Should St George's Day (the patron saint of England) be more widely celebrated (in England)?
Should we have a bank holiday to encourage more people to celebrate it?
Why is it that the English do not seem as proud as the Scottish or Welsh?
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Should St George's Day (the patron saint of England) be more widely celebrated (in England)?
Should we have a bank holiday to encourage more people to celebrate it?
Why is it that the English do not seem as proud as the Scottish or Welsh?
1. NoQuote:
Originally posted by simonm
Should St George's Day (the patron saint of England) be more widely celebrated (in England)?
Should we have a bank holiday to encourage more people to celebrate it?
Why is it that the English do not seem as proud as the Scottish or Welsh?
2. Yes
3. 'cos we don't need to. We know we are superior and don't need to prove it.
Hey, no way!
England has centuries of imperialism and cultural subversion under it's belt and thats why they're ashamed of their country.
Rightly so in my opinion!
GlenW
The problem is, we leave English pride in the hands of the nationalists who give it a bad name.
What other country in the world feels as embarrassed about having national pride as we do?
You know you're a ****, more like... :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
3. 'cos we don't need to. We know we are superior and don't need to prove it.
well Simon, comments like "we are superior", whether mentioned seriously or as a joke, don't do much for the cause...Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
GlenW
The problem is, we leave English pride in the hands of the nationalists who give it a bad name.
What other country in the world feels as embarrassed about having national pride as we do?
Being half Welsh and half English I consider myself British but I do find myself drawn towards the Welsh Leak. Maybe if England had a vegetable as it’s national emblem then St. Georges Day would gain more recognition. Broccoli?
1. No, we aren't as demonstrative as other countries. So the nutters are more in the spotlight. French nationalist idiots are certainly more prominent than ours at the moment. The Germans are shocking and in Spain they paint road signs with language versions. I meant my comments about us knowing we are superior was a bit of a joke, but it has an element of truth. We don't feel the need to tell others how good we are, we just know.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
GlenW
The problem is, we leave English pride in the hands of the nationalists who give it a bad name.
What other country in the world feels as embarrassed about having national pride as we do?
2. France is having a bit of a problem at the moment. I'm sure the events during the run-up to the last stage of their election will cause them some embarrassment.
Thats my longest post ever and I'm going for a smoke, a coffee and a lie down.
lol :D
How about the Aubergine of England?
Left-wing, bunny-hugging, liberal, PC ****e.Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
well Simon, comments like "we are superior", whether mentioned seriously or as a joke, don't do much for the cause...
That's the problem though, isn't it?Quote:
well Simon, comments like "we are superior", whether mentioned seriously or as a joke, don't do much for the cause...
Being proud to be English shouldn't arise out of a sense of superiority to other nationalities but out of a sense of difference and uniqueness. We should be proud of what makes us different but not despise other nationalities because of it.
I suppose there's a thin line between national pride and racisism.
A typically constructive contribution from an arsehole.Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
You know you're a ****, more like... :rolleyes:
So they have their own special way of going to the loo?:confused: :confused:Quote:
Originally posted by Bonker Gudd
I do find myself drawn towards the Welsh Leak.
For a national vegetable, what about the "Cabbage"? Picture it, boiled to a soggy, mushy pulp and sitting on your plate next to your roast beef...
We are starting to go off topic here, let's just blame cornwall and have done with it.
Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
1. No, we aren't as demonstrative as other countries. So the nutters are more in the spotlight. French nationalist idiots are certainly more prominent than ours at the moment. The Germans are shocking and in Spain they paint road signs with language versions. I meant my comments about us knowing we are superior was a bit of a joke, but it has an element of truth. We don't feel the need to tell others how good we are, we just know.
2. France is having a bit of a problem at the moment. I'm sure the events during the run-up to the last stage of their election will cause them some embarrassment.
Thats my longest post ever and I'm going for a smoke, a coffee and a lie down.
1. Fair point. Smug self-satisfaction will always perform well on the world stage. It's SO endearing...
2. France aren't having a problem becasue they celebraet Bastille Day, or whatever. They are having a problem because their population ether: a) wanted to show the left wing that there was alternatives and b) people couldn't be bothered voting. Their plans, however, hideously backfired. But I think they won't get in.
