http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk_...00/1883944.stm
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Hmmm....The problem is that they'll probably lump us in with the rest of the south west. :(
Cornwall should have its own regional assembly.
Get a grip, for God's sake. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
Cornwall should have its own regional assembly.
What a waste of time and effort.
Hmmm...I think regional assemblies are a good idea. At least England should have it's own one (if not the regions). What we have now is an imbalance with English people having less representation than the Welsh or Scottish.
I think it just promotes seperatism. It seems like something that makes people feel better but actually has no beneficial effect.
I'd rather have the grand-daddy parliament (ie. Westminster) having my say than some piddly-arse talking shop.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
What we have now is an imbalance with English people having less representation than the Welsh or Scottish.
Why do these people think their small-fry regional parliaments are ganna have a louder/stronger voice in Europe? That's bollocks.
Yes I am sure that the rest of Europe will be really concerned about what the local residents of Grimsby have to say once we get properly devolved. Maybe we can demand to have a thousand MEPs, one for each devolved parliament. Then they can all get ignored.
You could apply that argument to our national government. Surely all the national governments of Europe only promote seperatism? Let's abolish them all and just keep our euro MP's. :rolleyes:Quote:
I think it just promotes seperatism. It seems like something that makes people feel better but actually has no beneficial effect.
Exactly. They already don't really give a **** what westminster has to say, why on earth would they then give two hoots what Milton Keynes are harping on about?
I don't think the regional assemblies (should) deal directly with Europe.
There are some things that shouldn't be administered at a national level, that concern the regions differently and should be administered seperately.
I believe that is one of the main reasons why people support the idea. Inverted logic methinks.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
I don't think the regional assemblies (should) deal directly with Europe.
Interesting that counties surrounding London are the only places where the majority did not think it was a good idea.
That's not the impression I've had.Quote:
I believe that is one of the main reasons why people support the idea. Inverted logic methinks.
People in this country who are far away from London feel a great resentment towards Londoners. They feel that Londoners are self-obsessed and that laws, interest rates, tax rates etc. are all set with London in mind. Many people from the outlying regions just want the ability to vary these rates setting more appropriate levels for the region's specific needs.
The problem with Londoner's (and I must confess to comming from London) is that they don't acknowledge that the regions have specific needs. They're just somewhere to go on holiday.
I didn't see it on that page I linked to but on the 1pm news the reporter was saying that as I recallQuote:
Originally posted by simonm
That's not the impression I've had.
so what about when european-wide tax harmonisation comes in (which it undoubtedly will)?Quote:
People in this country who are far away from London feel a great resentment towards Londoners. They feel that Londoners are self-obsessed and that laws, interest rates, tax rates etc. are all set with London in mind. Many people from the outlying regions just want the ability to vary these rates setting more appropriate levels for the region's specific needs.
That's even worse surely.
by the look of things, they are trying to make our country run like America, where all the different states govern themselves. what they don't realise is that the reason our friends over the pond do it, is becuase most of the states are the size (if not bigger) than the whole of England.
just my tuppance worth :)
Chris
Well, I'm not speaking from reports I've read in a newspaper or seen on television. I am relaying what many local people have said to me having lived in Cornwall and Devon for 6 years.Quote:
I didn't see it on that page I linked to but on the 1pm news the reporter was saying that as I recall
Perhaps, but that's another issue.Quote:
so what about when european-wide tax harmonisation comes in (which it undoubtedly will)?
That's even worse surely.
I guess that for our economy to become more unified, it makes sense to have some harmonisation of taxation but I don't think this means that they all ahve to be exactly the same.
Personally, I think there should be individual countries should be able to vary their individual tax levels within a certain band and that individual regions should be able to vary the national tax level within certain limits.
I've never quite understood those Scots who go around with "Ecosse" stickers on their cars. What's the point in that? Are they trying to say that they'd rather be subjugated by France than England?Quote:
Originally posted by chrisjk
I believe that is one of the main reasons why people support the idea. Inverted logic methinks.
Odd.
I think the point there is that the Scottish people don't feel they're being represented well by the UK government in Europe. They probably believe that they could represent their own interests better than anyone else could.Quote:
I've never quite understood those Scots who go around with "Ecosse" stickers on their cars. What's the point in that? Are they trying to say that they'd rather be subjugated by France than England?
