Is immigration out of control?

[System_Error]

I've noticed it over the years, but I just got through watching an episode of Bill O'Reilly on immigration. It was talking about how 80% of immigrants(mexicans) are illegal. 32 million illegal mexicans now live in the USA, and have more benifits than most citizens. I don't understand that...They are allowed more rights and privaleges than any other immigrants like germans, italians, etc.. One thing they said on that show, was that a mexican(in specific) could come over sea's illegally, and get more benifits such as health, than a war veteran returning from war.

Now, I believe diversity is good, but chaos is weakness. Are our politician not paying immigration enough attention?

[DeadEyes]

I don't know who Bill O'Reilly is, but does he by any chance have an agenda.
I bet most of those illegal immigrants are employed, in jobs no one else will do either because of the pay or conditions. People complain about immigrants but stop them and people will soon be complaining about increasing prices and lack of services for all the dirty jobs.

[Malim]

You are right on Dead Eyes. My husband owns his own landscaping business. And, he employs many Mexicans. My husband checks for credentials like Driver's License and Social Security cards, but we're relatively certain that most of those are falsely obtained. Not all, but most of Mexicans are HARD workers. They have an incredible work ethic. They do work that many Americans would rather collect welfare than do. And, the majority of them are the most polite people I've ever met. We would not be able to remain in business without them.

As far as health benefits, I don't know any Mexicans who have them. Unless through employers. They use the hospital system and the public health system when they have to.

P.S. System Error - Mexican's don't come from over seas. Generally, they cross the border in Texas.

[davebat]

32 million illegal mexicans now live in the USA, and have more benifits than most citizens. I don't understand that...They are allowed more rights and privaleges than any other immigrants like germans, italians, etc.. One thing they said on that show, was that a mexican(in specific) could come over sea's illegally, and get more benifits such as health, than a war veteran returning from war.


I dont agree with you, Mexican imigrants do not get more benefits than americans.

[MasterBlaster]

One thing they said on that show, was that a mexican(in specific) could come over sea's illegally, and get more benifits such as health, than a war veteran returning from war.

That's sorta true but only because Our VA hospitals suck. Vets would be better off using public healthcare but they are disqualified because they already have health coverage through the VA. My buddy who just got back from Iraq less one arm is dealing with that now. Lost his house and is hundreds of thousands in debt now. Also, the army doctor hosed up the amputation and capped off the nerves incorrectly so he's got level 8 pain 24/7 for the rest of his life.

If the 16 to 21 year old crowd in the would actually get off of mommy and daddys couch, put down the video games and get a job, we wouldn't need illegal immagrants to mow lawns and flip burgers.

[crptcblade]

You are right on Dead Eyes. My husband owns his own landscaping business. And, he employs many Mexicans. My husband checks for credentials like Driver's License and Social Security cards, but we're relatively certain that most of those are falsely obtained. Not all, but most of Mexicans are HARD workers. They have an incredible work ethic. They do work that many Americans would rather collect welfare than do. And, the majority of them are the most polite people I've ever met. We would not be able to remain in business without them.

As far as health benefits, I don't know any Mexicans who have them. Unless through employers. They use the hospital system and the public health system when they have to.

P.S. System Error - Mexican's don't come from over seas. Generally, they cross the border in Texas.
Being a source of cheap labor doesn't justify circumventing the system.

[Malim]

In response to

Being a source of cheap labor doesn't justify circumventing the system.

I agree with DeadEyes because my husband has real world experience with this exact issue.


I bet most of those illegal immigrants are employed, in jobs no one else will do either because of the pay or conditions. People complain about immigrants but stop them and people will soon be complaining about increasing prices and lack of services for all the dirty jobs.


Like I said in my original post, my husband obtains Driver's License and Social Security cards. There's not much else he can do. He can't force people who would rather be on welfare than work a manual labor job to work for him.

[crptcblade]

I'm not disagreeing with your point of view. But the bottom line is, they are still in the wrong.

[Malim]

I understand what you are saying as well.

But, what it boils down to is this: They want to feed their families. They know there are jobs here that people are not willing to do. So, they ignore the fact that it is illegal. Most of them keep just enough money to live on, and they send the rest of the money back to their families.

[Dillinger4]

Posted by Malim

They know there are jobs here that people are not willing to do.

People are not willing to do the jobs becasue the payscale has been lowered. A large percentage of the time it's not the actual job that people won't do it's what the job pays. Granted most people don't want to sweat and do landscaping or do house keeping but the jobs that americans would do they won't do because the lower job market is flooded with illegals who will accept anything they are offered.

Even if you would be willing to accept the lower pay you have to contend with the illegals bringing there own in to fill any open slots. So you get the double wammy.

[szlamany]

Bill O'Rielly is full of it usually - the shock-jock of mis-information!

I was involved in implementing a state-wide program for affordable health care (subsidized) for low-wage earners. In CT the program was called HUSKY...

At any rate, several years into the program it comes to light that the biggest users of the program are all employeed by a handful of large-corporate employers. WalMart (large discount store chain), Home Depot (large discount home supply store) and Laidlaw (school bus drivers!).

Apparently these large corporations discovered they could blow off covering the health care of their workers - the workers are paid low wages anyway - they qualify for HUSKY and all of a sudden the tax-payers of the state are subsidizing these workers (ultimately these big corporations).

And yes, it just came to light that WalMart was knowingly employing illegal aliens.

What a rip off at all levels this is!

[Dillinger4]

It's all a scam. America is about business, so what leads me to believe that anyone would do anything about stopping people from comming into america illegal? Like they actualy would crack down at the borders create an employment deficit then be forced to up wages(cause no one is gonna work for $7 and hour).

[Malim]

It's all a scam. America is about business, so what leads me to believe that anyone would do anything about stopping people from comming into america illegal? Like they actualy would crack down at the borders create an employment deficit then be forced to up wages(cause no one is gonna work for $7 and hour).

Aren't business and America great! Business pays my bills, lets me live in a nice home, drive a nice car, pays for my family's meals and entertainment! In America I can work hard to become anything I want to be! I can make any salary I want as long as I am willing to work hard to do it. I think business and America Rock!

Personally, I'd rather work for $7 an hour than collect welfare. My husband pays his lead foreman $20 an hour and the other workers $15. I don't think that's a bad pay scale to ride around on a lawnmower, blow some leaves, trim some hedges and edge a few curbs. He's employed over 20 people and only two who have applied for jobs were Americans. One lasted three months and quit, and the other was fired because he refused to work when it was hot, cold or raining.

If people don't want to make $7 an hour, then they should make arrangements to find higher paying jobs, You know, rocket science things like getting through high school and college, or going to a trade school, etc. And, if they can't do that then they should find a company that promotes from within. At my company, the guy that started in the mailroom twenty years ago is now the Director of Accounts Receivable and manages $2 billion dollars in receivables.

