Simon
ok...Quote:
HAPPINESS
you know i have a feeling that you can't explain the difference between happiness and pleasure :)
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Simon
ok...Quote:
HAPPINESS
you know i have a feeling that you can't explain the difference between happiness and pleasure :)
I thought I already did...Quote:
you know i have a feeling that you can't explain the difference between happiness and pleasure
If pleasure is the sensation of satisfying desire, happiness is the feeling of contentment.
bleh ur all making no sense to me
im happy 98% of the time :)
you know that sounds like the same thing to me.. instead of describing in words, why don't you explain why they arise.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
If pleasure is the sensation of satisfying desire, happiness is the feeling of contentment.
Happiness is defined as "The opposite of wanting to die because your life sucks so much". Let's look at an equation
let's assume that TotalH is total happiness. HumanCondition is
the happiness that cannot exist out of the maximum possible happiness. Let YourH equal your level of happiness, and OtherH represent other people.
TotalH=OtherH+YourH+HumanCondition
YourH = TotalH - OtherH - HumanCondition
You see, your happiness will increase when the one variable OtherH decreases, and only then. The other two are constants. [this is a work of fiction for the incredibly retarded in the audience]
PS: I am not sure if this is what you guys mean, but I become happy when I recieve pleasure....:p
You can't pidgeon hole Happiness with a simple definition. 'Happiness' comes in many forms satisfaction/contentment ( as Simon said earlier. ), pleasure , total elation, just to name few. So in context of the original question 'should we be striving be happiness'...What level of happiness should we be striving for??
As an overall life experience, if you have 'contentment' in your life you are doing better than most.
Besides everyone knows whoever dies with the most rubber bands wins anyway.:)
The World Debating Councel have drafted the 2002 rules for this particular debate:
I just looked that up because it looked like some of you guys were about to piss off the judges. Just thought you should be aware of the possible consequences. Personally, I think that happiness should be defined. Unfortunately, my hands are tied in the matter. Sorry.Quote:
Rule 189-12a: Definitions - Happiness
In this debate, the term happiness will be understood to mean "A general overall positive feeling to include joy, security, well-being, harmony and peace."
Physical indicators of happiness will be an abundance of smiling and a bounce in the stride by those with the physical capacity to bounce. By no means is this an exhaustive list of emotional and physical indicators, but who cares anyway?
Rule 93-106e: Semantics
In no case shall participants be allowed to further discuss the meaning of any individual term or group of terms. All discussion will be directed towards the attempt to come to a conclusion regarding the original question.
Although this ruling in itself is open to being picked apart and the use of semantics by the participants, the judges will impose harsh penalties on those who attempt to do so - such as ignoring their posts.
Do a search on Malsow's hierarchy of needs if you want some sort of academic structure to this question.
Keda, I think I already pointed you to this before when you were feeling kinda average as I recall.
Quote:
Originally posted by Pickler
You can't pidgeon hole Happiness with a simple definition. 'Happiness' comes in many forms satisfaction/contentment ( as Simon said earlier. ), pleasure , total elation, just to name few. So in context of the original question 'should we be striving be happiness'...What level of happiness should we be striving for??
As an overall life experience, if you have 'contentment' in your life you are doing better than most.
Besides everyone knows whoever dies with the most rubber bands wins anyway.:)
I agree Pickler... as long as anyone's striving for and attainment of happiness does not make anyone else unhappy (as much as possible.. unfortunately sometimes it happens)
Lots and Lots and Lots of things make me happy... some very simple.. and some much more complex.. A life without those moments of happiness would be valueless to me...and I would rather be dead.
And I have quite a lot of rubber bands :)
You totally skirted the question there, DF. Is happiness the ultimate thing in life?
Kedaman
Why does it sound like the same thing? Didn't we establish that pleasure is fleeting, the sensation of satisfying desire. But it doesn't last. Happiness is the feeling of contentment. It can last as long as you let it.Quote:
you know that sounds like the same thing to me.. instead of describing in words, why don't you explain why they arise.
As to how these feelings arise, isn't that the topic of the thead? To find out the best way to achieving these things?
Quote:
Originally posted by cafeenman
You totally skirted the question there, DF. Is happiness the ultimate thing in life?
I think I did answer it Cafeenman....
Quote:
A life without those moments of happiness would be valueless to me...and I would rather be dead.
Previous generations spent their lives in miserable self denial and drudgery... in the hope of a better time after death.... Forget that;) I'll take my rewards here thank you :)
Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Happiness is the feeling of contentment. It can last as long as you let it.
I disagree that Happiness can last as long as you let it.. there are too many things that are out of our individual control..
for example you may be incredibly happy in a relationship with someone.. but they decide for what ever reason to leave the relationship... you cannot control those around you.. or events in your life.. you might be at the height of all things wonderful in your life and be struck with a crippling or fatal illness.
We should all take as much pleasure and happiness as we can find in life.. valuing the small as well as big pleasures we are lucky enough to come across.
Happiness is not controllable.. and should therefore be valued all the more.
Dragon Fly
I realise that it is impossible to convince anyone of this...that they must realise it for themselves...but you can control your own happiness.Quote:
I disagree that Happiness can last as long as you let it.. there are too many things that are out of our individual control..
OK, you can't control the world around you or the events that occur in your life but you can control your own state of mind (yes you can) if you believe it.
I sincerely believe that the biggest obstacle to happiness is your own mind. We don't let ourselves be happy. You must focus on this and realise it for it to be true.
