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Thread: [RESOLVED] Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

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    Resolved [RESOLVED] Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Is this the forum in which to air a gripe?

    Why doesn't Exit mean Exit ?

    Such a damn nuisance, so many utilities we buy these days know better than we do when we want to exit their program. I open a utility, use it, then click the [X] to close it... Does it close ? No ! (Of course not, otherwise I'd've made a few extra clicks to get to the actual exit) Those that write it know we don't want to actually close it when we click [X], they know we only really mean to put it into standby... So that it still uses the computer's resources to slow down other applications.
    As often as not, these same utilities will add a 'Start me up at start-up' too, which I then have to find and disable.

    It seems to me it's too prevalent for me to do anything about it now, if I'd seen it coming, instead of 'em just sneaking it in, I would've threatened not to buy the relevant product and maybe urged others to do the same... As it is, it was fete accomplis several years ago.

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    Last edited by Poppa Mintin; Jun 17th, 2017 at 05:04 AM.
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    MS SQL Powerposter szlamany's Avatar
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    I get it!

    Skype - really - I don't use you. You are always the app that hangs up a reboot. Why?

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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by szlamany View Post
    I get it!

    Skype - really - I don't use you. You are always the app that hangs up a reboot. Why?
    Right Click an empty space on task bar... from the menu select Task Manager > Startup

    Right Click an app. you don't need at start-up (Skype, say) : Select > Disable...
    Continue till you've cleared out all the trash...

    The maybe re-boot.

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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    I agree! I hate it when you have to click a secondary dialog asking if you really want to exit. Worse yet, some websites do this too! I have my electricity website that is terrible. Upon loggin in they do an alert dialog telling you that you are being redirected to your dashboard. Really? Come on now we are not back in the 90s of web development lol

    My quick books doesnt close at all. I have to find all the services and such to close in the task manager to actually close it so it stops using resources.
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Talk about a little irony...I support an application where the user community requested a project to disable the [X] because they didn't want the app closing right down by "accident". We put a little book icon for them to close "on purpose" and disabled the [X]


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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    Talk about a little irony...I support an application where the user community requested a project to disable the [X] because they didn't want the app closing right down by "accident". We put a little book icon for them to close "on purpose" and disabled the [X].
    Interesting that you call that a 'Book', I always thought of that icon as a Door. (way out)

    When your community use the 'Book' does the application Exit even if the original application would've normally gone to Standby ?


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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Poppa Mintin View Post
    Interesting that you call that a 'Book', I always thought of that icon as a Door. (way out)

    When your community use the 'Book' does the application Exit even if the original application would've normally gone to Standby ?


    Poppa.
    I'm not sure what you mean by "gone to stand by". The application "cleans up" after itself and exits.
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    I'm not sure what you mean by "gone to stand by". The application "cleans up" after itself and exits.
    In my original post I explained that the applications I'm complaining about don't 'Close' when I click the [X], they just go to Standby.

    I read your post #5 as "This application sits on the page header and is active for whatever application the user is currently using".

    I'm asking if your application actually closes (Exits) the application upon use of the 'book'.


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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Poppa Mintin View Post
    In my original post I explained that the applications I'm complaining about don't 'Close' when I click the [X], they just go to Standby.

    I read your post #5 as "This application sits on the page header and is active for whatever application the user is currently using".

    I'm asking if your application actually closes (Exits) the application upon use of the 'book'.


    Poppa.
    Sorry yes...my post was just about the irony of people not wanting the [X] to do what most people want it to do.
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by TysonLPrice View Post
    Sorry yes...my post was just about the irony of people not wanting the [X] to do what most people want it to do.
    Yes, I understood the irony.

    Is this application 'up for grabs' ?



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  11. #11
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    This has always been one of the more goofy and frustrating problems I have with apps.

    There's some apps where this is a welcome feature, even if on by default. IM apps, music apps, antivirus, sometimes I just want a little status indicator rather than a full-fledged taskbar icon.

    There's other apps that don't really need this icon at all, like Word. I think what led to it is one part "not thinking very hard about UI" and another part "it was the only way to do non-disruptive pop-up notifications in Windows for a long time".

