[SERIOUS] Best state in US for my bro to do his higher studies

Hi guys,

My bro wishes to do his degree(UG) in US. I would like to know your opinion regarding which state to select.
I mean we have been hearing many problems out there in shooting/bullying on students in US. So we are a bit nervous.

What we are looking for is a good place, that have very less crime rate, good climate, not much expensive for staying/living, having good colleges/universities, etc.

Any suggestions? We already have searched in internet for reviews. But each reviews are different and we are having hard time choosing a location. So I thought it would be better if I post it here since there're lots of members from US/Canada.

Looking forward to hear some suggestions from you guys.

:wave:

Best state is relative... you should be looking at the colleges/universities themselves and what they have to offer. You could pick a great place to live, but unless the college/university (if there is one) offers the degree sought, it doesn't matter how nice it is.

-tg

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Originally Posted by techgnome

Best state is relative... you should be looking at the colleges/universities themselves and what they have to offer. You could pick a great place to live, but unless the college/university (if there is one) offers the degree sought, it doesn't matter how nice it is.

-tg

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Thanks. Me too thought like that. Since we are not a resident of US, I believe there's 3x chance that we will get into problems. So that's why we decided to shortlist some locations first and then apply to those universities/colleges in those locations.

:wave:

I would also think that looking for colleges and areas where there are already a fair number of students and residents from India, would be useful.
Areas around Washington, D.C. of course have a diverse International population.
Other areas, for example as indicated in this article http://www.dallasnews.com/news/local...fort-worth.ece have had a growing population for quite a few years, and that growth tends to accelerate as it becomes more attractive to others to have familiar surroundings.

As mentioned in the article, there are hubs in other areas as well in California, New York and New Jersey which have shown a lot of growth, but cost of living wise, Texas should be the most cost effective.

I would suggest staying away from Texas and Arizona, just because of their immigration rhetoric.

Frankly, America is not nearly as dangerous as the media portrays it. Crime isn't all that high by most standards, and is dropping. Crime on campus is lower than crime in average, too, because the average is pushed up by high crime areas, which tend not to be located on college campuses, or near most of them (there are a few that aren't in the best of neighborhoods). Big cities have more crime, but they also have FAR more people, and even so crime isn't evenly distributed.

The point about cost of living is important, though. If your brother is going to be living on campus, that doesn't matter so much, because you'll know the cost up front, and be able to factor that into decisions. If he isn't going to be on campus, then cost variation between locations is likely to be HUGE.

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Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker

I would suggest staying away from Texas and Arizona, just because of their immigration rhetoric.

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Wow... condemning two entire states and more than 33 million people because of some political rhetoric? :rolleyes: Guess your liberal "tolerance" is showing through, huh?

I would personally avoid high cost areas like DC, NY, etc, but the ultimate decision should come down to what school gives your "bro" the best deal.

Apply to as many schools as he can. Look at not just the tuition/room/board costs but more importantly look at the grant (not loan) money they offer. Don't be afraid to apply to private schools. Many times they have lots of grant money to spend and will give you a better overall deal that the state-supported schools with supposedly lower costs and will get you through quicker as they are usually smaller, more laid back campuses with less demand on class space. Once your "bro" has all offers on the table then consider other tangibles like location, crime, cost of living, etc. and make his decision from there.

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Originally Posted by passel

I would also think that looking for colleges and areas where there are already a fair number of students and residents from India, would be useful.
Areas around Washington, D.C. of course have a diverse International population.
Other areas, for example as indicated in this article http://www.dallasnews.com/news/local...fort-worth.ece have had a growing population for quite a few years, and that growth tends to accelerate as it becomes more attractive to others to have familiar surroundings.

As mentioned in the article, there are hubs in other areas as well in California, New York and New Jersey which have shown a lot of growth, but cost of living wise, Texas should be the most cost effective.

