Printable View
I disagree. Its stores the info needed to create a human being (dog, cat self replication etc..)Quote:
Simon
Knowledge, is something subjective you know, that can't be stored in some kind of DNA string
Subjectivity comes into the interpretation of that knowledge.
Honeybee
The current situation of yours might just be because it's not likely for it to change. You won't commit suicide due to genetical information, but with enough information to counter it you can commit suicide as well. The point is that there is so much underlying information that you never get to understand. You are imprisonated by your own mind. "People who really are in their senses" are just innocent unknowing animals that don't qwestion anything, they eat their world without thinking about it.
Who said you cannot stop time? Who said it wouldn't be better if you just did? Have you met any 400 year old guys lately?
If i say that I one day is going to kill you, more specifically fourth june 2004, dead seriously would you just go say "I can accept that" and then live with it without feeling any fear? the ones with blood cancer that are going to die are certainly convinced they are going to die and can therefore accept the "fact", but would you be convinced that I'm going to kill you? It's fear that you wont get to do everything you want to have done, not fear what is beyond death. Now what do you need all those stuff done when they won't matter as soon as you die? I think it all ends up in one pile, but for now continue...
If that's the eternal truth then you die because you failed to understand the opposite. There's no proof you're going to die, all the "deaths" around are just faked.Quote:
Who said you're going to die? Nobody has to say it. It is an eternal truth.
More than that I can't really reply to you because it all goes into the category "I don't care", the people you know as "are in their senses" quite ignorant but I don't blame you.
btw, I won't kill you fourth june 2004 ;)
knowledge is data, DNA is a medium, the information stored in a medium is meaningless without interpretation, in fact there's no information stored in the medium without interpretationQuote:
Originally posted by RSINGH
I disagree. Its stores the info needed to create a human being (dog, cat self replication etc..)
Subjectivity comes into the interpretation of that knowledge.
To live a life and to live to help your loved ones and those around you in need.. while providing humour to your friends... Thats my theory... :)
Kedaman
Agreed BUT
The DNA data is interpreted at a different biological level, not by the human brain. It's just that we have acquired the ability to understand parts of it. It's a human failing to put ourselves at the centre and try to understand things from that perspective. Just because we are now able to decode DNA does not mean that we need to. It's there for a different purpose (the different biological level that I was blathering about).
what about DNA is just there because it's "likely" to be that way. I'm refering to evolution, DNA has preserved because of it. Ok, you could argue there is meaning to DNA but pick a ultimate purpose, what's the whole idea? Doesn't it run down to subjectivity now?Quote:
Originally posted by RSINGH
Kedaman
Agreed BUT
The DNA data is interpreted at a different biological level, not by the human brain. It's just that we have acquired the ability to understand parts of it. It's a human failing to put ourselves at the centre and try to understand things from that perspective. Just because we are now able to decode DNA does not mean that we need to. It's there for a different purpose (the different biological level that I was blathering about).
Say I have a pen on my desk. It's position on it can be interpreted as a number which by radix conversion could contain all the information in say the bible. Does the pen contain all that info? Not if you don't consider it to do so.
Kedaman
The point that I'm arguing here is that DNA is more than just a medium. I am proposing that it is an embodyment of knowlege itself.Quote:
knowledge is data, DNA is a medium, the information stored in a medium is meaningless without interpretation, in fact there's no information stored in the medium without interpretation
Why does our DNA embody knowledge? Because our DNA contains the information necessary to cause certain environments to produce copies of itself. Thus, the environment interprets the information or knowledge embodied in the replicating genes.
The point I'm concerned with is that human evolution is incidental in the sense that we are mere vessells or containers for these genes to propogate themselves. The genes are more important than the individual. It is the survival of these which is paramount. Our evolution along the way benefits the gene in that it can then continue to propogate. Hence the term The Selfish Gene. (The books quite an eye opener)
Oh if I could have used that one in my exams:DQuote:
It's position on it can be interpreted as a number which by radix conversion could contain all the information in say the bible
Me: There're the answers to all the exam Q's in the pen - get it out yourself, I'm off to the pub.
And that aint something because of strange random feature?