Can't be done with a single currency.Quote:
Personally, I think there should be individual countries should be able to vary their individual tax levels within a certain band and that individual regions should be able to vary the national tax level within certain limits.
It would allow competition to develop for investment by setting higher interest rates.
Another problem is that countries would not be able to set rates that match their needs.
Countries such as Greece and Italy typically, periodically suffer from higher rates of inflation and need the ability to raise tax levels to reduce it. This is not possible if Germany says the rate is good for their inflation.
I understand what you're saying but I don't see much harm comming from small variation in tax/interest rates. Thus you let individual countries vary their levels to suit their own needs without creating a significant imbalance between the member states.Quote:
Can't be done with a single currency.
It would allow competition to develop for investment by setting higher interest rates.
Besides, perhaps the loss of a little control is a worthwhile trade off if it means that, as part of Europe, we have much more economic clout. Wa can stand up to American economic bullying which, in my opinion, is a very good thing.
HaHa! The English are always baffled by the celtic wish to distance themselves from english culture. They think its so great but we just find it embarrasing to be associated.Quote:
I've never quite understood those Scots who go around with "Ecosse" stickers on their cars. What's the point in that? Are they trying to say that they'd rather be subjugated by France than England?
The Scottish people feel that, do we? :rolleyes: Thanks for letting me know. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
I think the point there is that the Scottish people don't feel they're being represented well by the UK government in Europe. They probably believe that they could represent their own interests better than anyone else could.
I have to say that that doesn't go any way to explaining those stickers. They would seem to imply that they think Scotland would be better represented by France than by either the UK or Scotland.
Speaking as a Scot, that's complete bull**** and in no way related to the question I was asking. Don't be such a ****.Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
HaHa! The English are always baffled by the celtic wish to distance themselves from english culture. They think its so great but we just find it embarrasing to be associated.
A few years ago I was vastly disapproving of Europe (comments such as Maggie's a few days ago would have made my day) but now I've learnt of what are effectively bullying tactics by the US (with canada over lumber as SD points out, bananas with the EU, and now this steel business) and the only way out of it as far as I can see is integration with Europe so it can get out there and throw it's weight around a bit.Quote:
Originally posted by simonm
Besides, perhaps the loss of a little control is a worthwhile trade off if it means that, as part of Europe, we have much more economic clout. Wa can stand up to American economic bullying which, in my opinion, is a very good thing.
As the 2nd largest economy in europe I'm sure they'd want us on board and we'd probably get a few perks. Although I reckon we'd lose that annual £2Bn rebate.Everyone manages to be civilised then you decide to be offensive...good call.Quote:
HaHa! The English are always baffled by the celtic wish to distance themselves from english culture. They think its so great but we just find it embarrasing to be associated.
So you'd rather Cornwall was governed by France?
I find it hard to imagine anyone wanting to be associated with France.
What is this problem with France ? I thought Agincourt was long past ...
Yes, they're arrogant, resisting, difficult, awkward and sometimes overly nationalistic but they have many good qualities too. I'm sure those above comments can be applied to the Germans, Italians, Americans, Australians and even the British.
So why all this hatred ?
It's not hatred :rolleyes: I do genuinely find it an odd concept, though, that anyone - especially anyone that's supposedly 'celtic' - in the UK would rather be governed by France.
Bollocks. Absolute ****e. I'm from Ireland, and have lived in England (and other countries) for 13 years. I love the people and the culture as much as my own country. Aspects are less than perfect, but isn't that the case for all countries?Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
HaHa! The English are always baffled by the celtic wish to distance themselves from english culture. They think its so great but we just find it embarrasing to be associated.
Urg, the human race is so pathetic sometimes :mad:
Fair comment at that.Quote:
Originally posted by HarryW
It's not hatred :rolleyes: I do genuinely find it an odd concept, though, that anyone - especially anyone that's supposedly 'celtic' - in the UK would rather be governed by France.
Still many feel that cheap shots on other countries are a way to justify their own faults.
Hey!
I didnt mean that I would rather be governed by France. I misunderstood what you said. I was just sayin that many people of celtic origin dont like to associated with english culture.
gaffer and duncan, if youre celtic, youll at least know about the strong anti english feeling of many of you compatriots. even if you dont feel that way yourselves.
I KNOW FOR A FACT that anti english feeling is much stronger in Wales, Scotland and Ireland.