You probably think I'm a loony, but there you go! :D
Simon
well I don't think there is such thing simon, any longlasting happiness is not because of a single event, but because the effect of that event triggers (which could be a chain of events)Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Kedaman
Why does it sound like the same thing? Didn't we establish that pleasure is fleeting, the sensation of satisfying desire. But it doesn't last. Happiness is the feeling of contentment. It can last as long as you let it.
As to how these feelings arise, isn't that the topic of the thead? To find out the best way to achieving these things?
Kedaman
No, it is not down to any single event. It requires constant attention to one's state of mind. It is very easy to get caught up in the events in you life and forget this.Quote:
well I don't think there is such thing simon, any longlasting happiness is not because of a single event, but because the effect of that event triggers (which could be a chain of events)
This is really scary. Simon is absolutely right about this. It's your thoughts that cause your feelings, not events.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Dragon Fly
OK, you can't control the world around you or the events that occur in your life but you can control your own state of mind (yes you can) if you believe it.
Here's how I know this:
If an event caused a feeling, then the feeling would be out of the control of an individual.
Event causes feeling = feeling is always the same for a given event.
So why do people feel differently when they experience the same event? (If you're guessing that I'm going to explain it, you're right. :) )
My wife hates me. We get a divorce. Divorce = the event
CafeenMan = :( (My feelings)
Wife = :p (Her feelings)
We both experienced the same event.
The difference is:
CafeenMan thinks; "I'm fat and unattractive. Women hate me. I'll be single forever and never be happy. :("
Wife thinks; "Woo Hoo! I'm finally rid of that fat slob. Now I can sleep with anyone I want and no more waking up in fatboy's armpit! :p "
Thoughts cause feelings. If CafeenMan would stop sniveling and think happier thoughts, he would be happier.
BTW, DF. No, you haven't answered the question. You've said that life wouldn't be worth living without moments of happiness. That doesn't necessarily mean that happiness is the ultimate thing to strive for.
I don't think life would be worth living if I weren't doing something productive for the most part. That doesn't mean productivity is the greatest thing in life to achieve.
Simon
Well from what you have said earlier it sounds like a single event has triggered your happinessQuote:
Originally posted by simonm
No, it is not down to any single event. It requires constant attention to one's state of mind. It is very easy to get caught up in the events in you life and forget this.
Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Dragon Fly
I realise that it is impossible to convince anyone of this...that they must realise it for themselves...but you can control your own happiness.
OK, you can't control the world around you or the events that occur in your life but you can control your own state of mind (yes you can) if you believe it.
I sincerely believe that the biggest obstacle to happiness is your own mind. We don't let ourselves be happy. You must focus on this and realise it for it to be true.
You probably think I'm a loony, but there you go! :D
No... I don't think you are a loony at all.. I completely agree that we have some controll over how we view the events in our lives.. and to what extent we allow them to affect our happiness/depression levels.... personally I am an almost always positive and happy person.. (I might be delusional in this;)) but I believe that we can be happy and content in life.....despite the obstacles that come our way.. but not everyone has the ability to think that way.. we see it constantly even on these forums.. people who drop into deep depression because of things that a lot of us would be able to take in our strides...
Having said that.. I think that a certain amount of positivism can be learnt.........presuposing the person has a real desire to be a positive and happy person.. (which most depressives probably don't)
Cafeenman
Don't sound so suprised! :pQuote:
This is really scary. Simon is absolutely right about this.
That's right! You're getting it. :)Quote:
Thoughts cause feelings. If CafeenMan would stop sniveling and think happier thoughts, he would be happier.
Kedaman
It was a single event that made me realise what the biggest obstacle to happiness was. Not to be confused with a single pleasurable moment that caused me to be happy for the rest of my life.Quote:
Well from what you have said earlier it sounds like a single event has triggered your happiness
Don't get me wrong, I'm not perfect. I often lose track and get bogged down in life. It is easy to forget.
DragonFly
I think that everybody doesp have the ability. It is not a special skill or talent that some people have and some people don't. It is something that everyone can realise, potentially.Quote:
.. but not everyone has the ability to think that way..
However, as you say, perhaps some people enjoy being unhappy...
Actually I've understood that for a long time. I'm just not good at applying it. I've taught stress management to many thousands of people and that IS the core concept. But it's not about happiness so much as it's about contentment. Maybe those are the same thing? To me they're different.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Cafeenman
That's right! You're getting it. :)
My definition of happiness is elation.
My definition of contentment is that things are OK.
In neither case are there any negative feelings.
Cafeenman
I think that Elation is merely a state of mind as well. I don't know if you would permanently sustain it however. Being able to call upon it at will would be good though...;)Quote:
My definition of happiness is elation.
Quote:
Originally posted by cafeenman
BTW, DF. No, you haven't answered the question. You've said that life wouldn't be worth living without moments of happiness. That doesn't necessarily mean that happiness is the ultimate thing to strive for.
I don't think life would be worth living if I weren't doing something productive for the most part. That doesn't mean productivity is the greatest thing in life to achieve.
No... Paul.. I did answer it... I can't answer what you or anyone else for that matter.... should strive for in life.. we are all motivated differently.. but I think for me .. the goal of happiness and contentment is my primary goal in life :)
Simon
Potentially we can all be a lot of things.. very few of us reach anywhere near our own potential.. but I agree it is a possibility
OK, that answers it. :) If you said that before I missed it. Sorry. :)Quote:
Originally posted by DragonFly
No... Paul.. I did answer it... I can't answer what you or anyone else for that matter.... should strive for in life.. we are all motivated differently.. but I think for me .. the goal of happiness and contentment is my primary goal in life :)