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Is it right that people should be able to choose to have a deaf baby?Quote:
A lesbian US couple, both of whom are deaf, deliberately chose to try to have a deaf child.
They were successful, and now have two deaf children.
BBC NewsQuote:
The decision of Sharon Duchesneau and Candy McCullough from Bethesda, Maryland, to do all they could to have a deaf baby has shocked many.
But they are part of a growing movement in the US which believes deafness is not a disability, but a cultural identity.
sorry?
Very Funny...:rolleyes:
Thats a surprisingly stupid question form you, you normally seem so inteligent.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Is it right that people should be able to choose to have a deaf baby?
BBC News
These people shouldn't even be allowed to live.
Thankyou :D :cool:Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Very Funny...:rolleyes:
Firstly, there are many differing opinions on this matter and secondly, I'm not intelligent.Quote:
Thats a surprisingly stupid question form you, you normally seem so inteligent.
Who? The parents or the children?Quote:
These people shouldn't even be allowed to live.
No matter how many opinions there are I will not ever change my view.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Firstly, there are many differing opinions on this matter and secondly, I'm not intelligent.
Who? The parents or the children?
These people have done something that I consider unforgivable.
The parent(s)? have done something that puts them beyond any resonable consideration.
At the very least the child should be taken from them, to minimise the damage it will have inflicted on it.
Sterilisation of the two aberations is also a good idea.
Thinking about this has spoiled my whole day.
This strikes me as being a terrible thing :(
I'm against any kind of genetic meddling.
Ahh, you are you against twins? or are you talking about human intervention?Quote:
Originally posted by Bonker Gudd
I'm against any kind of genetic meddling.
I'm against me :mad:
Genetics are only acceptable to the benefit of mankind.
I am against human intervention, unless it results in some sort of telepathic super baby
GlenW........pull your head out son! Anyone who doesn't meet with your approval shouldn't even be allowed to live?!?!?!?
Twins are a natural, no meddling involved.Quote:
Originally posted by Flustor
Ahh, you are you against twins? or are you talking about human intervention?
I am not against human intervention per se. As long as it is for good.
This case it was used intentionally to cause harm to a baby.
B'stards
I agree with you're point that it has to be for the good, but what do you define as good?Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
Twins are a natural, no meddling involved.
I am not against human intervention per se. As long as it is for good.
This case it was used intentionally to cause harm to a baby.
B'stards
I'm pretty sure that when the baby is a little older it'll be grateful to be alive, deaf or not.
Totally wrong.Quote:
Originally posted by barrk
GlenW........pull your head out son! Anyone who doesn't meet with your approval shouldn't even be allowed to live?!?!?!?
In almost any case I am one of the most tolerant people.
But I cannot tolerate intentional harm being inflicted on a baby, or any child.
How can anyone.
I am sorry........I thought you were referring to them being lesbians as the cause of the "These people shouldn't even be allowed to live.: statement. I jumped to a conclusion that was wrong and I hope you'll forgive me.
All I can say is that I personally wouldn't.
Something that is for a persons benefit.Quote:
Originally posted by Flustor
I agree with you're point that it has to be for the good, but what do you define as good?
I'm pretty sure that when the baby is a little older it'll be grateful to be alive, deaf or not.
This was not.
No problem.:)Quote:
Originally posted by barrk
I am sorry........I thought you were referring to them being lesbians as the cause of the "These people shouldn't even be allowed to live.: statement. I jumped to a conclusion that was wrong and I hope you'll forgive me.
Actually I quite like the idea of lesbians. ;)
You could argue that it was for the parents psychological good...Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
Something that is for a persons benefit.
This was not.
...but I'm not 'coz I don't think it is a good thing to do.
The childs benefit must always come first.Quote:
Originally posted by SjR
You could argue that it was for the parents psychological good.
I am sorry I find it difficult to make sensible arguments on any subject like this.
I just feel so strongly, I am a terrible softy when it comes to children.:)
Agreed, I'm probably over-judgemental over issues about raising children and having children and stuff.Quote:
Originally posted by GlenW
The childs benefit must always come first.
I am sorry I find it difficult to make sensible arguments on any subject like this.
I just feel so strongly, I am a terrible softy when it comes to children.:)
That is just so wrong. Madness. :(
This isn't quite true. They selected a sperm donor who was more likely to pass on a "deaf" gene. They are not actually surgically altering an otherwise hearing baby.Quote:
This case it was used intentionally to cause harm to a baby.
I have a question...What is the purpose of intentionally having a deaf child?
The couple in question are deaf so they feel that having a deaf baby will be better for them and the child.Quote:
I have a question...What is the purpose of intentionally having a deaf child?
It's also a cultural thing.
Quote:
"Deaf people do not believe themselves to be disabled. They are just living as a different normality."
Dr Vivienne Nathanson, head of science and ethics at the British Medical Association. said the case brought up a lot of difficult questions.
"If someone said they wanted to produce a child with a specific disability, most people would condemn that roundly.
"But there's an issue with deafness over whether it's a disability or not."
Deaf people who think it's not a disability are just kidding themselves. They are not able to hear thus it's a disability. I can't see how this could be a matter of opinion.