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Thanks. The problem is we don't have much Indian contacts in US. When went to educational consultancies in my city, each of them are talking different things. Because they may have tie-ups with certain colleges/universities, and they might probably boost theirs. So was having doubt whether to trust them or not.

:wave:

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Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker

I would suggest staying away from Texas and Arizona, just because of their immigration rhetoric.

Frankly, America is not nearly as dangerous as the media portrays it. Crime isn't all that high by most standards, and is dropping. Crime on campus is lower than crime in average, too, because the average is pushed up by high crime areas, which tend not to be located on college campuses, or near most of them (there are a few that aren't in the best of neighborhoods). Big cities have more crime, but they also have FAR more people, and even so crime isn't evenly distributed.

The point about cost of living is important, though. If your brother is going to be living on campus, that doesn't matter so much, because you'll know the cost up front, and be able to factor that into decisions. If he isn't going to be on campus, then cost variation between locations is likely to be HUGE.

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Thanks :wave:

Yeah, but the medias are giving lots more hypes regarding the crimes in US. Atleast the local medias in my place. When I open the newspaper, the "international section" page lists out various crimes, thereby increasing the heart beat! If he was doing the studies anywhere in my city, we could have given much attention to him and would feel secure. Since he will be staying 1000s of KMs away, we won't be able to reach their faster. So, that adds up the tensions.

:wave:

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Originally Posted by homer13j

Wow... condemning two entire states and more than 33 million people because of some political rhetoric? :rolleyes: Guess your liberal "tolerance" is showing through, huh?

I would personally avoid high cost areas like DC, NY, etc, but the ultimate decision should come down to what school gives your "bro" the best deal.

Apply to as many schools as he can. Look at not just the tuition/room/board costs but more importantly look at the grant (not loan) money they offer. Don't be afraid to apply to private schools. Many times they have lots of grant money to spend and will give you a better overall deal that the state-supported schools with supposedly lower costs and will get you through quicker as they are usually smaller, more laid back campuses with less demand on class space. Once your "bro" has all offers on the table then consider other tangibles like location, crime, cost of living, etc. and make his decision from there.

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Thanks :wave:

I am not sure why you emphasized the word "bro" in quotes. Yeah, I think it would be more better to stay within the campus. But the campus itself might not be safer some times. So overall we are a bit confused.


@all:

I will ask my bro to visit this thread to join the discussions too. So that he could clear his doubts as well.

Thanks all. Your suggestions are much appreciated :wave:

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Originally Posted by akhileshbc

I am not sure why you emphasized the word "bro" in quotes.

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Sometimes the term "bro" can have different meanings depending on context - especially in urban areas. Around here it is often used to refer to an affiliated gang member and/or drug dealer.

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Originally Posted by homer13j

Sometimes the term "bro" can have different meanings depending on context - especially in urban areas. Around here it is often used to refer to an affiliated gang member and/or drug dealer.

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Oh okay. Here, we call it as short for "brother", mostly to save some keystrokes while typing. Thanks for the clarification though.

:wave:

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Originally Posted by homer13j

Wow... condemning two entire states and more than 33 million people because of some political rhetoric? :rolleyes: Guess your liberal "tolerance" is showing through, huh?

I would personally avoid high cost areas like DC, NY, etc, but the ultimate decision should come down to what school gives your "bro" the best deal.

Apply to as many schools as he can. Look at not just the tuition/room/board costs but more importantly look at the grant (not loan) money they offer. Don't be afraid to apply to private schools. Many times they have lots of grant money to spend and will give you a better overall deal that the state-supported schools with supposedly lower costs and will get you through quicker as they are usually smaller, more laid back campuses with less demand on class space. Once your "bro" has all offers on the table then consider other tangibles like location, crime, cost of living, etc. and make his decision from there.

