Sentience: VB Game (comments please)

Fenris,

Thanks for looking at the game.

We know the interface isn't intuitive, we're working on it. Your comments are good. I'll try and whack in some highlighting of current choices as soon as. Behemoth's made some nice buttons but I haven't yet had chance to implement them.

To see what a building is merely click on it with the left mouse button. It will tell you all the details in the pane to the right of the map.

I need to tidy up the component construction screen. Yes, when you click on 'add to build queue' the component is added to the build queue, but it doesn't let you know. There is also a build queue viewer.

Click the menu button just above turn complete and choose industry. You can view the build queue there. Every turn components will be produced in the order they were added to the build queue and will fall into the warehouse.

Which brings me to the problem with the warehouse. It's already been mentioned but I've yet to fix the problem.

I'm going to spend the next couple of days fixing bugs I think!

:eek:

getting a runtime error "9"
subscript out of range


Just started the game, no idea what i am doing so i was right clicking on all the buildings, when i clicked on the warehouse and went into it I got this error when i clicked on the components button, then game went bye bye.

I am able to recreate it every time i do this. if it helps I have SP5 of all the runtime libraries and also running this on win ME.

A couple of things I didn't like though with my experience, there is nothing in the windows bar showing the game is running I used alt esc to move to other windows also when I did that if i had somthing like the ware house open it would disapear and move separetly from the game so after a while of swiching I had several windows scattered all over and none of them were in the windows bar. I like the intro, and the graphics so far the buttons could use some touch ups, I found a free distributable component on http://www.download.com that really spruces up the buttons. you can search there and play with it if you want.

good job so far guys some bugs but hey I have yet to see something bug free especially this early in dev. I just wish I knew what I was doing in it. I never moved anything around cause I couldn't figure out what was supposed to be moving, now I noticed I strted production on something and every turn it just said I could cancel production maybe something that would tell me how many turns left until production complete, ect. if it was there then i couldn;t find it

I think every1 should read the posts since the last release before they post ANYTHING. After they read all of that, read all the new ones from then on. This would really help this thread from getting to 50 ages on my settings (100 posts/page), and would stop me from getting e-mails that tell me this thread has been modified, and when I check it isn't something I knew about for 5 or 6 days, I think Arbiter would like this too, as it would make it easier to tell what is not yet known, at least to the best of our knowadge.

Guys,

Thanks for you all taking the time to look at the game and have a play.

Ok, what I've learned so far.

1) There's something wrong with the warehouse screen.
2) We need a manual.
3) The user interface needs tidying.
4) A general bug hunt is needed.
5) Tidy up the general process of creating a mech.

I'll get on with these as soon as I can.

Ked,

Sorry mate, didn't see your little post hiding up there.

The problems with the mech design screen and the warehouse I'm aware of now, but what's this with the visual terrain not matching where the buildings are placed?

Oh no, let there be nothing wrong with the world generator algorithm! Pleeeease!

What's the problem there Ked, could you give me a little more detail on it please?

Hairy Bloke,

Would you want to check out the link provided by Bound4Doom and see if the component is of any use to you/us?

Gaming,

I don't really mind people posting similar stuff to everyone else. Sometimes it's a bind of a bind trawling through posts that read the same, but if people have gone to the effort to download and play the game, the very least I could do is read and reply on everything they post.

Bound4Doom,

Thanks for having a look through. Your comments have been added to my list of things to do and Behemoth will look at the component you've suggested. He's already done some buttons that I've not added to the game yet. They may do the trick with the need for another component, but we'll check it out nevertheless.

Did you have a play will all the funky parts of the game (the research screen for example)? Did you actually manage to create a mech? If not, one of the previous post contains more detailed information on how to do this.

All,

Thanks again!

*acchem* fog of war *acchem*

Fog of Way?