If people possess skills that make them only worth $7 an hour that's their problem, not the welfare system's problem. And that is precisely why illegal immigrants come to America because they are willing to work for $7 an hour.

[Dillinger4]

First off your husband is the exception. Most landscapers get paid low wages. Second i highly doubt that you have trouble finding an american citizen to work for what your husband pays.

[Malim]

No, my husband is not the exception. We live in an area where landscaping is big business and if you are good, and that depends on your crew, then you can make A LOT of money. So, it pays to pay your workers. And, did you miss the part where I said out of twenty workers only two were Americans? What I forgot to say was that out of about 70 or so interviews for those 20 or so workers, there were only two Americans who applied.

[szlamany]

It's all a scam. America is about business,

I think people are all about beating the system. And business is just a group of people beating the system.

First off your husband is the exception. Most landscapers get paid low wages. Second i highly doubt that you have trouble finding an american citizen to work for what your husband pays.

Not to indict landscapers - but from what I've seen, the small landscaping guy isn't paying any taxes - just pocketing the cash - another example of beating the system.

If only those people could realize that they are beating it for themselves and everyone else!

In my opinion, it's all about ambition - I started working when I was 15 - started developing software when I was 18 - traveled the country for the company I worked for installing that product like crazy. That's my personal work ethic.

Now 25 years later I don't see that kind of work ethic anymore. I've hired college kids, consultants, high school students - very few have the drive that I wish they had.

[Malim]

Not to indict landscapers - but from what I've seen, the small landscaping guy isn't paying any taxes - just pocketing the cash - another example of beating the system.

If only those people could realize that they are beating it for themselves and everyone else!

Do you have any first hand knowledge of landscapers who cheat on their taxes? I know a lot and not one of them cheats. The penalties are too deep.

We started as a small landscaping firm and we've always paid every dime owed in taxes that we were expected to pay. Don't get me wrong, we'll be agressive - but, we stay within the law. We have a business checking account that all the money goes through, and if we don't report enough income to support our lifestyle, then we will be audited, and go to jail. Not worth it. I'm sure, many small business people cheat on their taxes, but the ones who have ethics, and morals, and don't want to go to jail don't.

[szlamany]

We started as a small landscaping firm and we've always paid every dime owed in taxes that we were expected to pay. Don't get me wrong, we'll be agressive - but, we stay within the law. We have a business checking account that all the money goes through, and if we don't report enough income to support our lifestyle, then we will be audited, and go to jail. Not worth it. I'm sure, many small business people cheat on their taxes, but the ones who have ethics, and morals, and don't want to go to jail don't.

As I said, I did not mean to indict landscapers - and surely not you :)

And yes - I do know of people that cheat...

[Malim]

I know of people who cheat too, and I always advise them to be as aggressive as they can, within the limit of the law, but to pay their taxes.

Coincidentally, most are immigrants (not illegal) who start their own businesses. I know that can be construed as a generalization, it just happens to be the case with the people I know who cheat on their taxes.

[Dillinger4]

I the way i see it is the ones with the drive just end up in a job where job per formance dosen't equal pay. I worked in a mailroom for three years. Out worked almost everyone there. Didn't i get payed anymore? no. All i got was an excuse every year why the company couldn't give us a raise.

[Malim]

Then you were working for the wrong company.

[Dillinger4]

They are all the same. All low level jobs in my area employ pretty much the same people. The mailroom was no exception. It took me eight months to find a job that was a block away. When i was hired i thought to myself why did it take that long? I realized that every time someone quit the spanish people would just bring in one of their own. Also why would the company not give any raises? Cause they knew that if the spanish people didn't like it and quit there would be no shortage of illegal workers to take their place. This pretty much came out of the workers mouths not mine.

[Malim]

I can sympathize with you, but you WERE at the wrong company. They are not all the same. Plenty of companies promote from within. In fact, in big companies I would say it is the norm, as long as you are a good employee, smart, and possessing a good work ethic.

I am certainly not trying to be disrespecful, but why did it take you three years to figure out that you were going no where at that company?

I've never had a problem finding a good paying job, even in desperate economic times. And, I certainly wouldn't hang around for three years in a job where I didn't get a raise or a promotion. Did you ask for a promotion?

[Dillinger4]

Posted by Malim

I am certainly not trying to be disrespecfut, but why did it take you three years to figure out that you were going no where at that company?

None taken. :) It didn't. I knew that there was nowhere to go within in the company early on unless i wanted to be a manager or work in human resources. Those were pretty much the only jobs posted on the companies job board. I stayed because of the jobs close proximity to my house.

[Malim]

Sometimes it is better to travel longer distance for better job with larger wage, than to have convenient commute for lower wage.
- Confucius.

Confucius also say - if manager job is available from mailroom job, take manager job.

[Dillinger4]

Posted by Malim

Sometimes it is better to travel longer distance for better job with larger wage, than to have convenient commute for lower wage.

Depends where you live. Driving 30 miles in heavily populated areas is different than driving 30 miles somewhere else.

Posted by Malim

Confucius also say - if manager job is available from mailroom job, take manager job.

Sorry im not a babysitter.

[Malim]

Depends where you live. Driving 30 miles in heavily populated areas is different than driving 30 miles somewhere else.

Agreed - I live in Atlanta. Traffic is terrible. And it's a trade off between quality of life and drive time. I'm not lying, I literally read all 1400+ pages of War and Peace while stopped at red lights commuting to a job in Atlanta. However, many companies are willing to let you telecommute at least a couple of days a week. And, if you are an independent contractor - which I was for 4 years, you can work from home most of the time. (If you are good, and if you deliver.)

Sorry im not a babysitter.
Too bad, I pay mine $10 an hour. Oh, never mind, that's not even good enough for a welfare recipient - only good enough for an illegal immigrant! Nevermind that I throw in a ride too and from the gig - dinner - and, a movie! "Fringe benefits."

Seriously, not everyone is cut out to be a manager. It's a tough job. And, if you can recognize in yourself that you don't want to be one, than that is a strength.

[Dillinger4]

That's why im trying to move from new jersey to knoxville TN. At least in knoxville i can live in the city without having to pay an arm and a leg for rent and car insurance plus they have good public transportation like trolleys and busses.

[Malim]

This is too funny...

I just moved to Knoxville. I work in the IT department for the best company in town. I have to have your resume.

(The public transportation isn't that great - and there are no Trolley's unless your talking in a tourist district downtown. But, there are no state taxes here!)

