A WILD BUT COOL IDEA

[dimava]

You know how in the MATRIX, in the very beggining there is this program that could crack any password, has anyone ever tried making a program like that? (not for hacking)





You could go to the second page (this problem has been kinda soved)

[Edited by dimava on 06-24-2000 at 11:36 AM]

[gfk]

Guess what? The Matrix IS NOT REAL.

:D

[dimava]

I know but my friend said he had a program like that, I was just wondering if someone could make it in VB

[gfk]

Your friend watches too much TV. :rolleyes:

There are so many different methods of encryption/data protection, it's impossible to have a single program which can decrypt anything.

[dimava]

Ok, guess I'll have to kill him


thanks for the info

[Eiredrake]

Actually that program wasn't decrypting anything it was trying to locate what phone number that transmission was coming in under. It was probably similiar to an IP address since the phone was just a representation of a network connection.

Actually it wasn't even all that efficient at it really... They can trace phones better than that now.


Eiredrake

[SYAlam]

There really isnt a universal "cracker" but there are different methods. I mean you can sendkeys and bruteforce crack, or use decryption methods for BlowFish, RSA, RCA4 encryption. Its a matter of choosing which way to decrypt. Its a tough task to determine what kind of encryption method was used. I wouldn't really try doing it, because its a waste of time for me of course. Matrix was a cool movie though, i love the special effects

[kb244]

I dont want to be rude, but I've seen so many people that thought that a crack will work for any software, just to kind of clear things up , when it comes to cracks, they are normally for a specific program, even a sepecific version, because it looks for a location in the memory of the code, changes some things, like jump points, or remove nag screen, also as far as passwords go, it would be nearly impossible for a universal cracker, since there are zillions of possible algorithms, and without knowing what one is you wouldnt have much luck, the only effective password decrypter is Brute force(not an actual program, its a method of trial and error) which throws in every possible combination of passwords, this method is usally extremely slow, and most computers will block out any user attempting to try a login more than a dozen times (especially supicious when its 50 trys a second) but in anycase there are sites to find cracks,keygens, etc which I will not mention on this site(since it's well known already)

[rino_2]

Hi,

No it's not possible to make a password cracker for all programs. However it is possible to make them for some. My friend is also a VB programmer and he made a program that was password protected and asked me to make a VB program to hack it. I did, and it worked! I was lucky because my friend had set the ok button to default so after generating a random combination of numbers and letters I used the SendKeys function to send the Enter key to accept. It wasn't a good program that I made and it wasn't able to detect if it had entered the right password, thus, after it sent the correct password it still send randomly generated passwords when no text box was selected. This coursed the computers internal speaker to make one hell of a racket and eventual crash! Bottom line, it takes a good computer programmer to make a password cracker! I know where you can download some (FOR INTERESTS SACK). (no hacking URLS please - John)

[Edited by John on 06-26-2000 at 07:24 AM]

[kb244]

The Site I was refereing to was (no hacking URLs please - John)

its a crack, keygen, serial search engine.

the method of the guy above me about the program that crashed, is exactly one of the reason why people dont use brute force, its not that they're a good programmer, most crackers, for specific software, already know the altgorithm and where to make the changes, and only needs to perform them once, also keygens are made when the programmer knows how a key is geenrated in the first place. Brute force can be effective if the computer can handle it, and it depends upon the method you use it on.

[Edited by John on 06-26-2000 at 07:25 AM]

the original post said "NOT FOR HACKING" what the hell other reason is there for trying to illegally obtain passwords?????

Don't pretend that you aren't interested in hacking. Every programmer worth his salt are interested in it, however only those that realise hacking is a loser's sport should be allowed access to developement software.

Anyway, thats my tuppence worth after a drink too many. :)

[dimava]

Well Maybe it's called hacking (but I don't think so) like tring to obtain a AOL password, Password for Diffrent Accounts, Windows Password (just examples)

[kb244]

In my opinion the only good reason a developer would be interested in hacking besides the illegal stuff, is to understand the exploits, it helps us as developers work towards making software that cant be cracked by the usual "duh" routines. thats just my two cents, In my opionion theres a big difference between the lame HAcking, and the somewhat useful cracking of software.

