General DoomSharp() Discussion

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Originally Posted by timeshifter

Say that again and I will hunt you down and kill you in your sleep. :eek:

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I admire the amount of work you're putting into something essentially useless. I really do. :wave:

Keep up the awesome work, guys, and post updated versions of what have you to keep us in the loop! Can't wait to see a movable version of the maps.

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Originally Posted by CornedBee

I admire the amount of work you're putting into something essentially useless. I really do. :wave:

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Stop making noise in our thread...:)

Thanks
- ØØ -

Well i saw dat pic! It is quite awesome! Very nice work man!

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Originally Posted by CornedBee

I admire the amount of work you're putting into something essentially useless. I really do. :wave:

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Nothing is useless. As long as you learn something along the way :)

chem

OMG OMG OOOMMMMMGGGGGGG!!!!!!

Noteme, marry me. Now. I just downloaded your stuff. IT ****ing works!!!!!!!

WO0t! I'm soooo happy.

Yeah there are a few big bugs still awaiting attention but this is the single biggest revelation in our development so far! The mouse movement is really nice, even if it is upside down, but that can be fixed in the form's mouse handling, it'lll just be a matter of flipping the Y axis, I'll do that in a minute.

This is fabulous it really feels like a physical 3D building now.

This is not a "small milestone" this is a towering, ominous, sinister monolith, putting fear into the hearts of man and beast alike.

I'm absolutely chuffed :D :thumb:

Note, there is a problem with the game now, this corridor should be 2 cube wider than it looks on screen. Not sure where the problem is. I'll investigate.

I'm afraid that screenshots will not be able to do this any justice due to their non-animated nature but the least I can do is try to post a Stereogram of our scene. Here it is... (you'll have to stand a long way back from your screen and make your eyes cross over so you can see the effect, hey if you don't know what a stereogram is then you need to get out more. :D)

those two images remind me of a game on my mac (Nanosaur II)...
it is a flying game with split red/blue images so you can wear the red/blue glasses to see the game in 3D. would this, or something similar, be possible with D#?

Theoretically possible yes, but extremely difficult at the same time.

But you can see the depth of the map with the above image :D

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Originally Posted by wossname

OMG OMG OOOMMMMMGGGGGGG!!!!!!

Noteme, marry me. Now. I just downloaded your stuff. IT ****ing works!!!!!!!

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Off course it works. It was me who did it..;)

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Originally Posted by wossname

Yeah there are a few big bugs still awaiting attention but this is the single biggest revelation in our development so far! The mouse movement is really nice, even if it is upside down, but that can be fixed in the form's mouse handling, it'lll just be a matter of flipping the Y axis, I'll do that in a minute.

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I was poundering that too. I first tested the code in DX, then ported it to use our vector class. And then it was suddenly moving in the wrong direction when I moved the mouse...I couldn't get it. So I just changed the two first lines in the "MouseMovement" function. And then it worked for me. But now you are saying that it is wrong again? Is it me or you that is tired now? Hmm

There is still a normalize bug in the mouse movement thingy. But I didn't bother to look at it...I was too tired. Will keep my promise and lay my fat fingers off the project a couple of days. Will work on the web page now.


PS: I saw a guy trying to kill him self today 5m away from me...BOOOOM..:(


- ØØ -

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Originally Posted by tr333

those two images remind me of a game on my mac (Nanosaur II)...
it is a flying game with split red/blue images so you can wear the red/blue glasses to see the game in 3D. would this, or something similar, be possible with D#?

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I must admitt that I have no idea about the math behind the 3D RedGreen stuff. But It is possible to draw like this, but it will be much slower then the current version. Probably abou 1/3 of the speed. But I don't know for sure though.

- ØØ -

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Originally Posted by NoteMe

I must admitt that I have no idea about the math behind the 3D RedGreen stuff. But It is possible to draw like this, but it will be much slower then the current version. Probably abou 1/3 of the speed. But I don't know for sure though.