We should learn from this - you MUST vote in an election. Apathy can lead to some undesirable results...
...2 labour landsides for example
I'm proud of being English, as I am of being a Bedfordian (my home town), as I am of being a European. I'm not really interested in what my ancestor did to someone else's ancestor. Right now, I think the English, Scots, Welsh, Irish.. have got it pretty good.
Very easy going nice people in general.
Mind you, a National day is going a bit far..except as an excuse for a pi55 up.. :cool: .. and perhaps the exceptance and celebration of the amazing cultural diversity.
:)
Now now ladies, no need to resort to blatant insults. There are other, far more amusing ways of insulting people, lets keep it witty shall we? ;)
I really don't give a toss about it. I don't feel the need to have a big song and dance about how fantastic we supposedly are. Lets just get on with being fantastic and not make such a big deal, shall we?
You ****ing listen to me, you ******. What reply do you expect when you post stuff like "We know we are superior and don't need to prove it." and "We don't feel the need to tell others how good we are, we just know. "Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
A typically constructive contribution from an arsehole.
You aked for a response and you got a response that was apt for you comments. Mate, I'm not an arsehole. Read your posts, and the definition of "arsehole" will become clear.
I HATE lazy, ill-considering posters :mad:
1. Absolutely . . . . *THUMPS CHEST*
2. Don't be daft . . . . why should we? Does Ireland have on for the snake hater? Scotland one for AndyPandy?
3. 'Cos the English were the oppressors for a long time (I'm not saying they are now mind . . . . ) so the Celt communities rallied around their patrons - that jingoism has continued and rightly so . . . . although I am enourmously proud of England and St.George . . . . *THUMPS CHEST*
Does spoiling your ballot paper count?Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
We should learn from this - you MUST vote in an election. Apathy can lead to some undesirable results...
I've given a lot of thought to this, my ex-brother-in-law moved to Aus and he was amazed that voting is compulsory.
In principle I think this is a good idea, but what if there are no candidates you want to vote for.
Maybe there should be a Mr Nobody on every ballot.
Oh and by the way I think my use of the word superior was in error. I don't think English people are better than anyone else, I think we are as good as anyone else.
The point I was trying to make was; that we don't feel the need to shout it from the rooftops.
And one last thing, HarryW blatant insults can be very entertaining, especially when they are given and taken in the right spirit. Tossa.
Sprouts. I think the Sprout should be the National Vegetable.
Oh and umm... you wanka...
Sometimes calling someone an arsehole is just so accurate that is it hard to believe.
Yes, if I think it is going to be taken in the right spirit.Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
I'm not going to trawl through your posts, it's a general impression I get. would you agree that you like to provoke though?
One of the things I like about this forum is that people seem, or have seemed, able to provoke and contribute to pretty heated discussions.
I also enjoy the daft, funny threads.
This is something I do for fun.
Perhaps you might take a less agressive view of me if you check back thro' this thread and see that I withdrew my comment about superiority.
But no matter what you say, I still think England were poor last week.
we do not like to blow our own trumpets in general, much less than any other nation I would say
Why, I don't know, perhaps because its viewed as up-you-own-arse, self-righteous cheese, but whatever, we don't make a fuss so we shouldn't expect anyone else to.
I can't comment on the England game, because I didn't see it, but I fear had we been playing a top-flight nation we would probably have come unstuck.
National Pride: Many people are proud of their nations, more so than us. But we collectively have a habit of looking like twats when we get nationalistic - from running round German streets dressed head to toe in the Union Jack pissed out of our heads, trashing property, to having someone in an internet forum bluntly stating twice about our superiority.
If the first comment was a mistake, it was certainly backed up in the second comment, and when that first comment was questioned, it was put down to being left-wing tree hugging liberal ****e.
