Has CC always been called "General Discussion / Chit Chat"? :ehh:
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Has CC always been called "General Discussion / Chit Chat"? :ehh:
It's a recent development.
Administration hasn't provided any reasons for the change of name.
Perhaps they want to make it look more 'professional' to the 'sponsors'.
So does that mean we can no longer say CC? GD/CC?
Its always been named that :D
Didnt anyone read the sticky?
http://vbforums.com/showthread.php?t=427391
And yes the name change should reflect the new improved atmosphere in CC. :)
I ruined it for everyone! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!11one
Should we use the [Not Serious] tag now? :ehh:
No tags should be required at all. If you post a fun non serious topic members should be able to pick the tone of the thread up and continue it. If you post a serioue tone/topic then that should be respected.
ok, u guys blew it!!
We coulda totally had Drew going... "yea, its always been called that? why do u ask??"
;)
I like general dissection / kit-kat.
You almost had me until that point. Nice.Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
More helium, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
That explains why Mendhak is talking so funny today.. :afrog:
I'm wearing clothes!
Ok, thats it! Your off topic/hijacking this serious discussion PG so we will have to Ban you now!Quote:
Originally Posted by penagate
See that is how it may be. ;)
Dont worry, no Ban, as we can all have fun in CC as long as its respectful. :)
Whoh, scary! :sick:Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
What's a serious discussion?
Ouch... :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker
What? Your saying that we allow everyone to do what ever they want and not follow the AUP?Quote:
Originally Posted by vbcode1980
CC is holding VBF back from making a forward progress and gaining respectability.
We all like to relax and have fun but if your not respecting other members then that would be an issue we would have to deal with.
No, I was seriously scared.. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
Aiight.Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
You guys are over reacting. This forum is not a free for all and doing so will only lead to disicipline. Nothing different then any of the other technical forums.
Ok, we will behave like professionals. That's what we are after all.
Professional.
Idiots.
I think we should ban friendly banter and genial insults in all walks of life. Having a sense of humour is just so disrespectful.
You might as well try to ban drugs and hookers. Its just not practical.
a ban was a bit OTT don't you think rob?
the comment was meant in jest, and i'm sorry you didn't see it that way, but why not just say so? I would have happily apologised and deleted the post.
knee-jerk moderation is also unprofessional.
would you have still banned me if it had been someone else's name instead of yours, penagate's for instance?
Do me! Do me! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by bushmobile
I love all the moderators, especially grilkipQuote:
Originally Posted by grilkip
hey! i didn't write that! (must be some new-fangled moderator praise functionality)
Brad is the sexiest of all Administrators.
I did type that. He's a hunk.
We are highly amused.
:rolleyes: :lol: :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
In my opinion, Chit Chat is one of the key features in making VBF what it is. There are plenty of forums about where you can get good technical answers to your questions but you suspect that the chap answering did the voice samples for Microsoft Sam. Or possibly is Microsoft Sam. One great thing about VBF is that the members here are individuals with proper personalities and everything, even [deleted by moderator].
The fact that we can come onto this forum and get to know each other as people rather than just as faceless automatons is a big factor in building a community such as this, and I suspect is one reason why so many people have hung around here so long. I include myself in this - I was here when RobDog was just a whippersnapper and will probably continue long after he has worn his fingers to the bone with posting.
Personally, I see nothing wrong with having a [Serious] tag to make it clear to all and sundry, drunk or otherwise, that you want a straight answer. Why not add something to the Post Icons list for such incidences? But the fact that there is hardly any thread hijacking out of CC suggests to me that members generally will respect the lines when they know where the lines are; the seriousness of a thread should be made clear (to non-serious and serious posters) in CC as well rather than leaving it up to individual interpretation. Otherwise all it does is create a climate of fear where nobody knows exactly where the line lies and people are as likely to cross it as not.
Of course people will break the rules now and then with the swearing and such like, but very rarely do I see what I would imagine the majority would call offensive posts. And given that offensiveness is so subjective and variable, it could get very easy to become heavy-handed on the basis that a member who joined yesterday was upset by my use of the word "yoghurt", following a nasty scare in the fridge that morning. Gentle nudging by the mods, who are free to edit posts for content anyway, should be more than enough in the vast majority of cases.