I don't think that's very fair Harry, I think they just want to be seen as normal, with their own language, culture etc.. I still think it's wrong to pursue the course of having a deaf baby. But I think that there's nothing wrong with wanting to be seen as normal.
Harry
I'm not saying that I agree with them. I think it's because a culture has arrisen around deafness and in that culture, deafness is not considered a disability (naturally).
The parents want their children to be part of that community and don't want them to be alienated.
What's normal, anyway? The pursuit of normalcy has resulted in the twisted creature you see before you.
:)
I think it's despicable
When that kid grows up and if/when they find out what happened, it's ganna hate them for it. I would
Bloody political correctness :rolleyes:
a crippled person is a crippled person, a deaf person is a deaf person, a blind person is a blind person.
It's not a culture such as new wavers or hippies or yuppies, it's a sodding disability.
Many people have cursed themselves to be born with a disability.
Where do these idiots get the idea that it would be greeted as a good thing to do ?
The world is full of rampant morons :(
Yes.Quote:
Originally posted by Wally Pipp
The world is full of rampant morons :(
And I'm one of them ? Yes allright, I hear you ...
bloody numbers :(
If I ever have a baby, I am going to select a mother who is genetically predisposed to having an athiest child. That'll make bonding that much easier... :rolleyes:
Oh yes, have another at me.
Thank you so much ...
So, do you think that a persons religion is genetically based?Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
If I ever have a baby, I am going to select a mother who is genetically predisposed to having an athiest child. That'll make bonding that much easier... :rolleyes:
:p don't answer that :p
;)
It seems completely fair to me. Perhaps not very nice, but I'm not trying to be nice. I'm trying to be realistic.Quote:
I don't think that's very fair Harry
Okay, fine, so being deaf is not a huge problem (apparently). I just cannot comprehend why it would be seen as beneficial to the child though. Community my arse, I mean however do we as 'hearing' people live without being a part of the deaf community? :rolleyes:
It's just selfish.
If they were my parents, I would kill them. :mad: :mad:
If they unintentionally gave birth to a deaf baby it's a different thing. But wanting their baby to be deaf just to prove a point is something very unacceptable.
Quote:
Originally posted by chrisjk
When that kid grows up and if/when they find out what happened, it's ganna hate them for it. I would
Hmm. Interesting.Quote:
Originally posted by thinktank2
If they were my parents, I would kill them
I don't condone intentionally arranging a disabled child into being
born, However, once born, it would seem to be unlikely that such
a child should regret its life. This child would never have occured
in any other way, and it would seem to be preferable to live with
deafness and "loving" parents, than to never have lived at all.
-Lou
One thing people seem to be forgetting is, if the child was never born at all, how could it regret or prefer anything?
:rolleyes:
I have a handicapped son. I did not plan for him to have it but I knew it was a possibility. I knew there was a chance that one of my children could be as my husband has a genetic disease. I doubt very much that my son either hates me for having him or Tom for passing on the disease. I'm sure he'd rather not have it but he doesn't, I don't and Tom doesn't regret his life!!!!!
I would never wish a handicap on a child and don't condone what these people did but none of you.....even me with my situation....can second guess what the child would feel toward his/her parents for having passed on a defect. If the child is given a good home and loving environment chances are that he would not hate his parents or wish them dead anymore than any other child. It's very easy for all of you to pass judgement.
I'm sorry for coming in late on this thread, but I am so confused....
A lesbian couple has two children. Are these children of natural birth (artificial insemination?) or adopted?
If they are of birth, what steps did the parents take to try and have deaf children?
Just reading the initial comments, I thought that two deaf people decided to adopt two deaf children. Which makes perfect sense to me, though I don't see deafness as a "cultural identity". It affects the way in which you percieve the world and adapt to it. Do I have a cultural identity because I'm dizzy?
I could see signing as being a cultural trait, but you don't have to be deaf to sign.
I think the story goes...
Two deaf lesbians found a man with a genetic disposition for deafness. One or the other was impregnated(artifically or naturally I don't know) specfically trying to have a deaf child.
Hope it wasn't the guy!Quote:
Originally posted by crptcblade
...One or the other was impregnated(artifically or naturally I don't know) ...
Ouch!
:eek:
Hey, if Arnold can do it, anyone can!Quote:
Originally posted by NotLKH
Hope it wasn't the guy!
Ouch!
:eek:
:)
Sorry, the link to the BBC news (which I thought was part of his signature at first) sheds light on the whole thing.
So this was a "designer baby".
Well...
So the question shouldn't be, "was it right for these people to choose to have a deaf child at the loss of all others", but "should any parent be allowed to dictate the criteria a child must meet as part of the conception-to-birth process". This is a huge can of worms that should not have been opened, yet.Quote:
once you allowed couples to have choice over what their baby was like, it was not possible to attack the choices people then made.
I think this is a moral issue and not an ethical one. As such, the government should not make any attempts to bridge the rights of these parents. It is all or nothing. Either it is unethical to use this technology at all, or it is ethically acceptable. But as to the moral uses of this technology... sorry... that is up to individuals to decide and try to help others make the same decision.
Just my random thought, take it or leave it.