Is that, in some way, related to the 'Fog of War'? :D

Plenderj, you appear to have mistyped "Frog of Whey...":D

no i didnt ;)

boo...no fair...Jamie cheated...
:(

Come on guys - stop wrecking the thread.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by BOUND4DOOM
A couple of things I didn't like though with my experience, there is nothing in the windows bar showing the game is running I used alt esc to move to other windows also when I did that if i had somthing like the ware house open it would disapear and move separetly from the game so after a while of swiching I had several windows scattered all over and none of them were in the windows bar. I like the intro, and the graphics so far the buttons could use some touch ups, I found a free distributable component on http://www.download.com that really spruces up the buttons. you can search there and play with it if you want.

---

I'm sorry, BOUND4DOOM, I don't know what or where in downloads.com you're referring. could you be more specific? I'd be happy to follow your recommendation, but I really don't have the time to go searching... Thanks :)

Well to both of you cause i am to lazy to write 2 pots.

Nope never got a mech created, not sure if I wa creating them right, I kept wanting to go into that warehouse and of course I would crash out of the game I played the game 5 times never made it past 3 rounds I figured I would wait till you guys got around to hunting down that bug till I tried this again.

Well I am sure his buttons are good, so far I have actually been pretty impressed with the graphics. Out of curiousity though though I should let you know I did try this game at work (Ok so I didn't feel like programming much today) anyway at work i have a program that sets up a skin on windows and changes some stuff like buttons and the actual window and the task bar, things of that nature, well it afected the game buttons too, not all game buttons either only the standard square ones. Just something to be aware of. Some of the other games installed on my computer at work(Hope the boss isn't reading this) are not affected. I will have to look again tomorow to see what the skin program is to get more specific

Anyway and then as far as components I found some you might find useful
Free resize and repossition or all screen resolutions
http://download.cnet.com/downloads/0...lst-1-9.912874

Free already built High score generator and keeper
http://download.cnet.com/downloads/0...st-1-10.911564

This is the one I was talking about
You can easily design the shape of buttons, text boxes, frames, and many other controls with this software. Simply draw your desired shape with the mouse in an affiliate drawing program. One line of code will let you give that shape to your controls.
Free
http://download.cnet.com/downloads/0...st-1-20.916907

Hope that help and hope these urls go through as posted

BOUND4DOOM / All,

Creating a mech involves creating at least one of each of a Chassis, Torso and Reactor.

Add one of each of these to build queue and skip 5-6 turns. Then load the mech design screen. Click new mech.

Firstly change the drop down to point to the only option within it (the construction yard) and then click on chassis and pick a chassis (you'll only have one unless you made more). Pick a torso and pick the reactor. The cancel button should now have changed to save.

Close the mech design screen and click next turn. You should now have a unit sat on top of the construction yard. Click on it and use the numeric keypad to move it around.

Have a play. To make more and varied mechs, add more components to the build queue and skip some more turns. Note the effect that adding weapons and other components have on the stats of the mech. Note the way that adding sensor chips increases the units view range. Add three sensor chips to a mech and then create it. Move it around and look how much further it can see.

I'm still working on the next version which will include combat, detailed mech design, RMV design (and a small army of bug fixes ;) ).

Watch this space - it's coming soon!

BOUND4DOOM,

I'll take a look at those components shortly. I've been trying to avoid using third party components (none are used at all so far) but if they can save me loads of time or are much better than what I can do then I may decide to use them.

Thanks for the links...

Kedaflump,

I've finally managed to have a look at your funky tool you eMailed me a bit back (I thought I'd best 'cos you shouted at me in that other thread).

Well, it works, and I loaded the plugin. And then, errrr..., I got a bit stuck.

I read the manual. Shook my head a few times and read it again. Got up, went for a coffee and read it once more. I then climbed under the bed and started sobbing.

I had a play, clicking buttons, expanding things, adding things etc - but I wasn't too sure what it was supposed to do. No, that's not true - I know what it's supposed to do, I just don't know how to get it to do it.

I can't actually change anything or make it do anything. I've probably just not understood the instructions.

Well, there's a couple of things to mention.

