This question came up when I was having a conversation with my co-workers. I think that the VB language compared to others is stupid, but I have yet to find a better IDE and way of working with GUI stuff.
Printable View
This question came up when I was having a conversation with my co-workers. I think that the VB language compared to others is stupid, but I have yet to find a better IDE and way of working with GUI stuff.
I only use it for about 15% of my work. For the rest, I use Access, DBIII, and occasionally SPSS.
It's easy, easily modified, powerful enough for my purposes, and does what I need.
I could care less about what the tecno-snobs think, it works for me.
I don't.
Then what are you doing on VB World? :p
Chit Chat, HTML Forum, and C++ forum.... :p
He's helping you. :)Quote:
Originally posted by filburt1
Then what are you doing on VB World? :p
I only use it because the client wants me to. I even use PerlScript for any personal ASP work I do (on those rare occasion when I want to port something to be served from IIS).
*shudder* IIS. Ick. :DQuote:
Originally posted by CiberTHuG
(on those rare occasion when I want to port something to be served from IIS).
just chit chat and C++ for me :) and the occasional graphics to see if anyones made anything cool :D
16 views and no votes? Come on, show some democracy.
I would vote if there was an option "I don't use VB"
I would vote if there was a "'Cause they make me."
Quit your whining Travis; if you hate VB so much, quit and find some Linux job.
I'm apparently not smart enough, yet. You could quit your whining and send me money to learn more. I would say $3000-$5000.Quote:
Originally posted by aknisely
Quit your whining Travis; if you hate VB so much, quit and find some Linux job.
I'm not whining, I'm just making a suggestion. It isn't healthy to be working with tools that you hate.
I use it when I need to quickly write a GUI program and can't be bothered to do it in C++ (right then).
i generally don't use it, unless i need to make something really quick on the fly.
I use it, sometimes I use it to make some simple counting program or something (one time i had to write 100 cards, so when i pressed a key, it added to the tally, and alerted me when i was done) and really simple stuff like thatQuote:
Originally posted by Wynd
I use it when I need to quickly write a GUI program and can't be bothered to do it in C++ (right then).
However I was working on a file sharing network with my friend, he's busy doing some game right now so he can't help me.
Well VB was the first language i learnt, and im not smart enough for C++:D . Well im learning C++, but after VB, everything seems so tedious in C++. Also, because i learnt VB first, and VB lets you get away with like anything, im in trouble when i have to learn Pascal in school soon.:p . Anyways, VB suites my needs. I completed a work term this summer. The programs werent big and fancy, mostly file parsing (which is easy in VB6 cause of split).
I think anyone who doesn't like it or worse still decides to come to VB world and diss it, should f**k off somewhere else and leave server bandwith to those of us who are interested in it.
The VB language is simple and easier to use. But I greatly prefer Java/C++ style syntax to VB's archane style. I'm not trashing VB, it's awesome, especially for GUIs. But the language itself needs tweaking.
Filburt: VB.NET is supposed to change a lot of that...
I know. But I still miss my braces { } around functions, ifs, etc. At least they're making Option Explicit a hard-coded thing. VB's End Whatever things are too Pascalish.
Ugh, Pascal. My mother was telling me stories the other day of when she was in computer science and learning pascal at the University of Jerusalem. Thirty years ago. At the local university, this was only the second year they replaced pascal with java for the first year of studies. Who the hell said technology was fast-paced?
Pascal is the most stupid-ass language on the planet...no professional uses it.
no, prologue is the most stupid arse language on the planet.
So is lisp...
Pascal is still the crappiest.
Lisp isn't as much of a language as much as it is a speech impediment.
Filburt, have u ever actually used Pascal??? I saw that as little as a few weeks ago u didnt know that Delphi grew out of Pascal. I dont think comparing VB with Pascal serves much purpose as Pascal came from the 80's and at the same time Basic was very much spaghetti code. I guess that ppl were trying out ways of making code more structured and maintainable.Quote:
Originally posted by filburt1
Pascal is still the crappiest.
Pascal was not a fave language of mine but compared to cobol (only in studies) it was an angel. Languages are developing to be more and more user oriented and the ideal is to have a program like VB that is very graphic and user friendly but that produces high speed results.