I think you're abusing definitions, knowledge is absolutely nothing without subjectivity. You can apply your ideas on DNA but I can apply them on anything, including the pen on my desk. IF i take a picture of my pen on the desk, it's info is copied.
Genes are subjective, they are nothing without a context. DNA is the molecule, not to mix with Genes which are the interpretations of them
I live life to please Jesus Christ because HE has given me a purpose for living!
:)
Kedaman
Quote:
I think you're abusing definitions, knowledge is absolutely nothing without subjectivity.
See the above statements. Firstly you say that "knowledge is absolutely nothing without subjectivity" and in your next breath you say that "Genes are subjective". Does not this then imply, from your own admission, that the knowlege embodied by genes does mean something?Quote:
Genes are subjective, they are nothing without a context.
Not really. Does a pen embody knowledge? Or, more to the point, does a pen cause certain environments to replicate it? No. The pen is not living (I don't think even you would argue against that).Quote:
You can apply your ideas on DNA but I can apply them on anything, including the pen on my desk.
Uh :p That's not what I meant. Genes aren't physical, they are interpretations of parts of the DNA molecule. Who said life is connected to information? As I see it only you can decide what information is, other than that you can only use applied scope.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Kedaman
See the above statements. Firstly you say that "knowledge is absolutely nothing without subjectivity" and in your next breath you say that "Genes are subjective". Does not this then imply, from your own admission, that the knowlege embodied by genes does mean something?
Not really. Does a pen embody knowledge? Or, more to the point, does a pen cause certain environments to replicate it? No. The pen is not living (I don't think even you would argue against that).
Interpretations imply a variety of meanings for one combination of DNA. A specific combination will always lead to one result. One gene equates to one result not one of several possibilities.Quote:
Genes aren't physical, they are interpretations of parts of the DNA molecule
However I think we are wandering way of topic to the original question.
What was the original qwestion?
That combination, the equety, that result is all information, such don't exist in physical reality.
First time I've seen this post :
Great way to start the thread :D like you too Kedaman :DQuote:
Why don't you go and die ...
might be funny :p but i was serious (people say you shouldn't kid about death but i'm saying you shouldnt fear it)
no 1 rule of life - ***** happens!
if I die, bummer, but that's it. I'm kinda fascinated in that side of it myself rather than scared, think I'd tend to believe the reincarnation theory, coming back as another baby seems the most logical explanation to me if I believe any of the theories (avoiding all the religious crap)! :D
Reincarnation rocks! Basically i could be everyone without knowing it ;)
Life is what you make of it. There are thousands of people doing what you do for a living. But you will be the only person alive who has sole custody of your life. Your particular life.
Your entire life. Not just your life at a desk, or your life on a bus, or in a car, or at the computer. Not just the life of your mind, but the life of your heart. Not just your bank account but your soul.
People don't talk about the soul very much anymore. It's so much easier to write a resume than to craft a spirit. But a resume is a cold comfort on a winter night, or when you're sad, or broke, or lonely, or when you've gotten back the test results and they're not so good.
Here is my resume:
I am a good mother to three children.
I have tried never to let my profession stand in the way of being a
good parent.
I no longer consider myself the center of the universe.
I show up.
I listen.
I try to laugh.
I am a good friend to my husband.
I am a good friend to my friends, and they to me. Without them, there would be nothing to say to you today, because I would be a cardboard cutout.
But I call them on the phone, and I meet them for lunch.
I would be rotten, or at best mediocre at my job, if those other things were not true. You cannot be really first rate at your work if your work is all you are.
So here's what I wanted to tell you today:
Get a life. A real life, not a manic pursuit of the next promotion, the bigger paycheck, the larger house. Do you think you'd care so very
much about those things if you had a heart attack one evening, or found a lump in your breast?
Get a life in which you notice the smell of salt water pushing itself
on a breeze over Seaside Heights, a life in which you stop and watch how a red tailed hawk circles over the water or the way a baby scowls with concentration when she tries to pick up a Cheerio with her thumb and first finger.
Get a life in which you are not alone. Find people you love, and who love you. And remember that love is not leisure, it is work.
