Maybe 1 + 0 > 4Quote:
Originally Posted by SearchingDataOnly
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Maybe 1 + 0 > 4Quote:
Originally Posted by SearchingDataOnly
I'm sure I was not clear in my post. Let me clarify.Quote:
Originally Posted by yereverluvinuncleber
1. I think what Wayne has achieved with tB is incredible. He's proven that it is possible to create a successor to VB6!
2. The amount of progress he's made with minimal assistance is unfathomable and to be commended
The point of my post was driven by my watching the daily release notes to see what was being worked on and looking at the development roadmap - I didn't see much emphasis on backward compatibility in terms of making sure that most/ALL current VB6 programs can be imported and run. This is the MAIN thing that would stop me from switching over from VB6. It's a very real issue for me as none of my large apps can be imported at this time. I imagine that the issue would be a barrier to adoption for others as well. I felt it important to chime in and let Wayne know that. Not in a complaining way but in a provide feedback way.
I don't have an expectation that all the issues should be ironed out in BETA.
With Olaf's views about what the future of VB6 should be I'm not too disappointed; he doesn't seem like he would be willing to drop the whole RC6 and no native, VB-compatible UI things.Quote:
Originally Posted by SearchingDataOnly
---
The lack of a true Win32 UI for the IDE was quite an adjustment, but especially with the new revamped post-423 IDE I've largely gotten comfortable with it as a daily driver; the modern editor amenities help a great deal with that. But @Chenzen, it's nowhere near as sophisticated as tB but you do know VB6 does have some color options, right? A few years back I changed it to a black editor background. There's addins that even allow using arbitrary colors instead of the small set in the built in editor; I made mine look more like tB lol
A VB6-successor will have no (long-term) future, when it is not working on multiple platforms (Win, Linux, Mac) - period.Quote:
Originally Posted by fafalone
(and since its a "visual language" - this includes *all* the underlying GUI-mechanisms - e.g. for VB-implemented "UserControls or Widgets").
You still don't understand the importance of it (due to lack of interest in OS-architectures and "structural, software-engineering"-things) -Quote:
Originally Posted by fafalone
but (as said earlier already) this might change, as soon as Wayne starts working on the Linux-support for real...
I leave it to Wayne, to educate you then, about all the up-cropping problems, when the time for it arrives...
To give just one example... your current knowledge about shell32.dll or comctl32.dll (and their accompanying typelibs) -
will worth nothing on the Linux-platform ... 98% of the current pool of "It works with TB"-Demo-Apps will not compile.
With that in mind, you might want to think about, on what basis e.g. a "native, tb-implemented UserControl" shall work,
so that the implementing "VB-drawing-primitives" will work on *all* platforms (without any changes, no matter for which platform you compile it).
And once you have developed such "nice, platform independent working" GUI- and native UserControl-modules+Classes -
what reason is there, to not develop the whole IDE based on *that* (and not on top of a Browser-engine, Electron-like).
There's quite a lot of things in the meantime, which do not make any sense to me (engineering- and management-wise) at the tb-Front...
(when the goal still remains, to make it a platform-independent tool in the end...).
What's happening currently, is only useful when TB remains a "Windows-only-tool"
(for a dying-out community of on average 60years old "Win-only VB-devs", which might carry it along for a decade or two - but not more).
Just my $0.02 on that matter...
Olaf
Yes thank you Captain "Professional" for the great wisdom of informing me Windows APIs only work on Windows and not Linux.
I understand the important of cross platform ability, but I don't think you understand the importance of existing apps that are for Windows to begin with to continue to work as-is. 'Rewrite the entire UI *first*' is too high a barrier to bringing in existing code. Without UI compatibility, people probably won't even be interested in taking the first step into a successor at this point, let alone jumping to cross platform.
If you really understand that, then why does e.g. a "WinDev-lib" even exists?Quote:
Originally Posted by fafalone
FYI, the codebase of a TB-App, which really is "portable between platforms", shall have not a single API-Declare,
which points to any Win-only-Flat-Dll (among them "kernel32", "user32", "shell32", "comctl32").
Is it really that important, as you make it out to be?Quote:
Originally Posted by fafalone
FYI, the most compatible compiler for existing VB6-code is still VB6.exe!
And I dare say, that even in 10 years, the 32Bit-Apps this existing (and near bug-free) compiler produces,
will still "continue to work" (on a then Win12 or Win13).