I guess the point I'm trying to make in this monologue is that the community spirit that exists within VBF is what lifts it above the rest (and, in my opinion, enhances its respectability), and to sacrifice that for the sake of worrying about the political correctness of some of the posts in instances where it is easily rectified would be a leap backwards in my opinion.
Oh, and that "[deleted by moderator]" above was put in by me. I'm sure nobody would really have wanted to delete the name of visualAd from there.
:)
Well said (probably, I couldn't actually be arsed to read it all to be honest).
Anyway.
Before the admins start whining about advertising in signatures again, I can name more than 40 members on VBF (mostly in the technical forums, which as we all know, never get the slightest attention from the mods) who have advertisements for their own products in their signatures. And I was leaned on by mod staff for having a small unobtrusive link in my sig for one of my projects.
Fair enough I removed it but incomprehensibly these other people are allowed to keep theirs?
And before you ask, no you can't have the list of names, get off your lazy butts and look for yourselves. You can find them easily enough using the forum search tools. They range from "buy my new tool..." to some quite blatant plagiarism.
I just banned Wally Pipp for 2 days because of his "Idiots" comment. On a different subject I have no problem banning anyone posting off-topic stuff in this thread or any other thread. Some may consider that "over the top" but as long as you are given fair warning you shouldn't be surprised if it happens.
Zaza, it would be nice to have all kinds of time going around editing posts in CC but rather then be reactive, its better for everyone if things could be proactive. We have, over a period of time, received PMs complaining. They also state that they will not post in CC anymore as they feel they were bully'ed out as they either were newcomers or regulars just the same.
We have had occasions where a member has been banned repeatly without "learning" what not to do anymore but they just keep doing it. They think its a game to see how many times they can get banned or such. Thats a waste of our time.
Yes i find that over the top, it's not offensive in any way, it simply refers to him acting like a professional idiot, if that's the case then why not let him call himself one?Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinLiss
Sorry, but i've started losing faith in the way VBF is run, CC to me was the one place i could let off steam, and recently i find i can't do that here. Nor any other forum i frequent. The mods/admins seem to be taking things a step too far.
If Wally had said "We're all professional idiots, especially [insert name]" i could see why you would warn him, or maybe a 24hour ban.
Also, Wossy has a fair point, if you're seriously trying to stop advertisement just look in the normal forums. That's all i care to say on that particular matter.
Chit Chat however was the only place people were ever non-serious, and it seems that you frowned on our invention of the Serious tag. Surprisingly many people here, if not all, embraced it. What was wrong with it?
As for CC making this site look unprofessional, what did they expect seriously? It's off-topic and should show threads with nothing to do with the main site, which is exactly what it did. For general discussion about programming etc there is the General Developers Forum. Chit Chat should mean just that, Chit Chat, aka, Idle Chatter.
Oh, and if you warn me on speaking my thoughts then fair do's. I've come to expect it recently.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew G
Yeah, I noticed that today. It's really weird. lol :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
thegreatone, if other forums you visit dont allow certain kinds of posts too then shouldnt that tell you something. ;)
As far as being unprofessional, when there is alot of posts on sexual innuendos, name calling, and generally inappropriate posts then yes, that is unprofessional in any context. Can you talk like that at your place of work? I think not. but you can talk about non-technical subjects just like at work during your lunch time etc. That should be a good guideline of what type of posts to make or not. ;)
First let me say that I know of no instance where anyone was warned for speaking their mind as you have done here. If you know of an instance please send me a PM and I'll look into it.Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreatone
As far as what should be in the new, revised, CC, nobody would mind post races, word associations, clean jokes or cartoons, and many other non-technical topics.
As for the [Serious] business, we are trying to make that unnecessary by encouraging people to stay on subject and not add juvenile comments, etc. In other words we expect the subject of the thread and the thread starter to be respected.
Please feel free to express any disagreement(s) you may have with anything I've said.
Not really what you wanted to hear, but yes i could freely talk about anything i liked at my place of work, from piracy to bad habits to sexual crap if i honestly wanted to. But i see where you're coming from.Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
Marty, i thought you'd take offense at my post challenging you. Hence the reason i'd thought i'd be warned. Luckily you listen to people, i like that.
