Good to know 10-digit PD number for when you can't get through to 911.

Recently a guy in Utah County had a heart attack. Unfortunately, he was unable to speak to a 911 dispatcher because the phone company had a phone circuit problem. Luckily, he once worked at a hospital and was able to speak to someone there.

Incidents like this make it helpful to know what to do when you can't reach a 911 operator. So I suggest you find out if your local police department has a ten-digit emergency dispatch number and write it down. If you can't find a 10-digit emergency number, write down the non-emergency number and hopefully they'll send help when you call them.

If you're in the Fairfield, CA area the emergency number is 707-428-7373.

Or put it into your phone.

In my state, these are the emergency numbers:

Code:

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Police - 100
Fire - 101
Medical - 102
Emergency Ambulance - 108

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Most of the time, 108 is being called during accidents and for all other medical emergencies. Because the ambulance is well equipped with modern technology and good machinery. And is GPS enabled too.

:wave:

Dialling a ten digit number when the guy has had a heart attack? I think three digits is good enough for emergencies.

I don't know if there should even be a conversation on 911 about the type of emergency. Maybe I have been reading too much or viewing too much TV, but if my house were being robbed and I dialled 911, I wouldn't have time to identify myself, give my address and describe the nature of emergency (well, at least in case of 'real' emergencies). It would best work where I dialled a short code (911 is short enough) and the emergency help arrived.

You could have separate numbers (like we have) for medical emergencies, crime-related emergencies and others (like calamities or natural disasters such as trees falling). The phone network should allow you to identify the caller's location and arrange for a QRT there.

I know the system will be misused, but at least as far as emergencies go I would prefer this one.

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Originally Posted by honeybee

Dialling a ten digit number when the guy has had a heart attack? I think three digits is good enough for emergencies. He had to. A circuit problem prevented him from reaching the PSAP.

I don't know if there should even be a conversation on 911 about the type of emergency. Maybe I have been reading too much or viewing too much TV, but if my house were being robbed and I dialled 911, I wouldn't have time to identify myself, give my address and describe the nature of emergency (well, at least in case of 'real' emergencies). They need to verify your address, and they want to know who you are so they can contact you. It would best work where I dialled a short code (911 is short enough) and the emergency help arrived.

You could have separate numbers (like we have) for medical emergencies, crime-related emergencies and others (like calamities or natural disasters such as trees falling). The phone network should allow you to identify the caller's location and arrange for a QRT there.
The fire departments (who, in the US, usually provide ambulance service) do have a non-emergency number. However, I think knowing how to call the PD in an emergency when you can't call 911 is enough.

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Response in bold.

I understand the need to verify the address and the person, however there may be cases where the person may not be in a position to do that. It should not be a mandatory feature in the system.

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Originally Posted by honeybee

I understand the need to verify the address and the person, however there may be cases where the person may not be in a position to do that. It should not be a mandatory feature in the system.

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The PSAP's use E911, which stands for Enhanced 911. This system allows them to figure out where the caller is. Here's how the system works:

When someone calls 911 on a landline, the system can look up the phone number in a database to find the address it corresponds to.
When someone calls 911 on a cellphone, the system can get an idea of where you are using nearby cell towers and the phone's GPS chip.

They ask for the address so they can ensure help goes to the right place.

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Originally Posted by moonman239

They ask for the address so they can ensure help goes to the right place.

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They need to step their game up. What if I make an extremely well brewed pot of coffee that is very hot. Yet, I decide to take a nice double chug out of it before waiting for it to cool and I severely burn my mouth/throat beyond being able to speak? Then what am I to do? Another case would be the ol' light bulb in the hamburger patty maneuver.

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Originally Posted by akhileshbc

In my state, these are the emergency numbers:

Code:

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Police - 100
Fire - 101
Medical - 102
Emergency Ambulance - 108

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Most of the time, 108 is being called during accidents and for all other medical emergencies. Because the ambulance is well equipped with modern technology and good machinery. And is GPS enabled too.

:wave:

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Why does your state have a medical emergency number and a number to call an ambulance?:confused:

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Originally Posted by thebuffalo

They need to step their game up. What if I make an extremely well brewed pot of coffee that is very hot. Yet, I decide to take a nice double chug out of it before waiting for it to cool and I severely burn my mouth/throat beyond being able to speak? Then what am I to do? Another case would be the ol' light bulb in the hamburger patty maneuver.