1) The menu's don't do anything. Are these blank purposefully and get populated by the plugins?
2) Error - I click on a new type I'd added and tried to rename it. Not knowing how to do this I clicked on it and typed the word 'gibbon' in the text box at the top. When I right clicked on the type's name after that I got a '91 - object variable or with block variable not set'
3) I also got a message 'stop - no keys'. What's that about?
4) Your little manual thing needs to be a little more easy to read. Consider a tutorial to walk people through their first use of the program.


I imagine that you'll have a new version by now as I have taken my time getting round to looking at it (for which I can only apologise). If you wish to mail me the new version (pref. with a tutorial) I play some more.

Arbiter

Sorry if i sounded a bit harsh in the other thread.

I'm very sad at tutorials i know :(
the textbox isn't doing anything, i just forgot to remove it.
I was trying to create a multiline textbox at runtime but i never got it work
I'm going to replace it by a rtb later.
menus are blank too, i'm thinking about customisation system where you can choose what items go to the treeview, treeviewpopumenus, listview, statusbar, toolbar and menus, the list is long (97 items and increasing) Currently treeview is only available in this mode and some stuff that are displayed in statusbar and listview or popupmenus are not counted in the list.

91's are much more common problems, but easily solved, i'll try to track it, but i can't emulate it, what exactly did you do? Youre suppose to edit the label when you single left click a selected item (like you do in explorer) the topleft textbox is just there for decoration ;) i'll remove it.

you get a stop - no keys, when you go into a item that's not implemented yet (ex Settings) it's no problem, just don't go into setttings because there are none currently.

I've been all busy with exams, but i'm working on fixed length string and array implementation now. The file system is very widely planned but i had to cut down most stuff in the release, i'll be working on that too.

you can try copy some type structures into clipboard from within vb, and then go into Types>Import type>Clipboard and doubleclick all items, that should load them into SEHM. I'll gladly answer to all further questions :)

Ked!

I had a little bit of a play last night with it (I was showing it to Behemoth) and imported some stuff via the clipboard. Cool as! What a funky bit of functionality, I was well impressed!! :)

Well, nearly. I got the option to import all the types I'd selected, but once I'd done that I had no idea what to do with them. The new types were created but I couldn't see the variables within them. Or at least, I couldn't recognise them. Where are they Ked?

Couldn't duplicate the '91 though I did try.

They should appear as subitems under the type, okay some online help:

let's say you add a type

Code:

---

TYpe Arbiter
        Myint1 as integer
        Myint2 as integer
End type

---

Before you do this, you should add a type manually "integer" with no subtypes, you change it's size to 2 (editing the number after the rightangled ruler)
Now you can copy the Arbiter type into the system, it should appear like follows if you expand the nodes. Myint1 is the name for the first subtype (green red box), and Integer is the datatype (the ghostbox), Followed is the size of the type, position within Arbiter, Array flag (you can double click on it) Description, Initial value (used when you instantiate a type using SEHM) And then of course, remove sub type. Arbiters initial value will override the integers if you set it, it won't though affect nested types that are in arrays within Arbiters subtype structure.
http://www.vbforums.com/attachment.php?s=&postid=351572

Aha!

I get it now. Right I'll play some more with that when I get home. Once I have, for example, imported all the types into it what can it then do with them. Give me a sales pitch here - what can your program do for me?

Also, how does it copes with types within types e.g.

Type Arbiter
Gibbon as single
Muppet as integer
end type

Type Kedaman
Jellyfish as Arbiter
Flidmire as Arbiter
end type

What would it make of that?

that's perfectly ok :) you'll find out that Kedaman's size is 12.

now if you do Open blah for binary as 1 and
GET#1,,somekedaman

then you have all data you edited in SEHM, within somekedaman.or the otherway round

PUT#1,,somekedaman

and you can open it in SEHM and see what you've stored in it.