    Seriously. WinXP was the first time any kind of "toast" notification showed up in Windows, and it could only be displayed via an icon in the notification area. For an app in the taskbar to get your attention, it could try displaying a dialog. Before XP, that might bring the app to the front. That was annoying as heck to users, so XP's new behavior was "I'll flash the taskbar icon so the user knows you want assistance." THAT was annoying because half the time I had the taskbar hidden so I didn't see a notifcation I wanted, and the other half I was busy and didn't want flashy lights demanding my attention!

    There's never enough granularity for notifications, some of that is because how distracting I'd like my notifications to be is context-sensitive and the computer's got no way to know. Sometimes I'm in the middle of something important, like paying bills, and I'm ticked off because notifications keep getting in the way of the UI. Sometimes I'm not so busy, but I completely miss a text from my wife because I looked away for a moment to make some coffee. Sometimes I really want to know when a file finishes downloading because it's big and I can't work until I have it. Other times I don't give a flip, it's a file for tomorrow.

    Anyway, I think going forward it might be a little bit more under control. You can stick things in Notification Center or whatever they call it in Win10 without having an icon in the tray, and there's some options for controlling what exactly displays in that. IMO it has its own UI problems, but they'll maybe get sorted out over time.

    But people who write "close to tray" apps without an option to disable it, they're gonna get a bad afterlife. I just know it.
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    I am in favor of just having the "X" but most of the apps we use has also an exit button, toolbaritem, whatever. I have not clicked exit for years , unless there is no other way to go.
    The problem is that sometimes you need to write apps (if you are on a company) that are "compatible" with the previous apps that exists there (in the company), so most probably you will create an exit button.
    Then you get the ironic smile or the "know it all" user telling you that u used the exit button while there is an "X".
    I KNOW DAMMIT, LEAVE ME ALONE!
    And when you do not use exit you will always find a manager that will tell you that an exit button must be added to the app.
    I KNOW DAMMIT, LEAVE ME ALONE!!!
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by sapator View Post
    I am in favor of just having the "X" but most of the apps we use has also an exit button, toolbaritem, whatever. I have not clicked exit for years , unless there is no other way to go.
    The problem is that sometimes you need to write apps (if you are on a company) that are "compatible" with the previous apps that exists there (in the company), so most probably you will create an exit button.
    Then you get the ironic smile or the "know it all" user telling you that u used the exit button while there is an "X".
    I KNOW DAMMIT, LEAVE ME ALONE!
    And when you do not use exit you will always find a manager that will tell you that an exit button must be added to the app.
    I KNOW DAMMIT, LEAVE ME ALONE!!!
    Yeah, I usually add an exit button to my applications, so quite often do the applications I'm complaining about, but these applications that do have an exit button only go to standby when you click exit... Other applications have a genuine exit button but bury it under a layer or two of other tabs or buttons.


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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Perhaps the best location or use for a prompt to ask if you really want to exit is whenever you have to log into something. Imo anything else is just a nuisance.
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    MS SQL Powerposter szlamany's Avatar
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    I needed to reboot today - what a PITA that is. I've got SSMS open to 6 different servers - got to close tons of windows.

    I get down to almost all of them clear. I see Skype in the task bar. I know that if I start a shutdown with Skype running it will freeze the shutdown with an app that is not responding.

    My OCD doesn't like that.

    So I attempt to intentionally kill it. [X] returns it to the task bar. Menu in the app is Skype, Tools, Help - under Skype is Close. That returns it to the task bar.

    I re-open it and go into TOOLS hoping to see a check box that says NEVER start this app again - no such luck!

    I close the app again - back to the task bar it goes.

    I right click the app in the TASK bar and find QUIT SKYPE! I select that and get a popup about not being able to send or receive instant messages! Quit and Cancel - Quit!!!!!

    Finally it's gone...

    Honestly who dreams this crap up?

    I wouldn't care if Skype was running as a service in the back end somewhere!

    I would never use Skype from my development machine anyway. Maybe from my Surface Pro 2 - probably not.

    Today's rant...