Our remaining, small community of then - "on average 70year old VB6-devs" will appreciate to still have this option, I guess.
What I'd like to see survive long-term - is "VB6 and its visual concepts" (a re-incarnation, attractive for "younger devs") -
whereas Wayne seems to give too much weight to the opinions of a "loud, but nevertheless shrinking community - nearing retirement"
(wasting whole years with "Win-only stuff", on a "compatibility" which is not really needed - because VB6.exe is still there).
Olaf
Because *I* understand the importance of continued support for Windows development too, and got tired of doing API declares the old way of grabbing them one or a few at a time for new projects or having to write new ones for platform built-in stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Schmidt
And thanks for restating the shocking revelation that any *Windows API declares* will not work *on Linux*. Maybe one day someone will learn that for the first time from you.
Yes, yes it is as important as I've made it out to be. And of course VB6.exe will be the *most* compatible, but it won't ever be updated to add any new features. Almost everyone has wanted something new in the language. We know 32bit support will be around for decades to come, but that doesn't mean the VB6 runtime in particular will (vbscript is being phased out already... the day will come when msvbvm60.dll will become deprecated like that and stop shipping with Windows; then sometime after that, things in it will start breaking in newer Windows versions and won't be fixed).Quote:
Is it really that important, as you make it out to be?
FYI, the most compatible compiler for existing VB6-code is still VB6.exe!
And I dare say, that even in 10 years, the 32Bit-Apps this existing (and near bug-free) compiler produces,
will still "continue to work" (on a then Win12 or Win13).
Our remaining, small community of then - "on average 70year old VB6-devs" will appreciate to still have this option, I guess.
What I'd like to see survive long-term - is "VB6 and its visual concepts" (a re-incarnation, attractive for "younger devs") -
whereas Wayne seems to give too much weight to the opinions of a "loud, but nevertheless shrinking community - nearing retirement"
(wasting whole years with "Win-only stuff", on a "compatibility" which is not really needed - because VB6.exe is still there).
Olaf
Do you have any evidence besides your own opinion that there's a huge number of people who want *some* VB6 compatibility, but don't care to have their Windows UIs continue to work because all they care about is going cross-platform, and nothing else? I think if that was a popular opinion we'd here somebody besides you giving it, and with enough support maybe the priority order for tB would have changed. Or do you think these are people not currently in the VB community, but would come running to use it back from wherever they are now?
Again, everyone knows cross-platform support is increasingly important, but compatibility is more important. There just not a huge market for "VB6-compatile, but only non-API code"; their needs are being met by other languages. A working ecosystem of upgraded VB6 full compatibility with cross platform *potential* is a draw. But you're making the barrier for entry a mountain so high you may be alone climbing it.
I agree more with Olaf. But the problem is that Wayne has spent too much time on compatibility, too much time on details, too much time on the Win platform. Well, he is now riding a tiger (getting off a tiger is not an easy task), and he can only continue to work hard and release the official version twinBasic-1.0 as soon as possible. When the official version of twinBasic is successful in the market, Wayne needed to bring in external capital and build a full-time development team to work on cross-platform compiler, cross-platform UI-libs and cross-platform IDE.
Someone is actually doing something and telling us the progress and I'm happy with that, ie Wayne with TB64. VB is at last going somewhere. Before, it was largely going nowhere despite the efforts of many fixing it up in the form of various additions in the codebank and online. VB now has an owner and a Project Manager who knows what he wants to achieve and a direction. He is making it work. That is a success.
Olaf made serious progress on the cross platform front with RC 5/6 but we have had no recent update regarding progress on what I call 'OlafBasic' (not sure what OlafBasic actually consists of, how much actually exists or is under development) but I'd love to have an update from Olaf on the progress of his magnum Opus. I use RC5/6 every day and appreciate it for what it is so far.
Wayne is correct in his decision that TB64 needs to replicate VB6 and all its foibles to fill a perceived gap in the market due to VB6 entering 'legacy mode', Olaf is also correct in that VB6 needs a cross platform future to survive in the longer term. There is some conflict between the two directions but these won't be resolved by arguing about them. Wayne is taking steps in a direction and perhaps the cross compatibility aim will suffer in the medium term but I have confidence that a direction/solution will reveal itself. Wayne will tell us his plans when he is ready.
I've always said we ought to contribute to a group goal but this group can't work together, that is evident.