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Well akhileshbc & Bro want to go somewhere where they can feel safe and not be harassed (too much) ... Texas & Arizona's are currently some what less than welcoming to immigrants at the moment. There's something of a blacklash going on... it's a fact... not political rhetoric... the politicians have made some rhetoric about it, waving the flag and all that, doing the NIMBY thing.

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Originally Posted by akhileshbc

Thanks. The problem is we don't have much Indian contacts in US. When went to educational consultancies in my city, each of them are talking different things. Because they may have tie-ups with certain colleges/universities, and they might probably boost theirs. So was having doubt whether to trust them or not.

:wave:

Thanks :wave:

Yeah, but the medias are giving lots more hypes regarding the crimes in US. Atleast the local medias in my place. When I open the newspaper, the "international section" page lists out various crimes, thereby increasing the heart beat! If he was doing the studies anywhere in my city, we could have given much attention to him and would feel secure. Since he will be staying 1000s of KMs away, we won't be able to reach their faster. So, that adds up the tensions.

:wave:

Thanks :wave:

I am not sure why you emphasized the word "bro" in quotes. Yeah, I think it would be more better to stay within the campus. But the campus itself might not be safer some times. So overall we are a bit confused.


@all:

I will ask my bro to visit this thread to join the discussions too. So that he could clear his doubts as well.

Thanks all. Your suggestions are much appreciated :wave:

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Of course the newspaper is full of crime from the US... that's what sells papers. The international pages here are the same thing... it's full of the crime and bombings and other "bad" news from around the world. Out side of the owner, no one cares about the kitten rescued from the tree in Ogallala - yes that's an actual place, it's in Nebraska you can look it up - it might make local news on a slow day, but it's never going to make any regional or national or international news. Good news doesn't sell papers...


Reminds me of a client I once worked with a couple lifetimes ago. Our Co Pres was getting flack from the Pres of one of our clients... stuff wasn't working, all he was hearing was how this wasn't working and that wasn't working and we were incompetent, our software was crap, etc. What we found was that ONE person was doing the complaining... but that's all she was doing, she was reporting the bad stuff... what she wasn't reporting was that 90% of the things she complained about had been fixed within days of reporting. So all he heard was the bad stuff... because that fit her agenda... when things went right she'd conveniently forget to tell him that it was fixed and going good.


I tell my wife that a lot of this "reality TV" she watches... isn't reality. Reality is on the cutting-room floor... life for the most part is boring. For every 15 min of "reality TV" that makes it to the air, there's probably at least 2 hours of on the floor. Drama, conflict, that's what sells.

-tg

Remember, the US is a "look at me!" country. So, a guy in a pickup truck running over 2 sheep can make headlines news (the sheep are gay, and there's a big backlash against bald pickup truck drivers because the truck was racist...).

I guarantee you that you can go to almost any state, to any college and not come anywhere near to experiencing what the news advertises as a "daily occurrence". Your biggest concern is going to be how much you want to spend, are you going to get value for money, and where do you want to live. Of course, it also depends on what you (or, rather, your brother) is going to study.

There is absolutely no reason to go to a college with a 'large indian student body'. How does that help you? If you want to be around indians, why not stay in India?

What do you want from the experience? If you want a warm climate go to the south, a cool (cold) climate then the north. I currently work in Dearborn, MI where there is an extremely strong Arab population. A good number of Mosques and so on. If your religion may require certain accommodations, then this may be a consideration for which college is chosen. My home town, Charleston SC, has a very small Muslim population so finding religious accommodations would be a (minor) hardship.

There are web sites with college rankings, what they offer as far as courses, and so on. This should be your focus rather than deciding your actions based on the infotainment industry; you will be much poorer for it. I, personally, and of course, would recommend South Carolina. Very hot in summer, mild in winter, and beautiful on the coast (if you like that sort of thing), a warm ocean, and only the occasional hurricane. They have an extremely good medical university (Raleigh-Durham is also strong in the medical field, and has the best hospitals in the world), but if a technical field is what your brother is after then Clemson University a bit further in land is a reasonable place.