- ØØ -

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*The following is a hypothetical musing, we are NOT going to implement this EVER...*

Its actually very simple maths. All you need to do is take 2 'photo's of the scene, one from the position of your left eye and one from the right eye.

Then you make the left one turn red and the right one blue. Then you superimpose the images on the screen (it will look like a right mess unless you are wearing the glasses).

The red lens decodes the left eye's image and the blue does the right eye's image. The human brain does the rest.

This may be possible because we'd be rendering 2 scenes instead of one, we could get away with lowering the detail and maybe even getting rid of textures completely.

It would look like crap but they 3d depth effect would be very cool.



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Note: regarding the mouse up/down issue, what I mean by the "right way up" is that if you push the mouse forward the camera looks downward, like in a flight-simulator. Other people prefer it the other way, maybe we should have an option for this. Which way do you normally have it? :)

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Originally Posted by wossname

It would look like crap but they 3d depth effect would be very cool.

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i agree... since when did 3D images have to have textures like 2D images?

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Originally Posted by wossname

maybe we should have an option for this. Which way do you normally have it? :)

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almost every game i can think of has the option to reverse the mouse y-axis in the user preferences.

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Originally Posted by wossname

Note: regarding the mouse up/down issue, what I mean by the "right way up" is that if you push the mouse forward the camera looks downward, like in a flight-simulator. Other people prefer it the other way, maybe we should have an option for this. Which way do you normally have it? :)

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I prefer the FPS way, and that was what I tried to do, but remember I was tired.::D..I might have thought I moved my hand forward, but was pulling it backward...:9

I like the inverted y-axis for console games, but i'm so much more used to moving the mouse right where it needs to go, eg if the enemy is in the top right, i move my mouse to the top right...


[WOSSY]
About the mouse painting in the map editor, I really like it, but I think you should try and put the original copy back in, too. It'd be cool and much easier to use if you could hold shift to paint tiles, but if you didn't hold shift, it would just copy the single tile to a single place like it originally did.

I don't know what the code for that would look like or how hard it would be, but it would still be a very user-friendly way to do things.

For the overlay 3D, you simply manage two cameras at once, positioned about 3-4 cms apart (that's the distance between the two eyes). Throw away textures - the colouring makes them ugly anyway.

The special edition Shrek DVD contains a video made in that style, although they used very tricky techniques to preserve most of the colours.

FarBrauche (SP? you german speaking guy) made a demo with the 3D effect. It is incredible.

But don't you need 3 cameras? One straigth on, one to the left, and one to the rigth?

Like on this picture, it looks like you first draw the original image, then one red version without textures to the left, and then one blue without textures to the right.

http://www.starshadows.com/Eclipse3D.jpg


- ØØ -

There's no original version in that picture. Both the red and blue images are textured, though. (Monochrome textures, translated to red and blue, respectively.)

Well I guess it can't be too hard then..:)...it would have been wossy that got 99% of the job anyway..:D:D:D:D

I guess it is a job for someone that wants to play around with our engine when we are done with ti...;)


- ØØ -

Ok, i got a texture going onto a quad properly for you.

It's not perspective yet (did you still want that?), it just stretches an image onto a quad, and it is still VB.NET and hence still EXTREMELY slow...

so i guess i'll be touching it all up and making sure it works with a number of quads and convert it all to c#, although wossname will have to do alot of that especially to make it faster and fit in with your current code.

As wossname said.. i'm not sure if this kind of blitting of the textures will ever be fast enough for your needs.

0.00025 what?

alright,

i have basic perspectvie working (basic as in 1 axis works, not the other)
it's looks hot

this is it with wossnames old avatar
notice because ive set a fairly large z so its stretching the first pixel alot and hardly anything from the other side is visible.