Originally posted by wossname
the original post said "NOT FOR HACKING" what the hell other reason is there for trying to illegally obtain passwords?????

Don't pretend that you aren't interested in hacking. Every programmer worth his salt are interested in it, however only those that realise hacking is a loser's sport should be allowed access to developement software.

Anyway, thats my tuppence worth after a drink too many. :)

In other words, he is not responsible for what you do with the software that you get from there. Legally it's right. For example, If I say, go to http://www.gd.com for information on global domination and how to control people's mind, I can say "For info purposes only. I'm not responsible for what you do with this info" and I cannot be charged. I stated that I am not responsible for it.

[kb244]

Megatron is right, alot of pirating, cracking or otherwise sites will say a disclaimer, something like "These are for educational purposes only, use at your own risk, we are not responsible..." and so forth, the crack or the program itself made for cracking is not illegal in itself, and stating a usage otherwise helps them keep their legality.

[dimava]

Ok, now to change the subject,

do any of you know how to hack websites?

I really wanna know

[kb244]

I think your question really is "do any of you know how to hack a webserver" a website is nothing more than just files, first off need to figure out what kind of webserver it is, what security holes there are, I Dont know how to hack one, but I Can tell you this, it isnt something that you can download a program to do it for you.

[invitro]

First of all... if u wanna talk about all this goto the chitchat forum. Sorry to be rude :)
Second of all, its possible to make a universal cracker... but it would take about 99x10^9999999999 years to crack a program. Even simple encrypted strings can take up to years to crack trough brute force.

When i said universal cracker, i dint mean 1 method which is used for all. But a program which combines different methods to get the password. But all this is far into the future... dont even look at VB for complex concepts like that.

NOW MOVE THIS TO THE CHITCHAT FORUM!!!!! ;)
Dont watch to many movies. They will brain wash you...

Cheers,
InVitro

[dimava]

Really? How many Years?
I have a Athlon 1Ghz PC with 128 MB SDRAM
how long will it take on my PC?

[invitro]

Make a program that decrypts data like that first.. using over 10000 methods of decryption, tell me how many loops and functions u put in there, and then we'll talk.

[Superkat86]

To find a password in vb you just need to copy the *'s for mor visit http://gator.naples.net/~nfn18616/

[dimava]

I'm 12 I have no idea about hacking (well I just hacked the RI SCHOOL DEPARTMENT WEBSITE. well not exactly hacked but logged in to there servers using FTP) but still, I have to idea of how to get passwords

VB is not the language for doing any hacking. Most advanced hacking software is either written in C++ or Assembly.

[dimava]

Ok, But I saw some software made in VB that was used for hacking

What kind of hacking was it? Was it fast at doing it? You could always make a better version of a VB program using C++.

[kb244]

Maybe it was a very simple KeyGen or something.

[dimava]

It was a program that tries every possible combination of letters and numbers for Office 2000 (it took about 5 hours to find it)

[kb244]

sounds like a weak brute force, I could find the serial for an office2000 in a matter of seconds, since they already have keygens out there(microsoft doesnt just make random numbers)

[Paul282]

How many people here know what is involved with brute forcing a password?

It's not really an option anymore, there are better methods of crypto-analysm.

for example, take DES encryption, it's considered weak now as it is only 56bit. meaning it has 2^56 possible keys. That's a big number.The record for guessing a key is 56 hours and the system had 1500 cpu's distrubuted. It would take many years on my home PC.

128 bit encription is not possible to brute force! (maybe in the future, but not the forseable future) even using something like Seti@home won't crack 128 bit encription before the sun engulfs the earth.