People will have their favorites; but it doesn't mean that will be a good fit what your bro wants.

Hey Akhilesh,

while i know nothing about US colleges, what i would recommend if you can is choose an area that your brother likes the look of, choose a few colleges (preferably in neighboring states only so you can get to them all in 1 trip) and to take a trip over to the US and visit. Also go with him if you can.

I know this will cost money, but it will cost your brother more if he wants to leave after 1 term as he hasn't settled.

It will give you far more of an idea as to what the colleges and campuses are like than any looking over the internet will.

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Originally Posted by homer13j

Wow... condemning two entire states and more than 33 million people because of some political rhetoric? :rolleyes: Guess your liberal "tolerance" is showing through, huh?

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Not really. There are 50 states to choose from and several thousand colleges and universities. With that much choice, you have to start with a pretty coarse filter to narrow things down to a manageable level. For instance, I'd also stay away from Hawaii and Alaska because they'd both leave you somewhat restricted in view (and Hawaii is mighty expensive, too). So, that leaves you with only 46 states to choose from and still several thousand colleges and universities. You're going to have to make a bunch more cuts based on dubious criteria to reach any kind of decision, so pare away. If crime is a concern, then I'd be less inclined to those states that have a current reputation of being agitated by immigrants (though there is some of that everywhere, and not just in the US).

Frankly, the anti-immigration rhetoric in Texas isn't as remarkable as it is in Arizona, but it's probably enough to be ruled out by a coarse filter.

The next filter I'd use would tend to be climate, but that's a tricky one. The norther tier states have COLD winters, but pleasant summers. The eastern states will have humid summers, the western states...well, we have dry, smoky summers. So, you can go with hot and dry (southwest), hot and humid (southeast), cold and humid (northeast), cold and dry (upper midwest and the northwest excluding Portland and Seattle), and corn (central midwest).

I'd rule out California due to cost, but I'd rule in California for their university system. I'd say about the same for New York.

Ohio has some great schools. I got my masters from Miami University, which is a good school in a good location, and probably pretty affordable, too.

Idaho is a great place to live, but the schools don't strike me as being particularly outstanding....which reminds me. I went for a bike ride yesterday morning and saw a farmer who was out standing in his field.

I want to know where techgnome lives so we can poke some fun at his State:afrog:

I've lived in Texas all of my life and unfortunately us native Texans are getting harder to find due to all the "cultural differences" that has moved in with us.

My company's main office is in Mumbai... (reverse outsourcing)

In my small little USA office are five people:

Three "whites" for lack of a better description
One African American
One Indian

So that's a fairly typical mixture of people that you can find almost anywhere.
(i won't mention the part about how it's four women and me and how hard that can be all day long)

Like others have mentioned, I would pick the school first... I would also factor in the weather.

For people in the US, the school is WILDLY overrated for almost all professions. Once you have your first job, nobody will care whether you went to burger-flipping U (BFU) or to Harvard. All they care about is that you have a degree, and they generally won't even bother to confirm that, because after that first job, it is references and experience that matter more than anything else. That's what stews me with the cost of higher education. It is soaring, and for what?

The exception to that rule is that there are certain schools that are highly desirable for certain subsets of certain professions, but those are pretty rare.

Outside of the US, I would guess that name recognition means a whole lot more when it comes to US universities. After all, if you said that you went to some place nobody has ever heard of....well, you could be making it up, or it could be the University of Pheonix, or something like that. For example, most people outside of Idaho (at least those who follow college football) can probably name one school in this state, but I'm not sure that it is even the third best school in the state, and certainly isn't the best. However, if name recognition is the primary value of the degree, then that school would rank higher than the other schools that would probably provide a better education.