[Dillinger4]

My xgirlfriend lives in pigeon forge and runs a hotel i think in gattlinburg which i love going to. I sent in my application to transfer to utk so im hoping that i get accepted. She won't be too far from me, i think 30 miles so that's pretty good. Funny she said that the public transportation is slow so i should keep my car. :lol:

[Dillinger4]

I looked at the kat maps and the trans seems to cover a lot of the area though. But then again i don't know how big knoxville is so. :sick:

[Malim]

Pigeon Forge is great, and so is Gatlinburg. There aren't that many big corporations in Knoxville, and that's where you want to be (most likely) if you want to move up in the company. Are you a VB.net developer? If so, we are looking at resumes.

[System_Error]

Bill O'Rielly is full of it usually - the shock-jock of mis-information!

Bill O'Rielly is your daddy, that's all I know.

[Malim]

Bill O'Rielly is your daddy, that's all I know.

You finally post again, and that's all you have to add??????

[System_Error]

I dont agree with you, Mexican imigrants do not get more benefits than americans.

How many american citizens can go over seas, rape a girl, and get away with it, without being sent back to your country?

[Dillinger4]

Posted by Malim
Are you a VB.net developer? If so, we are looking at resumes.

Strictly Java. I used to program in Vb a long time ago. When versions 5 and 6 were out.

[System_Error]

I don't know who Bill O'Reilly is, but does he by any chance have an agenda.
I bet most of those illegal immigrants are employed, in jobs no one else will do either because of the pay or conditions..

Your wrong. Employers are all about money, they would rather pay ten mexicans one dollar an hour, than one american ten dollars an hour. Americans working for lower level jobs now have to compete with mexicans that will work for half the money, not even enough to feed a family. So whats the point in even applying for a job were you have that kind of competition.

[System_Error]

You finally post again, and that's all you have to add??????


Most of the arguments presented, including yours, can't be considered valid arguments. You can't even support your crap.

As for mexico, I just read were the president of mexico has actually made a dvd that tells mexicans how to get over here illegally without being caught.

[Dillinger4]

Malim does your husband run his business out of knoxville? For 15 an hour ill cut lawns all day then wax your car. :lol:

[System_Error]

You finally post again, and that's all you have to add??????

I've had work to do...

[System_Error]

Malim does your husband run his business out of knoxville? For 15 an hour ill cut lawns all day then wax your car. :lol:

Or he could pay one of those illegal immigrants he seems to support 3 dollars an hour.

[Malim]

Most of the arguments presented, including yours, can't be considered valid arguments. You can't even support your crap.

As for mexico, I just read were the president of mexico has actually made a dvd that tells mexicans how to get over here illegally without being caught.

You have got to be kidding me! Are you smoking Crack? I have real world experience that supports what I've stated. We own our own business that deals with these exact issues! What experience do you have to support your arguments? Oh yeah - I forgot - you watch Bill O'Reilly. Okay - expert O'Reilly want-to-be - tell me where I failed in my crappy arguments!

[Dillinger4]

Ok ok let's get back on topic. A job for me. :lol:

[System_Error]

You have got to be kidding me! Are you smoking Crack? I have real world experience that supports what I've stated. We own our own business that deals with these exact issues! What experience do you have to support your arguments? Oh yeah - I forgot - you watch Bill O'Reilly. Okay - expert O'Reilly want-to-be - tell me where I failed in my crappy arguments!

You run a business right? You probably get your sources from something that supports your side, with made up evidence, and invalid arguments. I don't blame you, if I ran a business, I would want the cheapest workers. See, you don't get both sides of the stories, just the parts that make you feel good.

[System_Error]

Ok ok let's get back on topic. A job for me. :lol:


Maybe after the argument...Or during.

[System_Error]

tell me where I failed in my crappy arguments!

Thanks for the admitance, and contridiction.

[Malim]

Ok ok let's get back on topic. A job for me. :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

My husband sold his business when we moved here. He may get back into it, might not. We are surveying the market to see if there is the same demand as there was in Atlanta. Right now, it seems like there isn't as much of a demand. But, it's still frigid here at times. So we'll see.

But, if you are a java developer, and you know VB 5 and 6 - VB.net is different - but not a huge leap. Brush up. Do you know ASP.net?

I work for the greatest company, and we have a web development team. I don't know if they are hiring right now.

[Malim]

Thanks for the admitance, and contridiction.

Did you get in a fight with your girlfriend tonight???? Or, is Bill O'Reilly your boyfriend? Don't know where you are coming from at all!

[System_Error]

Did you get in a fight with your girlfriend tonight???? Or, is Bill O'Reilly your boyfriend? Don't know where you are coming from at all!

What? You just said that in one of your posts...Please say something valid next time. I'm tired of wasting my time with someone who has little knowledge of the subject.

[Dillinger4]

I only touch Java. Keep in touch. I should be in knoxville within the month. Perhaps we could do lunch some time. :)

[System_Error]

I only touch Java. Keep in touch. I should be in knoxville within the month. Perhaps we could do lunch some time. :)

It's a big scam, she just wants to rip you off
:D

[Malim]

What? You just said that in one of your posts...Please say something valid next time. I'm tired of wasting my time with someone who has little knowledge of the subject.
I just looked at your public profile - you are only 16 - if you were truthful in filling out your profile.

OMG - I am arguing about owning a business with a 16 year old! :blush:

[Dillinger4]

I doubt that. What would she take? Im pretty much going down there with only the shirt on my back. :lol:

[szlamany]

Most of the arguments presented, including yours, can't be considered valid arguments. You can't even support your crap.

As for mexico, I just read were the president of mexico has actually made a dvd that tells mexicans how to get over here illegally without being caught.

They have all, actually, been insiteful and full of personal experience.

You are simply batting at the edges and giving no good input - from what I can see.

[Dillinger4]

Posted by Malim
OMG - I am arguing about owning a business with a 16 year old!

Yes. :lol:

[Malim]

I only touch Java. Keep in touch. I should be in knoxville within the month. Perhaps we could do lunch some time. :)

No problem. Maybe you could visit my office, I'd be happy to show you around, and introduce you to people in my IT department. It's a great place to work!

Knoxville is great too! Lots of lakes, and water skiing. Then, the mountains aren't far, so there's relatively decent snow skiing too! It's a fun place to live.

[System_Error]

They have all, actually, been insiteful and full of personal experience.

You are simply batting at the edges and giving no good input - from what I can see.


hmm...exactly what I said except in different words..Thanks for the repitition.

[System_Error]

I just looked at your public profile - you are only 16 - if you were truthful in filling out your profile.

OMG - I am arguing about owning a business with a 16 year old! :blush:

Doesn't it suck when someone younger than you actually knows more?

[Dillinger4]

Posted by System_Error
hmm...exactly what I said except in different words..Thanks for the repitition.