I too very much enjoy the discussions on the forum, and have participated in many. But I don't see how you enjoy them glen, when you admit your largest ever post has been 7 lines long, and frankly, you posting tactics seem to be based on typing whatever comes into your head first; no forethought required. I mean, you may be a nice guy, but in this thread you look like a bloody right wing BNP supporter...
that's just a few hundred nutters who don't represent everyone in the country. Most of them ain't even bothered about the football and just go to cause trouble.Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
But we collectively have a habit of looking like twats when we get nationalistic - from running round German streets dressed head to toe in the Union Jack pissed out of our heads, trashing property,
1. I thought I had dealt with this point.Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
National Pride: Many people are proud of their nations, more so than us. But we collectively have a habit of looking like twats when we get nationalistic - from running round German streets dressed head to toe in the Union Jack pissed out of our heads, trashing property, to having someone in an internet forum bluntly stating twice about our superiority.
If the first comment was a mistake, it was certainly backed up in the second comment, and when that first comment was questioned, it was put down to being left-wing tree hugging liberal ****e.
I too very much enjoy the discussions on the forum, and have participated in many. But I don't see how you enjoy them glen, when you admit your largest ever post has been 7 lines long, and frankly, you posting tactics seem to be based on typing whatever comes into your head first; no forethought required. I mean, you may be a nice guy, but in this thread you look like a bloody right wing BNP supporter...
2. I stand by that. I consider what I said an insult, so I was replying to you in kind.
3. An attempt at a joke that appears to have flown over your head. I believe my politics would be considered right of center, but certainly not extreme right wing. I won't even answer the BNP suggestion.
For some reason you have decided to have a go at me personally, I don't know why, but if you have a hidden reason please tell.
Will someone please slap this **** and remind him that Cornwall IS part of England:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
Hey, no way!
England has centuries of imperialism and cultural subversion under it's belt and thats why they're ashamed of their country.
Rightly so in my opinion!
I'm not ashamed of my country
I think that's the most patriotic thing I've ever said;)
and I see no reason to apologise for "centuries of imperialism and cultural subversion"
gladlyQuote:
Originally posted by Guru
Will someone please slap this **** and remind him that Cornwall IS part of England:rolleyes:
The problem is though, that those nutters DO represent the country. Sure, everyone doesn't act like that, but as we now live in a world where media rules, those pictures are shown globally.Quote:
Originally posted by chrisjk
that's just a few hundred nutters who don't represent everyone in the country. Most of them ain't even bothered about the football and just go to cause trouble.
The reputation of the english in other countries is less than favourable. And it's not just the footballers. Try any major European city. There's only one group of people that walk down the street in kilts and ginger wigs, pissed and loud.
Why don't the Italians, Germans, Dutch etc do this?
YupQuote:
Originally posted by simonm
Should St George's Day (the patron saint of England) be more widely celebrated (in England)?
Should we have a bank holiday to encourage more people to celebrate it?
Why is it that the English do not seem as proud as the Scottish or Welsh?
What other country in the world feels as embarrassed about having national pride as we do?
That's the problem though, isn't it?
Being proud to be English shouldn't arise out of a sense of superiority to other nationalities but out of a sense of difference and uniqueness. We should be proud of what makes us different but not despise other nationalities because of it.
I suppose there's a thin line between national pride and racisism.
Nope, we don't get a day off for Dewi Sant
Because it's rebellion. We were once taken over by the Saes (english) like the Irish and Scottish, and most other countries in the world, so then, it was like saying that we won't change for you or anyone else, unlike the irish and scots, we're gonna keep our language alive.
Or maybe it's just an excuse for a good piss up :D
Glen, you're a ****.
None apparently
There is. I know, I used to be racist, hating the english, because thats what I was brought up with. Now, as I'm older, I know different. I hate what they've done to us, yes, but I don't hate them. It's not their fault that their ancestors tried to destroy our language.
Why broccoli? Have you looked up why the daffydil and leeks are our emblems? It's something to do with when we were fighting the saes in a muddy field, a couple of hundred years ago.Quote:
Originally posted by Bonker Gudd
Being half Welsh and half English I consider myself British but I do find myself drawn towards the Welsh Leak. Maybe if England had a vegetable as it’s national emblem then St. Georges Day would gain more recognition. Broccoli?
The rose is England's emblem, but, many people say tnat they don't wear one any more, because of Labour pirating it.