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Like I said, they can get an idea of where you are. So if you can't talk, they'll send help to where they think you are. They'll just search for you. If an emergency vehicle passes you, you'll want to try to get their attention. However, it'd probably be best to alert someone who can talk to the fact that you need an ambulance. Then they can call 911 and tell the operator where you are.

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Originally Posted by moonman239

Like I said, they can get an idea of where you are. So if you can't talk, they'll send help to where they think you are. They'll just search for you. If an emergency vehicle passes you, you'll want to try to get their attention. However, it'd probably be best to alert someone who can talk to the fact that you need an ambulance. Then they can call 911 and tell the operator where you are.

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Okay, now add in that I could be a senior citizen, and I have fallen and cannot get up. Solve that one, no Life Alert.

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Originally Posted by thebuffalo

Okay, now add in that I could be a senior citizen, and I have fallen and cannot get up. Solve that one, no Life Alert.

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No problem. Just dial 911 and hopefully they'll send help.

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Originally Posted by moonman239

No problem. Just dial 911 and hopefully they'll send help.

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How?

PS: I mean how to call 911 in this case?

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Originally Posted by thebuffalo

Okay, now add in that I could be a senior citizen, and I have fallen and cannot get up. Solve that one, no Life Alert.

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Well, if you can drink boiling liquids and eat glass, and have survived thus far without that ambulance, perhaps you'll figure it out?

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Originally Posted by honeybee

How?

PS: I mean how to call 911 in this case?

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It's easy if you're near a phone. Otherwise, you're toast until someone finds you. Right now, there's just no way for emergency personnel to know you need help if you can't reach a phone or if nobody else knows that you need help.

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Originally Posted by moonman239

The PSAP's use E911, which stands for Enhanced 911. This system allows them to figure out where the caller is. Here's how the system works:

When someone calls 911 on a landline, the system can look up the phone number in a database to find the address it corresponds to.
When someone calls 911 on a cellphone, the system can get an idea of where you are using nearby cell towers and the phone's GPS chip.

They ask for the address so they can ensure help goes to the right place.

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It is referred to as the ANI/ALI system. Automated Name Information and Automated Location information. For Wireless 911 calls it depends on the age of the phone. There are two different phases. Phase 1 calls will give you a very vague location based only off of the currently connected cell tower. Phase 2 will give you GPS coordinated along with a percentage of how accurate it is.

Sometimes I will give a w911 call that will show a giant circle around the entire city, Phase 1. Other times it will show me exactly what room in a building they are calling from.

As for landlines, there is something calls a MSAG - Master Street Address Guide which has an address for every single phone number in a city. As well as who is the Police, Fire and Ambulance jurisdiction to respond so that all calls get routed to the nearest PSAP.

Surely with landline phones, which are connected through a wire, and which (tend to) remain fixed in a location, you shouldn't have to ask for the caller's address?

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Originally Posted by honeybee

Surely with landline phones, which are connected through a wire, and which (tend to) remain fixed in a location, you shouldn't have to ask for the caller's address?

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Thats correct. The address will automatically show up. But you still want to confirm with them. If someone calls to report a burglary at a neighbors house, you dont want to just put in the callers address. You want to confirm which address.

Or if someone calls 911 from a large office building with tons of offices, sometimes the ANI/ALI information will give the address of the building but not the office number. This is pretty typical of office building since the PBX isnt set up correctly.

Also cellphones are quickly replacing landline telephones. When someone calls 911 from their house from their cellphone you will get a pretty good mapping of where they are, but the radius could be around two houses or more depending on which Phase they are calling in on.

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Originally Posted by dclamp

It is referred to as the ANI/ALI system. Automated Name Information and Automated Location information. For Wireless 911 calls it depends on the age of the phone. There are two different phases. Phase 1 calls will give you a very vague location based only off of the currently connected cell tower. Phase 2 will give you GPS coordinated along with a percentage of how accurate it is.

Sometimes I will give a w911 call that will show a giant circle around the entire city, Phase 1. Other times it will show me exactly what room in a building they are calling from.

As for landlines, there is something calls a MSAG - Master Street Address Guide which has an address for every single phone number in a city. As well as who is the Police, Fire and Ambulance jurisdiction to respond so that all calls get routed to the nearest PSAP.

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Are you a 911 operator?

I believe that part of the reason they ask for details etc is just to keep you on the phone and talking. That might sound odd but in most emergencies this is actually desirable because it keeps you calm and focussed. And in the case of you phoning in an injury to yourself (for example) it also helps keep you concious and stops you going into shock. Of course, just taking your address isn't going to keep you engaged for long enough for an ambulance to arrive but it does get the dialogue rolling. I don't know if that's actually true but I've heard it from more than one source.