I think szlamany was referring to you.

[System_Error]

I think szlamany was referring to you.


Yes, I directed a similar post at him, and he did the same thing at me. That's why I said it was exactly what I said.

[Malim]

They have all, actually, been insiteful and full of personal experience.

You are simply batting at the edges and giving no good input - from what I can see.

Okay - I've lived it. As far as I can tell, you haven't. Who can give better input than someone has lived it?

Batting at the edges and giving no good input? It's simple. There are jobs people aren't willing to do here. There are jobs that people are willing to do here who happen to be illegal immigrants. I don't think it gets much deeper than that. If Americans were willing to do the jobs it would be different. But, they aren't.

Tell me where I'm going wrong. My husband has been running this company successfully for ten years. What's your experience? Experience is the best educator that there is. Just like when a child puts there hand up to a hot stove and it burns, they won't do it again....

[System_Error]

Okay - I've lived it. As far as I can tell, you haven't. Who can give better input than someone has lived it?

Batting at the edges and giving no good input? It's simple. There are jobs people aren't willing to do here. There are jobs that people are willing to do here who happen to be illegal immigrants. I don't think it gets much deeper than that. If from America were willing to do the jobs it would be different. But, they aren't.

Tell me where I'm going wrong. My husband has been running this company successfully for ten years. What's your experience? Experience is the best educator that there is. Just like when a child puts there hand up to a hot stove and it burns, they won't do it again....


I see what your saying, but your missing my point. What would be the point of an american working a job, and only getting payed half of what they should because of the competition they have?(illegal immigrants)..You own a business right? If you had such strict competition, would you lower prices so much that your really not making anything?

[Malim]

Doesn't it suck when someone younger than you actually knows more?

No - it doesn't suck at all. When a 16 year old can make an intelligent argument without placing all of his intelligence in a Bill O'Reilly show, I don't have a problem at all admitting when I am wrong. I happen to know many teenagers who are smart and can formulate their own opinions from the information they get. And, I am more than happy to listen to their opinions.

But, you haven't made one bit of sense yet! You have only repeated something you watched on T.V.

[System_Error]

Okay - I've lived it. As far as I can tell, you haven't. Who can give better input than someone has lived it?

What is your definition of living it? I live in an area that has one of the highest immigrant population in the US?

Why do you think I know nothing of this, just because I'm 16, and I don't own a business?

[System_Error]

No - it doesn't suck at all. When a 16 year old can make an intelligent argument without placing all of his intelligence in a Bill O'Reilly show, I don't have a problem at all admitting when I am wrong. I happen to know many teenagers who are smart and can formulate their own opinions from the information they get. And, I am more than happy to listen to their opinions.

But, you haven't made one bit of sense yet! You have only repeated something you watched on T.V.

That show gave me the idea, I didn't just take everything from it. Personally, I think your the one not making any sense, but yet we both say that, so maybe none of us is making any sense.

[System_Error]

You have only repeated something you watched on T.V.

How could an individual remember all of those statistics and information from a TV show?

[szlamany]

Okay - I've lived it. As far as I can tell, you haven't. Who can give better input than someone has lived it?

Batting at the edges and giving no good input? It's simple. There are jobs people aren't willing to do here. There are jobs that people are willing to do here who happen to be illegal immigrants. I don't think it gets much deeper than that. If Americans were willing to do the jobs it would be different. But, they aren't.

Tell me where I'm going wrong. My husband has been running this company successfully for ten years. What's your experience? Experience is the best educator that there is. Just like when a child puts there hand up to a hot stove and it burns, they won't do it again....

Are you actually speaking to me here?

[Malim]

What is your definition of living it? I live in an area that has one of the highest immigrant population in the US?

Why do you think I know nothing of this, just because I'm 16, and I don't own a business?

Once again, I own my own business where Americans are not willing to do the job for a good pay that illegal immigrants will do.

Okay, that said, we still check for driver's license and social security cards because we want to comply with the law. However, we are somewhat suspicious that they may not be legitimate.

They are great workers, and we do not underpay them, or cut down the pay scale for them. We pay them well, because our success is tied to what they do for our business.

We report the wages that we pay to them to the IRS via 1099. At that point, it is up to the IRS to track them down, because it is not our fault that they have slipped through the immigration cracks especially when we have done what we can do to check for green card/citizenship etc.

Why are we ranting about illegal immigrants that come into this country to do what fat, lazy welfare recipients consider to be substandard work? (Reminder - we pay our staff very well for what they do.)

The focus should be, why do fat, lazy Americans insist on collecting welfare when there are perfectly good jobs (might not be the most appealling) for them to do. (And, I'm not talking about those who are on welfare legitemately, I'm talking about those who work the system.)

It's not that I think you know nothing of this. But, I have ten years of experience in a business that deals directly with this issue. Don't you think you should consider the experience of someone who has had real world interaction in the debates that you are having? And, not simply dismiss them as invalid, or in your words, crappy.

[szlamany]

Yes - I posted what you said when I replied. Look at post 61 :)

Why? I was backing you up to this young inexperienced mouth :)

[System_Error]

But, I have ten years of experience in a business that deals directly with this issue. Don't you think you should consider the experience of someone who has had real world interaction in the debates that you are having? And, not simply dismiss them as invalid, or in your words, crappy.

I do regard your arguments, but I still don't understand why you think I know nothing just because I don't own a business. Also, I was only trying to get at you with saying that your debates were crappy, although you do consitentely avoid my questions, as for the reason, I don't know.

Now, once again, I would like to know why living in one of the highest immagrational area's does not count as legitimately "living" it. And what is your definition of living it? Are you saying that only people owning businesses have valid arguments in a subject such as this?

[System_Error]

Why? I was backing you up to this young inexperienced mouth :)

Wow, what a contributor...age is everything right? I can see your presenting your side very well.

[szlamany]

You run a business right? You probably get your sources from something that supports your side, with made up evidence, and invalid arguments. I don't blame you, if I ran a business, I would want the cheapest workers. See, you don't get both sides of the stories, just the parts that make you feel good.

You really should be more cohesive in your arguments - from reading these posts you are loosing the debate.

[System_Error]

I'm having fun, but I have to sign off...See you guys later.

[Malim]

Why? I was backing you up to this young inexperienced mouth :)


Yes - I see that now. I'm sorry. I read your response that he took to validate his point. Which, now I see was taken out of context.

Thanks for watching my back!
:wave:

[System_Error]

You really should be more cohesive in your arguments - from reading these posts you are loosing the debate.

Once again! What a powerfull post..By the way, you can't even spell losing right, so how can you constitute a win?

[szlamany]

I do regard your arguments, but I still don't understand why you think I know nothing just because I don't own a business. Also, I was only trying to get at you with saying that your debates were crappy, although you do consitentely avoid my questions, as for the reason, I don't know.