I am hoping that RC and TB64 have a future together and possibly some sort of symbiosis toward that aim of cross compatibility. I hope it will at the very least continue to work...
There really isn't a battle here, it is just how we do it and step by step, perhaps we can make progress. If would be nice if you lot here could let bygones be bygones and not battle over it all. It isn't constructive.
"I tried my program and it didn't work" is the number one thing turning people off to tB.
I just have a hard time believing "I tried my program and it didn't work, but if I rewrite the entire UI first and everything else dependent on Windows, maybe it will, or maybe it still won't" ('OlafBasic' almost certainly won't support internals-hacking asm thunks or obscure undocumented msvbvm60 calls either, so the 'maybe it won't' is inevitable) is something people are clamoring for. It's just not realistic that people looking for a VB6 replacement in 2024 or later are interested in major rewrites of existing code before they can even run it. And without a lot of existing work to get people interested, why would a non-VB6 person suddenly want a VB6 replacement?
i keep getting this error when adding available packages
twinBASIC Internal Error 33330 : IDE was unable to read builtin package file data
Most likely, you've extracted the IDE zip file content over an old version of the IDE. You must extract the zip file cleanly into a new location.Quote:
Originally Posted by Semke
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: June 24, 2024
Highlights include a new multi-line caption-editing dialog, implementation of several missing VB6 control properties, and advanced pointer handling via CType(Of ).
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-june-24-2024/
Just an observation, these 60 year old devs might have a bit of technical 'clout' being in the business so many years. Some of them will have influence in making a suggestion here and there. In addition, this thread has received over a million views, that is an indication of how popular a subject TwinBasic is. Bear in mind, this little forum of a few win-only VB devs, is generating a lot of hits on a subject that at least some of the world, finds quite interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Schmidt
bug with lenb when non-english characters used in udt .
Attachment 192126
The forum does not allow twinbasic questions or technical articles or code libraries to be displayed in the VB6 section, which is a big loss. It would also be good if this topic or questions about TWINBASIC could be pinned to the top and displayed in the VB6 topic category.Quote:
Originally Posted by yereverluvinuncleber
In fact, every question about the TWINBASIC release and every code bank module file should be displayed in the VB6 topic category at the same time, because the two are almost the same.
At the same time, TWINBASIC should be displayed on many other forums and community websites, such as python, linux, vb.net, excel vba, office automation, WEBIDE, JAVASCRIPT, C# and other community categories for posting and asking for help. Twinbasic should be everywhere.
What is the positioning of TWINBASIC? Replace VB6 to develop some gadget software? Or develop cross-platform software and develop scripts instead of powershell, like AutoHotkey.exe and AutoIt3.
Maybe its function is like python, enabling rapid development, and it is similar to an IDE like codeblocks, which can quickly develop some EXE programs like VC++.
In the future, the web version of the IDE will not run on the Windows system. You can directly open the web page on your mobile phone to use the purchase, sales and inventory software, ERP management software, and the web version of the remote desktop to directly operate the WIN10 system on the Amazon cloud server.
python, javascript, node.js, java, c# rule everything, vb6, vb.net, twinbasic are becoming more and more difficult to follow.
In another 20 years, maybe our generation of VB programmers will all leave the world, and no one will use the VB language anymore?
tB:VB6::VB6:VB1. Of course, think of the chaos if 99% of the forum was VB1 because most people weren't ready to upgrade to VB6 :D
twinbasic,
form1.printform,Do not know if this method has been implemented?
I used Vb6 to add some tags and three images. As a result, when printing, the text of this tag is always out of focus. Sometimes it becomes left-aligned, and sometimes the text is not fully displayed.
Because the size of this print is very small, it is a supermarket label, but it also needs to print two two-dimensional code pictures.
It is mainly about the printing system of BB, as well as the font size and size of the text
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: July 3, 2024
Highlights include initial Printer object support, a new PDF Merge utility from fafalone, and an answer to one redditor's burning question.
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-july-3-2024/
Perhaps the best choice is to be acquired by b4i, b4a development tools company, which implements Android app development, Apple app development, b4j Java interface and program development.They got a lot of venture capital money.Quote:
Originally Posted by SearchingDataOnly
If we can read the wine code. The windows UI control. Into the Linux GTK implementation, so you don't need to translate it all together.Just like Linux uses Cario, or GTK, raylib, winform, MauiQuote:
Originally Posted by fafalone
It's just a choice.