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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    LOL. You've been skyped!
    I remember my first close skype attempt (I think when MS bought it they did that close thing). I closed it and then , I got a message! Closed it and....MESS-AGE. I think I almost broke the keyboard before i discover what was going on. Unfortunately I must use it at work because we talk to London Belgium and New Zealand so...But never at home.

    I have a recent even that it does not involve Windows. I got on my job in the morning and from a certain time and forth some @#$@#$ colleague was playing the whole Sign of the hammer album! I mean the thing kiss serious buttocks but I can't concentrate with music when I'm working (that and aggressive keyboard karate, you know, click-click-click-CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-TAP-TAP-TAP!!! Man how would it makes any difference if you hit the key hard?!Will it get scared and write code itself?! I have no issue with game hard keyboarding, do it myself but not at work!!Anyhow getting out of topic here). So after a certain point my patience was wearing thin and i tried to locate the perpetrator....Yeah well! Samsung Android my friends! I left the office the previous day and I was listening some music in the car. I went home paused the music player and then closed it with the "X" from the side menu(that appears at the top with the running apps). At night I closed the damn phone completely. Next day at the office i turned it on.So the player somehow did not close at all!It kept going!!! I mean this is the most persistent non closing thing I have even seen. Ok that and the old Nokia alarm clock on the mobile that I use to get up in the morning. It may well sound the alarm even if the phone is closed!!
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    after it happened to me (again) i cannot resist anymore and have to add two things i find even more disturbing than the Exit-sure?-really? Thing.
    These two seem to spread like a Virus and i really, really hate them:
    - A window that is not maximized but still covers the entire sceen so you do not immediatly realize that it is not maximized. now after you read what is in the window, could be a mail, a word document or spreadsheet, you want to Close the window. what do you do? move mouse to top right Corner and click. hu? Window is still there? yes, because you did not hit ist Close button but the Close button of the maximized window underneath, so you closed an application window that you did not want to close... very nice....

    and then there is this one which i mainly observed in web applications:

    - you open up the Webpage of an application that requires you to log on with username and Password. the Webpage loads and soon the fields to enter your credentials are displayed with a flashing Cursor, you start to enter your username/Password but after typing the 3rd letter, the the Focus is moved to some other control because only now the page has finished loading. this is especially a very cool Feature if your username is still displayed from the last logon, so you click into the Password field and while you type your Password, the Focus is set to the cleartext username field...

    i really hate These things. the "not really maximized" window is happening in MS Office applications recently.

  18. #18
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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    I think you're ignoring what the X button is. It isn't an exit button, it is a close window button.
    The three buttons are window state buttons, i.e. Minimize the window, maximize/unmaximize the window and close the window. Whether the application exits when you close a window is up to the application. Legacy VB by default has used the paradigm of exiting the application when the last Form is closed, but of course, you could easily leave some method active in a dll which would keep the executable from exiting when the last Form was closed.

    Of course, if Skype exited when you closed the window it would be pretty hard for someone to call you. If you want the phone to ring you have to leave it connected, it isn't magic.
    Last edited by passel; Jul 13th, 2017 at 10:36 AM.

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    Re: Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by passel View Post
    I think you're ignoring what the X button is. It isn't an exit button, it is a close window button.
    The three buttons are window state buttons, i.e. Minimize the window, maximize the window and close the window. Whether the application exits when you close a window is up to the application.
    Thank you Passel,

    I've been using windows since sometime in the late 1980s and didn't know that !
    It certainly answers (and corrects) my question.


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    Re: [RESOLVED] Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    You resolved something in Chit-Chat

    I'm not sure that has ever been done before.
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    Re: [RESOLVED] Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy Hiker View Post
    You resolved something in Chit-Chat

    I'm not sure that has ever been done before.
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    MS SQL Powerposter szlamany's Avatar
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    Re: [RESOLVED] Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    It isn't resolved - not to me anyway.

    Deciding to keep alive an app AFTER it's last window is closed?

    Something never considered decades ago.

    Just cause they gave you a tray doesn't mean you have to use it. Trays? Trays? I got no stinkin' trays!

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    Re: [RESOLVED] Why doesn't exit mean exit ?

    Every time I see this thread I assume it's going to be a complaint about Brexit
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