Code:

---

Open PickEitherOne(Woman.Holes) For Input As #1
    PUT#1,,somekedaman
Close #1
Debug.Print "Was it good for you ?"

---

... I am aware of the programatic discrepencies ;)

:rolleyes:

Kedamans size is twelve? Wishful thinking there boy!

So, besides being able to edit save game files, what else can it do? Come on - really sell it to me!

You can score with alia when you use it.

Alia?

Kedaman's avatar.
She's a character from a series of books entitled "Dune" by frank herbert.

Alia is Paul Muad'Dib's Sister.
She was prescient and intelligent from before she was born.

Ah yes.

I bet she'd look nice kneeling down, gazing up at me with those cute little eyes.

Ok, Stop, stop!

This is degenerating into filth now.

This is my lovely thread, stop polluting it with Irish smut!

She's arrakeen, not irish ;)

Plej has some serious problems, we should bann him from this thread :p

Well savegames? hahaha, that would be a bit uselesss, you can use it for storing the game data as well, and for editing this data in particulary handy ways you can make plugins, i've thought about activeX controls that will be displayed instead of the listview. Referencing the SEHM library and the gui, and implementing a specific interface IPlugin it will recieve events from SDIP. A SITEM object will be passed so that you can manipulate the data accordingly.

Ked, I don't under stand what your program is good for. From what I have read in this thread, it seems it just is a hard way to do easy stuff.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Gaming_World
Ked, I don't under stand what your program is good for. From what I have read in this thread, it seems it just is a hard way to do easy stuff.

---

Kedaman defined.

;)

indeed, what is not understandable?
I agree a similar task could be achieved easier but that would limit the customisation with plugins

Go on Ked, whack 'im!

Sort PlenderJ out - yeah!

So don't mess wiv Ked or e'll clobber yer! Yeah.

Ok, I'll stop trying to cause a fight.

Well people, the new version should be online shortly with a small herd of bug fixes and....

drum roll......

wait for it.....

Unit pathfinding!

And Combat!

And other cool things!

I know, I know, you can barely contain yourselves! But you must, you must - it won't be long now.

Are you all excited?

HO HO HO!!!!

New version is uploaded!

All in one easy downloadable file.

Fantastic! Highlights are:

Bug fixes.
New, improved mech design screen.
Pathfinding (of sorts).

Damn, it's looking good!

Get your copy now, while they're still warm and keep those comments/suggestions coming in!

Sentience wouldn't be where it is today without you guys!!!!

Download from www.btinternet.com/~bstap

I'll have a look this weekend ;)

While its still warm ?
Pfff! I'm into necro...... ahh I see.

OK I'll have a look :)

I knew I could count on you two! Thanks guys!

I'm going to put you two down as the lead testers as you've been testing this since I uploaded the first version, unless you have any objections....?

Yes I do have objections.

"Lead Smartass Git"


Bah! Call me what you want :)

Hi,
Little bug for you. My monitor runs at 1152x864, 32bit color and 85Hz refresh rate. Everytime I load your game up and then quit out, it drops my monitors refresh rate down to 60Hz, which does not do the eyes very good :(. Anybody else experienced this??

Haven't played the game properly yet as I have not figured out what to do :rolleyes:

Cheers

S@NSIS

Hey there!

Thanks for looking at the game.

Your refresh gets changed when the game crashes or when you quit out using the quit options? I never even considered the monitors refresh, I'll look into that one.

Sorry about the lack of instructions, we've not got round to making a manual yet. If you have any questions then feel free to ask them all here. I'll answer them as soon as I see them...

At last the tacky fog of war is gone :)
Ok a few points :

I finally figured out how to build mechs.
It'd be nice if it didnt take a turn to produce each component.
Took me about 8(?) turns to build the parts.

Then I went into the mech design screen.
Quite nice once you figure it out :)

I had created all 3 types of chips ; but only two were showing in the drop down menu for the chips part of the mech screen. It could just be that they were cut off by the bottom of the screen.