Something i have to ask though, you object to Wallys comment, and have banned him for it, yet entire threads of random junk are perfectly fine? Seems strange. But still, it happens.
Thanks for furthur clearing things up mind. Helps a bit to see what you're trying to acheive here.
Robdog, actually, the other forums i visit for some reason don't like idle chatter at all, makes me kind of angry at the,. It happens anyway, and people get banned for it. I just thought VBF was different.
I can see that the AUP is there to be enforced though, so, i say good luck to you all.
As Martin posted in #40, we do allow idle chatter that other forums dont allow, just a small part of what makes VBF different. ;)
Personally I enjoy reading the comments made by some users. Even to my own posts I find them extremely humorous. Just my 2c though..
chem
Thanks for understanding.Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreatone
We've decided that random junk threads are okay (why anyone would want to post in or create them I don't know but maybe I'll too old) as long as they are in accordance with the AUP. However random junk has no place in "serious" CC threads.
Wally's comment was of a totally different stripe than yours.
I'm kind of with you here, i enjoy it too, but only when my question has been suitably answered. Otherwise it's plain annoying. (Unless it's real humour, not just "attach it to your left nipple")Quote:
Originally Posted by chemicalNova
No problem understanding now Marty, you've explained it alot better. Should make a great difference!
Wow. Banning Wally is just plain, um, silly. Cracking down on threads where people are flamed, or where the swear filter is skirted, or other blatant, purposeful AUP violations are going on is one thing. But, everyone pretty much knows Wally Pipp's posting style (as well as many others who have been made examples of recently), and if they don't and the word idiot offends them, then there are other issues that VBF can't help with.
I agree that there are certain members that are incurably rude to the point of being mean. If your moderators weren't buddy-buddy with them, they would have been banned long ago (more than once or twice for two or three days). But good Lord, bans like the recent rash may not make the points you think they do. If there's such a problem, maybe the moderators need a kick in the pants instead of the community that's been posting the same way for years. Yes, I said community - that thing that keeps you in business. Your rolling tanks into chit chat square and that's just plain dumb. IMHO, this is certainly not how you encourage people to post, which is, as stated, one of your goals.
Personally, I like chit chat and world events because one of the two usually has some decent debates between some armchair master debaters. The other, well, the other is the other and serves its purpose as well. I'd hate to see tumbleweeds blowing through it. Ah well, such is life.
the concern I have is regarding how the AUP is / will be intepreted.
Take for instance:where would (obscenity-free) friendly teasing fall in this?Quote:
Originally Posted by AUP
the perpetrator may have meant it as friendly, the recipient may have recieved it as friendly, but a moderator might view it differently. what happens in this case?
does the moderator attempt to establish the feelings of those involved? (you've already mentioned that the mods don't have enough time) or is it going to be blanket banning?
this is a genuine query - i'm not trying to provoke or rile anyone.
Non-AUP-violating teasing is no problem as long as it's not off-topic. And if you are not sure how a tease may be interpreted then don't post it. Perhaps that makes CC less fun, but fun, although its allowed under many circumstances, is not the main purpose of CC.
I'd like to join the chorus encouraging CC to be CC. I've been around here for about four years now, I have never been banned, and I believe I have only had one comment censored, and I'm not even sure what that was. Therefore, I do believe that it is possible to stay within some bounds of reasonable speech, yet still be pretty much inane.
I participate in several forums on MANY different topics, as programming is only one of my interests. There is NO forum that I am aware of that is focused on a particular niche, as this one is, that has such excellent participation. If anyone knows such a forum on backpacking, sailing, robotics....let me think abit....well, ok, leave it at that...that boasts so many skilled and knowledgeable replies to a post in such a short amount of time, I'd like to know about them (I realize that sentence is a massive, poorly constructed, piece of linguistic butchery, but so what).
I don't believe this forum would be so good on the technical side if there was not CC. The reason is pretty simple: Technical talk does not create bonds. Keep all you discussions narrowly focused on a single subject, and you will NEVER form any kind of a relationship. CC is the diversity of life that makes this site what it is. Other forums fall short largely because they stay on topic.