Now, once again, I would like to know why living in one of the highest immagrational area's does not count as legitimately "living" it. And what is your definition of living it? Are you saying that only people owning businesses have valid arguments in a subject such as this?

My grandfather immigrated to the US when he was 16 - back in 1910 - by 1950 he owned his own shop in NYC - a house - two house actually - and left a legacy of "do it" in his grandchildren.

From what I can tell, in the USA, NYC is the biggest immigrational areas per square foot ever developed!

[szlamany]

Once again! What a powerfull post..By the way, you can't even spell losing right, so how can you constitute a win?

Speeling and dislexxia are the ture signs of a genuius - loose the attidute - dude!

[Malim]

Once again! What a powerfull post..By the way, you can't even spell losing right, so how can you constitute a win?

Grow up Sweety System Error, everyone spells things wrong on the forums because in the end it's not that important.

What was that??? Did I hear your mother calling you to brush your teeth and go to bed?

BTW - powerfull is spelled powerful - or was that your attempt at sarcasm?

[szlamany]

I believe that he made the first spelling error with "immagrational".

I get picked on by my customers for not spelling lose and loose properly - we were just joking about that in a meeting today - funny he would point it out.

BTW - I've had my own software house since 1986 - when I decided that giving my proprietary rights to the lizard boss was no way to make it in the world! I've got a 1000 square feet - at nearly $2000 a month - the rent and electric can put you out of business! I love owning my own business - have great feelings of respect for my customers - as do they for me.

My kitchen was built by (probably) illegal Brazil'ians - house cleaned by maybe illegal Brazil'ians - lawn cut by the son of a landscaper - probably not on the books - what are you supposed to do?

[szlamany]

I've noticed it over the years, but I just got through watching an episode of Bill O'Reilly on immigration. It was talking about how 80% of immigrants(mexicans) are illegal. 32 million illegal mexicans now live in the USA, and have more benifits than most citizens. I don't understand that...They are allowed more rights and privaleges than any other immigrants like germans, italians, etc.. One thing they said on that show, was that a mexican(in specific) could come over sea's illegally, and get more benifits such as health, than a war veteran returning from war.

Now, I believe diversity is good, but chaos is weakness. Are our politician not paying immigration enough attention?

privaleges? Typing too fast were you?

[Malim]

BTW - I've had my own software house since 1986 - when I decided that giving my proprietary rights to the lizard boss was no way to make it in the world! I've got a 1000 square feet - at nearly $2000 a month - the rent and electric can put you out of business! I love owning my own business - have great feelings of respect for my customers - as do they for me.

My kitchen was built by (probably) illegal Brazil'ians - house cleaned by maybe illegal Brazil'ians - lawn cut by the son of a landscaper - probably not on the books - what are you supposed to do?

:lol: :lol: :lol:

It's funny how people hate illegal immigrant workers until they realize the savings they can make!

Wow - in business for yourself since 1986. Is it just you? It's impressive any time a business can stay open for 5+ years! Much less nearly 20!

[Malim]

privaleges? Typing too fast were you?

Too Shay!! : :afrog: :afrog: :afrog: :bigyello:

[szlamany]

Wow - in business for yourself since 1986. Is it just you? It's impressive any time a business can stay open for 5+ years! Much less nearly 20!

I had a partner in 1986 - he split in 1997 (best thing that could have happened - we had different work ethics).

So, now it's just me - I've got some HS student help (3 or so people) - trying to convert 20+ years of mainframe software to VB/MS SQL.

New clients see me as just a "small single person shop" - existing customers see the "business" value I add to their operations - hard to compete against the slick sales jobs given by the "big boys".

[DeadEyes]

How many american citizens can go over seas, rape a girl, and get away with it, without being sent back to your country?
Plenty if the're in the military (Status of Forces Agreements)

[System_Error]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

It's funny how people hate illegal immigrant workers until they realize the savings they can make!


What are you saying, you take advantage of them?

[System_Error]

Speeling and dislexxia are the ture signs of a genuius - loose the attidute - dude!


lol sarcasm is a sign of frustration.


By the way, what attitude?

[szlamany]

lol sarcasm is a sign of frustration.


By the way, what attitude?

I wouldn't call that sarcasm, as much as I would call it mocking!

Apparently there was lots of sarcasm being tossed about in all our threads!

[szlamany]

What are you saying, you take advantage of them?

I believe she was pointing out the economic reality of immigration. No one said they like it here from what I can tell.

[Malim]

What are you saying, you take advantage of them?


Did you see how much we pay our immigrant workers? Trust me, they don't feel taken advantage of. We treat them with utmost respect, and they treat us with utmost respect. We recently moved, and my husband sold his business, but is still bound to be involved for a period of time. He insisted that the new business owner maintain their pay scale, and about a month after we sold the business the new owner began to cut pay. My husband is now helping his foreman set up his own landscaping business since the new owner is not sticking with the terms of the agreement. Does that sound like taking advantage of them?

What I was saying, like Szlamany pointed out, is that generally people say they oppose immigrant workers until they realize that they can get better work done for a cheaper wage, and then they close their eyes to whether it is right or wrong.

[MasterBlaster]

Wow. This thread blew up nice :wave:

System_Error, I'm not sure where you live and I'm too lazy to look up your profile. I'm in Seattle. Everyone here is either Asian or Mexican unless you run a 7-11 then you are Indian. Then there are a few white people scattered around near Microsoft and Boeing. I have a small story. There was a Burger King down the street that got busted for hiring Illegal Mexicans. The state gave the owner(A friend of a friend) a second shot and sent someone to oversee all of the new hiring they did. In 2 months they had to close down because they couldn't find enough people to cover the shifts. They Pay $11 an hour $15 for managers. not to shabby for scraping grease vats and wiping down tables. The shop was 1/2 a mile from the local High School and a Technical College. You'd think someone would need a job. The big problem is too many young people are too busy living off their parents or the state. The scenario you and Fox News put out is valid and does happen in some instances but it is not the norm. I thougt I heard you say you had to work. Congrats, It's good to hear a young person who has some self respect. You're in the minority these days.

[Dillinger4]

To me it's a very complex problem with no clear solution. With the addition of illegal workers there is an environment created where there is an absence of competitive wages being offered by companies. Without the illegal workers companies would be force to up wages to bring in new hires thus probably passing on the increased monies paid into their products prices.

[System_Error]

Did you see how much we pay our immigrant workers? Trust me, they don't feel taken advantage of. We treat them with utmost respect, and they treat us with utmost respect. We recently moved, and my husband sold his business, but is still bound to be involved for a period of time. He insisted that the new business owner maintain their pay scale, and about a month after we sold the business the new owner began to cut pay. My husband is now helping his foreman set up his own landscaping business since the new owner is not sticking with the terms of the agreement. Does that sound like taking advantage of them?