And of course they check your address and details if you're able to give it. Why would they pass up an opportunity to trivially build redundancy into the system? That doesn't mean they'll fold their arms and ignore your call if you're unable to speak, though.

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Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

I believe that part of the reason they ask for details etc is just to keep you on the phone and talking. That might sound odd but in most emergencies this is actually desirable because it keeps you calm and focussed. And in the case of you phoning in an injury to yourself (for example) it also helps keep you concious and stops you going into shock. Of course, just taking your address isn't going to keep you engaged for long enough for an ambulance to arrive but it does get the dialogue rolling. I don't know if that's actually true but I've heard it from more than one source.

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Yeah, I've been the caller in such a situation, though it wasn't to emergency services, directly. I don't remember it, but I was kept rambling (one could hardly call it talking).

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Originally Posted by moonman239

Are you a 911 operator?

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Yes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

I believe that part of the reason they ask for details etc is just to keep you on the phone and talking. That might sound odd but in most emergencies this is actually desirable because it keeps you calm and focussed. And in the case of you phoning in an injury to yourself (for example) it also helps keep you concious and stops you going into shock. Of course, just taking your address isn't going to keep you engaged for long enough for an ambulance to arrive but it does get the dialogue rolling. I don't know if that's actually true but I've heard it from more than one source.

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Depending on what you are reporting, yeah they want to keep you on the line for as long as they can. If you are alone and reporting a medical emergency they will keep you on the line because you are the only one there, and the dispatcher wont know whats going on if they hang up. And if it gets worse you might not be able to call back.

If someone is calling in a medical emergency about someone they are with, they will get all the relavent information they can and then hang up. Since there is someone else there, that person can call back and report any changes.

If its a dangerous situation (active shooter, robbery, domestic violence) they will take all the information as soon as possible and either keep talking to you to keep you calm, or not say anything. The dispatcher will often ask the caller to leave the phone off the hook so the dispatcher can listen for any changes and not compromise the life of the caller (if the caller needs to leave or run out).

If it is a child calling then the dispatcher will stay on the line with them as long as possible until help gets there. After they get the important information like address and whats going on, they will talk about things that children can relate to so it distracts the child.

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Originally Posted by FunkyDexter

And of course they check your address and details if you're able to give it. Why would they pass up an opportunity to trivially build redundancy into the system? That doesn't mean they'll fold their arms and ignore your call if you're unable to speak, though.

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And Yes. If for some reason you call in and your address is incorrect the dispatcher can submit and update and keep the system up to date.

Another huge reason that we ask for address is because of VoIP phones. If you live in california and you register your phone at 123 Main Street California. And you take your phone on vacation to NY. 911 will still direct to the 911 call center at your address in CA, and the display will show your address in CA.

So if the dispatcher doesnt ask your address and you are reporting medical problem in your house. Fire Dept shows up to your CA house, you dont answer. Then they bust down your door, you're not there.

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Originally Posted by dclamp

Yes.

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So you work for a PSAP (Public Safety Access Point).

Do you work for the local police department? I know in Fairfield, if I call from a landline, the call will be routed to the PSAP at the police department. So if I call the above number, it will still go to the PSAP. However, if I call from a cell phone, the call will go to the local Highway Patrol station. The operator will then decide whether the emergency is to be handled by the highway authorities or the local authorities.

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Originally Posted by moonman239

So you work for a PSAP (Public Safety Access Point).

Do you work for the local police department? I know in Fairfield, if I call from a landline, the call will be routed to the PSAP at the police department. So if I call the above number, it will still go to the PSAP. However, if I call from a cell phone, the call will go to the local Highway Patrol station. The operator will then decide whether the emergency is to be handled by the highway authorities or the local authorities.

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Yes... i work for my university police dept and the communication center is a PSAT. I dispatch solo (call taker and dispatcher). Its much more difficult than working in a large agency where where are separate people for call taking and dispatching. I monitor 10 different radio channels as well as call take, monitoring the Fire system for the entire campus, and the Parking and Transportation Dept.

And it depends on how your county is setup. If you are on the highway in California, 90% of the time 911 calls get routed to the California Highway Patrol. However, my campus is located along a major highway and we receive tons of calls from the freeway. We do not receive any land lines from the surrounding city because we are a campus police. However we receive all the campus 911 calls, including emergency code blue phones, and elevator phones and of course wireless 911 calls.

Some pretty good insights. Thanks dclamp and others!

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