Having read that over, it sounds overly cynical, but I don't think it really is. I'm really skeptical that the education you get in the classroom is the most important part of college for a persons life. I have a couple degrees, but aside from a bit of work identifying fish, I'm not sure how much practical use the things I learned have been put to. The degrees themselves, on the other hand, have been put to good use by getting my foot in some doors.

for the record, I'm in South Carolina ... South Carolina - starting crap in the US since 1865... I'm just outside of Charleston.

And we don't need anyone making fun of us... we're perfectly fine doing it ourselves (google "Welcome to Myrtle Manor" & "Southern Charm").

We've also got our share of issues... we recently had the police shooting, and before we could get past that, we had the church massacre... and now we've got churches being burned in the middle of the night O.O


-tg

I love your chews.

Thank you guys for your valuable suggestions. Much appreciated. :wave:

It would become a big post if I quote each of your posts to answer. :p So am writing this post as a common response.

It will be just my brother that would be going.
But if possible, me, dad and mom might go during his admission time. It can cost much for the travelling and stay for us, I guess. So it's still on hold.

Eventhough we are by religion, Hindus, we(me, brother, dad and mom) had visited some of the temples(of Hindus), mosques(of Muslims) and churches(of Christians) in my city. Because we don't have any discrimination regarding religion. So it's not mandatory to have any worshiping place nearby. There's a quote in Sanskrit, "Maatha Pithaa Guru Daivam" which is in English "Mom, Dad, Teacher, God". Like that, our primary Gods are our dad and mom. And we are thankful to them for all their help, support and the freedom that they have given us.

We have noted down all your suggestions/comments. We will look some more details regarding the college/universities in those locations you guys suggested. Btw, my brother is interested in computer related courses. Though he doesn't seem to like Computer/Software Engineering, because of the maths subjects in it. Anyway, I have asked him to join the discussions in this thread so that he would get some ideas/inspiration when talking to you guys. :thumb:

Thanks again :wave:

Hey Akhilesh,

can i ask why in particular does your brother want to go to a US college rather than an Indian College? not that it is a bad choice i was just curious as to his reasoning?

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Btw, my brother is interested in computer related courses. Though he doesn't seem to like Computer/Software Engineering, because of the maths subjects in it.

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Do you think he is maybe influenced by what his big brother does ? It sounds to me like he looks up to you :)

And when you say computer related courses, what kind of thing do you mean exactly? Networks? Databases ? e.t.c ?

Thank you all for giving your opinion and suggestions...
I'm actually planning to do Web/App Development Associate Degree Course..
Right now , I am looking at Northampton College in Pennsylvania State..
Does anyone have any feedback regarding this college?
Is an associate degree valid for getting jobs in good companies (Like Google or Facebook) ?

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Originally Posted by NeedSomeAnswers

Hey Akhilesh,

can i ask why in particular does your brother want to go to a US college rather than an Indian College? not that it is a bad choice i was just curious as to his reasoning?



Do you think he is maybe influenced by what his big brother does ? It sounds to me like he looks up to you :)

And when you say computer related courses, what kind of thing do you mean exactly? Networks? Databases ? e.t.c ?

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It's actually one of my dreams to study in USA and get settled plus I wanted to get an associate deg which is not provided by any of the Indian Institutions ..And also , I wanted to get my own US Paypal account for business purposes since Indian paypal accounts have so many restrictions..

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I'm actually planning to do Web/App Development Associate Degree Course

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Well that's a good choice in my opinion, Web and Mobile development skills are good to have.

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Is an associate degree valid for getting jobs in good companies (Like Google or Facebook) ?

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Probably not, but that doesn't mean an associated degree wont help you get work, you just maybe need to set your sites a little lower than Facebook or Google, there are plenty of good companies out there that you will have never of heard of.

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I wanted to get my own US Paypal account

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So i would assume you would need to have a US bank account for that, which i would have thought you would be able to do as a Student.