Even then, if you attempt to brute force something like DES, knowing when you decrypt the origional message is not easy. DES won't say "Wrong, try again" it just unscambles the cyphertext with the key you give it, if the message is readable then it's right. If you just search a piece of decrypted text for known words to see if it's readable you're in for a surprise, 2^56 randoms cyphers generates most words eventually and what if the message was a word doc or a zip file?(Binary)? so, multiply 2^56 by the number of format checks you have to do after each decrypt. Imagine waiting 10 years and searching the entire keyspace just to find out that your software didn't find anything readable because the secret Nuke plans were in arabic!

It's not about a big loop till the software says "Congratulations!".

The DES algorithm is on-line and the tutorials are very easy to read, you don't need to be a maths professor to code it in VB, very worth taking a look at if you want to know about what's actually involved in real world encription, not just "Swap the letter" or "XOR the text to a password"

Public key encryption is usually about 1024 bit because it's inherantly easier to crack. with a public key you get some text that you know and encrypt it, then instead of sending it that user, you try to decrypt it KNOWING what the message will be, if you get it right then you have that private key and you can get anything ecrypted with that key.

For these reasons Crypto-Analysts ARE maths professors looking for patterns in number factors and primes to help find a way around the password rather than through it.

Next time a friend tells you that he's written a VB tool to decrypt any text, humour them and tell them that you'll have to report it to the CIA! :D

or better still, laugh at them for being a moron



[Edited by Paul282 on 06-22-2000 at 10:51 PM]

[HeSaidJoe]

there are pgms in vb that will seach out the registery or what not for passwords that have been "save my password"
defaulted...after all, if it's on your hard drive, someone will find a way to get at it...think the apps on Planet but I'm not sure...tried it and it picked up a lot...old and newer....

dimava

I have a 650 K7 with 128 and every now and then, especially on sites using heavy java script and asp
I lock up....does this happen on yours?

[HeSaidJoe]

Readme for Inet Pass Cracker v1.1
---------------------------------

This program shows you the cached dialup passwords of the system it is run on !

ADDED: You can open dialup networking now and you can copy the passwords to clipboard.

If the password isn't fully visible (if it's too long or something) doubleclick it !

This program is freeware !

please visit my website at (no hacking URLs please - John)

--------------------------
Copyright 1999 Black Flash
--------------------------

[Edited by John on 06-26-2000 at 07:26 AM]

[dimava]

I have a cabel modem
my hard drice is 37 GIG and only 1GIG free
My PC crashes all the time I need to reformat it soon

[Paul282]

Originally posted by dimava
You know how in the MATRIX, in the very beggining there is this program that could crack any password, has anyone ever tried making a program like that? (not for hacking)

If you're into this you should see the movie "Sneekers" That was a great film on this topic

[nitrolic2]

Ok you guys im going to sound like an idiot at this point:

But for example if i want text to appear in another programms text box (the text comes out of your programm) what do you need to do? API calls? ....

thanks

[kb244]

To alter another program's inputs, I would think if you can get the handle of the textbox, then use a SendKey api to it.

[dimava]

Take it easy on me, I'm only 12, but what's API? I always here people talking about it but what is it?

[Mih_Flyer]

they are "Application Programming Interface", i think you will find some help in Visual basic's help files, go and check, don't you have a VB book, there are many good ones to teach you API, try to find some good one.

[dimava]

I have

SAMS VISUAL BASIC 6 IN 24 HOURS - no API
SAMS VISUAL BASiC 5 IN 24 HOURS - no API
VISUAL BASIC 5 DATABASE - HOW TO - 3 pages in API


maybe I'm getting the wrong books.

[Mih_Flyer]

yes, i think you have the wrong books, try to find some good books, but do not ask me about names

[Paul282]

I don't think you have the wrong books, but it's probably time you moved on from them.

an API is a set of functions that is written by the product vendors or writors, in Windows the API means the Win32 API or the Windows API. Many of the things that you see windows do that can't be done in visual basic are use API programming. It takes a bit of study before you can actually use it but Microsoft have published the windows API (or at least most of it) so that other people can use it too.

In VB help look up the "Declare" keyword. That what you use to link an API function from on of the core DLL files in MS windows (like Kernel32.dll for the system itself, GDI32 for graphics). Then it's like a function or sub already written for you. There are thousands of API functions that do all sorts of things and sometimes when you can't do something in VB or VB can't do it fast enough, you call the API functions for extra functionality.