If this isn't an example of cultural domaneering, I don't know what is :rolleyes:Quote:
Will someone please slap this **** and remind him that Cornwall IS part of England
Gaf, Afraid I hafta agree with you on this one. I work about 200 yards from the Ajax Arena, I have often had cause to shut my mouth, keep my head down & try & get through the crowds of British Louts attending a football match, then, later in the evening, had to step over them p**ssed, & Pukeing as they fall over, belch & swear at everyone & noone in particular...Not the face of a Nationalism I'm proud to share...but again, I would ask the question,Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
The problem is though, that those nutters DO represent the country. Sure, everyone doesn't act like that, but as we now live in a world where media rules, those pictures are shown globally.
The reputation of the english in other countries is less than favourable. And it's not just the footballers. Try any major European city. There's only one group of people that walk down the street in kilts and ginger wigs, pissed and loud.
Why don't the Italians, Germans, Dutch etc do this?
Does this behaviour represent the populous ? Or merely the football watching fraternity ????
Either way, this is not Nationalism in it's essence. Being British igoes far deeper than that IMHO.
Peemanaaaaa
I don't know about the Welsh but I know the Scottish already get more bank holidays than we do. So, having a bank holiday on St George's Day would go some way to redressing that balance.
Stop using big words!Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
If this isn't an example of cultural domaneering, I don't know what is :rolleyes:
We get that problem. There's always a bunch of drunken pillocks, no matter what country it is!Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
National Pride: Many people are proud of their nations, more so than us. But we collectively have a habit of looking like twats when we get nationalistic - from running round German streets dressed head to toe in the Union Jack pissed out of our heads, trashing property, to having someone in an internet forum bluntly stating twice about our superiority.
Or if you're going to use them, learn to spell them first. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally posted by rinoaheartilly
Stop using big words!
YEAH! thats right! Dis me in any way you can without addressing my point.
Bloody Imperialists! :mad:
Look feller, if you want to play silly buggers and offer snippets of sun-reader wisdom like you did in your first post, you're going to get insulted, if not by me by someone else. That's why I called you a ****, because IMO, your comment deserved it. And I would say it to you again, every time.Quote:
For some reason you have decided to have a go at me personally, I don't know why, but if you have a hidden reason please tell.
Peeman - No, not the general populous, but the most visible in media terms. And that affects other country's perceptions of us.
Rino - It's a British disease. No Europeans manage it quite to the extent that we do...
Paying homage to the patron saint of England should be a holy day.
We should all learn from the annointed as they truly bask in God's radiance!
Blessed are we who follow in his shadow. :)
Pure literary genius. Nearly up to Sun reader status.Quote:
Look feller, if you want to play silly buggers and offer snippets of sun-reader wisdom
Huh, contradiction for my own question really. I was sat with a firend of mine (Scottish guy) in 'respectable' Red-Light district pub, watching people trekking up'n down the road....we commented almost at thesame time ho you could spot a brit a mile-away, not quite sure what it is but their deportment, manner, almost an arrogant air, borne by the male of the species seems to predicate the fact that they're 'british', its not even a style of clothing per-say, simply a loutishness. Now I'm gonna go one step further with this and ask if anyone believes this kind of sleeve-borne Nationalism to be a product of class ? That may make me out to be a snob, perhaps, but I'm not sure how many middle-class (if there is such an entity ????) louts you see about....
Peeman.....oh !
Uh-oh. Peeman's opened a whole new can of worms... :p
:confused: My quote or yours?Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
Pure literary genius. Nearly up to Sun reader status.
We had a court case up here recently, concerning organised violence after a Newcastle vs Sunderland game.Quote:
but I'm not sure how many middle-class (if there is such an entity ????) louts you see about
One of the defendants was a solicitor and another an accountant.
Don't know if this proves anything, but it did worry me.
:) simple question.....:pQuote:
Originally posted by InvisibleDuncan
Uh-oh. Peeman's opened a whole new can of worms... :p
I originally meant yours, but I suppose mine was below Sun reader status as well.Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
:confused: My quote or yours?
Archy
What is it, exactly, that St George did to become a saint? Other than kill a dragon of course...Quote:
Paying homage to the patron saint of England should be a holy day.
PeeMan
There are plenty of midle class xenophobes around - they're just a bit more furtive and less obvious in their methods. I'm not sure but isn't Nick Griffin of the BNP from a middle class background?