No it doesn't, but in all seriousness, what areas are they employed in?
I think I might ask my uncle what he thinks about this, because he owns a biomedical engineering company, and I might get some good feedback from that..But I never see him.

[System_Error]

I wouldn't call that sarcasm, as much as I would call it mocking!

Apparently there was lots of sarcasm being tossed about in all our threads!


sarcasm is mocking...

Sarcasm: the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.

[System_Error]

To me it's a very complex problem with no clear solution. With the addition of illegal workers there is an environment created where there is an absence of competitive wages being offered by companies. Without the illegal workers companies would be force to up wages to bring in new hires thus probably passing on the increased monies paid into their products prices.


This is true, but the main purpose of this thread was to see if people thought immigration is getting out of control..but oh well.

[System_Error]

Wow. This thread blew up nice :wave:

System_Error, I'm not sure where you live and I'm too lazy to look up your profile. I'm in Seattle. Everyone here is either Asian or Mexican unless you run a 7-11 then you are Indian. Then there are a few white people scattered around near Microsoft and Boeing. I have a small story. There was a Burger King down the street that got busted for hiring Illegal Mexicans. The state gave the owner(A friend of a friend) a second shot and sent someone to oversee all of the new hiring they did. In 2 months they had to close down because they couldn't find enough people to cover the shifts. They Pay $11 an hour $15 for managers. not to shabby for scraping grease vats and wiping down tables. The shop was 1/2 a mile from the local High School and a Technical College. You'd think someone would need a job. The big problem is too many young people are too busy living off their parents or the state. The scenario you and Fox News put out is valid and does happen in some instances but it is not the norm. I thougt I heard you say you had to work. Congrats, It's good to hear a young person who has some self respect. You're in the minority these days.

This thread isn't as hostile as it seems, we are just having some fun :wave:
Anyway, thank you for the nice input. Personally, I think 11$ an hour is ridiculous, and 15$ an hour for a manager is ridiculous also. I mean, that is of course if the standard of living is much higher than anywhere else. Around here, I think they pay about 7$ an hour, and maybe 9-10$ and hour for a manager. So I'm guessing the standard of living/the general level of prices are way beyond what they are here.

It is true that some people refuse to work at such a place. I don't know why though, it's like impossible to start out making 50k a year.

[Shaggy Hiker]

System error: Do you know where Mexico is? You've twice indicated that you thought Mexicans had to travel overseas to get here. As for the attitude, most of us were 16 once. Most of us were brilliant at that age. Most of us have realized that we were full of excrement at that age. You will, too. It isn't that you aren't smart when you are young, but everybodies world view starts to change pretty radically when they start paying their own bills....or maybe there is some other reason, but I have never met anybody from post-college on who thought they were much of anything as a teenager. Sucks, though.

I live in an area with a large Mexican community (and Bosnian/Croat, too). We hired a fair number of low-skilled manual labor sorts. I was always unhappy with what we were paying people, but I had no input, nor did my boss. One thing I found was that the immigrants (either group) were excellent workers. Older Americans were excellent as well, but hard to find. All the troubles we had were with Americans, and generally young to middle-aged Americans. It was hard to keep the younger folks sober enough to show up, while the older ones that we had trouble with tended to be trying to take advantage of the system. Since we were really scraping the grime off the bottom of the barrel, we didn't expect much, but the Mexicans were always pleasant and hard-working. We couldn't give them much but respect, food, and low-pay, but they sure appreciated that first item, which may have made up for the last item somewhat.

[szlamany]

This is true, but the main purpose of this thread was to see if people thought immigration is getting out of control..but oh well.

Ok - I've got some information on legal methods of entering the country...

We have had an au-pair (actually two now) for the past couple of years.

They get a special visa - can stay for 13 months in the country. 12 months they work and live with you. They can only be paid $145 a week (for 45 hours work) - State Department rules. It's supposed to be a cultural exchange program - but it's really inexpensive child care.

The last month they can travel the country.

Our first attempt at getting one we actually got three that got visa-rejections by the US embassies in their home countries. One was 27 - too old in the opinion of the embassy to want to return to their country. One was too poor, with no father - also no good reason to return. Rejected from Brazil and Russia...

We ended up with one from Sweden (first one) - she got a boy friend here - did return to Sweden a few months ago, but I don't doubt she will marry him and return to the US as a citizen.

Another example - had a high school kid working for me last year - born in China - father came here to work for a large aerospace company (helicopter that is!). Father becomes citizen no problem - family as well. Not sure how that works (?)

[Shaggy Hiker]

If you work around Gatlinburg, you are doomed!

That area has the strongest, most distinctive, and most addictive accent in the US. I doubt a person could spend a year in that environment without being permanently imprinted with a strong southern drawl.

Some awesome caving not far north of there, though, and pretty good hiking, too.

[Shaggy Hiker]

We have had an au-pair (actually two now) for the past couple of years.



Now wait a minute! You have a pair au-pairs? A pair of pairs....so....there's like four of them....right? Is that like....an au-quad or something?

[MasterBlaster]

This thread isn't as hostile as it seems, we are just having some fun :wave:
Anyway, thank you for the nice input. Personally, I think 11$ an hour is ridiculous, and 15$ an hour for a manager is ridiculous also. I mean, that is of course if the standard of living is much higher than anywhere else. Around here, I think they pay about 7$ an hour, and maybe 9-10$ and hour for a manager. So I'm guessing the standard of living/the general level of prices are way beyond what they are here.


Any where on the West Coast is generally more expensive than the rest of the country not including NY/NJ. Cost of living here is pretty high. A 600 to 800sq ft apartment generally runs around 13-15 K a year to rent without utilities. $11 an hour roughly works out to 22K a year pre tax. That's most of your cash going to a roof over your head with just enough left over to eat.

[szlamany]

Now wait a minute! You have a pair au-pairs? A pair of pairs....so....there's like four of them....right? Is that like....an au-quad or something?

Actually not at the same time :bigyello:

And having someone live in your house is no easy experience - trust me!

[Malim]

No it doesn't, but in all seriousness, what areas are they employed in?
I think I might ask my uncle what he thinks about this, because he owns a biomedical engineering company, and I might get some good feedback from that..But I never see him.

What do you mean, what areas are they employed in?

If you ask your uncle what he thinks about this issue from the perspective of owning a biomedical engineering company, you won't get an apples to apples comparison. Biomedical engineering companies employ people with very specialized skills and aren't going to be likely to hire illegal immigrants.