There are quite a few VB books that are quite good for VB beginners who are moving on from being beginners. The book I have which I like is QUE, Using VB6 Special edition. It goes in to classes, ActiveX controls and API, Database access etc but starts easier. You'll probably find the first quarter of the book is pretty much the same as the books you own, but I don't thin a 24hr guide or a dummies book is going to teach you what you want to know.

Take a look at amazon.com, often reading through the customers comments helps you find a good book. Although it might be worth sitting down in a book shop and leafing through a few books to find one with the topics you want to know about and a format you find easy to learn from.

Hope this helps.

[dimava]

Ok, thanks, I'll look for that book

[kb244]

the nice thing about API is that 90% of the ones that are used, are the DLLS in your system, and can be used by almost all of microsoft's programming language.

basically an API is just like increasing functionality by using the libraries of the system , you can always check msdn.microsoft.com for infomation about each API call, you can always check the API Text Viewer that comes with VB, so that you dont have to guess how to declare them, you just cut and paste into a module, and then you can use that function elsewhere.

I use API in visual basic, visual C++, when creating activeX dlls and controls, sO i can minimize the size of the code, and final executable.

API have a few advantages over just getting an ActiveX control to do the work for you, for one API are at most times faster and smaller than a activeX, you can control their behavior more easily and include only what you want to use, an API is not too different from using an ActiveX dll, the only difference is, an ActiveX is registered to the system, VB may already know all of its functions

an API however, is directly linking to a function or subroutine in a non-ActiveX dll, VB doesnt know what commands are in a non-ActiveX dll, so you have to declare the API command, which is where the API Text viewer comes in handy, once you declared it in the code, you can use it just like any other function that you would declare, the only other thing that would make them confusing, is the types that it often uses, most API are directed towards languages like C++, and you normally wouldnt use an API for simple task, which is why you'll see alot of API with really weird(to you at least) purposes.

[dimava]

You said you know VB & VC++ right? which do you think is easier?

[Paul282]

VB

no contest

[kb244]

I know VB, VC++, ASP, VBscript/Javascript, HTML, and usage of most of the other languages of visual studio, and which is easier, well for you VB is certainly, VB has at most of the time been easier, but I found VC++ mroe flexible and powerful, you can write an ActiveX dll in VC++ to port your functionality over to Vb, which is something I have done several times for this company because there were just a few things they couldnt do in VB, or would need faster performance.

[Paul282]

I've never me a person on the planet who said VC++ was easier than VB (better maybe, but not easier)

I found VC++ to be a nightmare, and I like C++.

Be sure you understand that VC++ is not visual in the sense that VB is.

[kb244]

he's correct, visual C++ sets it all up as code, the Visual portion , is more like C++ with Microsoft extensions, it'll create the visual objects for you, but a vast majority of it is in codes, and heavily relys on MFC (microsoft foundation class) which helps a bit in working with some more complex C++, but can often times cause bloated codes, in my opinion VC++ is for the people who want to get down to some serious heavy work, VB can do alot of the stuff, plus some more advanced stuff with the help of API, so you should be just fine in VB, it's easier to work with, and should be able to handle alot of common tasks, the only time I found it not to suffice, is when you are making a Client/Server application that uses it's own protocals, and needs to work greatly on the socket level, also VB isnt good if you are going to create something that requires intense mathematical operations and logic(such as a smooth 3d engine, or something similar) I love C++ in the sense that it combines power with flexibilty, if you are thinking of going in that direction in the future, let me warn you , do not try to learn VC++ specifics first, try to learn the C++ language itself, leanring the standard will ensure a smooth transitions into a specific compiler like Borland C++ or VC++ and the standard "Should" work on most supporting compilers. but for you , I'd recomend you spend your spare times playing with Visual basic, thers a future behind that as well, and will help make your transitions into any other languages.

