I think Russia is sending a message and Green Peace will probably think twice before boarding anything owned by the Russians in the future. That's where they crossed the line in my opinion. Kind of like you can stand in the street in front of my house and protest you don't like something I'm doing but if you step onto my property you changed the game.
Maybe enough international pressure might get them freed but it doesn't look like it.
Last edited by TysonLPrice; Nov 5th, 2013 at 10:30 AM.
Don't these Greenpeace people have anything better to do ? God this is stupid. They're complaining that oil is warming the world. Idiots like them don't realize that many of the comforts they take for granted are possible because of oil. As for the warming of the world....get real, the planet's been hotter before and probably will be again weather we exploit oil or not.
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
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Beyond the question about if it's ok or not what Greenpeace activists do, my question was more related to how much time do you think they'll stay captive by the Russians, as the GP site says: "The charges of piracy and hooliganism are extreme and disproportionate". As Tyson said I also think Russia is sending a message but i hope they'll release them eventually, in the short term i mean. I understand they may have "crossed the barrier" this time but they're not criminals and their family is waiting for them.
Beyond the question about if it's ok or not what Greenpeace activists do, my question was more related to how much time do you think they'll stay captive by the Russians, as the GP site says: "The charges of piracy and hooliganism are extreme and disproportionate". As Tyson said I also think Russia is sending a message but i hope they'll release them eventually, in the short term i mean. I understand they may have "crossed the barrier" this time but they're not criminals and their family is waiting for them.
When they illegally climbed aboard the Russian oil rig they became criminals. It is piracy on the high seas and "disproportionate" is in the eye of the beholder. I can't say how much time they will do but I'll venture a guess and say at least a year.
When they illegally climbed aboard the Russian oil rig they became criminals.
It rather harsh thought isn't it, expected? probably, the Russian government is not very tolerant of dissent.
It is piracy on the high seas
No its not, they climbed aboard an Oil platform not a ship, and the Russian Gov. has now changed the charges anyway to a lesser offence of vandalism or hooliganism or something like that, as even they probably realised that they were looking a bit foolish calling them pirates.
They will all still all do Jail time, but the one i have most sympathy with is the journalist who accompanied them. Was he putting himself at risk by filming with Greenpeace? probably, but he is not affiliated with Greenpeace he was there to give an independent view and he should have been given slightly different treatment.
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It rather harsh thought isn't it, expected? probably, the Russian government is not very tolerant of dissent.
No its not, they climbed aboard an Oil platform not a ship, and the Russian Gov. has now changed the charges anyway to a lesser offence of vandalism or hooliganism or something like that, as even they probably realised that they were looking a bit foolish calling them pirates.
They will all still all do Jail time, but the one i have most sympathy with is the journalist who accompanied them. Was he putting himself at risk by filming with Greenpeace? probably, but he is not affiliated with Greenpeace he was there to give an independent view and he should have been given slightly different treatment.
Yes it is...at sea is the key not just a boat.
"Piracy is typically an act of robbery or criminal violence at sea. The term can include acts committed on land, in the air, or in other major bodies of water or on a shore. It does not normally include crimes committed against persons traveling on the same vessel as the perpetrator (e.g. one passenger stealing from others on the same vessel). The term has been used throughout history to refer to raids across land borders by non-state agents."
At sea, there are no rules and regulations except those set by man's good judgement.
While I know the Greenpeace folks live in harsh conditions for something they believe in, their ideology is blinding them to the above fact. If the Russians see it as piracy, then that is their prerogative.
One thing my dad said when I cam to the US from the UK; "just because they speak English, it's still a foreign country". People would be well served understanding that there is no understanding between men in foreign nations.
I wouldn't see much outrage if the Russians decided to execute a tenth of the crew and let the rest go. Association (the journalist) has little bearing on the case. This is why it should be respected that embedded journalists have a very tough job. Should the Russians decide to treat them differently, so be it - and we will see a standard against our own civility. If not, then the 'foreign' notion holds sway, and we should realize that society and cultural norm is not universal.
"Ok, my response to that is pending a Google search" - Bucky Katt. "There are two types of people in the world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data sets." - Unk. "Before you can 'think outside the box' you need to understand where the box is."
At sea, there are no rules and regulations except those set by man's good judgement.
True...but that could be said about anywhere on this planet. If you meant there are no rules at sea there is (international maritime law).
I agree with what you are saying. Some might say cutting off a thief's hand is disproportionate but if you live in that country that is the law. In the U.S. you can be on death row for twenty years. In china, I have heard, you can be taken out and shot the next day.
Beyond the question about if it's ok or not what Greenpeace activists do, my question was more related to how much time do you think they'll stay captive by the Russians, as the GP site says: "The charges of piracy and hooliganism are extreme and disproportionate". As Tyson said I also think Russia is sending a message but i hope they'll release them eventually, in the short term i mean. I understand they may have "crossed the barrier" this time but they're not criminals and their family is waiting for them.
I get it but its really hard for me to care too much about how much time they'll spend in Russian captivity when you consider how utterly stupid what they did to get there was. I mean, to me that's like deliberately breaking to speed limit in protest to support some self-righteous idealistic nonsense and then expecting and/or receiving sympathy when the police charge you. I mean its not like they these protesters had any real problems. Just another notch for the "1st world problems" meme.
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney
The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney
The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber
The problem is that the Greenpeace activists have spent too long living in the land of no consequence. In most of the western world they benefit from a very sympathetic press, mostly because they market themselves as the kind of touchy-feely organisation that second-rate celebrities like to attach themselves to, and have therefore come to believe that they enjoy universal backing and can do what they want with impunity.
Unfortunately for them, the Russians aren't as easily swayed by celebrity. Steering a huge (oil-powered) ship alongside an oil platform and then clambering aboard is a highly dangerous act of crass stupidity, and the consequences could have been disastrous. A year or so in a Russian prison sounds quite reasonable to me.
I think we should be concerned about the tats. After all Russian prisons have a tradition of impressive and symbolically significant tattoos, with different tattoos meaning different things within prison culture. So, forget about the prison terms, what kind of tats can they expect?
C++ programmers will dismiss you as a cretinous simpleton for your inability to keep track of pointers chained 6 levels deep and Java programmers will pillory you for buying into the evils of Microsoft. Meanwhile C# programmers will get paid just a little bit more than you for writing exactly the same code and VB6 programmers will continue to whitter on about "footprints". - FunkyDexter
There's just no reason to use garbage like InputBox. - jmcilhinney
The threads I start are Niya and Olaf free zones. No arguing about the benefits of VB6 over .NET here please. Happiness must reign. - yereverluvinuncleber
I don't know how long that link will be available. Here are the first couple paragraphs:
ST. PETERSBURG, Russia (AP) -- A Russian court on Tuesday granted bail to Greenpeace protesters from Brazil and New Zealand, the first foreign activists eligible to be released from jail while awaiting trial for participating in a demonstration outside a Russian oil rig.
The Primorsky court in St. Petersburg on Tuesday set bail at 2 million rubles ($61,500) each for Ana Paula and David Haussman. The court said the activists would be released if the bail is paid within the next four days
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