[System_Error]

System error: Do you know where Mexico is? You've twice indicated that you thought Mexicans had to travel overseas to get here.

Ok, I just now realized I said that..It was an accident, so please don't kill me.
:blush:

[szlamany]

Any where on the West Coast is generally more expensive than the rest of the country not including NY/NJ. Cost of living here is pretty high. A 600 to 800sq ft apartment generally runs around 13-15 K a year to rent without utilities. $11 an hour roughly works out to 22K a year pre tax. That's most of your cash going to a roof over your head with just enough left over to eat.

Don't forget little CT - we live in Fairfield country - perpetually judged to be one of the most expensive locations in the country!

And cold and snowy - why don't I just move to San Diego!

[System_Error]

What do you mean, what areas are they employed in?

Special fry cook, dish washer, what ever? What are they employed in?

[Shaggy Hiker]

Actually not at the same time :bigyello:

And having someone live in your house is no easy experience - trust me!

Yeah, even if they pay rent. I have a friend who rents out a room or two in his house. He's only rented to friends so far, but it still seems like it would suck.

[Malim]

Special fry cook, dish washer, what ever? What are they employed in?
They cut grass. Ride lawn mowers, blow leaves, edge curbs, and trim hedges, etc.

[MasterBlaster]

Don't forget little CT - we live in Fairfield country - perpetually judged to be one of the most expensive locations in the country!

And cold and snowy - why don't I just move to San Diego!

Yeah Forgot about there. I couldn't see that there were actually people there under the 60 ft of snow. I grew up in the North East. I'm proud to say I haven't had to shovel snow for 8 years :thumb:

Bla haha. Don't move to San Diego Unless your fluent in Spanish :)

[szlamany]

Yeah Forgot about there. I couldn't see that there were actually people there under the 60 ft of snow. I grew up in the North East. I'm proud to say I haven't had to shovel snow for 8 years :thumb:

Bla haha. Don't move to San Diego Unless your fluent in Spanish :)

At least it's overseas from Mexico...

Oops - there goes my sarcasm again - sorry System_Error...

(I grew up in Queens NY - sarcasm is a way of life for me...) :bigyello:

[Malim]

:lol: :lol: :lol:
If you work around Gatlinburg, you are doomed!

That area has the strongest, most distinctive, and most addictive accent in the US. I doubt a person could spend a year in that environment without being permanently imprinted with a strong southern drawl.

Some awesome caving not far north of there, though, and pretty good hiking, too.

We just moved to Knoxville from Atlanta, and we are having a hard time getting used to the accents.

My husband was wearing an 84 Lumber shirt and this lady asked him "What time do youins open?" My husband said "Maam - I don't know where Ewings is." She gave him an ESAD look. But, he literally did not know what she meant!

[Malim]

At least it's overseas from Mexico...


:lol: :lol: :lol:

Now y'all stop making me laugh! I'm gonna get in trouble!

[System_Error]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Now y'all stop making me laugh! I'm gonna get in trouble!

Your not a very nice person.

[Malim]

Your not a very nice person.

I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings! :cry: You were the one who said we were just having fun! :)

[System_Error]

I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings! :cry: You were the one who said we were just having fun! :)

I never said being a mean person wasn't a bad thing, I know I am.

[szlamany]

sarcasm is mocking...

Sarcasm: the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.

Yeah by me calling it mocking - that was being even more sarcastic!

Kind of the satirical form of sarcasm - I have all flavors available at my beck and call :rolleyes:

[Shaggy Hiker]

:lol: :lol: :lol:


We just moved to Knoxville from Atlanta, and we are having a hard time getting used to the accents.

My husband was wearing an 84 Lumber shirt and this lady asked him "What time do youins open?" My husband said "Maam - I don't know where Ewings is." She gave him an ESAD look. But, he literally did not know what she meant!

I stopped in there (actually in Dollywood...shudder...) to get some groceries while on a spring break trip to the Smokies. My roommate was running around the aisles of the store laughing his ass off at what people were saying. Very friendly folks, but boy is that accent thick!

[Dillinger4]

My way to combat the southern drawl is to watch GoodFellas every night after i get home from work.

[Malim]

I stopped in there (actually in Dollywood...shudder...) to get some groceries while on a spring break trip to the Smokies. My roommate was running around the aisles of the store laughing his ass off at what people were saying. Very friendly folks, but boy is that accent thick!

Again, :lol: :lol: :lol: Especially, the part about Dollywood .... shudder...!!!!

We moved up here about two months ago and my five year old is picking the accent up! !!!!!!!!!!!SCREAM!!!!!!!!!

She has started calling me MaMa. But, not just MaMa. I mean MAaaAaaMaaaAaa. How many syllables can a two syllable word have????

I swear sometimes I feel like I'm in a remake of the movie Deliverance!

(I work in Knoxville, and it's not like that, but we live on a lake west of Knoxville.) It's absolutely gorgeous, and not that country on the lake, but the surrounding area is sooooo Southern! I never thought I'd move North and find more Southern people than in Georgia!

[Dillinger4]

Dollywood that's funny. My girlfriend is itching to take me there. Im looking forward to hitting up that ski place they have over in Gattlinburg. www.obergatlinburg.com We took the lift up in the summertime. What a view!

[Malim]

Dollywood that's funny. My girlfriend is itching to take me there. Im looking forward to hitting up that ski place they have over in Gattlinburg. www.obergatlinburg.com We took the lift up in the summertime. What a view!

Great view, but you're from NJ, right? Skiing will not live up to your expectations if you ski in that area, or out west

However, if you are a good skier you can show everyone esle up! Bonus!

The water skiing is great! You should try that too! There are so many beautiful lakes, it's serenity!!!! Except for that Deliverance part!

[System_Error]

Dollywood that's funny. My girlfriend is itching to take me there. Im looking forward to hitting up that ski place they have over in Gattlinburg. www.obergatlinburg.com We took the lift up in the summertime. What a view!

I didn't like dolloywood that much. I think their is another thing nearby knox. called ghost town or something, and it's also not very fun.

[Dillinger4]

Yeah i would say that Ober is on par with some of the smaller slopes in my area. Perhaps maybe Hidden Valley. Im only a once in a while snowboarder anyway. I do own my own equipment though. A couple of Burtons and a Healside which i think is made in Australia. Im looking to get away from the snow though. :D

[Malim]

Yeah i would say that Ober is on par with some of the smaller slopes in my area. Perhaps maybe Hidden Valley. Im only a once in a while snowboarder anyway. I do own my own equipment though. A couple of Burtons and a Healside which i think is made in Australia. Im looking to get away from the snow though. :D
I've been here this winter, and there isn't A LOT of snow. Mostly flurreys that don't stick. Now the minute you move here there will be an avalanche. So don't move here based on what I'm saying!!!!!