I then went to add weapons to the mech. I had only created one gun, but was able to use that gun for each 4 mounts on the particular mech.

Then I noticed "ding" to the right of the weapons part and was wondering *** it was. Its the right hand side of the Building button on the main screen. Anyway I clicked on it and the mech screen lost focus. I tried to Alt-Tab (desperate attempt I know) back into that form but I was brough into windows.
So I managed to get back into the active game, and clicked on the Mech design button and was brought back into the screen ; but then the game crashed with RE53 : File not found.

I was brought back to the desktop with res = 800*600 :(

Anyway, its coming along nicely.
Keep up the good work :)

PlenderJ,

Thanks for looking at it so quickly!

I got rid of the tacky FOW just for you...

Yeah, the components do take a bit to produce. You get 150ind points per turn and that is used to make stuff. If the component at the top of the queue takes 100 pts then 50 are moved onto the next one. (unless you have distributed industry turned on in which case the points are spread across all components in the build queue).

The figures used are not the final figures, everything will be changed at some point when we move into play testing proper to get the balances right.

To bring back the mech design screen if you click off it, simple call it from the menu again. It will return in exactly the same state you left it.

Currently there is no billing for components. You can make as many mechs as you like from one of each component. This is just for testing so you don't have to make millions of components to make some mechs.

Not sure what the file not found was for... I've never had that one.

So, did you make a mech? Did you move it around and use its pathfinding? Whaddya think?

The mech design screen still needs an awful lot of work but it's getting there now. Behemoth's still plugging away with the component graphics. Some of them look really cool don't they?

PS - how's craft coming along?

Well the game crashed, and then I came on here to report my findings, and then my boss came in, so I never got to make the mech.

I'll be looking at the game later + over the weekend anyway.

And craft ; well thats been put on the long finger for the while.
I put an updated version on the webpage the other day. But I wont be working on it until after june 1st (last day of exams).

Well, make that about june 10th, I should have recovered from the hangover I get on the 1st by then :)

A nine day hangover... Nice!

That sounds like a douglas adams quote at the bottom of your sig ...

I have no idea where it's from.

It came from my mind but it's entirely possible it based on something I've read or seen elsewhere.

Bwahahahaahah you've read books before !?!?
hahahahaha.


... sorry ;)

Button it parrot face - I've read the whole of the Dick and Jane series!

nice game for VB. I did notice, don't know if it was justme or not, but when I put the map to whopping, the mapin the center stayed the same size and the map on the bottom right (the square) got real small. is that the way it was suppose to go? I didn't figure out how to make a mech yet , so I will keep trying later. Plus play around with everything else.

all in all it looks like it is coming along real good, and hats off to the graphics maker.

keep up the good work. :D

Scoutt

Hey, just a couple of suggestions:

Change the background, ok? The game has nothing to do with space, so why do you make the background a NEBULA?! :p

Also, you should make building mechs more intuitive. It seems that no one can figure that out :D

Another thing, related to AI: How are you gonna make the AI build mechs? :p
I have an idea, in case you haven't thought of that before: the AI starts with a standard mech, with nothing in it (except for the really basic ones). Then it tries to put some random stuff on it (but only the ones available to it!) (NOTE: I said SOME. Changing it only a bit at a time will get you better results). Each frame or so, it would change the mech a bit and test it against each one of the player's mechs (the ones it has seen, to make it more realistic and not a cheater). If it can beat it, try to change it a bit next frame (so it improves). If not, change it back and try again! This kind of AI would be really smart, because it would counter the player's mechs, even though they are built by the player. There's no such table as "this mech is good against this other one" at first, like in most strategy games. It would be built as the game progresses. What do you think? ;)

Scoutt,

Thanks for looking.

The map in the centre will remain a constant size (unless zoomed) but the map in the bottom left will resize dependant on the map sizes chosen. The map in the bottom right is the minimap and gives you and overview of the world as you see it.

Details instructions on how to create a mech are posted a little further up. They may help you if you get stuck. :)

Behemoth has done all the graphics in the game so far and I think he's an incredible job.

