tube videos. He'd written the maddest book I've ever read. He probably had a rubber girl-freind. Hell, he even had T-Shirts printed. And all of it was wonderfully insane. And I don't think I saw him once insult or abuse another member (although he did seem to carry a negative rep but I never saw that posts that earned it for him so I can't judge them). If he was pullig our legs then he didn't seem to be trying to make us look ridiculous, he was making himself look ridiculous. That's in the fine tradition of clowns through the ages. If that's trolling then long live trolling because it frequently had me holding my ribs with laughter. Even when I wasn't laughing I found myself thoroughly engaged.

---

I saw on Moti's battle programming site that he is accepting new members, perhaps you would like to register?

Whoa, what an interesting discussion this is turning out to be.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker

Niya, I think you are taking the wrong lesson from what you are doing. If you take your alleged pseudo-example (it seems quite plausible to me, so I wonder just how phony it really is), you aren't really doing what you said you were doing (I'm too lazy to go back and find your actual quote). What you are really doing is pointing out a contradiction in a set of beliefs. This is not appreciated in ANY setting, but it is highly valuable in nearly EVERY setting.

We never really understand the world around us, nor do we ever really understand any programming problem. All we ever do is build up mental models to represent the world, then act on those mental models. To some extent, every one of those models fails to accurately represent reality, but it is relatively common for a group of people to accept a common mental model (though each individual has an actual understanding of that model that differs from all other members of the group). As a general rule, we need those models to be able to function in the world, but we often fall into the mistake of believing that our mental models ARE reality rather than just an imperfect representation of reality. All you were doing with that trolling example was exposing a flaw in the model held in common by some set of people. I think Socrates used the exact same technique, and did so in the same way (at least, that's my mental model of what he was doing). Had you opened with stating that you wanted to show that they had a flawed model, they would assume that you were an enemy to their views and would pre-reject whatever you had to say. From that perspective, they would reject even reasonable things you said (you see this in politics nearly every day). Instead, you open by posing as a co-believer in the model so that they accept you, then extend the model in a logical fashion to the point where you expose a contradiction in the model (even a casual student of the bible would see that Jesus both loved and hated people with fairly equal fervor, and he certainly wasn't always accepting or forgiving). Socrates made use of this technique to tear apart people's understanding of the world around them. As programmers, we are generally pretty used to doing the same thing to ourselves when working on difficult problems.

Whether it is good or bad to highlight the flaws in the mental models we use to view the world is entirely situational. I don't think it is inherently right or inherently wrong. At times it is necessary, since it is the source of inspiration and understanding, but since the mental models allow us to function in this world, there are times they have to be left alone.

---

This is quite an excellent post. Certain points even merit discussions of their own, particularly the point of differing perspectives. However, I'll address this in the context of our trolling discussion.

Firstly, yes....that example was totally contrived by me. Christians have such rigid thought patterns its easy to divine what their conversations would look like.

Secondly, I think you misunderstand my motives. While I won't deny that exposing flaws in people's ideologies, beliefs and general perspectives has a part to play, its far from my primary motive. My primary motive above all else is entertainment. Now, I'm getting the distinct impression of a seething moral disgust with this from you guys. Maybe its time for little background. Why is Niya such a twisted individual :confused: :)

I actually had to think about why I tend to be so blaze about this and I think it goes back to my days as a young gamer on Battle.Net. Aside from programming, I enjoyed a couple video games like any youth but my first real in-depth interaction with any type of online community was on Blizzard's Battle.Net playing Brood War. When it came to forums and chat rooms and general online etiquette, I was really wet behind the ears at that time. If any of you have ever spent any time there you'd know that its a pretty harsh community. Hell, harsh is too polite a word. There is no moderation there and no censorship. This environment fostered such a powerful spirit of obnoxiousness and wanton verbal revelry that would put even drunken sailors at a strip club to shame. I mean when it came to interacting with one another, nothing was too offensive. Nothing too hurtful. Guys there would tell you all the ways they wish you would die and how they'd screw your mother in her mouth while you're dead all because you didn't pull your weight in a team game and cause them to lose. There was no such thing as "reporting to moderators". You had to fend for yourself. No one cared how you felt....its like who the hell are you ? If you can't take it get off. And you know to be honest, I wouldn't have it any other way. Never the less, this was my first experience interacting with other humans over the internet on a regular basis. Now don't get me wrong, I loved every minute of it. From the get go, I had pretty tough skin and had no problem dishing it as bad as I received and it was really entertaining. But what Battle.Net taught me about online communities can be summed up as:

• I'm not as important as I think I am.
• My feelings aren't important to someone I only know through text on a screen assembled 1000 miles away. Nor should it be important to them. Who the hell am I that they should care anyway.
• Something is only offensive if you decide to be offended. Something is only personal if you decide to take it personal. You alone control your emotional state, not text on a screen composed by someone in all likelyhood you're never gonna see in real life. What do you care that they think you're a moron....