EDIT NOTE (AGAIN): 00025 fps.. but the counter for that is definetly stuffed, that number is impossible, lol.. ill have to fix that

ha, ok.. im still not 100% sure this is right so dont get too thrilled.

but its actually over 2000 fps
i swapped to the last way i did it with actually counting frames and comparing seconds, and that showed very low.. 1 or 2..

then when i commented the line that output to the screen and uncommented the one that showed 2000, it came up with 1

commented out all the counting code and back up to 2k for the other method.. so it seems all along that code for measuring speed i was using was causing the speed loss! never doing it that way again..

I cannot help but feel somewhat sceptical about your framerates.

Can you show us your timing code?

yeah, im sceptical of it too.. thats why i said dont get excited, lol

VB Code:

If tcs > Now.Ticks Then
                'Me.Text = (Now.Ticks + (Now.Ticks.MaxValue - tcs)) / 1000
            Else
                Me.Text = (Now.Ticks - tcs) / 1000
            End If
            tcs = Now.Ticks

but the perspective is looking great! can't believe i got it working (i have little faith in myself these days)

hmm.. ouch..

discovered the issue, now using Now.Millisecond not .Ticks
it now reads like 0.3-0.4 fps, not cool

Hey Noteme..
Maybe you could use some technique of Image Processing by using a Filter to Filter one of the RGB to get the effect of seeing through glasses.I know...for me to say is easy..
but,Is that idea also very hard? :) I bet you can do it..You're an IP guru ;)

Yes it's only a few lines of code to do this, but this is all academic really since its not going to happen :D

Roger that...

We don't need much IP to accomplish the Red Blue/green effect. But as Wossy says. We will leave it out. Others can do it if they want, when we release the code.

- ØØ -

Oh,then,I wish I will be the one to do that :)

OK, the web page is still far from done, but at least I have managed to upload all the screen shots and sketches and so on. 4 categories. So now it is easier to find them all. At least I hope..:)


DoomSharp();


- ØØ -

Nice website work note :)

I had a revelation about the blitter last night, it was an epiphany. The clouds parted and the gods (Carmack, Romero) showed me a sign.

Trapezoids are not required, it is a theory of great beauty and elegance. Or at least it will be once I work out how the hell to code it. :D

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Originally Posted by NoteMe

OK, the web page is still far from done, but at least I have managed to upload all the screen shots and sketches and so on. 4 categories. So now it is easier to find them all. At least I hope..:)


DoomSharp();


- ØØ -

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noticed a few typos on the screenshots page:


"Scetches" should be "Sketches"

"Wossname have made on of the sexiest map editors ever for this simple game." should be "Wossname has made on of the sexiest map editors ever for this simple game."

"Except from that, the rest of the pictures are from the engine from early stages untill the end." should be "Except from that, the rest of the pictures are from the engine from early stages until the end."

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Originally Posted by tr333

"Wossname has made one of the sexiest map editors ever for this simple game."

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Hey, nobody's perfect :D

Hehe..thanks...I corrected the word Sketches a few places...but I guess I missed one or two places..thanks..:)

- ØØ -

also on the contact page:

"Wossname and NoteMe got togheter"
"Wossname and NoteMe got together"


"He is also the map viewer and this web page." - not sure what this should say ;)

Hehe..come on...we havn't even finsihed half the page....we can use a spell checker one day when we don't need coffee through a tube into our arm to stay awake..:)


- ØØ -

Leave it as it is, I think it adds a certain charm :D

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Originally Posted by wossname

Nice website work note :)

I had a revelation about the blitter last night, it was an epiphany. The clouds parted and the gods (Carmack, Romero) showed me a sign.

Trapezoids are not required, it is a theory of great beauty and elegance. Or at least it will be once I work out how the hell to code it. :D

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don't even know where the traoezoid idea came form, lol
would your spark be the same as the way mine is coded? ;)
it just needs to be touched up and converted to c#
do you want the source to it?

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Originally Posted by Phill64

would your spark be the same as the way mine is coded? ;)

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I don't know, I haven't seen yours.