Once you've had a play around, I'd like to hear any comments you may have with regards to any aspect of the game (user interface, format, speed, things you'd like to see etc).

The more comments we get, the better the game will turn out.

Thanks again!

Jotaf,

Thankyou for looking as well!

The game is vaguely space related it's just there's no manual or background supplied yet. The intro movie (that's right - intro movie) gives a brief intro to the game (ie where you're there etc) and involves spacecraft and other such stuff. :)

Building mech's is intuitive - once you know how to do it. I must have made about 8 billion in testing so far. Once you have the components, you can make a mech in about 7 clicks. It's just there's no instructions :rolleyes: . I'll get round to them one day...

We're still working on the concepts for the AI at the moment. I'm thinking of making it based around models, whereby each mech can have a different role, i.e. aggressive, passive, coward, sniper etc

The computers 'overview AI' is going to be hellish to code as I do not want it to cheat in any way shape or form. The mechbuilding stuff you've outlined is a good idea, we'll have to look at that and see how it can be implemented.

If you're interested in the conversations Behemoth and I have to thrash out the games workings then have a read in the communications forum. It may or may not interest you, but it's no secret. AI is quite a while away at the moment, but any other suggestions you have will be gratefully received.

Thanks.

You're welcome ;)

BTW, where's the communications forum?

http://forums.vb-world.net/forumdisp...?s=&forumid=15

It's accessible from the main forums list. It's right down near the bottom...

I've been reading this topic for a couple of days, but only just got a chance to DL & try Sentience. I'm having a new problem with it: I can't work out what to do :rolleyes:! What do I do after adding a whole bunch of components to the build queue?

Also, can I please, please, please, please, please, please (etc) help with some of the basic AI code? I've never had a chance to really look at AI, but I've found it very interesting for quite a while.

Very stable, Arbiter!

I like ;)

Every time I go to make a mech, and have prepared all the parts, and tell it to build it, when I complete my turn and the game screen is about to appear I get the file not found error.

A tad annoying :)

PlenderJ,

Yeah sorry about that. Quick fix - make an empty file (using notepad or whatever) and save it in the root of C (C:\) as temp.bmp

This will solve the problem in the short term (I've fixed it already but haven't uploaded the new version yet.

Sas,

Glad you like it - I'm looking forward to seeing how you've been getting on with ToW...

Matthew,

Common problem - we really must make a manual!!!!

Firstly do as per PlenderJ, make a blank file on C:\

Ok, once you've added the components to the build queue. Wait a few turns for them to be complete. You can check if they're done by either opening the build queue from the industry option on the main menu or looking to see if they're appeared in the warehouse (under manufactured).

You'll need at least one torso, one chassis and a reactor. Everything else is optional. Then, right click on the top right building and choose mech design. Design a mech, save it and then next turn it will appear!

We're still quite a way off from beginning AI coding but when we start, any suggestions will be gratefully received.

All,

I've been burning the midnight oil recently and have fixed the problems with path finding routes, fixed numerous bugs, combat is good to go and you can also define and reuse templates for mechs. There's also some behind the scenes stuff (like a scripted help file - I figured we needed one) and more!

The next version is going to kick arse!

Not much luck here guys :(

When I went to options, I got a Out of memory error :(

and when I clicked on New Game i get a "cant create autodraw image" error :(

Hey Simon,

Thanks for trying...

I get that occasionally when I've been testing and the games crashed, so I re-run and it crashes again. After I've done that a few times I get the out of memory error. I exit the VB IDE and reload it and it's fine then.

Now, this can't be the problem with you as you're not running it from within the IDE. You haven't had your machine running for the past 8 days without a shut down have you?

It's not really an out of memory as it runs fine on my laptop (P133 with 16mb of ram - woohoo). Try running it straight after a bootup without having ran anything else.

PS - just as a thought, you don't have the world and its dog running in the background do you?