That is my frame.

It started on BNet, and I've hardly changed since. I've long left BNet but my attitude towards online interactions remain basically the same, that its just a source of mindless entertainment, not meant to be taken seriously.

Of course there are exceptions. Here and Zdoom.org are the only two communities where I have had good peaceful relations with the membership. Why ? Well, even I have stuff I take seriously. Programming is one of them. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

Christians have such rigid thought patterns its easy to divine what their conversations would look like.

---

Well, yes. I believe one uses divine guidance for that, right?

Quote:

---

Secondly, I think you misunderstand my motives. While I won't deny that exposing flaws in people's ideologies, beliefs and general perspectives has a part to play, its far from my primary motive. My primary motive above all else is entertainment. Now, I'm getting the distinct impression of a seething moral disgust with this from you guys. Maybe its time for little background.

---

If you took what I wrote as seething moral disgust, that wasn't even close to what I meant. In fact, I meant rather the opposite of that (though I'm not quite sure what that would be...maybe calm, amoral, attraction...but that's almost as disturbing as you and your goat). My point was that the mechanism used was really quite valuable. While the target would be flustered, they should actually be thanking you if you were to use such a mechanism, as the contemplative mind would find it a valuable avenue to explore their own beliefs. This will either make their beliefs more robust, or cause them to change them entirely, but any belief that can't take scrutiny isn't much of a belief.

Quote:

---

Why is Niya such a twisted individual :confused: :)

---

Nope, never wondered that. Never wondered why a tree is woody or a rock rocky, either.

I'm not a fan of incivility under most any circumstance. I'd say that you should be who you want to be whether you wear a disguise or not.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker

Well, yes. I believe one uses divine guidance for that, right?

---

Lol....I'm watching too much Spartacus. In their dialog, the characters use "divine" in place of "guessed"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker

If you took what I wrote as seething moral disgust, that wasn't even close to what I meant. In fact, I meant rather the opposite of that (though I'm not quite sure what that would be...maybe calm, amoral, attraction...but that's almost as disturbing as you and your goat). My point was that the mechanism used was really quite valuable. While the target would be flustered, they should actually be thanking you if you were to use such a mechanism, as the contemplative mind would find it a valuable avenue to explore their own beliefs. This will either make their beliefs more robust, or cause them to change them entirely, but any belief that can't take scrutiny isn't much of a belief.

---

Actually, I thought your post was pretty neutral. I was thinking of Tyson, Jennifer and Joacim who seem quite off put by my revelation of a love of online trolling.

All this talk about trolling brought back memories. Lemme share one with yall. I was trolling hard in that thread a couple years back. The site seems to be malfunctioning a bit now so you can't see the handles of some of the posters but my handle was TaintedOne which you would see when some of the others quoted me.

Aside from those posts. My posts are:-
2,4,11,13,17,19,22,25,27,30,32

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niya

Lol....I'm watching too much Spartacus. In their dialog, the characters use "divine" in place of "guessed"



Actually, I thought your post was pretty neutral. I was thinking of Tyson, Jennifer and Joacim who seem quite off put by my revelation of a love of online trolling.

---

As far as that goes we, meaning me, use the term "online trolling" differently and by the way I define it (as posted above and generally accepted) I was surprised to hear someone defend it. Piecing together what I think you mean by "online trolling" we are talking about a different kind of activity. I'm thinking you are in a minority thinking of trolling as some sort of positive activity. All the same I'd like to see a banner somewhere for new users to see saying:

"Please don't feed the trolls"

How about we put it right next to the notice that tells new members that their posts may not appear right away, since we know that always gets read. Or the one that suggests using the search, or right in the description of each forum...

-tg

Quote:

---

seething moral disgust

---

I think it's more seeping than seething.:D

Quote:

---

Out of interest, have any of those letters that promise to release millions of dollars of cash to you after you pay them a small transaction fee ever paid out? Or are you still waiting for them to get back to you?

---

Completely missing my point doesn't qualify as "clever" so you fail rule 2.:p

Mind you, if you've got the URL to Moti's forum then defnitely share it. I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

Quote:

---

"Please don't feed the trolls"

---

But you've got to admit, sometimes it can be fun...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

Completely missing my point doesn't qualify as "clever" so you fail rule 2.:p

---

Don't leave us hanging; did they pay out or not??????