Maybe some of the other US based guys here can say a bit more on that

you'll want more than an associate's ... you'll want a bachelor's degree at least. All I have is an associates, but I'm an aberration... There's a saying "for every rule, there's an exception." I'm the exception. But I'm also that proof that once you get that first job or two, the degree is largely irrelevant. And to be honest, there are thousands of other companies out there that I'd consider good companies to work for that aren't monolithic conglomerate juggernauts. Companies like Microsoft, Google, Amazon, and FB maybe great places to work at, but they also seem to have high stress or high pressure environments that lead to high turnovers. That's not to say smaller companies don't have pressures, they do. it's just often a different sort.

I'd consider the company that I work for a good company. Even both of my previous employers are good companies. One is small (total # employees is less than 20) and large (over 3000+ people)

so don't sell yourself short.

-tg

I'd also go with a bachelors, but would second what TG said. There are big companies with big names, but there are FAR more jobs in other companies (when you consider how many more companies there are that have just a few people, you see that this must be the case). My sister and her husband both worked for MS, and the stress level was fairly high. The pay was high, too, so you do get compensated for the stress. There are jobs that are move fun, but don't pay as well, and there are probably jobs that are more fun that pay nearly as well.

I looked at where Northhampton is. It is a pretty nice area, though I'd prefer to be further west in PA (of course, you don't really get to choose that). The college is located to the east of the Appalachian ridges, so it will be an area that is low, rolling hills, heavily forested where it hasn't been cleared for development, and will generally have summers that are warm to hot with high humidity and winters that are pretty mild, though snow will likely happen. Trees in the area are all deciduous, so it will be looking a bit gray and barren in the late fall.

The reason I like further west in PA is because of the Appalachian ridges found out there. On the other hand, it's a good distance from Philadelphia, New York, and Harrisburg, so I would expect that you can get to the cities with ease, yet aren't living in one, so it is likely to be pretty nice.

Despite going to college in PA, myself, I know nothing of Northhampton. PA is oddly divided between the east and the west parts of the state. I went to a college in far western PA. The population was dominated by the cities of Pittsburgh and Cleveland, and the largest group of students were from those two areas. We also tended to play other schools from Ohio and western PA. Meanwhile the eastern part of the state seems to center around Harrisburg, Philly, and New York. The divide is pure fiction, but going to school there it did seem like people knew more about Ohio than they did about eastern PA, as if the mountain ridges divided the population more effecitvely than the state border.

Also, don't necessarily limit yourself to software companies... there are plenty of other industries, nearly all of whom use computers - my last employer was a construction company. I've interviewed at medical companies (one did testing, another makes needles), education companies, book publishers, last time I was doing the interview rounds, it came down to a well-known grocery company and my current employer... Even Shaggy - he doesn't work for a SW house... I'd venture a guess that a good number of us don't.

-tg

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Originally Posted by techgnome

I've interviewed at medical companies (one did testing, another makes needles)
-tg

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How were those interviews? I'd imagine that the first one asked you LOTS of questions, while the second one asked you very pointed questions.

well the second one was a much more pr!ckly (edit - wow, the word filter here is aggressive) situation, that's for sure. The first one had me looking at them quizzically.

Puns aside, the first one was a company that builds diagnostic systems for testing just about everything but human tissue... I'll let your imagination run with that one. I remember them telling me that they had a total of 5 slots, 1-entry level, 2-junior and 2-senior... they had the entry level and one jr level filled and were looking to fill the jr slot... they weren't authorized to fill the senior slots (eh?) I was one of several from my former company that applied there. In short, they knew they had coveted spots we were all looking for and figured they could fill a jr slot with sr caliber while paying essentially entry level prices.


The second one oddly is a company whose products I use every day - Becton, Dickinson (BD) - the main problem I had with that one was it is quite literally in the middle of no-where. During WWII, the gov't decided that their manufacturing process was a matter of national security and so was moved to middle of NEbraska, a bit off the beaten path - off all paths as it were. I odn't know that I would have enjoyed it much.

-tg