To achieve the highest degree of compatibility with wine, it is definitely necessary to develop an IDE.There was a Chinese who turned 300 dlls of Google Chrome into only one DLL.
The Google kernel becomes a webbrowser-like OCX control. From 500 megabytes in size to only 35 megabytes.
This technical solution was quite useful before Microsoft's webview 2 control.
In the past, the speed of mechanical hard disk was only 100 megabytes.We will choose the memory operating system.Trim down the operating system to just the necessary files. As long as your C disk changes from 20gb to 5gb.
Then we install the system into the memory, and you only need 16gb of memory, and you can experience the read and write speed of 8000 MB per second.
Now the technology of solid-state hard disk is becoming more and more powerful.The speed reaches about 2GB per second.So of course no one uses the memory operating system.Its greatest advantage is that it can prevent viruses from invading, and every time it restarts the computer, it becomes a brand new system.
windows api,createwindowex,findwindow,listview,listbox by api,All technologies can be implemented on Linux.
First of all, I developed an IDE twinbasic, in which all the windows are the first to use the functions of the API, cross-platform, this is no problem. It needs to be integrated with open source technology.
You can also use Linux as a normal application. QT, UI, GTK, for example, are packaged as VB6 form interface elements. Or simulate winform.
At present, some college students have implemented a winform cross-platform UI. The GTK package becomes the windows forms implementation on all systems with an almost identical display. It's just that he has fewer interfaces.
When importing a VB6 project in a non-English development environment(32/64), the editor will automatically insert space characters at the coding file beginning when you try to enter some code.when imported project name used pure english characters then everything goes well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xiaoyao
Why? The whole point of having different forums is organization. If something were to be cross-posted to all forums, then there's no point in having forums at all. Everything would be everywhere and everyone would have to sort through a bunch of chaff to get to any wheat. That defeats the whole purpose of the forums.
If Apple's development strategy is that the mobile operating system has nothing to do with the system on your computer, and even Apple's computer development department does not know that there is an iOS mobile operating system, and their different employees also discriminate against each other, it will be very bad.
Just like the users of Fat Force Aite here will never look down on Fat Force, and the users of Fat Mark will basically not use vb.net
He could say that the two are completely different programming languagesIn the end, Microsoft used this method to buy Nokia's mobile phone system for about $10 billion.
In just two years, it declared bankruptcy directly, and the sale price was only $100 million.
The biggest problem is that the forum has been out of development and probably hasn't changed in 20 years.
In fact, if the two languages can share these code or technical articles, it can be displayed in both sections at the same time, which is necessary.
If I'm on an Android phone, I can never find news about Apple apps. I think this is a step backwards in technology.
radbasic,twinbasic,Their source code is almost 100% directly similar to VB6, and they are directly compatible with each other.
In our community forum in China, he did not say that in the office software, uh, if most of it is about office VBA related technologies.It can't get it to show up on the office question page.
In fact, we are all completely free, and they can send it wherever they want. Because they use the same syntax and code, it's all generic.
Suppose twinbasic officially releases a VBA replacement.
He was even banned from posting news on the VBA community board.If there is a pure forum, most of them are to exchange VB6 technology. He doesn't even have a separate section for VB. Net.
Then they are not allowed to exchange twinbasic, VBA and VB. Net, which I think is very inconvenient.
Because a lot of code can't be implemented in one language, such as face recognition. The opencv is implemented directly with py. I just need to call it directly through a command function, or use Web socet communication
Different programming languages are used in conjunction with each other. There was even a time when Microsoft had a rule against using openai. But a few months later, they officially issued a press release to cancel the rule.
Because it's like they're saying that the company's employees are prohibited from using iPhones. Customers or employees of Goldstone purchase non-windows products. Even if they leave the company, they can not engage in the development or assistance of Google's Android system.
Those last few weren't on topic, but if I understand your point here, you think that spreading the knowledge between forums would benefit everybody. That's true, but also against the principle of the forum. People are not here to have knowledge spread to them. They are here for an answer to the question they have at the time they have it. Most people want that, and only that. Sure, being exposed to different ideas might benefit them, but it also might not. That's up to them to decide, not for us to push on them. People in Classic VB probably DO want to know about TB, but I'd be surprised if any regular user of the classic VB part of this forum is not currently aware of TB. That means that cross populating the forums would only aggravate them without helping them in any way.