Chirs
Yep, I definitely agree with that.Quote:
A few years ago I was vastly disapproving of Europe (comments such as Maggie's a few days ago would have made my day) but now I've learnt of what are effectively bullying tactics by the US (with canada over lumber as SD points out, bananas with the EU, and now this steel business) and the only way out of it as far as I can see is integration with Europe so it can get out there and throw it's weight around a bit.
I would much rather be part of Europe than part of (dominated by) America. I'm proud of the culteral diversity of Europe and pleased to be a part of it.
There's something strange about the whole reasoning of Thatcher :
She's willing to sell the UK to the NAFTA but wants nothing to do with the EU.
She prefers to be a US servant over an equal partner in the multicultural EU ?
I don't get it :confused:
Of course Fried Egg, you're completely justified in hating the English. We're all evil. It's perfectly okay to hate your countrymen if they're not from the same region as you.
Than where? England? :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
I KNOW FOR A FACT that anti english feeling is much stronger in Wales, Scotland and Ireland.
I seem to have had the same conversation in two places, so I'll quote myself.Basically, you get bigots in any society. Doesn't mean we should approve of it.Quote:
Originally posted by InvisibleDuncan
I've often heard that said, and I do know a few people like that. They're usually the same ones who hate blacks, asians, gays... It's certainly not the case within my family, nor within my circle of friends and acquaintances.
I dont hate the english. I dont like english culture. theres a difference.Quote:
Of course Fried Egg, you're completely justified in hating the English. We're all evil. It's perfectly okay to hate your countrymen if they're not from the same region as you.
Its like many people hate american culture but it doesnt mean they hate american people.
Not really. we haven't been culturally subjegated by the blacks, aisans or gays. just the english.Quote:
I've often heard that said, and I do know a few people like that. They're usually the same ones who hate blacks, asians, gays... It's certainly not the case within my family, nor within my circle of friends and acquaintances.
You know, that looks like you're flatly accusing me of lying.Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
Not really. we haven't been culturally subjegated by the blacks, aisans or gays. just the english.
Now whether you like it or not, it is the case that the majority of my countrymen who exhibit bigotry towards the English also exhibit bigotry towards any other ethnic / behavioural group you care to name. A bigot is a bigot is a bigot - no matter what petty little grievances you may want to hide your racism behind.
They tend to be individuals who require an excuse to be antagonistic, have bigotted parents, or bigotted peers.Quote:
Originally posted by Fried Egg
Hey!
I didnt mean that I would rather be governed by France. I misunderstood what you said. I was just sayin that many people of celtic origin dont like to associated with english culture.
gaffer and duncan, if youre celtic, youll at least know about the strong anti english feeling of many of you compatriots. even if you dont feel that way yourselves.
I KNOW FOR A FACT that anti english feeling is much stronger in Wales, Scotland and Ireland.
People from my country (Northern Ireland) are begining to wonder what it was all about, over the last 500 years. Why should generations hate, I mean hate enough to kill, people that they don't even know. Just because they are British.
I'll tell you what, you maintain that attitute. You stay in your little corner of whatever country you wnat to call it, and live in your own bigoted, stifled, unprogressive world. I'm here to embrace life, not ****ing winge about it....
*Polite applause*Quote:
Originally posted by Gaffer
I'll tell you what, you maintain that attitute. You stay in your little corner of whatever country you wnat to call it, and live in your own bigoted, stifled, unprogressive world. I'm here to embrace life, not ****ing winge about it....
Okay, so some bad things happened FIVE HUNDRED YEARS AGO and the logical way to fix this 'cultural subjugation', as you put it, is to set up a local regional government? What exactly is this supposed to do to fix the 'cultural subjugation' that happened FIVE HUNDRED YEARS AGO?
You english are so fuc-king touchy. you bang on about the american culture all the time but youre not being biggotted then are you?
as soon as someone says they dont like english culture, they must be biggots. seems to me that the only 'culture' on these forums that cant take a knock is the english.
yeh, youve said it. too little, too late.Quote:
Okay, so some bad things happened FIVE HUNDRED YEARS AGO and the logical way to fix this 'cultural subjugation', as you put it, is to set up a local regional government? What exactly is this supposed to do to fix the 'cultural subjugation' that happened FIVE HUNDRED YEARS AGO?
Still, we'll take whatever we can get!