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

Mind you, if you've got the URL to Moti's forum then defnitely share it. I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

---

N.P see post #26

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

But you've got to admit, sometimes it can be fun...

---

Fatten them up a bit????

Quote:

---

N.P see post #26

---

Bizarrely I read that then immediately forgot about it. Must be my age.

Excellent link and well worth a visit. It was like putting on a comfy old sweater. Time to Amp up the Beef!!

Perhaps yotamarker will now satisfy your every desire!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TysonLPrice

As far as that goes we, meaning me, use the term "online trolling" differently and by the way I define it (as posted above and generally accepted) I was surprised to hear someone defend it. Piecing together what I think you mean by "online trolling" we are talking about a different kind of activity. I'm thinking you are in a minority thinking of trolling as some sort of positive activity. All the same I'd like to see a banner somewhere for new users to see saying:

"Please don't feed the trolls"

---

I won't go as far as saying its positive. I never intended to imply that. I simply find it entertaining. As far as weather its positive or negative, its one of those things like beauty, its in the eye of the beholder. People react negatively most of the time but strangely, I've also seen positive outcomes. I've made friends online that way too. I've even had women try to pick me up(Guess women like bad boys online too ;) or at least become quite receptive to me. So in the end its really up to the person on the other end if they want to take it as good fun and roll with it or if they want to take serious offense.

Oh yea, that definition of trolling you posted. I think I've seen that before. Reads like it was written by a seriously butthurt person. He attempts give it depth it doesn't have. I don't know about any of that, its just entertainment. Plain and simple.

Oh an congrats on your shiny new gem.....Looks good on ya. Want a pair of green shoes to go with it ? ;)

I guess somebody lives a rich inner fantasy life.

What ever do you mean ?

Well let's just say I hope those women who try to pick you up online because of your adorable trolling are actually female at all - assuming they even exist.

Oh how cute....Don't be so envious dilettante ;) Its a little telling that you would think that a self-confessed troll is that gullible.

I've done the whole pretending to be a girl thing myself and one time I had a guy one eating out of the palm of my hand to the point where he was willing to send me pics and stuff. He deserved it though. I was pretty nice to him yet for some reason he didn't like my guts so I took advantage off his stupidity for my entertainment and all it took was a screen handle that implied femininity, "Leluna". Even my current handle "Niya" was originally conceived because of its sexual ambiguity. Guys can be so stupid online when they believe the person on the other end is female. Note, that I didn't use it here at VBForums for that reason though. I started "Niya" years ago and I've grown accustomed to it being my handle in most places so I kinda stuck with it. So no, I of all people will not be so gullible as to blindly assume the sex of another person online.

Anyways, I assure you, what I said is no fantasy. In one particular instance that, I'll never forget, one woman went so far as give me her phone number. I later got a peek into her life and that of her children through Skype. She also sent me pictures and even suggested sending a ticket for me to come visit her, at her expense. Mind you this has happened more than once and it all started with me dicking around in some chat room.

I can understand your skepticism though. Even I can't believe it sometimes. Are people are so lonely that they'd become that attached so quickly to a total stranger online. The strangest twist in all this is that they don't even know what the hell I look like. I'm always in awe when these things happen. Words are really a powerful thing, even when they're not serious.

Trolls are also in L.O.T.R: http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Trolls
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vi5pdd7xHNI

Those are cave trolls....I'm a digi troll....We're evolutionary cousins ;)

Wasn't in the disambiguation???? http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Troll_(disambiguation) or here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special...i+trolls&go=Go
Cave-trolls
Mountain-trolls
Snow-trolls
Stone-trolls
River Trolls
Olog-hai
Half-Trolls
Hill-trolls

Did you mean digimon?

Nah not digimon....Digi Troll. Cave-trolls troll caves. Mountain-trolls troll mountains. Digi-trolls troll the digital world.

Seems to be digimon to me: https://twitter.com/DigiTrolls

lol...seems I have relatives I don't know about;)

There you go, time to get twittering!

Hmm....trolling twitter. There's something I haven't done before lol.

So many sites, so little time!

Troll party and I missed it. You suck!

Nope, it's not called the troll party thread!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Witis

Nope, it's not called the troll party thread!

---

Niya
Witis
Niya
Witis
Shaggy
Funky
Dilettante
...
and others

Party On, Dude!

Have you lost it????? It is called the "How to deal with trolls..." thread not the "Troll party thread..." !!!!

Everywhere theres a troll...its a party no matter what!!! Party on dudes!!!!

Troll party music!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E58v1IOhNtE