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: July 8, 2024
Highlights include a sneak preview of a coming report writer, plus support for accessing the Printers collection by printer name.
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-july-8-2024/
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: July 15, 2024
Highlights include another week of progress on the upcoming report writer, including another sneak peek video of the feature.
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-july-15-2024/
The report sample cannot be opened properly on Win7.
Attachment 192271
That error only occurs if you have closed the TOOLBAR. If you put the TOOLBAR panel back, it should work as expected.Quote:
Originally Posted by fan2006
Yeah,everything goes well following your instructions.thx.
Over 1 million views of this thread!
Good to see so much interest in the new twinBASIC programming language :D
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: July 22, 2024
Highlights include two blockbuster features that Access developers will instantly recognize: an Access-style report writer and a lightweight expression service.
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-july-22-2024/
Buy a coffee for twinBASIC.
https://ko-fi.com/twinbasic
Done and more than well-deserved!Quote:
Originally Posted by VB6 Programming
I'm sure Wayne will appreciate it :thumb:Quote:
Originally Posted by AAraya
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: July 29, 2024
Highlights include in-place editing of label captions and a mini toolbar for quick formatting of font properties for form and report controls.
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-july-29-2024/
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: August 5, 2024
Highlights include improved array features (better non-Variant support, compile-time type checking, and assignment syntax) and a command line arg handling discussion.
https://nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-august-5-2024/
the tb color dialogbox is not properly displayed.
Attachment 192506
I cant see whats wrong in that pic, can you clarify?
I mean The color dialogbox is not well adapted to the position and is obscured by the taskbar .
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: August 13, 2024
Highlights include predefined caption/text when adding controls, a progress update on form control implementation, and how to set the icon for your tB apps.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-august-13-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: August 19, 2024
Highlights include...a periodic reminder that the twinBASIC project typically keeps an insane release frequency.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-august-19-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: August 25, 2024
Highlights include a couple of teasers regarding forthcoming twinBASIC releases, a possible VIP "Silver" package, and bug fixes for fafalone's WinDevLib twinPACK.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-august-25-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: September 2, 2024
Highlights include bated breath, cautious optimism, sayings of sooth, and pithily proffered prognostications.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-september-2-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
The long awaited new release 593 of the twinBASIC programming language is now available.
See vbforums.com/showthread.php?900178-twinBASIC-programming-Beta-releases&p=5653599&viewfull=1#post5653599
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: September 8, 2024
Highlights include new releases focused on improved performance and VB6/VBA compatibility, along with Microsoft's latest attack on its own tech stack.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-september-8-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
The exe file built with recent release flickers when running.
When running on a toaster? explain - detail.
This sentence means nothing to me. I am an Englishman born and raised in Oxfordshire - and I recognise my language but that's about it.Quote:
Paying off technical debt helps ensure the project's long-term success, but it's a bit like your NFL team drafting an offensive lineman with their first pick: it may be the best choice, but it's still not very exciting.
Attachment 192819
The attchment will make it clear.just check the userform and the taskbar.
Does this translation help?Quote:
Originally Posted by yereverluvinuncleber
"Paying off technical debt is important for the long-term success of a project, but it often feels like doing maintenance work. It’s necessary to ensure everything runs smoothly, but it’s not as exciting as adding new features or making visible improvements."
:thumb: :)Quote:
Originally Posted by aaraya
Yes, I'll take that and "run with it". Thankyou for the translation. I was beginning to feel like a foreigner.
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: September 16, 2024
Highlights include support for the .Image property on Form/PictureBox/MDIForm objects, two new static analysis warnings, and inline assembly language support.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-september-16-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
twinBASIC status update:
twinBASIC Update: September 23, 2024
Highlights include big plans for the future of UDTs in twinBASIC and an in-person presentation on twinBASIC at Oxford University in England.
nolongerset.com/twinbasic-update-september-23-2024/
The latest releases of the twinBASIC programming IDE are available at https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/releases
Why I can't connect listview to ImageList in twinbasic 610?
Not implemented yet. You can set it via code right now as a workaround... I'll have to check later whether it still requires API.
bug with tb mothview .the monthview will not stop when the left/right arrow button is clicked.
There's an existing report on this you can follow to track status: https://github.com/twinbasic/twinbasic/issues/1898Quote:
Originally Posted by fan2006
The issue is now fixed as of Beta 613 .Quote:
Originally Posted by fan2006