Granted, some of the ring-leaders of such violence etc will like-as not be professionals but I'm more asking about the culture that is labelled as Nationalistic ??? Why is labelled thus ? Additionally, why do we associate arrogance and noxious peronalities with being British ? IS that a reaction to other cultures fundamental hatred ? Or is that why some cultures have developed that fundamental hatred ? Where does this take us when (and no slight intended here) Rino's sig used to contain (and did so for a long time) such comments as "I support anyone who beats the English" or somesuch ???Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
We had a court case up here recently, concerning organised violence after a Newcastle vs Sunderland game.
One of the defendants was a solicitor and another an accountant.
Don't know if this proves anything, but it did worry me.
Chicken & Egg ?? Which came first ??
I thought mine was OK :confused:Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
I originally meant yours, but I suppose mine was below Sun reader status as well.
I reckon it's all class independent - it's just the methodology that is different.
Expect y'er right, but Xenophobia is an inherrent extreme of Nationalism anywhere. That is not particular to being British, equally the Irish are more agressively patriotic than we are. I have had many a cause to encounter out and out Racism there disguised as Nationalism, not particularly directed at British people either. For my money, the general populous of the UK are far mre tollerant and accepting than other races, hence my question, has History made us hated thus we are reacting, or is the populous that bad that other nations have just-cause ???Quote:
Originally posted by RSINGH
PeeMan
There are plenty of midle class xenophobes around - they're just a bit more furtive and less obvious in their methods. I'm not sure but isn't Nick Griffin of the BNP from a middle class background?
FATBOYPEE
I believe you're confusing two different types of people here.
On the one hand, you've got your average lager drinking yob and on the other you've got your professional hooligan who latches on to football crowds, demonstrations or anything else they can to get into some serious violence.
It's a bit like fight club isn't it, really?
I think there should be a legimate outlet for such violence so that they would not inflict it on normal people. Charge people to come and watch a big punch up in a stadium and that will pay for the hospitalisation of the casualties that emerge.
When you see BNP marches on the telly, the nutters in the Doc Martens and braces aren't interested in the politics or the right and wrongs within the debate.
They just want trouble. Few, if any, of them are capable of stringing together a coherent sentence let alone doing any organisation.
But football violence is different. At St James park some of the most vitriolic, foul-mouthed idiots have good jobs, some of them professionals.
Oh Dear God! This looks like me and Gaffer are agreeing about something.Quote:
I reckon it's all class independent - it's just the methodology that is different.
I do believe we share the same opinion (and not just about GlenWanker) just yours is more Welsh:cool:Quote:
Originally posted by rinoaheartilly
Yup
Nope, we don't get a day off for Dewi Sant
Because it's rebellion. We were once taken over by the Saes (english) like the Irish and Scottish, and most other countries in the world, so then, it was like saying that we won't change for you or anyone else, unlike the irish and scots, we're gonna keep our language alive.
Simon, Thing is, I'm not sure I am ?? Football Hooligans, why choose football ? why not Rugby, Tennis, Bowls ???Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
FATBOYPEE
I believe you're confusing two different types of people here.
On the one hand, you've got your average lager drinking yob and on the other you've got your professional hooligan who latches on to football crowds, demonstrations or anything else they can to get into some serious violence.
It's a bit like fight club isn't it, really?
I think there should be a legimate outlet for such violence so that they would not inflict it on normal people. Charge people to come and watch a big punch up in a stadium and that will pay for the hospitalisation of the casualties that emerge.
My personal opinion here is that the outlet given by hooligansim is a reaction to a primitive need/drive to belong to something meaningful (in their eyes), a clannish, war-like belonging. This void used to be filled by belief systems (and no, I'm not raising this for debate here :) ) and now the people involved in these kinds of activities need that kind of belonging, is it sheer boredom, depression, naievety , wot ? that drives it, I dunno, but it's seem as a face of Nationalism whaever it's guise or level. I'm simply asking whether or not the bitterness that seem to be prevalent in this behaviour is active or reactive to cultures 'dissing' for want of another word what it is to be British. Is it a legacy of our history that makes us thus asa nation by the empirical attitude or the desire of other nations to never let us forget the errors of of our ancestors ???