[REM]

I find the subject of finding 'cracks' for software fascinating. Like making a keygen would be a wicked challenge, and I would like to look into it (Using WIn32DASM hexEditors etc, analysing code etc etc) one day. If i did start getting into this, I wouldn't distribute the stuff I found, I would use it entirely for my own educational purposes, that is all... ;)

Laterz

REM

[kb244]

Just want to clear things up with you REM, a crack would be good with the assemblers you mentioned, a keygen is nothing more than an ecoder that can encode your name the say way the software does, so it doesnt actally touch the software, however I dont know exactly how they figure out the algorithm needed to make a Keygen for a specific programmer.

well anyways good luck on your path to being a cracker.

[dimava]

Is it true that JAVA script and JDBC and is similar to C++? and is CGI similar to HTML?

[kb244]

Java = Platform independant programming language(compile it once, and it'll run on any machine and any oppertaing system with a java virtual machine, and the structure is very similar to C++)

Javascript = not Java related other than the structure, and is a scripting language created by netscape+Sun systms for HTML

C++ and Java are similar and structure and somewhat in syntax, java (if written to be universal) is very restrictive, and has no permision to the user's file system, nor does it allow direct memory access, C++ is more capable than Java, but it lacks' java's portability to run on any system without having to compile it again for a certain machine.

[kb244]

Also JDBC is a beta platform independant Database language, at the momment some of the most popular languages are SQL Query, ADO , DAO, so on, JDBC is suppost to allow universally distribuitable Databases, and is kind of in a beta state, also CGI is Common Gateway interface, itis not HTML, CGI can be written in C++, Perl, and numerous other languages,it is different from active server page in the sense that a CGI is compiled before it is placed on the webserver, an ASP is interpreted (never compiled, it is interpreted when a USer request the document, why it is sometimes slower than a CGI)

I think you are confusing a whole mesh of languages, because of this I recomend you just stick with Visual basic and go slow about the whole range of programming possibilties, Java, CGI, C++, etc are mainly popular because they are universally portable, there is least a compiler , and support for each of those in Linux, Unix, Windows, and even MAC OS, no single company owns the language, but several company has compilers for them, which is why they would be popular, where as Visual Basic is owned by Microsoft, and created by them(the 'BASIC' was created by someone else in the early 60s[refresh my history if you know], and have seen over dozen of variatys and flavors since then)

[dimava]

can CGI be written in VB?

[kb244]

No I've never heard of VB ever writing a CGI, I think thats why they have Active Server Pages by Microsoft. Besides I feel a CGI works best if you use a 100% Native language, VB even at version 6 is partially interpreted.

[dimava]

Are there any other laungagues based on vb's structure?

[Paul282]

You can do CGI in VB. ASP is better but in a book I've got it has a project with one module (no forms) starts with a sub main and reads for the environment vars (querystring etc from the HTML forms) and outputs to the stdout.

It has to be kept light as if it's slow to start up the server can't precess many concurrent requests.

I wouldn't bother with it because I like ASP and the dact that I can write dlls to be called from asp.

but it can be done, I can send you the project if you like.

[dimava]

But Are there any other laungagues based on vb's structure?

[kb244]

Not that I know of Visual Basic is created and owned by microsoft, anything that would take on both it's visual and coding interface would have to face Microsoft in court unless their own compiler was uniquely different, Vb is what you may call an Advanced flavor of BASIC , theres Qbasic for dos, theres been some other microsoft competitor basics for dos and early versions of windows like TruBasic, and ProBasic, none of which are very sucessfull when it comes to building a carreer based on them, Visual Basic is about the closest you get to a Easy language, that can actually go somewhere. Perhaps Paul has some insights on this as well, I cant be the only one(thats for sure).

[dimava]

No, What I mean is:

not nesseseraly visual

form example:

window.width = 576
window.value = "afs"




etc...