From what i have read about programming anyhow, most of the speed problems for beginners (and others :p) come not from VB functions or routines themselves but from incorrect conceptualisation of algorithms or methodology. Simple examples, accidently calling a combo boxes click event when loading it by setting the listindex etc. Forgetting to disable the textbox change event when passing formatted text. There are too many to mention.
So, anyhow, VB is good for what it does and u can always add specific tools for speed or memory intensive routines. And, remember that the end user doesnt care what language a program is written in as long as it runs fast and reliably.
Regards
Stuart
So why is Pascal taught in school? Java and C++ both provide the OO-ness that you need to learn OOP.
Thats what im wondering to. People actually use Delphi, but they dont teach that. They teach Pascal, which he students will probably never use. They might as well teach C++, at least people might use that. But if im not mistaken, Pascal was created to teach programming techniques right? So its really strict etc..Quote:
Originally posted by filburt1
So why is Pascal taught in school? Java and C++ both provide the OO-ness that you need to learn OOP.
As I said, pascal was just replaced by java at the UofA. I predict other schools will (perhaps slowly) follow.
That was at UofA. They have money. Im talking about a Canadian High School. They're not broke, but by the time they change over, ill be long gone from HS anyways:rolleyes: .
In my high school they teach visual basic :rolleyes:
damn, the best our school does is C++, and the teacher asks me what to do for most of his lessons (its funny cuz i know very little C++)
beachbum,Quote:
Originally posted by beachbum
Filburt, have u ever actually used Pascal???
I think you're forgetting that filburt1 is just a kid whose opinions account for very little.
He's not a professional programmer.
i use VB because it's brilliant for developing business applications quickly, plus it's easy to learn. when VS.NET comes out i might try learning things like C++ and C# for personal applications, but i'll stick with VB for business ones. :)
You have now consigned yourself to a fate worse than death - the ire of a smitten flibbert :pQuote:
Originally posted by ©¿©¬
beachbum,
I think you're forgetting that filburt1 is just a kid whose opinions account for very little.
He's not a professional programmer.
:rolleyes: I use VB because I have no choice, the job decides.
I personally think VB is pretty crap, I've used PowerBuilder a lot in the past and that slaps VB in the face! For those who haven't used PowerBuilder, it has something called a Datawindow where fields map directly onto the database :cool:
HiQuote:
Originally posted by Bonker Gudd
:rolleyes: I use VB because I have no choice, the job decides.
I personally think VB is pretty crap, I've used PowerBuilder a lot in the past and that slaps VB in the face! For those who haven't used PowerBuilder, it has something called a Datawindow where fields map directly onto the database :cool:
Have never used Powerbuilder but have never read one good thing about it in the comp'r press. By the way you are looking a lot better these days. Prison life must be agreeing with you.
Regards
Stuart
ps Doesnt Powerbuilder have per seat licence fees?
My name is Mark Sreeves and I use VB
There, I've confessed to it now.
I also use several other languages in the course of my work as well however.
The first language I was taught at University was Modula 2 which I believe is very similar to Pascal.
Modula 2 was chosen as a first language because it forces good practices. It is very strongly typed and does not have GOTO so code has to be well structured and I think it is an ideal first language; strict not too cryptic.
Modula 2 used to be used (maybe it still is) in embedded systems a lot.
Quite amusing to read people slagging off the languages - I've used Pascal, BASIC (anyone actually remember what that stands for?!, clue: B=Beginners) C, C++, Lisp, xBase, PAL, Perl, Java, Rexx and a dozen others. They all have their own idiosyncracies and shortcomings but it is generally horses for courses.
Delphi is great to use, strongly typed and truly OO and has a better IDE than VB but the VCL can be leaky. C++ is just too much work. VB is fine but I wouldn't code an OS in it. It isn't OO and it is STILL interpreted.
For elegance and small programs, you can't beat C but it ain't exactly new and I'm probably just misty eyed over my first "Hello, World"
Cheers,
P.
Hi, I don't know about the licence but you're probably right, luckly I don't have to pay for it :pQuote:
Originally posted by beachbum
ps Doesnt Powerbuilder have per seat licence fees?
Feeling good, I'll be out before you know it!
hi again
I am also quite amused at the bagging of VB (lordly criminals excepted :p). surely it must be a form of ***** envy. when i first started programming u were lame if u didnt know assembly, then you were lame if u didnt know cobol etc etc etc... the other month i went to see my ISP about something on the website and he asked me what i had used for it... Frontpage i meekly responded... geeesh .. real webbers type in the html and asp directly... oh well.