The only technical forum that ever came close to this one was the old BPBasecamp backpacking forum, and even then it was only the sleeping bag forum that was so heavily traveled. That might seem odd, unless you had taken a look at that forum. It was nothing but an all out flame-war brawl between a single manufacturer, and a couple of malcontents. The war was stupid, juvenile, and had no winners, but it went on for a year or more, and in that time that single forum dwarfed every other subject. Not everybody participated in the war, but once the manufacturer was completely banned (he kept returning in differnt guises), the whole forum dried up. The war ended, and all the non-participants left with the participants.
We don't have that kind of a war (unless you recall Arc's immigration thread), but the point was that the mix of non-technical appeared to draw in the technical as well.
I agree with RD that people who never seem to learn have....issues, and that does have to be dealt with. However, you should not throw the baby....nah, that's an old cliche.
In summary, I strongly suspect that this forum is successful not inspite of CC, but BECAUSE of it. It would make an interesting sociology experiment, I hope some grad student is listening.
Marty and RD, you know I support your right to call it as you see it, and I generally agree with your judgement, but consider the possibility that CC is the strength of VBForums, not a liability.
I believe that most moderators would agree that CC is a strength of VBF but it also had been getting out of line. Here is one example.
That is the most idiotic thing I've ever seen .... :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinLiss
Seriously guys, take a good look at the big picture. You have been destroying this place little by little for many months. And as for the mods and admins here having a bad reputation, yes, you do. Thats why I got out. The general consensus is a group of two faced, trigger happy, over the top police men.
Considering that you are in the best position to fight back against all this corporate piffle, why don't you? Maybe you don't want to, maybe you are afraid, maybe there is another reason. Maybe I shouldhave stayed and fought the cornor ... who knows.
Go back a year, two years, three years and compare the atmosphere. The evidence is there, staring you in the face.
This forum is like a school yard.
You mean a school yard at recess time :D
So your saying that calling people a name like that is ok and not a violation of the AUP?Quote:
Originally Posted by visualAd
Look 7 posts up ;)
Look at the context of the post. It's not rocket science ... the person who slapped that ban on deserves to bebanned himself. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
[Rodney King]Cant we all just get along?[/Rodney King] :D
Yet it's alright for the moderators to bully people out of CC?Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
Actually, yes, I can. I work for a massive multinational commodities trading company, in an IT department staffed with some very bright people who all have university degrees and at least ten years' IT experience - those are the minimum recruitment requirements. We're not a bunch of kids, bullies or hooligans - we're intelligent, grown-up adults with responsibilities at work and at home, probably the type of people you want to have on here. All of us are able to take a joke at our expense, and we can cope quite happily with sexual innuendo. You know why? Because we're adults.Quote:
Originally Posted by RobDog888
If you're not able to joke about things that have nothing to do with work - and yes, even about sexual topics - then you must either still be in school or living in a police state. Frankly, it wouldn't be somewhere I could imagine any adults wanting to spend any time, as I'm sure you'll discover when you continue with your progression towards becoming a police state and log on one morning to discover nothing but tumbleweeds and sweet wrappers rolling around in CC.
Wally's comments would have raised a laugh in my office. Conversely, your overall attitude of intolerance and bullying would certainly lead to a reprimand from the powers that be... and it also wouldn't gain you any friends.
Then what on Earth is its main purpose? Surely a chit-chat forum is a place to have a chit-chat?Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinLiss
http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/chitchat?view=ukQuote:
chit-chat
informal
• noun inconsequential conversation.
• verb talk about trivial matters.
I'm sorry you feel that way but the "atmosphere" is not going to change. If you can't deal with that then you always have the option of leaving. I'd hate to see that happen however since you are a valuable contributor to the PHP and other forums.Quote:
Originally Posted by visualAd
Other than banning Wally for a completely nondescript comment, the most idiotic thing I've encountered in all of this is the entire concept of a "serious" thread in Chit Chat.
As InvisibleDuncan has pointed out, the very definition of "Chit Chat" is antithetical to "serious". Anyone posting a serious thread in Chit Chat deserves exactly what they get. If you have a serious question, post it General Developer or General PC or ANYWHERE but Chit Chat.The interpretation will probably be moderator specific, and it would seem "thin skinned" is the operative phrase of the day. :sick:Quote:
Originally Posted by bushmobile