[kb244]

You mean calling an object, then a property, well almost all the microsoft languages are similar to that, but the actual stucture I mean like

Visual Basic:

for j = 1 to 10
Debug.Print j
next j

C++ ( works in Console mode in vc++ ):

for(int j; j=1; j<=10)
{
cout<<j<<'\n';
}

Qbasic:

for j = 1 to 10
Print j
next j

of course theres more to it than that, but the things you mentioned like taking an object, and defining it's properties, that exist in almost all object oriented programming(anything that uses the concepts of objects, to make programming more understandable and usable when it gets complex) Qbasic, VB, so forth follow the BASIC language structure, the syntaxes, the way its just written, but they all in some way or another acts the same just written differently.

I am not sure if I am clear enough, so just let me know

[dimava]

I mean something that uses the . (dot) as commonly as visual basic, like almost every command has a . (dot) in it

[kb244]

:/ , just learn more VB, just doing a little then going to another language isnt going to help, stick with VB.

[dimava]

Yea, I'll keep learning Visual Basic, its just fun to learn a new laungaue then maybe I could make a bi-lingual program

lol
:)

[kb244]

You normally wouldnt want to do that, unless you're an intermediate->Advanced programmer with the current language. When you know Visual Basic more, you then understand when it's appropiate to use outside languages to use for functionality.

[dimava]

ok... One more question for now....


what is the easest computer laungae in the world!!! (not vb, and donesn't have to be programming)

[kb244]

Well , lets see, for a computer it's machine language 0100010010101 :) , but I would say if it doesnt have to be programming, any number of Batch files would be easy(take a Dos batch for example, just throwing a single command at a time)

[dimava]

NO, I ment like HTML, JAVA, CGI, JDBC, C++, Inter DEV, Fox Pro, etc...

[kb244]

None of those except HTML or JDBC(not a language), HTML is more scripting, and just design, JDBC is a database.

[PsyVision]

I have some code so that when you come to a window with a password covered with a '*' it will uncover the real password

[dimava]

really??? how????

I used to have one of those programs, but never the VB code for one!!!!

[kb244]

Oh thats easy, goto snadboy.com and download Revelation.

[dimava]

cool!!!!!

[kb244]

Its funny but this would be Correct(well yours works too, but this would be shorter)

If windows.crash = true then
load Unix
elseif Unix.Crash = true then
end of the world
end if

In VB you can use an ElseIf(yes it's all one word)

[dimava]

I don't think that there's anything bad about having a long signiture, and what you wrote, is a little more complex to read

[kb244]

Ok, well your choice, I personally like one I seen before

if 2+2 <> 4 then
Print "Your computer is seriously retarded"
end if

[dimava]

hehe, that's funny

[John]

There is some good points and content in this thread, so I have left most of it in place. However, we do not endorse any form of hacking, cracking, warez, or any other dubious activities, so I must request that you do not post links to such sites.

John

[dimava]

ok, (sorry)

[activeX]

hey dimava,
use these books they are gr8.
1. Visual Basic 6 SuperBible by The Waites Group
2. Visual Basic 6 SE by Jeff Spotts & Brian Siller

hope it help ... pal
:))

[dimava]

thanks

For proper API work in VB, get Dan Appelman's Programmers Guide To The Win32 API.

It is the bible as far as VB and the Win API goes.

Worth every cent.

And for a second language, there are a ton out there. Try ADA for a real language (it's a military laguage used for programming avionics packages and the like), or stretch you mind by trying Lisp, Smalltalk or Miranda, which are functional languages (which is comletly differnt to VB)

- gaffa

[tumblingdown]

Following up to Paul on the first page, where he was talking about cracking 56bit DES in 56 hours, on 1500 distrubuted processors.

Does any one know of any groups out there who are aiming
to better that using processor sharing on the net? It wouldn't matter about the speed of each node, it would all be in parallel.

Would any one be interested in participating in this kind of thing?

/me starts to daydream of a simple distributed vb app and a giant disturbance on the net ;-)


andy.

[tumblingdown]

btw, Dan Appleman is the Man, but i recently found another
book which i have to say is better allround (although not as a functional reference, Dan's wins that hands down).

It's one of those O'Reilly books (small monkey on the front of this one) and is called 'Win32 API programming with Visual Basic'.

This is a great book.

andy.