I am off to the peat marshes to suck up some oil, which i will then refine to get my self built car ticking over. But i refuse to drive on those god damned infantile roads.
Beginners All-Purpose Symbolic Instruction Code ;)Quote:
Originally posted by paulw
I've used Pascal, BASIC (anyone actually remember what that stands for?!, clue: B=Beginners)
Oh, bah to the lot of you :p
I've written raw machine code on my ZX81, beat that!
Well, I use VB for probably 95% of the work I do. I taught myself VB as a business decision, not becuase it was easy.
I started with Ada (military language used for avionics packages, and probably the single most stable compiler written), and learnt Miranda (oh, the joys of recursion), assembler, Unix C, C++, Delphi, Perl and a few others for various things.
But I use VB in preference to the rest, cos I'm running a business, so I haveto make money. I would have been out of business years ago had I chose C++. I probably could have used Delphi, but Borland just don't provide the huge amount of technical data that Microsoft do.
That said, I certainly wouldn't advocate teaching VB, Delphi or even Java as a first language - its to easy to get distracted from the fundamentals of programming (go, Donald Knuth, go) by the pretty interfaces.
Putting a button on a form and showing a message box ins't programming. Neither is linking to a database using a data control - they are more pseudo-programming tasks.
Writing double linked lists, red black trees, quick sorts etc - that's real programming. But then, it would be much harder to make any money out of it if I had to code every form from scratch. I still refuse to use data controls though...
As a side note, remember: Real programmers don't eat quiche.
- gaffa
Well, i can beat you but only by 1!!!! ZX-80 :rolleyes: now there was a machine.. where did that keyword go...looking... looking...Quote:
Originally posted by Bonker Gudd
Oh, bah to the lot of you :p
I've written raw machine code on my ZX81, beat that!
[QUOTE]Originally posted by gaffa
As a side note, remember: Real programmers don't eat quiche.
QUOTE]
Emmm egg and bacon pie is still okay, right? :eek:
Just, beachbum, just...
- gaffa
ARRGGH!!Quote:
Originally posted by gaffa
...Miranda...
Miranda!
I think you are only the 3rd person ever so utter that dreadful word on this forum!
Oh right, it's not just me then!Quote:
Originally posted by gaffa
I still refuse to use data controls though...
I NEVER use data controls. I prefer it if I have control over my data.
Ok
change of subject. I know it is not nice to laugh. I feel reaaaaalllly guilty....but here goes... I have seen this post about developing a MSN replacement program (like we need another one of them) but the cruel bit is that after 145 posts they still havent worked out how to stage the first meeting :rolleyes: i am soooo sorry... i couldnt help it but it cracked me up. :p
Miranda was the first language I ever used - I had only had a computer for a few months when I decided to transfer from an arts degree to a comp sci degree.
Had never heard of unix, let alone f****** vi editor. That was a very hard six months, but when I transferred again to a different uni and did ADA, I caned it - particularly when it came to recursion (somewhat unsurprisingly I guess)
Data controls are the spawn of the devil. My company has a policy of turning programmers who use data controls into eunuchs.
- gaffa
viQuote:
Originally posted by gaffa
let alone f****** vi editor...
luckily I managed to avoid using vi, the UNIX systems at university had Emacs as well.
I liked Emacs so much that I got hold of a DOS version and used to use it on my home PC. It was better than Edit because when I shelled out of my DOS Modula 2 compiler there wasn't enough memory left to run Edit but Emacs was fine.
There, you can all sleep easier now with that knowledge. :D
Beachbum,
What is it with people wanting to write instant messangers? I mean, the world has had instant messaging for years - it's called the telephone....
- gaffa
Excuse me? I might be in high school and have no real professional training, but I have customers for each of my two shareware programs.Quote:
Originally posted by ©¿©¬
beachbum,
I think you're forgetting that filburt1 is just a kid whose opinions account for very little.
He's not a professional programmer.
Quote:
Originally posted by filburt1
Excuse me? I might be in high school and have no real professional training, but I have customers for each of my two shareware programs.
I agree, pretty soon all you old people will die off and us "kids" will be the pros... i know that filburt knows quite a bit about programming, possibly more than you "professional" programmers.
Aw, thanks. I'd kiss you but I'm not gay. :D :D
lol, its true tho *cries because he thought arien would finally kiss him :D :P :D