[Dillinger4]

Ill probably be stuck in a UT dorm anyway. Wouldn't be any different than what i do now though. :rolleyes:

[Shaggy Hiker]

Ill probably be stuck in a UT dorm anyway. Wouldn't be any different than what i do now though. :rolleyes:

Hey, you can go Noodling!!! I'd try that, as redneck as it is.

As I said before, there's great caving in that area. Rock Castle County KY is just north of you, and the karst limestone of that area dips down into TN. Some excellent caves in the area.

[MasterBlaster]

Hey, you can go Noodling!!! I'd try that, as redneck as it is.

:lol:

I thought that was an Alabama/Mississippi thing

[Malim]

Hey, you can go Noodling!!!

What the heck is Noodling?????? :blush:

[szlamany]

What the heck is Noodling?????? :blush:

I've been afraid to even google for it - just in case the FBI keeps track of what we all google for :lol: :lol:

[MasterBlaster]

What the heck is Noodling?????? :blush:

A form of catfish fishing that you are only able to particate in if you fit at least 3 of the followin criteria

1: Your wife is a blood relative
2: You have more fingers than teeth
3: You think Busch Beer is premium
4: You can move your house with a ford pickup
5: You think a stock tip is advice on worming' your hogs
6: You've been married three times and still have the same in-laws
7: More than one living relative is named after a southern civil war general.
8: There is a stuffed possum anywhere in your house.
9: The primary color of your car is "bondo."
10: You think that beef jerky and Moon Pies are two of the major food groups
11: You have to go outside to get something out of the fridge.
12: You mow your lawn and find a car.

[Malim]

I've been afraid to even google for it - just in case the FBI keeps track of what we all google for :lol: :lol:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I think "noodling" is when you disribute a vb.net app that worked perfectly fine one your computer and doesn't work on a computer with the same exact specs as the one you were developing on! Noodling is trying to figure out why your app won't work on that stupid machine!

[Malim]

A form of catfish fishing that you are only able to particate in if you fit at least 3 of the followin criteria

1: Your wife is a blood relative
2: You have more fingers than teeth
3: You think Busch Beer is premium
4: You can move your house with a ford pickup
5: You think a stock tip is advice on worming' your hogs
6: You've been married three times and still have the same in-laws
7: More than one living relative is named after a southern civil war general.
8: There is a stuffed possum anywhere in your house.
9: The primary color of your car is "bondo."
10: You think that beef jerky and Moon Pies are two of the major food groups
11: You have to go outside to get something out of the fridge.
12: You mow your lawn and find a car.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Y'all are so funny!

[Dillinger4]

Posted by Shaggy Hiker

As I said before, there's great caving in that area. Rock Castle County KY is just north of you, and the karst limestone of that area dips down into TN. Some excellent caves in the area.

Id like to take a trip over to Mammoth Cave National Park. 360 miles explored and mapped. That's a lot of underground!

[Shaggy Hiker]

Unfortunately, MB is right, so I probably never would be allowed to go noodling. I don't believe it is only Alabama and Mississippi, though.

Noodling is fishing for catfish by hand. I believe the target is flathead or blue catfish. They spawn under rocks (or in rock 'caves') in relatively shallow reservoir waters. When the reservoir level is lowered, folks go out and create structure for the catfish (I expect that it rarely exists naturally). During spawning season, the catfish are very reluctant to be driven out of these holes, so a person reaches into the hole, and hooks a hook through the lip of the fish (for purchase), then drags them out of the hole. Considering that these catfish can reach VERY big sizes, and are pretty much all muscle, this results in broken and dislocated fingers, as well as the occasional inadvertent swallowing of chew. I don't chew, either, so I guess I would be barred for that reason, as well.

[Dillinger4]

Ive seen the size that catfish can reach. You got to be crazy to stick your hand in the mud after one of them.

[NotLKH]

I've been afraid to even google for it - just in case the FBI keeps track of what we all google for :lol: :lol:
Related Question:

Certainly, if you email from your work PC, Your company can have the resources to Int-cept them.

What about Post Responses?
That is, if they don't have key loggers???
{99% sure no keylogger on my machine, ...10 % sure our security guy isn't watching my emails...seen some serendipidous events lately following my emails to friends....}

:wave:
-Lou

[Dillinger4]

99% of stuff is blocked anyway. When i worked at basf i couldn't get anything. Dam proxys. :lol:

[demotivater]

6: You've been married three times and still have the same in-laws
7: More than one living relative is named after a southern civil war general.
11: You have to go outside to get something out of the fridge.
12: You mow your lawn and find a car.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

:cry:

[Suzzi]

How many american citizens can go over seas, rape a girl, and get away with it, without being sent back to your country?

cough!

http://202.221.217.59/print/news/nn01-2005/nn20050123a5.htm

[nemaroller]

I've noticed it over the years, but I just got through watching an episode of Bill O'Reilly on immigration. It was talking about how 80% of immigrants(mexicans) are illegal. 32 million illegal mexicans now live in the USA, and have more benifits than most citizens. I don't understand that...They are allowed more rights and privaleges than any other immigrants like germans, italians, etc.. One thing they said on that show, was that a mexican(in specific) could come over sea's illegally, and get more benifits such as health, than a war veteran returning from war.

Now, I believe diversity is good, but chaos is weakness. Are our politician not paying immigration enough attention?

They don't pay attention to immigration because American's aren't putting up a big stink about it - because we're all immigrants, and its not a problem - O'Reilly will say it is when he runs out of things to talk about and needs to stir up controversy to get ratings.

The big issue is health care costs are out of control - but its not because of illegal immigrants, its strictly a HUMUNGOUS aging population, followed by gouging on the part of the lawyers, drug companies, and managing a paperwork mountain (although that is starting to come under regulation).

Health care costs are the biggest threat to American business and prosperity right now.

So, If we were all O'Reilly we'd say : ship all the eldery out of the country so we can prosper again (and of course O'reilly would have to go to :) )

[demotivater]

Carousel has begun

[Shaggy Hiker]

They don't pay attention to immigration because American's aren't putting up a big stink about it - because we're all immigrants, and its not a problem - O'Reilly will say it is when he runs out of things to talk about and needs to stir up controversy to get ratings.

The big issue is health care costs are out of control - but its not because of illegal immigrants, its strictly a HUMUNGOUS aging population, followed by gouging on the part of the lawyers, drug companies, and managing a paperwork mountain (although that is starting to come under regulation).

Health care costs are the biggest threat to American business and prosperity right now.

So, If we were all O'Reilly we'd say : ship all the eldery out of the country so we can prosper again (and of course O'reilly would have to go to :) )

Hear, Hear!!