Pick up the phone. Send an e-mail. Write a letter.
Get a life in which you are generous. And realize that life is the best thing ever, and that you have no business taking it for granted. Care so deeply about its goodness that you want to spread it around. Take money you would have spent on beers and give it to charity. Work in a soup kitchen. Be a big brother or sister. All of you want to do well. But if you do not do good too, then doing well will never be enough.
It is so easy to waste our lives, our days, our hours, our minutes. It is so easy to take for granted the color of our kids' eyes, the way the melody in a symphony rises and falls and disappears and rises again. It is so easy to exist instead of to live.
I learned to live many years ago. Something really, really bad happened, something that changed my life in ways that, if I had my druthers, it would never have been changed at all. And what I learned from it is what, today, seems to be the hardest lesson of all.
I learned to love the journey, not the destination.
I learned that it is not a dress rehearsal, and that today is the only guarantee you get.
I learned to look at all the good in the world and try to give some of it back because I believed in it, completely and utterly.
And I tried to do that, in part, by telling others what I had learned.
By telling them this:
Consider the lilies of the field.
Look at the fuzz on a baby's ear.
Read in the backyard with the sun on your face.
Learn to be happy.
And think of life as a terminal illness, because if you do, you will live it with joy and passion, as it ought to be lived.
Nice theory, Chris! I concur 100%!!!!!!!!:)Quote:
Originally posted by chrismitchell
To live a life and to live to help your loved ones and those around you in need.. while providing humour to your friends... Thats my theory... :)
The PoINt of Living is:
FIND GIRLS DATE GIRLS, SEX WITH BEAUTIFUL GIRLS... WHEN THEY'RE OLD DITCH THEM!!!:);)
Oh give it a rest :)
Life is given to you by your parents for whatever reason they deemed fitting (procreation, love, any kind of reason).
The point is :
You have about 70-80 years on this planet. More if you're lucky or take care of yourself. And that's it. 70-80 years of life to do as you please. After that comes the great void. No paradise, no gods to answer to, no reincarnation.
So what's the point of living then ? The point is that you are here and you have to, wanting or not (suicide is always an option), live your life.
So make the best of it, any which way you can. Be as good a person as you can be. And, first and foremost, make sure that you can look back to a life that was good and wonderful.
Live it goddamnit and cut the crap about religion and the genepool :p
When it's over, it's over. No genepool or god will save you then.
And now it isn't ? Is that what you're saying ? After all the religious wars mankind waged ?
Believe in your god as much as you want. I believe in the life that has been given to me by my parents, no middle man required.
Why ? Because that is all that I can see.
your quote :
"The fear of God, the fear of what will happen on the Judgement Day is what makes a human do good things here. Whatever be your ideas about God or the post-death matters, you cannot ask people to disbelieve in God, as it will lead the entire mankind to its doom. "
That was what the 3 questions were all about.
It's what the religious types have always done, isn't it ?
Trust in god and life will be ok. Lead it to His example and you're a good person.
The righteous will go to Heaven (or equivalent), the sinners to Hell(or equivalent).
You'll grant me my beliefs and I grant you yours. The difference is that this "fear of God" takes away all rational thought.
I give up Honeybee, I don't think you ever be able to understand me :) But that's ok.
I've always wondered what makes you believe in ghosts Honeybee. I suppose you have rational explanations for your beliefs.
Honeybee i never forced my belief on anyoneQuote:
Originally posted by honeybee
I understand why you are confused at me believing in ghosts. But I have been experiencing them since last year. If you remember, I had mentioned about a very close friend of me dying in a tragic car accident. She has returned to us. There is one more ghost/soul whatever you call it, but that's a different matter. Via these two ghosts, I have also been able to communicate with God to some extent.
I know, it all sounds like a fairy tale, but I swear by my knowledge of VB that it's all true. And since I am not Kovan, I don't insist that you believe it just because I believe it.
I don't know if you will have such experiences in your life. I hope so. It's so exciting.
.
and i dont or never attempted that everyone has same views as I do
your just pissed at me because you couldnt keep up a discussion on history about your own heritage